posted April 21, 2019 03:40 AM            

Firstly, I've one of the best relationships with my dad. And since young I've always been the type to just cry whenever someone bullies/gets angry with me and I don't get easily offended. I only learned to defend myself when I became older. Now I'm not afraid of confrontations but I still tend to avoid them because it gives me a headache. This is the result of growing up in a family filled with conflicts & bullying relatives. So now I avoid people with similar nature who bully and/or pick fights because it's an extremely stressful experience for me. I also feel stressed by people who demand a lot from me. I avoided a friend for 10yrs because of this (she was demanding and prone to heated arguments).

I also reflected on my love life... my ex-bfs were always the demanding ones... that I gotta be this/that and one of them was always annoyed over the slightest thing.

posted April 21, 2019 08:48 AM            

the energy will manifest in your life in one form or another even if it's not you, as for the parent relationships it can be a different parent that you have the issue with (in my case i don't care for either of my parents)

i've seen it listed as a love/hate aspect, and that i can relate to, if i love you i also can hate you no in between

i can relate to an extent, but i wouldn't say they're behaviors i regularly display, because i tend to be more laid back than all of that, and it takes a lot to actually get me mad and most people don't see it until years in because before then i don't generally give a **** the same way, or i'm only starting to care and everything is new so i'm unlikely to have strong negative feelings or reactions

like you i'm not easily offended (i'm extremely hard to offend because i'm apathetic in general and even moreso when it comes to what 95% of people have to say) though i've always been the fight back type rather than getting upset so we differ there

i'm not a particularly jealous person, and i can share so there's that but on my terms and if i dislike someone outside of that's behavior i admittedly do see it as them going after what's mine which is a possessive mentality regardless of manifestation past that

i can be quarrelsome, usually not though like you i prefer to not be bothered (unless it's something meaningless, i'm bored, i don't have to deal with the person but i generally save that up for pushing people's buttons with politics whether or not i agree with them) but if there needs to be an argument it will happen

cruel though yeah i can be cruel, i can also be extremely cold which is where that same thing comes from

i'm good at knowing what to say and do to make people feel better and the flipside of it is i also know what to say and do that would hurt them, and it comes from the same place it's just that i don't tend towards hurting people and i keep that side of myself pretty buried because there's no reason for it really

it surprises people though, i think the libra/venus energy tends to make them feel one way, and they can't imagine that i can be such a "cold ******* " (i've heard that exact phrase from a lot of people who have gotten to know me, though it's always more of a "you can be such a cold ******* " thing where that's not just me in general just how i can be at a certain point and in certain situations) until they see it

i'll tell people that upfront and it's always still not what they imagine (it really hits people with daddy issues in weird places i've noticed, i've had weird "my dad..." talks with women after the first time they've really argued with me) or they assume i'm joking

either way it's definitely there, and i make an active effort sometimes to avoid being that person

what i noticed with you though based on what you said is you seem to be more passive aggressive than me (whereas i'm either passive or aggressive but not both at the same time) talking about avoiding people who are argumentative and **** rather than working out problems or discussing them etc

and a lot of times people who are passive aggressive are actually way more aggressive than they realize but tell themselves they aren't doing anything because it doesn't seem like it, since part of that is pushing the other person into the aggressor position through more subtle behavior that's easy to deflect

depending on your mars and venus signs that makes sense (just like alternating between being laid back and wanting things to just go smoothly to not caring and being completely cold is how it works for me given the libra-cap energy, the combination makes me less volatile than other signs for you it might manifest as being laid back and then being passive aggressive depending on your chart) and could be what does it

this also sometimes creates situations where someone else might seem demanding or aggressive but really it's a reaction to the way you shut down communication (and a lot of people who have been in abusive situations as kids or dealt with their flight or fight responses being triggered frequently as children are neurologically affected as adults and can often be triggered into certain modes as they get older, "i cant deal with this" being one of them but over things that should be dealt with sometimes too) and put up a wall

i'd say reflect and you might see some of that behavior in yourself just not manifesting in the ways you picture it, and definitely in others in your life because it's also about what you attract in your relationships too

it's possible i'm wrong and it's just people outside of yourself, but sometimes subconscious behaviors that seem minor can affect the way other people act so it could be both you and them

posted April 21, 2019 09:30 AM            

1)The native's sensitivity to trouble & strife heightens. Its either they will consciously avoid "bottleneck" situations or passionate people.

So relationships become a bit of a challenge for the native as they want intimacy(Venus) but dislike strife or discord(Mars). And typically there is a heady mix of both, the closer they get to someone.

The result is often that as a result of being passive or sensitive, they may attract to them (unconsciously) people who are a lot more aggressive or combative. Like a moth to a flame(excuse the cliche).

And this is because of not "owning" the assertive elements of their personality or disassociating with their own ability to stand up for themselves or having to fight for peace etc.

There is too much self preservation and more balance needed in getting in touch with the inner "warrior".And not so much the "worrier".

2)The other side of the coin could see someone who picks a fight(Mars) a lot in relationships(Venus). They may be touchy, irritable, vexing to be with and quite a handful.

This is the other extreme where one feels that love (Venus) is a battlefield(Mars) where they have to "wrestle" the partner down and "win" etc.

In the latter case, the native needs to get more synchronized with their Venusian archetype qualities and learn to be still, be attentive, gentle and bring things to harmony

These people seem to love drama(especially when Venus is in Aries/Scorpio too) and so there is likely to be sexual arousal(Venus) linked to fights/ disagreements(Mars).

They mistake turbulence for "passion".And "drama" for love etc. The result being that they attract people who bring out angry feelings in them ie. usually the "meek", "mild" types who have disowned their Mars etc

In both cases however,Mars square Venus suggests that relationships will be a point of much strife. Obe has to consciously bring the needs of the self vs. the needs of what they want from another into constant balance.

posted April 21, 2019 01:54 PM            

I just feel that the descriptions of Venus square Mars make us out to be some kinda fighting roosters. I've Pisces Mars square Gemini Venus. I'm not afraid of confrontations but I choose my fights. If the person repeatedly pressed my buttons or did something seriously offensive, I'll tell them off, but I shut down if repeat attempts end in failure or I just find this person a lost cause.

Sometimes I'm passive-aggressive and I'll distance someone or cut them off in extreme cases. That happens when I feel that I can't get through to them or they're not worth my time. I remember a friend who stirred up so much **** when I confronted her (actually she called me when she knew I found out) she lied about doing any of such thing. When it happened the 2nd time she lied again and insisted I was mistaken. I cut her off as I see no room for a constructive confrontation with someone who refused to even be honest.

Like you I also know what to say that can hurt people, but I don't like to do it. A few cold words and cutting off can hurt more than a quarrel. With friends and loved ones, I quarrel if I feel it's worth a quarrel to sort things out.

posted April 21, 2019 05:22 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hikaru29:
@Dumuzi

I just feel that the descriptions of Venus square Mars make us out to be some kinda fighting roosters. I've Pisces Mars square Gemini Venus. I'm not afraid of confrontations but I choose my fights. If the person repeatedly pressed my buttons or did something seriously offensive, I'll tell them off, but I shut down if repeat attempts end in failure or I just find this person a lost cause.

Sometimes I'm passive-aggressive and I'll distance someone or cut them off in extreme cases. That happens when I feel that I can't get through to them or they're not worth my time. I remember a friend who stirred up so much **** when I confronted her (actually she called me when she knew I found out) she lied about doing any of such thing. When it happened the 2nd time she lied again and insisted I was mistaken. I cut her off as I see no room for a constructive confrontation with someone who refused to even be honest.

Like you I also know what to say that can hurt people, but I don't like to do it. A few cold words and cutting off can hurt more than a quarrel. With friends and loved ones, I quarrel if I feel it's worth a quarrel to sort things out.

One person that I often avoid a confrontation with is my mom because it usually leads to heated arguments (with my dad getting hit by stray bullets) so she's one person I refused to deal with for the sake of "world peace".

---

i never thought that of the descriptions tbh, read a few just now to see if i remembered them right

i know i can be aggressive, just how i am, it's not intentional it just is

as a result i tend to like people who are as well because i find that people who arent have this kind of weakness i cant respect and then i get bored of them so i tend to get close to more volatile people kn which case i don't mind the confrontation because there's enough reward for it to be worthwhile

not particularly the best, but it's why i like pluto heavy people so much

i'll distance myself in some cases, but i tend to just be upfront and say something when i was younger it would manifest differently

a fight would happen, i'd take it as an opportunity to push it further they'd snap, give me an excuse to be completely cold hurt them and walk away

i'd tend to spend time with people i didnt care for because they liked me and it'd make me feel guilty so i'd try to force myself to enjoy them, fail, and do that

when i was younger i was just more volatile in general though, lot of destructive urges and a need to release aggression though i tended towards vandalism and fights with strangers, setting **** on fire etc

channel it differently now, not as off balance with it, but i still tend towards close relationships like that and generally find it more engaging still

when i'm bored i'm a worse person is the reality of things

but most of the time it's more like i said, laid back and apathetic

people who knew me when i was younger find me now shocking and people who know me now who hear stories about me when i was younger are equally shocked

it was an awkwardness in a sense because pent up energy i didn't know what to do with tended to just come out aggressively channeled into doing dumb **** for a rush and fights while avoiding close personal relationships almost entirely keeping people at arms length

and with close relationships i feel like my fiancee and i basically taught each other how to interact in positive ways because neither of us had that in a home situation and we had to learn that as adults

with my parents as a kid i had an easier time avoiding conflict with my mother and my father it was impossible, but now as an adult i find my mother more grating and with my father well...

there's no closeness but him and i can get through an hour or so together if we make fun of something and then talk about cars or putting down floors and **** which is good enough

posted April 22, 2019 12:57 AM            

Usually I just wanna to be left alone and not be embroiled in complicated situations but people won't do that. I could be singled out as the ringleader just by being there. Strife finds me. It's very tiring to address each of them. I think with Venus square Mars, people sensed the edginess in us so they tend to see us as a threat even though we're just minding our own business. That's at least my experience.

I usually won't have long-drawn repeat quarrels with people because I find it a waste of time esp. if they're not even anyone important. I remember this gal who tried to provoke me whenever she saw me and she got a kick when she saw me getting annoyed, so I started to give her a non-response and she quit. These are what I called vampires so why should I let her "feed" on me?

posted April 22, 2019 08:38 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hikaru29:
^ I think it's all about channeling your energies to the right places. I'm very active when I was young - did a lot of sports. And I write. When I have differences with my friends & loved ones, I prefer to talk it out, not quarrel. But of course for people who refused to be reasoned with but just want to have a bitchy quarrel, I will take them on.

Usually I just wanna to be left alone and not be embroiled in complicated situations but people won't do that. I could be singled out as the ringleader just by being there. Strife finds me. It's very tiring to address each of them. I think with Venus square Mars, people sensed the edginess in us so they tend to see us as a threat even though we're just minding our own business. That's at least my experience.

I usually won't have long-drawn repeat quarrels with people because I find it a waste of time esp. if they're not even anyone important. I remember this gal who tried to provoke me whenever she saw me and she got a kick when she saw me getting annoyed, so I started to give her a non-response and she quit. These are what I called vampires so why should I let her "feed" on me?

I actually find you very patient from the way you reply posts on LL. You can come across aggressive but you also make the effort to reply most people's comments. I think that's a Libra trait?

---

you had a proper outlet younger than i did then, i was a lot more destructive than you i'm a lot calmer now and i got a lot of that aggression out as a kid by doing dumb **** (for me sports was playing chicken with cars and running away from **** i probably shouldn't have done in the first place) but i also did grow up needing to fight at home so when things aren't properly shaken up i can feel a need and in personal relationships where i don't feel the need to shake things up i tend to find difficult people

for a couple reasons 1 i tend to understand their lives better because they have a lot more in common even if it manifests differently, and 2 i find them more interesting

which is why i tend to end up around pluto heavy people, and because i don't generally just back down fights are inevitable with people like that but because i'm used to fighting it doesn't bother me in the way it does other people

outside of personal relationships i'm still like that, not always, generally i'm fine being left alone but every once in a while i crave an argument or something of that nature so i find appropriate outlets to feed that kind of thing

i've never been accused of being a ringleader in a close relationship or among groups of acquaintances etc and outside of that only by people i was actively ******* with that were all fairly inconsequential just testing boundaries as a kid/teenager and they weren't wrong, generally authority figures

i did get people riled up intentionally to **** with them when i was bored and found what was going on pointless and stupid

with people i talk it out when it's worthwhile yeah or to my advantage, but i don't mind arguments when they're worth having

i only find it worthwhile to have what i'd consider a real argument if i care or it's going to sever things (which will escalate quickly) and i want that, or it's just going to happen because conflicts of personality

what's funny is when i care about a person it's a matter of something being a repeated behavior that could have been exhibited over a minor thing, but it's the fact that repetitive behavior while minor every so often becomes much larger over time

so what seems like a small thing (and would be in an isolated incident) is part of a general pattern and it's the pattern that will have set me off not the seemingly minor event that triggers it, so i can be an ******* when i could probably handle something better in a close relationship at points

because "it's no big deal" until it is right? that's what letting **** slide because it's easier and not a big deal can so that's venus-mars in a sense

reality is you deal with it right the first time and you don't have to get to the point where it's a behavior necessarily, the default laid back venus **** not always the best method for some things, and honestly it's the fact that being used to extreme situations makes you nonreactive in situations other people would react to that adds to the behaviors that eventually cause a fight

you accidentally set up that kind of pattern longterm

but anyway what makes it funny is when i have to get along though i can control myself very well and just won't let attempts to start **** with me go anywhere even in highly emotionally volatile situations

in those cases sometimes the way i can act is completely calculated because then i'm not nice for their sake, it's more for mine and the people around me who i actually care about

a good example is my fiancee's mother who's an abusive narcissist that hates me because i "took her daughter away from her family" by dating her (nevermind that we were around so much her younger siblings called me their dad after their father died because her and i used to take care of them while their mother was off doing whatever the **** with whatever guy she met same as it was for a little while just before we started dating) and me hugging her at a funeral right after she told me how much she hated me and how it's all my fault her and her daughter don't get along

she spent a lot of time at the funeral trying to stir **** and get at my fiancee for having gone no contact with her once her siblings were adults and the situation became too unbearable, and scapegoating me (it was made a little harder by the fact that i spoke at the funeral, which worked to my advantage, but i didn't do that to get at her i did that to kill the last few minutes of time left

my fiancee's uncle was trying to pressure her brother to talk right before the funeral was over and he's a pisces moon and he'd just lost his twin and couldn't do that so i wasn't going to let someone have a chance to make him feel forced to speak about it to a group of people)

anyway we went back to her house afterwards with everyone (her brother asked us to) and while everyone was leaving i walked over to her and told her i was sorry and she launched into a speech about how she hated me and how hard she tried all the time to be decent to me in spite of hating me etc and how all she wanted was her daughter to talk to her and everything is my fault etc and so on

and because i could see everyone watching us, and i knew that my fiancee had gone there with the intention of clearing the air with the rest of her family and be honest about her mother's abuse being the reason she wasn't around i gave her a hug and told her it was alright and that i understand that she hates me and that her daughter is more than free to make her own choices etc

then i went to go puke because i was drunk as ****

but my point is i had lost someone i cared about deeply and then had to have some woman who abused her and other people i loved tell me how ****** she thought i was in front of people and rather than react i just gave her a hug, talked to her like she was reasonable and apologized etc not because i felt bad for her on any level but because i knew everyone was watching and it made her look like a ***** in turn making me look better and what my fiancee was saying have more weight

and people in her family noticed because they spoke to me about it the next day at the burial and how good i was for trying

reality is i wasn't trying to make peace with her which is what they took from my behavior, i was just showing her that my fiancee hates her because of something between them and showing that to everyone

so i can be in a lot of pain and dealing with someone who's stressful even under good circumstances and keep it together to not escalate things, but i can also go from being in a good mood with someone i care about to being really ****** off for a little while because they did something for the millionth time that would be completely alright if it was just once (usually it's overly defensive difficult behavior like what you describe setting you off)

in that sense as a lover, being close to me is definitely more volatile than not, because i tend to fall back on my libra traits when i deal with people who i'm not close to (moon square mars and moon opposite venus with the ascendant/descendant being involved probably add to this, but it's a little better thanks to mercury/uranus allowing for detachment) because that's surface default especially when i'm apathetic

without really picking it apart though i'd be inclined to say that it's more other people than me, because i can point out volatile behaviors in them when we're close that help things escalate, but it's both if i reflect honestly and really look at things past that

my energy just is that way and as a result it's also what i attract (which is why you get either manifestation to different degrees) but i also have a lot of other planets and aspects involved and hitting that aspect and it touching my ascendant could be why i notice it more than you would not to mention cardinal signs rather than mutable

i think venus-mars can just be a matter of short term pleasure or ease being prioritized over the long term in close relationships which is ultimately ineffectual, same way exerting yourself completely all at once as far as you're willing to go is also poor strategy

sometimes "peace" at appropriate times is strategic whereas at other times it's not and that balance is hard to find with the square because you get used to fighting and boundaries being pushed past as a child without that control being there

edit: it's also a matter of being forced as a child to have to act in an extreme manner in order to gain any ground and not get leveled by your surroundings (not just parents)

once your childhood is over the passivity/fighting in turn to those extents becomes irrelevant but all that energy is still there because it's how you were taught to function so you find people you repeat those patterns with until you find some kind of balance because you're used to extremes being necessary

because you learned if you're extremely passive one day you can avoid something, but in turn if you assert yourself with everything you have on another then you come out on top in another with no in between

you learn to not care about a lot of things through forced passivity, and then this gives an issue with showing that side of yourself that's assertive when it becomes necessary in situations that are less extreme than what you deal with

it's a weird sort of conditioning that can really make someone too passive and ineffectual as much as it can make someone who doesn't know when to stop fighting for every inch of ground they gain in a situation

at its most basic it's that kind of thing, because when you finally do want something you want it completely don't you? on one hand this isn't selfish in the larger picture, on the other you might go about getting things that are perfectly acceptable to want in a selfish manner in the moment

to someone with the square it makes sense, you were passive all this time so why is it when you finally do assert yourself you have to try so hard? can't they just give in because x amount of times it was different in their favor? but the reality is you probably waited too long until you had too much to let go of, and you've gotten the other person accustomed to certain kinds of behavior being acceptable

creates friction ultimately, and makes you appear selfish because in the moment you're finally reacting you probably are being selfish to some extent

learning to rely on other aspects or learning from those past situations helps a lot though

about me being patient, i can be for a very long time, people with the square often are until they're not

really think about you when your patience has run out then think about the aspect

posted April 22, 2019 08:48 AM            

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posted April 22, 2019 11:20 AM            

However, I find it an issue when people expect me to be a certain way like it's a given. Having said that, I could have also allowed tension to build which I shouldn't have, and when I finally raise it, they feel offended.

I think what you did with your fiancee's mom was right. It wouldn't have been wise to lock horns with her at that kinda occasion anyway and in front of everyone.

Sometimes I do that as well... when people pick a fight with me in plain view, I'll just let them put up their own "show". Like you it's not because I sympathise with them or anything.

You're right again the square makes it hard to find a balance between maintaining peace and aggression. I've learned since young that if I don't fight back, I get trampled by people. When I started to fight back I couldn't manage the energies well... took me years to centre my core.

I don't cry when people bully me anymore... I don't throw violent temper tantrums anymore... But I've also become more cold & cutting and I'm trying to manage that.

posted April 22, 2019 11:20 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
May have confusion in sexuality but will have a lot of charisma in kind of an edgy way

---

posted April 22, 2019 12:43 PM            

2nd = no problems with expression of my sensuality while dancing, expressive for sure

3rd = i want love and romance and a relationship but.... i'm too lazy to engage in the dynamics of courtship/dating etc.

ahahahhahah

venus scorpio/mars virgo square

posted April 22, 2019 02:05 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hikaru29:
@Dumuzi
Thanks for sharing your experience. Perhaps you're right, that they get accustomed to certain behaviour being acceptable... and they kinda expect it. I wouldn't say I bent backwards for them... I did what I did because I was ok with it. Like I said I'm usually easy-going... I don't have all kinds of strict Dos/Don'ts and I find people like this very troublesome.

However, I find it an issue when people expect me to be a certain way like it's a given. Having said that, I could have also allowed tension to build which I shouldn't have, and when I finally raise it, they feel offended.

I think what you did with your fiancee's mom was right. It wouldn't have been wise to lock horns with her at that kinda occasion anyway and in front of everyone.

Sometimes I do that as well... when people pick a fight with me in plain view, I'll just let them put up their own "show". Like you it's not because I sympathise with them or anything.

You're right again the square makes it hard to find a balance between maintaining peace and aggression. I've learned since young that if I don't fight back, I get trampled by people. When I started to fight back I couldn't manage the energies well... took me years to centre my core.

I don't cry when people bully me anymore... I don't throw violent temper tantrums anymore... But I've also become more cold & cutting and I'm trying to manage that.

---

well that's what i mean about something being ok until it's not, because i'm the same way i don't have boundaries in ways that a lot of people can til i do and someone finds it by accident usually by doing something they might've done several times over and that'll be the time i'm not in the mood for it

i can be cold then (cap mars), and it'll be surprising for them, but understandably so when you're used to getting libra energy

when what people see is one side of things and they don't expect the other then there's a lot of confusion, of course you can't expect someone to always react the same or always just be open on some level but it's unrealistic to expect people to really think about that particularly hard at any given moment

i do what you do i just express it a little different, and when i reflect i see how it could be taken by someone outside of that which is an abrupt change in demeanor with no warning or build up even though on my end it makes perfect sense that they'll eventually see the other side of me

what i did with my fiancee's mother was right yeah, but it didn't have to be done, i walked up to her and i could've avoided her altogether

i just didn't because i saw an opening to make her come off in a way that worked better for both my fiancee and myself so i took it

of course i wasn't going to lock horns with her (funny that you said that though her and i are both aries moons, which i'm used to my fiancee is an aries moon so is my mother) under any circumstances, but i initiated that conversation and then proceeded to feign sympathy (i had none for her, we both lost someone but as far as i was concerned none of her feelings actually mattered because she spent years handing me, all her children, and i'm not even sure how many other teenagers and kids free opiates and benzos for years then her daughter died of an od) because i knew what being nice to her and looking like i wanted to make peace would come off like and i knew exactly who was watching

i could've walked right past her and she would've just sent me death glares but stayed quiet to not make a show, by creating and controlling the show that was made i took the upper hand

that's what i mean about myself though, in situations where someone i don't care about is directly trying to pull open wounds it won't happen because i can be pretty dead inside lol so it's not this uncontrollable temper thing, and i'd say that right there is a case of me being capable of using both the libra and cap energy effectively together though the balance is hard to achieve when it's me doing something with just me in mind (which is why in closer personal relationships i find that balance harder to achieve)

me losing my temper, when i do lose it, is really ****** up and i can't even lie about that because i'm legitimately a very cold person then who can and will draw out everything that will leave the other person feeling crushed and if i have no feelings at all towards them at that point it'll be 10x worse (i very rarely actually feel bad about it afterward, i have to absolutely love someone to feel that way, and that's not true of very many people)because i can be very thorough

meanwhile having boundaries in the first place probably would've altered that ever being an outcome, but like you though i'm typically just laid back and see no reason for it

like you it's not that i'm bending over backwards it's just that one time i laid out a boundary because i felt like i needed it temporarily i went extra if it was ignored by someone who was really used to getting something else from me

in that way though there's responsibility on my part for it, just like for you if you recognized things sooner instead of defaulting to the laid back venusian tendencies your mars when it came out wouldn't be so shocking or full force

especially because when you start off, being nice or not, suddenly setting a boundary the other person being used to being treated in a completely opposite manner isn't going to just immediately respect it every time so they push and when you push back it's full force

of course it won't be what it was when you were younger as you get older and better at dealing with it, but it'll be extreme and it'll be an intense experience for the other person

from a person with the venus-mars square's perspective it makes perfect sense, there was build up, but the person on the receiving end got no build up or feed back they just got venus until they got mars and they got them both full force

like you i was taught asserting myself to an extreme was the only manner in which it worked from an early age through a lot of hard **** , and i also had a breakdown of personal boundaries which made me unclear of what they are or how to have them, but i'm sure you can see how that creates issues and can give people a different impression from the outside than the inside

i completely get you though and i know where you're coming from and why you feel like "i'm more laid back though" than people tend to describe when they're only focusing on the more explosive side of things, but outside looking in completely detached from my own **** i can see why some people might describe the square in that manner

edit: not sure what's meant about the confused sexuality thing ami anne said in relationships that are sexual it manifests as love/hate if i love the person and just complete indifference with sex attached if i don't

i'm bi and not particularly masculine as far as appearances go but i wouldn't say there was confusion there lol maybe for other people who aren't comfortable with androgyny i suppose

i just don't love people who don't make me feel both extremes of what love is (love and hate, opposite of love is indifference) because then they don't make me feel enough emotion to love them

so how can i? i need extremes to feel balanced and i need both in one person

this doesn't work for everyone, but it's why i tend to like plutonic people they'll make you feel everything and feel it with you other people don't hit me there

it's not that i confuse passion for fighting like some people will say, i don't, but the two go hand in hand with me if i feel no passion i won't fight (if i fight with someone i'm close to but dislike i'll feel passion because they'll have affected me for a long time before anything goes wrong) and i'll get what i want through more underhanded needs that i'll hide behind lots of smiling and being friendly because it's easier

but if i love you, we'll fight because then i'll actually have more feelings and **** that i don't really care for having but do anyway

posted April 22, 2019 02:12 PM            

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posted April 22, 2019 05:26 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by coffeecuriosity:
lol so here is how it manifests for me =

first of all i've been told i 'exude sexuality' and i'm quite magnetic and eye catching

2nd = no problems with expression of my sensuality while dancing, expressive for sure

3rd = i want love and romance and a relationship but.... i'm too lazy to engage in the dynamics of courtship/dating etc.

ahahahhahah

venus scorpio/mars virgo square

and gendry slamming the axe in last nights episode of GOT really got me going.
just he is my absolute type urgh, like shy and so into her but quite dominant and confident too.. yasss

---

that's interesting, i put consistent effort in despite always wondering if i'd be happier entirely alone without any relationships with anyone else where i have feelings

it'll be years in i'll still be taking someone out on dates and giving them surprises and all that **** but the entire time i'm simultaneously thinking about chewing my arm off and running away

but then i'll legit go through pretty much anything and everything if i love someone and i've promised them something

so i'm similar in the sense that i feel two very conflicting ways about relationships but different because i don't necessarily want all the actual real world messiness and effort relationships can take (i'm never 100% sure on things like that, certainty can be an impossibility)

commitment terrifies me but i'll stand by commitments i've made consistently and not ease up on efforts in spite of obstacles

when it comes to sex i'm very aware that people are attracted to me and people can be a little invasive when it comes to letting me know that (either through what they say or just physically touching me and getting close) or just intense offering me things (in particular older gay and sometimes bi men are this way with me but i've had women behave this way too) and with what they say

i get a lot of intense behavior from people sexually or otherwise just in general

posted April 22, 2019 07:31 PM            

T-square Mars square Venus in Gemini & square Moon-Neptune in Sagittarius (as seen in your natal chart positions here on LL) places a bit more emphasis on Moon-Neptune than on stem planet Mars. So sensitivity and empathy are more marked, easily taking on others' feelings/ This is a Moon sign/aspect combination that is more boundaryless than most people. (That Moon position is 18° if measured topocentrically, so not quite as wide a conjunction as would first appear to be.)

So the t-square should be interpreted with Venus square Mars seen as part of it, but not the strongest part, which is Moon-Neptune. Moon-Neptune opposite Venus emphasizes sensitivity and tenderness even more -- enough to soften from two directions -- Venus and Neptune -- the expected reactivity/aggression of Mars.

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"Drift like a cloud and flow like water, seeing that all life is a magnificent illusion, a playing of energy, and there is absolutely nothing fundamentally to be afraid of." -- Alan Watts

posted April 23, 2019 05:39 AM            

Like you, the opposite of love for me is also indifference.

I don't particularly like Plutonic people (they exhaust me at times) but I find myself attracting them! Both as friends and lovers. I chase after light-hearted feelings but I find intense connections running after me.

posted April 23, 2019 08:56 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hikaru29:
@Dumuzi,

Like you, the opposite of love for me is also indifference.

I don't particularly like Plutonic people (they exhaust me at times) but I find myself attracting them! Both as friends and lovers. I chase after light-hearted feelings but I find intense connections running after me.

---

i'm used to them, they're always in my life and always who i end up getting close to (what's funny is this is true even with sidereal placements people im around will still have scorpio placements) even as a kid that's just who i was around

if not scorpio then just some heavy pluto aspects on personal planets in their charts and in their synastry with me, i get a lot of saturn in synastry too

my ex fwbs had his pluto/moon conjunction on my saturn (his saturn was on my moon/descendant) square my sun, the composite had sun conjunct pluto in scorpio

another aquarius friend i have who has venus opposite pluto has her pluto on my ascendant/venus and her venus conjunct my descendant/moon (so that's all hitting my kite/t-square)

i have a scorpio friend (scorpio sun and mercury and uranus in scorpio is on his sun or mercury i cant remember which) whose libra pluto/venus conjunction is on my ascendant too

my fiancee and i have pluto stuff and she has heavy pluto **** , i had a friend for years with a scorpio moon and considering the age gap probably also had pluto on my ascendant, an ex with a scorpio mars (conjunct pluto both square her sun), my mother has a **** ton of scorpio (mercury, ascendant, venus, neptune), first close friend did etc

posted April 23, 2019 09:42 AM            

I know some people have a love/hate for intense people, the energy makes them feel "alive" for some.

Is it that scorpio feels "genuine and raw"? And that makes you feel the connection is "deep and real"?

Is it that you have much darkness (well we all have) and turmoil and storms inside of you that feels cathartic to release in deeper connection with scorpios?

I have had some intense up and downs with love interest before. All saturnian, neptunian, libra and fire heavy people and

everytime I thought "well now its not light hearted anymore between us, he sure as hell can't take this intensity, he will back off all scared".

But the persons would always still be there, seemed like they enjoyed the up n downs and crisis and the confusing pain even when they themselves was not plutonic or just a bit plutonic.

Maybe its like, you see the plutonic dramatic person like an erratic, enigmatic wild horse and its an exciting dynamic where you are, not trying to tame the horse, but just enjoying the energies so to speak?

Or you get tired of the rosy romantic feels (looking at libra and neptune!) and just wanna get out the bad things inside of you...

I hope you get the idea I'm trying to get across,

I'm not good at explaining my mind that well in english:/

I can just say that for plutonians, we have all that inside of us, so we will be caught in our own emotional storm regardless if you are causing anything.

Its like we are gasoline and other people are a small spark of fire that makes us explode sooner or later emotions wise.

Like the other person does not have to do much, we will hurt ourselfs anyway

posted April 23, 2019 09:42 AM            

I read it as "Uranian people being attracted to pluto energy". In dumuzis case I know you are uranian and I always have attracted uranian people, they seem to wanna be able to connect with super intense energies because it helps with their "detachment" (I haate that word). Or neptunians aswell, as it helps them with their "apathic or passive feelings"

What do you guys think?

posted April 23, 2019 10:22 AM            

i like the intensity because i feel generally detached yeah, i rarely feel much of anything towards most people and in general so i like when a person can hit me in a place where i feel everything

i do have a love/hate for it because i'm not particularly comfortable with having feelings at all lol but it has its value ultimately and is meaningful so i like that

my connections with them have been deep and real whereas with most people i can enjoy them, see them every day, interact with them all the time and then one day leave and not miss them or care that they're not in my life anymore i'll just meet new people and those people will be just as good

plutonic people i dont generally feel that way about, i'll miss them, i'll care, i'll want them around and not someone else and even in the time that i'm away from them i can still feel that connection rather than them just disappearing from my life out of sight out of mind

i have plenty of **** inside me i'm disconnected from and pluto people can bring some of that to the surface come to think of it, but this is the first time i ever thought about that so i'd need to think further to give you details on that

i think having heavy libra makes it feel almost balanced for me, since i have a lot of uranus + libra it sort of balances that detachment and i like that in another person same as me going for water heavy people because i lack it

having a lot of fire in my chart helps in the sense that i'm not easily pulled under by their intensity and can sometimes pull them out of their obsessive loops when they're not ok

i think the ups and downs work for me in the sense that they just feel like part of what life is and again i can't normally feel a lot outside of those sorts of relationships so i feel like i need that to feel human if that makes sense, makes me feel alive keeps things interesting etc

i get bored, the intensity shakes things up enough for me to pay attention and not feel that way

posted April 23, 2019 12:31 PM            

i suppose what i like about them is they show everything, and force things out of you either that or they just learn it on their own because they're always watching

the issue with them is they tend to think they're always right and get emotional based on that and when you go along with them for a ride it changes you, they change but you do with them or because they were around for a bit

they say the kind of things that stick, and that works for me because of my detachment issues

posted April 23, 2019 12:51 PM            

I like intensity and passion in a relationship but I find it exhausting to deal with people who don't manage their pluto/scorpio energies well, e.g. I know a Scorpio gal who constantly overanalysed people/situations and thought that everyone was out to get her. She would get annoyed over little things and accused people of trying to backstab her. In the end she cut me off over a misunderstanding, wouldn't listen to my explanation and not only that, took revenge by creating a lie turning everyone against me. She's probably an extreme case but she also showed me how crazy an unhealthy plutonian/scorpio can be.

There was also another Scorpio guy who refused to talk to me again because he asked me to be his gf and I said I needed to think about it because I felt we were moving too fast. He got offended.

posted April 27, 2019 05:35 AM            

All the things you mentioned about yourself and how you find the pluto energy, is what I absolutely sensed in him aswell both instinctual and in rational ways aswell..

I could see he was really being affected by my plutonic energies even when he tried not to. As said I was not doing anything on purpose, it was all defence mechanisms etc in my case... very instinctive..

This is also like the song Bono sings " Can't live with you or without you". One really needs to get away from each other from time to time to process and collect one self..

But what to do when you can't see each other face to face and both parties refuses to take the first step to reconnect?

I'm in such pain, but I'm afraid he is just unfeeling about it all... I imagine him being like "F this sh**t I'm outta here!" and blaming it all on me for not reconnecting.

Yes I do believe plutonic people does help one to face ones inner demons so you can process them one way or the other. Its not a delightfull experience, but pain seems to make people connect very well emotionally...