posted March 09, 2006 07:07 PM         

"Why yes, yes I have. I just don't believe he was God."

"Wha-what do you mean?", she protested, her smile now tucked away somewhere. "The Bible specifically states that he IS God."

"Well no..there are some pretty vague references that are wide open to interpretation, no offense, but that's hardly TELLING us."

"Huh?"

"Well look, first, can we both agree that Jesus was a real, flesh and blood person and not a fictional character? I mean, I truly believe that Jesus walked the Earth...don't you?"

"Of course, He died for us here on Earth."

"Right..right. OK so don't you believe Jesus when he tells us that he came not to change the laws of the Old Testament..?"

"Well suure..he came to die for our sins."

"Maybe we should discuss that next..but anyhow, if Jesus walked the earth...and his coming didn't change the law..then the Ten Commandments are still valid, right?"

"Of course!"

"Well the Second Commandment specifically states that we aren't supposed to worship anything as God which has walked the Earth."

posted March 09, 2006 08:18 PM         

NRSV - 3 you shall have no other gods before me.

TEV - 3 "Worship no god but me.

2nd Commandment: DO NOT MAKE IDOLS

KJV - 4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: 5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

NRSV - 4 You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the LORD your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and the fourth generation of those who reject me, 6 but showing steadfast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments.

TEV - 4 "Do not make for yourselves images of anything in heaven or on earth or in the water under the earth. Do not bow down to any idol or worship it, because I am the LORD your God and I tolerate no rivals. I bring punishment on those who hate me and on their descendants down to the third and fourth generation. But I show my love to thousands of generations of those who love me and obey my laws.

posted March 09, 2006 08:27 PM         

Fayte used the basic references except for the Quran:

Thou shall make no image of God. 2. There is nothing that equals (like) Him. (42:11)
No visions can encompass Him, but He encompasses all visions. He is the Compassionate, the Cognizant.(6:103)
"My Lord, make this a peaceful land, and protect me and my children from worshiping idols. (14:35)

quote:

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"Well the Second Commandment specifically states that we aren't supposed to worship anything as God which has walked the Earth."

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I am curious how the word " walked" applys to the Commandment?

Blessings

posted March 09, 2006 08:38 PM         

References to LORD God "walking" on the Earth.
I have made arguments to the theory that This LORD God is NOT the God of the first creation of Genesis Chapter One.
Various Gnostic works identify him as an imposter..the "blind god" Samael.
Not the Creator.

Book of Genesis:
Chapter 3

3:8
And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden.

Genesis 19:24

"Then Yahweh [on earth in human form] rained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from Yahweh [in spirit form in heaven] out of heaven. Genesis 19:24.

posted March 09, 2006 08:46 PM         

The Names of God
by Lambert Dolphin

Old Testament (The Hebrew Scriptures, or Tanach):
EL: God ("mighty, strong, prominent") used 250 times in the OT See Gen. 7:1, 28:3, 35:11; Nu. 23:22; Josh. 3:10; 2 Sam. 22:31, 32; Neh. 1:5, 9:32; Isa. 9:6; Ezek. 10:5. El is linguistically equivalent to the Moslem "Allah," but the attributes of Allah in Islam are entirely different from those of the God of the Hebrews. ELAH is Aramaic, "god." Elah appears in the Hebrew Bible in Jer. 10:11 (which is in Aramaic, and is plural, "gods"). In Daniel (the Aramaic sections) Elah is used both of pagan gods, and of the true God, also plural. Elah is equivalent to the Hebrew Eloah which some think is dual; Elohim is three or more. The gods of the nations are called "elohim." The origin of Eloah is obscure. Elohim is the more common plural form of El. Eloah is used 41 times in Job between 3:4 and 40:2, but fewer than 15 times elsewhere in the OT. See the Catholic Encyclopedia entry on Elohim.

ELOHIM: God (a plural noun, more than two, used with singular verbs); Elohim occurs 2,570 times in the OT, 32 times in Gen. 1. God as Creator, Preserver, Transcendent, Mighty and Strong. Eccl., Dan. Jonah use Elohim almost exclusively. See Gen. 17:7, 6:18, 9:15, 50:24; I Kings 8:23; Jer. 31:33; Isa. 40:1.

EL SHADDAI: God Almighty or "God All Sufficient." 48 times in the OT, 31 times in Job. First used in Gen. 17:1, 2. (Gen. 31:29, 49:24, 25; Prov. 3:27; Micah 2:1; Isa. 60:15, 16, 66:10-13; Ruth 1:20, 21) In Rev. 16:7, "Lord God the Almighty." The Septuagint uses Greek "ikanos" meaning "all-sufficient" or "self-sufficient." The idols of the heathen are called "sheddim."

ADONAI: Lord in our English Bibles (Capitol letter 'L ', lower case, 'ord') (Adonai is plural, the sing. is "adon"). "Master'' or "Lord" 300 times in the OT always plural when referring to God, when sing. the reference is to a human lord. Used 215 times to refer to men. First use of Adonai, Gen. 15:2. (Ex. 4:10; Judges 6:15; 2 Sam. 7:18-20; Ps. 8, 114:7, 135:5, 141:8, 109:21-28). Heavy use in Isaiah (Adonai Jehovah). 200 times by Ezekiel. Ten times in Dan. 9.

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JEHOVAH: LORD in our English Bibles (all capitals). Yahweh is the covenant name of God. Occurs 6823 times in the OT First use Gen. 2:4 (Jehovah Elohim). From the verb "to be", havah, similar to chavah (to live), "The Self-Existent One," "I AM WHO I AM" or 'I WILL BE WHO I WILL BE" as revealed to Moses at the burning bush, Ex.3. The name of God, too sacred to be uttered, abbreviated ( . . . . ) or written "YHWH" without vowel points. The tetragrammaton. Josh., Judges, Sam., and Kings use Jehovah almost exclusively. The love of God is conditioned upon His moral and spiritual attributes. (Dan. 9:14; Ps. 11:7; Lev. 19:2; Hab. 1:12). Note Deut. 6:4, 5 known to Jews as the Sh'ma uses both Jehovah and Elohim to indicate one God with a plurality of persons.

JEHOVAH-JIREH: "The Lord will Provide." Gen. 22:14. From "jireh" ("to see" or "to provide," or to "foresee" as a prophet.) God always provides, adequate when the times come.

JEHOVAH-ROPHE: "The Lord Who Heals" Ex. 15:22-26. From "rophe" ("to heal"); implies spiritual, emotional as well as physical healing. (Jer. 30:17, 3:22; Isa. 61:1) God heals body, soul and spirit; all levels of man's being.

JEHOVAH-NISSI: "The Lord Our Banner." Ex. 17:15. God on the battlefield, from word which means "to glisten," "to lift up," See Psalm 4:6.

JEHOVAH-M'KADDESH: "The Lord Who Sanctifies" Lev. 20:8. "To make whole, set apart for holiness."

JEHOVAH-SHALOM: "The Lord Our Peace" Judges 6:24. "Shalom" translated "peace" 170 times means "whole," "finished," "fulfilled," "perfected." Related to "well," welfare." Deut. 27:6; Dan. 5:26; I Kings 9:25 8:61; Gen. 15:16; Ex. 21:34, 22:5, 6; Lev. 7:11-21. Shalom means that kind of peace that results from being a whole person in right relationship to God and to one's fellow man.

SHEPHERD: Psa. 23, 79:13, 95:7, 80:1, 100:3; Gen. 49:24; Isa. 40:11.

JUDGE: Psa. 7:8, 96:13.

JEHOVAH ELOHIM: "LORD God" Gen. 2:4; Judges 5:3; Isa. 17:6; Zeph. 2:9; Psa. 59:5, etc.

JEHOVAH-TSIDKENU "The Lord Our Righteousness" Jer. 23:5, 6, 33:16. From "tsidek" (straight, stiff, balanced - as on scales - full weight, justice, right, righteous, declared innocent.) God our Righteousness.

JEHOVAH-ROHI: "The Lord Our Shepherd" Psa. 23, from "ro'eh" (to pasture).

JEHOVAH-SHAMMAH: "The Lord is There" (Ezek. 48:35).

JEHOVAH-SABAOTH: "The Lord of Hosts" The commander of the angelic host and the armies of God. Isa. 1:24; Psa. 46:7, 11; 2 Kings 3:9-12; Jer. 11:20 (NT: Rom. 9:29; James 5:4, Rev. 19: 11-16).

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EL ELYON: 'Most High" (from "to go up") Deut. 26:19, 32:8; Psa. 18:13; Gen. 14:18; Nu. 24:16; Psa. 78:35, 7:17, 18:13, 97:9, 56:2, 78:56, 18:13; Dan. 7:25, 27; Isa. 14:14.

ABHIR: 'Mighty One', ("to be strong") Gen. 49:24; Deut. 10:17; Psa. 132:2, 5; Isa. 1:24, 49:26, 60:1.

BRANCH: (tsemach), The Branch: Zech. 3:8, 6:12; Isa. 4:2; Jer. 23:5, 33:15.

KADOSH: "Holy One" Psa. 71:22; Isa. 40:25, 43:3, 48:17. Isaiah uses the expression "the Holy One of Israel" 29 times.

SHAPHAT: "Judge" Gen. 18:25

EL ROI: "God of Seeing" Hagar in Gen. 16:13. The God Who opens our eyes.

KANNA: "Jealous" (zealous). Ex. 20:5, 34:14; Deut. 5:9; Isa. 9:7; Zech. 1:14, 8:2.

PALET: "Deliverer" Psa. 18:2.

YESHA: (Y'shua) "Savior" Isa. 43:3. Jesus is the Greek equivalent of the Hebrew "Joshua." The latter is a contraction of Je-Hoshua. ("Christ", the anointed one is equivalent to the Hebrew Maschiah, or Messiah).

GAOL: "Redeemer" (to buy back by paying a price). Job 19:25; For example, the antitype corresponding to Boaz the Kinsman-Redeemer in the Book of Ruth.

MAGEN: "Shield" Psa. 3:3, 18:30.

STONE: Gen. 49:24

EYALUTH: "Strength" Psa. 22:19.

TSADDIQ: "Righteous One" Psa. 7:9.

EL-OLAM: "Everlasting God" (God of everlasting time) Gen. 21:33; Psa. 90:1-3, 93:2; Isa. 26:4.

EL-BERITH: "God of the Covenant" Used of Baal in Judges 9:46. Probably used originally to refer to the God of israel.

EL-GIBHOR: Mighty God (Isa. 9:6)

ZUR: "God our Rock" Deut. 32:18; Isa. 30:29.

Malachi calls Messiah "The Sun of Righteousness" (Malachi 4:2).

Isaiah calls Messiah "Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God (El Gibhor), Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace" (Isa. 9:6).

'Attiq Yomin (Aramaic): "Ancient of Days," Dan. 7:9, 13, 22.

MELEKH: "King" Psa. 5:2, 29:10, 44:4, 47:6-8, 48:2, 68:24, 74:12, 95:3, 97:1, 99:4, 146:10; Isa. 5:1, 5, 41:21, 43:15, 44:6; 52:7, 52:10.

"The Angel of the Lord: " Gen. 16:7ff, 21:17, 22:11, 15ff, 18:1-19:1, 24:7, 40, 31:11-13, 32:24-30; Ex. 3:6, 13:21, Ezek. 1:10-13. Seen in the theophanies, or pre-incarnate appearances of the Son of God in the OT (See I Cor. 10:3 NT).

FATHER: 2 Sam. 7:14-15; Psa. 68:5; Isa. 63:16, 64:8; Mal. 1:6.

THE FIRST AND LAST: Isa. 44:6, 48:12.

posted March 09, 2006 08:52 PM         

Hos 2:16-20

And it shall be in that day, says the Lord, that you will call Me Ishi, and you shall no more call Me Baali [my Baal].

Interesting....as Baal/Baali is considered not a true god.

Ok..rant over...

posted March 09, 2006 08:56 PM         

NRSV - 13 You shall not murder.

TEV - 13 "Do not commit murder.

8th Commandment: DO NOT STEAL
KJV - 15 Thou shalt not steal.

NRSV - 15 You shall not steal.

TEV - 15 "Do not steal.

10th Commandment: DO NOT COVET
KJV - 17 Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.
NRSV - 17 You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife, or male or female slave, or ox, or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.

posted March 10, 2006 10:18 AM         

I have pondered many times over the question of worshipping Jesus if he indeed had walked the earth.
I have a very lame argument. If humans were created in the image of God, then God and his image is not very different. The guy next to me is God too. From my soul eyes I see how his ego has blinded him in to being in his sin. (The sin of ignorance, hatred, judgemental or what ever other negative qualities they experience because of their ego.) Now this one bit does not make them stop being God. If I must worship him I will. I am ready to bend down on my feet and wipe his feet. I think this was Jesus's message. A paradigm shift those times.

Oopsss....I lost my train of thoughts because my taxi is here.

Will come back here later....

posted March 10, 2006 11:56 AM         

Sadly tink, the link went the way of the crapaton. I will try to refind it tho

love