posted August 16, 2006 12:39 PM            

I don't have Mercury in Sagittarius,but I do have something similar. I have Jupiter in Sagittarius in 3rd,and its conjunct my IC with 3 degree orb.
My 9th house ruler(Venus)conjunct my Mercury in Scorpio in 3rd house. I also have Neptune in Sagittarius in 3rd house. Therefore,I have 2 Sagittarius Planets in 3rd along with 9th house ruler conjunct Mercury in 3rd house. I guess that would give me the affinity with Mercury in Sagittarius. I also have retrograde Saturn in Gemini in 9th which oppose my Jupiter-Neptune in Sagittarius in 3rd,and my Moon in Pisces in 6th squares it. That's my primary indicator of my Dyslexia,Dyspraxia, and 3 yrs of special education in my early years. Transiting Jupiter is in my 3rd house right now,and so that indicates my thinking,communications is more expansive. I have Mercury seminovile Jupiter with only 4 minutes of arc which appears as Mercury oppose Jupiter with 33 minutes of arc in the 9th harmonic chart.

I agree with all the affinity stuff. Those are important for helping two relate to each other. Yes...the synastry aspects does help pull the affinities into consciousness. The synastry aspects are the connections...especially if there are some conjunctions,oppositions,and aspect configurations. I am not sure if lack of Venus aspects and Ascendant aspects indicate lack of attraction. I haven't seen anything conclusive about that. My Venus doesn't aspect my gal's planets in major aspects,and I am definitely very attracted to her. Her Venus doesn't aspect my planets but trines my Ascendant with only 3 minutes of arc,and she's definitely very attracted to me. She and I have very strong 8th house synastry. As you know, 8th house is the house of sex,transformation,shared resources,and regeneration. It is one of the psychic houses. Her Sun,Mercury,Mars are in my 8th. My Sun,Mercury,and Venus are in her 8th house. That could indicate a strong sexual attraction. Our Ascendants in opposition to each other with only 16 minutes of arc seems to definitely a very strong attraction. Venus trine Ascendant and Ascendant oppose Ascendant are the closest major aspects in our synastry. I look at midpoints too. It's weird. Her Sun is in my 8th house and opposes my Venus/Mars midpoint. My Sun is in her 8th and squares her Venus/Mars midpoint. That's a double whammy,and that would definitely seem to indicate a strong mutual sexual attraction. I also wonder if her 5th house ruler(Moon) conjunct my Sun(the natural ruler of the 5th house) and trine my Moon indicate a mutual romantic attraction. From my studies,I have learned that house rulerships are important. They can be used in not just houses but also aspects. They work in transits,secondary progressions,solar arcs,synastry,and natal. Vedic Astrologers use house rulerships extensively. Her Venus oppose my Sun/Venus midpoint indicates that she can be attracted to and love my will to have relationships,love,and create. That's an indicator of a physical/romantic attraction between us. Her Mars oppose my Venus/Pluto midpoint and my Mars conjunct her Venus/Uranus midpoint is a double whammy of a midpoint configuration involving Venus and Mars,and that can indicate mutual sexual attraction. Our Marses are both 8th house rulers in our charts,and they sextile each other with only 26 minutes of arc. As you see midpoints can be good at finetuning chart readings. I have been studying Cosmobiology and Uranian Astrology which is based heavily on the use of midpoints. The use of midpoints in traditional Astrology is modern cutting edge technique. I use the conjunction,opposition,square,semisquare,and sesquiqadrate. I would also use no more than 1 degree orb. That would keep the midpoints manageable. That's how Cosmobiology works. I don't use any of the minor planets. I don't need them. There are just so many,and you can just find any configuration that fits. They are good for finetuners though,and so I don't discount their significance. I like to see strong themes in a chart. A minor planet configuration should confirm something that's already shown in traditional astrology and not reveal something new. I feel the same with midpoint configurations too. Robert Hand talked about that. I would also look into the use of minor aspects as finetuners too. The minor aspects aren't necessarily minor. They just require smaller orbs. Many traditional astrologers don't use them because they are hard to see in a chart with the exception of the semisextile and quincunx which are also whole sign aspects. The semisquare and sesquiquadrate are used in Uranian Astrology and Cosmobiology,and the practitioners of those astrological systems find those aspects to work stronger than trines and sextiles when it comes to midpoints. They only use the hard aspects with midpoints because the intensity of the aspects trigger those sensitive points. I looked in the Astrological Encyclopedia. 5th harmonic aspects are given an influence of 1 to 3 degrees, depending on the astrologer. 7th harmonic aspects are often give an influence of 1 to 2 degrees. 9th harmonic aspects are given an orb of 1 to 2 degrees. BTW...Trine is not only a 3rd harmonic,but it is also a 9th harmonic aspect. 120 degrees is also 3 times 40(the degree of a novile. 8th harmonics(Semisquares and sesquiquadrates) are given an orb of 2 to 3 degrees. Noel Tyl is big on the quindecile(165 degree aspect),and he gives an influence of up to 2.5 degrees. 10th harmonic aspects are given an orb of 1 to 2 degrees. I won't go beyond the 10th harmonic. The 11th harmonic is most prominent in my chart(my Ascendant,Mercury,Mars,Saturn,and Uranus form what looks like a longhorned pentagram or a longlegged pentagram...the "chin" points to Uranus and the horns points to Mars and Saturn). I actually have Uranus conjunct the Mercury/Ascendant midpoint and oppose Mars/Saturn midpoint. Midpoint configurations are often involved in aspect patterns,and they include also minor aspect patterns. As you see, I am very much into geometrical and harmonic Astrology. Vedic Astrologers use harmonic charts extensively including especially the 9th harmonic chart for marriage and to use as a 2nd main chart. I have been thinking about experimenting with using the 9th harmonic chart as a 2nd main chart in Western Astrology.

I use only 5 degree orb for Synastry aspects except when they involve outerplanets. I only use 2 degree orbs for Uranus and 1 degree orb for Neptune and Pluto. The reason why I use wider orbs for Uranus is that Uranus travels much faster than Neptune and Pluto. If you check astrology-numerology.com, Uranus is the only outerplanet that is included in the synastry aspects. I also slightly stretch the orb out when it's part of an aspect pattern. If the out of orb aspects involve a stationary planet,I definitely take that aspect into account. I pay close attention to those stationary planets. Those planets are powerful by themselves,and they have a powerful influence in a house too. Even stationary social and outerplanets have a powerful influence in a house. If they aspect an angle or personal planet, those can be very strong connections..especially if the aspects are less than 2 degree orb. That is how I work with aspects. I find that it works for me. Aspect orbs are hotly debated in Astrology. There is no definite agreement on what is considered a too wide orb or a too narrow orb. You just have to see what works for yourself. Another thing to keep in mind is that some people can relate to wide orbed aspects because they are part of a midpoint configuration. For instance..somebody can feel that they have Moon square Uranus,Moon square Saturn,and Saturn oppose Uranus even though all those aspects are too wide. They could probably identify with it because they have Moon oppose Saturn/Uranus midpoint within 1 degree. Close aspect patterns tend to be also midpoint configurations that are much less than 1 degree. I notice that tight grand trines involving Saturn aren't all that great because they turn out to be 3 midpoint configurations involving Saturn. A very close orbed Moon,Saturn,Neptune grand trine turn out to be 3 midpoint configurations of Moon,Saturn,and Neptune which can be challenging configurations in midpoint astrology which suggest that there is likelihood for depression,suffering,and health problems. Very close orbed grand trines are much powerful than wide orbed grand trines. Midpoints are geometrical concept. Western Astrology is mainly geometrically based.

Parallels and Contraparallels are really valuable. They are hidden aspects that are often missed in charts. The orbs can vary too. They are not so cut and dry that I have seen as I have showed you with my Mars contraparallel Pluto beyond a 1 degree orb appears as Mars oppose Pluto under 4 degree orb. Robert Hand recommends only a 5 degree orb in his book, HOROSCOPE SYMBOLS. Parallels and Contraparallels are aspects in the declinations which are latitude coordinates involving the celestial equator. If points are on the same side of the celestial equator and within orb, they are parallel. That has an effect as a conjunction. If points are on opposite sides of the celestial equator and within orb,they are contraparallel. That has an effect as an opposition. Parallels in a regular chart often appear as conjunctions in a declination longitude equivalent chart. Contraparallels often appear as oppositions in a declination longitude equivalent chart.

I agree that challenging aspects in synastry aren't necessarily bad,and that they can be like weights that help you build muscle. The challenges can help each other build character. I just don't like seeing challenging aspects involving Mars because they can indicate problems with aggression,anger,impatience,violence,and irritation. I don't like seeing challenging aspects involving Saturn because they can indicate restrictions,limitations,too much controlling,depression,and pessimism. I don't like seeing challenging aspects involving Uranus because they can indicate instability,unpredictability,restlessness,rebelliousness,erraticness,and change. When I mean change, I mean that there can be change in partners. You can see the problems that can cause. I only use no more than 2 degree orb for Uranus synastry aspects..unless one of the planets in the aspect is stationary. BTW. Sun and Moon are the ones that are never stationary nor retrograde. I don't like Neptune challenging aspects because they can indicate too much idealism,seeing each other with rosecolored glasses,confusion,deception,illusion,escapism,too much sacrificing,codependency,and denial. I don't like Pluto challenging aspects in a synastry because they can indicate too much intensity,power issues,manipulation,secrets,trust issues,resentment,vindictiveness,violence,and danger. I only use no more than 1 degree orb for Neptune and Pluto aspects..unless one of the planets in the aspect is stationary. I also consider conjunctions to be wild card aspects because they can operate as challenging or easy. It really depends on how the conjunction is aspected. Also..cosmobiologists and uranian astrologers consider conjunctions as hard aspects too, and so do medical astrologers. The conjunction is and that involves the energies merging and fusing. That's a very intense aspect,and that is why it activates midpoints like the square,opposition,semisquare,and sesquiquadrate does. All those aspects are said to be event-oriented aspects. The uranian astrologers have said that the easy aspects work on a psychological level only and are not related to events. One of the reasons that I don't like challenging Saturn and outerplanets in synastry is that they work on a higher level and they can be hard to control...especially the outerplanets. The challenging synastry aspects indicate the possibility one or both people can have psychological issues too...whether it's anxiety,depression,psychotic,personality type issues. Also neurodivergent conditions that include Autism,Aspergers,AD/HD,Dyslexia,Dyspraxia, Sensory Integration Disorder. It could even be trust issues from being a victim of some type of abuse. Challenging Pluto aspects can definitely indicate that there can be skeletons in the closet. Challenging aspects can be great for growth,but there is much to learn and work on before you reap the benefits. As you have read about Saturn which some astrologers say is the karmic planet. What you sow is what you reap. Saturn's glyph is the sickle which is a reaping tool.

I am a strong believer in Free will. I believe that it is the ultimate factor. I believe that we can make our energies work. However, the challenging aspects indicate that there is a lot of effort need to make those energies work well. I know this personally with my t-square of Moon in Pisces in 6th,retrograde Saturn in Gemini in 9th,Jupiter-Neptune in Sagittarius in 3rd. My life has been challenging overall. I have had challenges early in life. For instance,I have Dyslexia that involved serious auditory processing and speech problems,and so I needed special education. I also had coordination/balance problems. Specialists thought that I would need special education until 7th grade. I was out of special education by 3rd grade. I overcame a lot of the challenges of my Dyslexia and Dyspraxia that I got out of special much faster than predicted. They said that it was because of my high IQ. I was lucky that my Dyslexia was caught at 4 years old because of my foreign sounding language while trying to speak my native English language. hehehehe I got early intervention special education in my early school years(1st and 2 years of 2nd grade). I had auditory therapy,speech therapy,and phonics that helped correct my Dyslexia and enabled me to compensate. I had fine motor skills therapy and swimming helped with my gross motor skills. I am a very good dancer,a very fast runner with quick reflexes,and a very good with massage in spite of still having some coordination issues,awkwardness,and clumsiness which is typical of Dyspraxics. I was lucky to have great special ed teachers who believed in me. I guess my Sun trine my t-square apex Moon indicated that I had the luck and gift to overcome my Dyslexia,Dyspraxia,and special education. I guess have Mercury conjunct Venus in Scorpio in 3rd could indicate that too. Maybe my Jupiter in 3rd conjunct IC in Sagittarius. Any ways...I realized that I was actually lucky even though I thought I was unlucky for being in special education. It was better to be in special education and be called a "retard" for a few years,and be very literate than not be in special education and be very illiterate which many Dyslexics are for not getting help. Many of them do keep their problems a secret. If they are gifted without language problems,they can compensate well and hardly anybody has a clue about their issues. Yeah...I know about great challenges and to be able to overcome them. I believe that everybody has challenges that help them learn and grow. This applies to people in relationship too.

If you have any questions, Please feel free to ask. I also feel that you really know your stuff. I look forward to more discussions with you. I really do admire your thought processes.

May I check out your chart?

To each, his own
Whatever floats your boat
Different strokes for different folks

I really believe these terms really apply to Astrology.

posted August 16, 2006 04:35 PM              

according to your description of your horoscope, can it be that you have been born on 10/29/1971 at 3:15 a.m.?
And of course you may check out my chart, actually I feel flattered that you want to do it.
I was born on 12 / 18 / 1974 at 7:07 in Viersen (that is close to Düsseldorf in Germany).

When writing about your synastry, you wrote that "Venus trine Ascendant and Ascendant oppose Ascendant are the closest major aspects in our synastry."
I think those aspects qualify as Venus-aspects, because they connect to the Descendent and that is a Venus-point.
Also I think Ascendant oppose Ascendat are among the strongest signs of attraction. Each of you has, what the other one needs. what more can you want?

When you mentioned the emphasis on the 8th house (and I can only say: Wow! That is surely magnetic!), I suddenly understood something.
In another thread I posted my confusion why I feel so fascinated by this actor, Keanu Reeves. I couldn`t see the astrological reasons for it.
Because honestly our synastry chart has some horrible aspects.
For example: his Sun, Mercury, Uranus stellium is opposite my Jupiter and square my Neptune, therefore creating a very challenging T-square (and the square between Neptune and Sun has an arc of 0°15 and the square of Neptune and Mercury has an even closer arc of 0°01).
No major Venus and Mars aspects (well, now with my new knowledge I can see of course that my Sun and Venus are contraparallel his moon, that my Descendant is parallel his Mars and that my Ascendant is parallel his IC).
But maybe what created that fascination for me was the emphasis on the 8th house.
His Moon, Venus and Mars fall all into my 8th house (even though Moon and Mars are also conjunct my Saturn; probably not the best placement).
Concerning midpoints we share some connections,too.
My moon is opposite his Sun-Venus, Venus-Uranus, Mars-Uranus and Mars- Pluto (well, maybe a bit much Uranus for my taste).
His Mars is opposite my Sun-Moon and Mars-Jupiter.
And interestingly enough, Moon is the ruler of my 8th house and Mars is the ruler of his 8th house.
So maybe THAT is the reason for that fascination with him.

Like you said, I also think rulerships of houses are very important. I consider the ruler of the 1st, 4th, 5th, 7th and 8th house to be important for relationships, since they represent Mars, Moon, Sun and Venus.
So, yes, I think that the 5th house ruler conjunct your sun and trine your moon indicates strong mutual romantic attraction. Definitely!
I once had my 5th house ruler (Venus) trine a man`s Venus and also trine his Pluto (yes, it has been a Grand trine, and his Venus also fell into my 5th house) and I was completely under his spell. I mean, there was real magic in the air. Well, it was unrequited, but all those romantic feelings I had for him inspired me, actually he was the one who set my creativity free. I wrote nearly 300 pages of poems for him in 4 years. Yip, I definitely consider the rulership in synastry.

you wrote about harmonics. What is this? I am not familiar with them, I fear.
I also don`t use minor aspects and planets. NOt because I don`t believe they are unimportant, but it all gets a bit crowded in my brain, too much to handle. And I like to see the big picture. But if I get lost in too many details, I lose that "big picture", so I stick to the major aspects I think.

You wrote: "Another thing to keep in mind is that some people can relate to wide orbed aspects because they are part of a midpoint configuration"
Yes, that is an idea I have been thinking about, too.
I recently stumbled over the midpoints, and found them fascinating, but didn`t know how to interprete them or if they are really valuable. My feeling sais they are definitely important. If you look at all the wonderful geometry and symmetry in astrology, midpoints seem to be such a natural part of it all.

On your view on Mars aspect, I think I agree. I also don`t want to have too many Mars-squares in my synastries. This energy can lead to violence, of course it doesn`t have to, but why take the risk?
Also, I think Neptune-squares are often underestimated. They can be very destructive, in a slow, hardly noticeable, dreamy way. But with Neptune aspects (even the conjunction in my opinion) it`s really difficult to see the other one as he or she is and then, if he or she falls from the pedestal, you can end up so disappointed, disillusioned and sometimes heartbroken.

You said you believe in Free will.
I agree. Of course I do.
But I sometimes wonder: what or who determines our free will? What or who makes us want,what we want?
Well, that is a philosophical question, but generally I think Free will is important. And yet I believe in fate and karma.
But I think fate gives us opportunities, arranges meetings with people or events, but what we make out of it, is up to us.

You wrote that you have Dyslexia; I`m very glad that you`ve had so good teachers. I know it must still have been hard, but at least you`ve had people who cared for you.
I am a teacher myself and it breaks my heart to see some of my fellow-teacher, who still think a kid is stupid or stubborn, just because it has Dyslexia. It makes me so angry and sad. But this has also to do with the fact, that I have a mentally handicapped brother, and I know how cruel, mean, thoughtless and shallow people can be.
You also mentioned coordination / balance problems. wEll, this is something I can relate to. I also have coordination problems, but didn`t have a special education. I guess they were not so bad, that anyone would notice.

Oh it`s so much fun to discuss those things with you. You`re giving me a lot of input and I love to learn from people, who are as gifted, intelligent and generous with their knowledge as you. Thank you.

posted August 17, 2006 12:26 AM              

Thanks! Im doing some research into this aspect. My guess would be that youre the Venus person? In any case the Venus person is supposed to be the best cure for Moon's anxieties. Its a lovely aspect.

posted August 17, 2006 09:07 PM              

I agree with darkdreamer's theory that the effect of the synastry aspects really depends on the individual's natal chart.

For example, I was in a relationship where both our Moons were heavily aspected by each other's planets and angles. My Moon was:

sextile his Mercury,
sextile his Venus,
trine his Mars,
trine his Uranus,
square his Pluto,
and conjunct his Descendant.

Likewise, his Moon was:

conjunct my Venus,
sextile my Mars,
conjunct my Jupiter,
trine my Saturn,
trine my Uranus,
conjunct my Descendant,
and square my Midheaven. Whew!

This was wayyy too much "Moon energy" for me to handle. I am not an emotional person; in my natal chart, I only have one major aspect to my Moon--a square to Pluto. I have no personal planets in water signs, and only one planet in a water-sign ruled house (8th).

His chart, on the other hand, has a stellium of 4 planets in the 8th house, a well-aspected moon, and several other indicators of emotional intensity.

Our reaction to the relationship was much different. We were incredibly close on an emotional level--yet while he enjoyed such closeness, it made me feel extremely uncomfortable and exposed. I wasn't ready to be so emotionally open with anybody... partly because I wasn't in tune with my OWN emotions, much less able to share them with someone else.

posted August 18, 2006 12:28 AM              

---------

posted August 18, 2006 01:06 AM            

the orbs are too wide. You don't have any challenging Sun-Pluto aspects. That's good. I don't use more than 1 degree orb with Pluto in synastry,and I will stretch out a little if it involves an aspect configuration. If Pluto was stationary,then I would consider wider orbs like up to 3 degrees.

I understand now what you said about the relationship. That's great. You have a great attitude and really aware of the strengths and weaknesses. I feel that awareness,perseverance,and patience helps a relationship be successful. It seems that you have that. :-)

posted August 18, 2006 01:43 AM            

Harmonic:

Harmonic astrology was developed largely by British astrologer John Addey. Harmonic astrology provides a conceptual model for understanding how aspects work, and this conceptual model expands the concept of aspects enormously beyond the concept of aspects as used in traditional astrology.

In harmonic astrology an aspect is viewed as a fraction of a circle. For example, a trine aspect of 120 degrees is 1/3 of a circle, a square is 1/4 of a circle, a sextile is 1/6 of a circle, a quincunx is 5/12, and so on. Some of the critical ideas in harmonic astrology are:

ANY fraction of a circle can be used!

John Addey, for example, did research using fractions of a circle like 1/25, 2/25, 3/25, and even fractions like 1/125, 2/125, 3/125, etc. The staggeringly enormous number of possible aspects used in harmonic astrology is perhaps one reason that it has been accepted rather slowly and gradually despite the impressive research results that John Addey had using this concept. Certainly, using harmonic astrology requires a computer, and even then one can be overwhelmed by the vast amount of data and at a loss as to how to utilize it practically.

The astrological influence of an aspect is based on the numbers in the fraction.

For example, the number 3 gives smoothness, agility, and ease, so the 1/3 aspect (trine) has these qualities. Note that the meanings of numbers in harmonic astrology may not necessarily be the same as those used in numerology. For example, in harmonic astrology, the numbers 4, 8, and 16 are challenging and stressful while in numerology these numbers are often assigned a different meaning.

The denominator is far more powerful than the numerator.

In most harmonic astrology the numerator is dispensed with entirely! Therefore, a 1/7, 2/7, and 3/7 aspect, for example, are very similar in influence. Also, the 1/9, 2/9, and 4/9 aspect are very similar in influence. Note that I skipped 3/9 because 3/9 reduces to 1/3 so the 3/9 aspect is actually a 1/3 aspect and has the qualities of 3 rather than 9.

The denominator of a fraction is often to referred to as "the harmonic".

For example, if someone says "I have Venus and Jupiter in 7th harmonic" this means that Venus and Jupiter are either in a 1/7, 2/7, or 3/7 aspect. Since harmonic astrologers are usually relatively unconcerned with the numerator, they very frequently discuss only the harmonic (that is, denominator) of an aspect rather than the specific aspect. In other words, most often they are content to simply say that Venus and Jupiter are in 7th harmonic rather than specify whether the aspect is a 1/7, 2/7, or 3/7 aspect.

Many harmonic astrologers believe that doubling a harmonic does not change its essential meaning.

For example, it was stated earlier that the numbers 4, 8, and 16 are challenging and stressful. This doubling of the number can be continued: the harmonics 32, 64, and 128 are also challenging and stressful. It may seem strange that doubling a harmonic does not change the essential meaning of a harmonic, but this makes more intuitive sense when you realize that the theory of harmonic astrology has many similarities with wave theory in physics (which we will not go into detail here, but John Addey does discuss this in his books) and in music, the note A is 440 cycles per second. if you double the cycles per second to 880 cycles, then you have reached the note A again one octave higher. Doubling again to 1760 cycles per second produces A an octave higher. Also interesting is that a musical string such as on a guitar, for example, can be caused to double the cycles per second and therefore play one octave higher by pressing down one's finger on the guitar string so that precisely one half of the string is vibrating. In harmonic astrology, an extraordinarily similar thing occurs: an angle of 90 degrees, for example, is 1/4 of a circle, and when we cut this distance in half to 45 degrees, 1/8 of a circle, the essential meaning of the aspect has not changed. To musicians there is little difference between the note A played at different octaves, but there is some subtle difference; clearly the notes are not identical. Some harmonic astrologers believe that the higher harmonics are more internal, more hidden attributes not as visible to the outer world. The higher harmonics give talent and inner power. The lower harmonics give personality and style but not a deep inner power, talent, or extreme problem for the person. In harmonic astrology it is generally believed that an anlysis up to about the 180th harmonic is possible, but clear limits are not known.

The orb is proportionate to the harmonic.

A general rule of thumb is that for an aspect to be really signficant the harmonic

can be divided into a number between 12 and 30. Some harmonic astrologers use a number of about 16 to limit themselves to aspects that are definitely significant in a person's life. A 1/4 aspect (square) has an orb of about 4 degrees to be strong (16 divided by 4 equals 4), a 1/8 aspect has a 2 degree orb (16 divided by 8 = 2), and a 16th harmonic aspect has a 1 degree orb.

Factor a harmonic to get its meaning.

Harmonics that are not prime numbers derive their meaning by

factoring the harmonic. For example, the 15th harmonic has a meaning

that is a combination of 5 and 3.

Meanings of the harmonics.

Virtually everyone agrees that the harmonics based on 1 are driving and motivating forces for the person. These are harmonics 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, and 128. In a sense these are the most important harmonics because they are the most dynamic and basic and obvious traits of the person. Harmonics based on 3 (3, 6, 12, 24, 48, and 96) are also fundamental forces for the person although they are not as stressful and motivating as the harmonics based on 1.

The 5th harmonic is associated by many astrologers with freedom and lack of control. Some astrologers believe that the 5th harmonic gives intelligence and mental talents. Astrologer Ken Negus hypothesizes that the 5th harmonic is involved in hereditary patterns. Astrologer David Cochrane believes that the 5th harmonic gives a taste for cultural activities which can range from enjoying watching television to any form of art, literature, music, or cultural activities; the 5th harmonic also gives a disinclination to involve oneself with taking care of basic daily chores; the 5th harmonic wants to be free from struggling for food, clothing, and shelter so that the world of entertainment and ideas can be enjoyed.

The 7th harmonic is considered to confer spiritual awareness and interest by many astrologers. Astrologer David Cochrane hypothesizes that the 7th harmonic gives a serious, deep approach to life, a motivation to uncover the depth of things, an interest in symbols and the roots of things, and also steadiness and self-discipline to achieve one's goals. The 7th harmonic is rather introverted, inner, quiet, persevering, stabile, self-controlled, and discipined.

The number 9 is not a prime number as it can be factored to be 3 times 3, but it seems to act as a prime number nevertheless. In Vedic astrology the 9th harmonic has been used for many hundreds of years as a key to compatibility in marriage. Some astrologers believe that the 9th harmonic is a key to understanding the sexuality of a person. Others believe that the 9th harmonic gives caringness and warmth, a desire for harmony and peace, and a disinclination to involve oneself in struggle. The 9th harmonic person, for example, although good with children and loved by children may not have children of his/her own because of the great amount of work and sacrifice required. Whatever the exact meaning of the 9th harmonic, it is agreed by most harmonic astrologers that Vedic astrologers are correct: the 9th harmonic is critically important in issues of love and marriage.

posted August 18, 2006 02:05 AM            

Quintiles are measured from plus or minus seventy-two degrees. Bi- quintiles are measured from plus or minus one hundred and forty four degrees which is one or two fifths of a circle. When planets are quintile or bi-quintile this is an indication of uncommon creative energy and talent. They are trend-setters and need an audience. The energy here is specialized and purposely striving toward power. Quintile and bi-quintile energy can be romantic, playful and demonstrative. The quintile family of aspects can indicate science, math and engineering. There's a need to make things happen. Cosmic will seems to be at play here, so if creative things aren't happening, then look for destruction. Quintiles and bi-quintiles bring a certain dignity, clarity, pride and unusual sexual energy. A quintile resonates with the Sun, Fixed, Fire and Leo energy.

There is a whole family of septile aspects including the septile, bi-septile and tri-septile forming one, two and three sevenths of a circle respectively. Septiles are measured in denominations of fifty-one degrees twenty-five minutes, one hundred two degrees fifty one minutes five seconds and one-hundred-fifty-four degrees, seventeen minutes and two seconds. The septile family of aspects is very different. They divide the circle into one, two and three sevenths respectively. This is the first series of aspects that to not divide evenly. This is a somewhat irrational force of energy, something sacred and holy going on here. Much like the number seven, Septiles contain spiritual power and imply the possibility of cosmic intervention. Septiles indicate harmony and union though in a non-conforming way. These aspects can indicate extraordinary creative efforts at self-knowledge and ultimate understanding and canbe a real turn on. Septiles resonate with Venus, Cardinal, Air and Libra energy.

The octile family of aspects include semi-squares and sesqui-quadrartes. A semi- square is measured from plus or minus forty-five degrees. A sesqui-quadrate is measured from plus or minus one hundred and thirty five degrees. The semi-square and sesqui-quadrate represent one eighth and five eighths of a circle respectively. Two eights is a quarter or square. Four eights is an opposition. These aspects are related. To some extent, key words for the opposition and more so the square can also be applied to the semi-square and the sesqui-quadrate. These aspects can be harsh and react sharply and abruptly. They can indicate a need to act for the future. Resistance is likely. There's a need to keep cool, act cautiously and make the best of things. It's time to resolve rather than ignore problems. Octiles resonate with Pluto, Fixed, Water and Scorpio energy.

A Novile occurs when two planets are plus or minus forty degrees apart. A bi-novile occurs when two planets are eighty degrees apart. A quadra-novile occurs when two planets at one hundred and sixty degrees apart. The novile aspects are one, two and four ninths of a circle. The novile series of aspects are related to the trines and sextiles. They're all in the same family as it were. The word novena is rooted in novile. Noviles are related to the nine muses and to the ennead. The novile conveys a somewhat charismatic, transcendental, mystical force, latent karmic details and spiritual growth. Noviles can indicate ceremony and relate to marriage. Noviles resonate with Jupiter, Fire, Mutable and Sagittarius energy.

A Decile occurs when two planets are thirty six degrees apart. A tri-decile occurs when two planets are one hundred and eight degrees apart. A decile is one tenth of a circle. A tri decile is three tenths. The decile family of aspects is related to the quintiles. The energy of the deciles is such that it conveys order and structure. Mental ingenuity is at work here. Deciles are power and career indicators. They often bring strong technical insights and abilities. Deciles indicate special gifts that may be wasted or unappreciated. Self-improvement is needed to capitalize on this power. Deciles resonate with Saturn, Cardinal, Earth and Capricorn energy.

An Undecile occurs when two planets are plus or minus thirty-two degrees, forty-three minutes and seven seconds apart (approximately thirty-three degrees). An undecile is one-eleventh of a circle. Undeciles indicate psychic gifts. Where undeciles are found, modifications are required. Undeciles relate to the power of computers, science and technology. Undeciles resonate with Uranus, Fixed, Air and Aquarius energy.

A Semi-Sextile occurs when two planets are plus or minus thirty degrees apart. A semi-sextile is one twelfth of a circle. A semi-sextile is somewhat comparable to the pearl within an oyster. The oyster itself is illusive and then once you have it you still have to dig to get the benefit. Semi-sextiles are receptive and internalizing. They often indicate latent abilities and require preparation. Planets in semi-sextile aspect help to clarify each other. Semi-sextiles help link the perimeter to the center. Energy and resources are attracted. Semi-sextiles require both worldly assets and spiritual goods. Often they can indicate the power of divination and subliminal influence. Higher consciousness is required to make effective use of this energy. Semi-sextiles resonate with Neptune, Mutable, Water and Pisces energy.

posted August 18, 2006 11:03 AM              

--Sun Square Saturn

me:
Scorpio sun 14°27'06 in house 9/10
Scorpio saturn 18°31'12 in house 10

her:
taurus sun 10°02'36 in house 10
scorpio saturn 25°57'13 in house 4

so I am guessing it is her sun square my saturn with a 8°28'76 orb

--Moon Square Mars

me:
aries moon 21°54'40 in house 3
capricorn mars 9°48'46 in house 12

her:
virgo moon 9°10'18 in house 2
gemini mars 2°49'42 in house 11

so I am guessing her moon square my mars which is a very tight orb. d'oh. at 0°38'28 orb

--Mercury Square Ascendant

me:
sag mecury 0°16'29 in house 10
cap asc 20°29'42

her:
aries mercury 13°19'25 in house 9
leo asc 8°00'28

so her mercury square my asc with 7°10'17 orb

--Moon Opposition Neptune

me:
aries moon 21°54'40 in house 3
Sagittarius neptune 29°32'06 in house 12

her:
virgo moon 9°10'18 in house 2
Capricorn neptune 03°26'46 in house 5

so I am not sure which moon is opp. which neptune cause they don't seem to make a tight orb, either of them. maybe mine if you are allowed to go 29-30-back to zero, ect.

--Venus Square Saturn (THE BIG ONE)

me:
sag venus 21°11'10 in house 11
scorpio saturn 18°31'12 in house 10

her:
aries venus 6°33'49 in house 9
scorpio saturn 25°57'13 in house 4

so my venus square her saturn with 4°46'3 orb -- (so does this make her want to keep our relationship (the more intimate details) more private while I am fine being sort of public. I talk to my friends about sex, she takes a more private approach. I post "i Love you" notes on her facebook wall (myspace for college kids, college directory), she would rather send me an email stating that. maybe it stems from this aspect, our differences in how we deal with the relationship in the outside world. or is that moon Opposition Neptune? I like people to realize we are a couple, to know we are in love. that does not seem to concern her. I will talk to her about it and see how she feels about my approach and hers.

--Mars Square Neptune

me:
capricorn mars 23°15'27 in house 1
Sagittarius neptune 29°32'06 in house 12

her:
gemini mars 2°49'42 in house 11
Capricorn neptune 03°26'46 in house 5

not at a tight enough orb since it involves neptune, a slow moving planet.

--Jupiter Square Pluto

me:
cap jupiter 9°48'46 in house 12
scorpio pluto 2°34'03 in house 9

her:
Aquarius jupiter 15°02'24 house 7
scorpio pluto 3°10'02 in house 4

her jupiter square my pluto. Certiantly not a tight enough orb with pluto in question as one of the planets in the aspect! but maybe it add to that let the world know/ secretive approach we both have. me the first approach, hers the second as I mentioned prior.

posted August 18, 2006 12:43 PM              

thank you for the long information about the harmonics. But I`ll have to think about this some more, because I can say I really understand it. It`s such a new concept for me.
But I noticed one thing, or actually I wondered: are those minor aspects all derived from the harmonics?
And what are your practical experiences with those aspects / harmonics?

posted August 18, 2006 02:28 PM            

yeah..you got the hang of it.

Your Venus square Saturn with her is 4'46 orb. I use only 5 degree orb for a synastry aspect that doesn't include the outerplanets. That aspect is not that strong. It wouldn't be much of a problem. A matter of fact,it can actually be good because it's not so close. This could be that you two take the relationship seriously but it's not restricting,limiting,depressing at all. It can be pretty much so if the aspect was like 2 degrees and less....especially if it's under 1 degree.

Your Sun square Saturn with her is 8'26 orb. That is way too wide. I would scratch that off your list. I wouldn't consider it an aspect.

Your Mercury square Ascendant with her with a 7'10 orb is too wide as well. I would scratch that off your list. I wouldn't consider that an aspect.

Your Moon oppose Neptune with her with a 4 degree orb is too wide for a slowmoving generational planet like Neptune. I would scratch that off the list.

I was suspecting that the hard aspects that you were talking about were not that close and/or too wide to be in aspect.

Scratching out those aspects makes your synastry look less challenging.

Keep in mind that the the narrower the orb of the aspect,the stronger the influence. The wider the orb of the aspect,the weaker the influence.

If you use orbs that are more than 5 degree,you are bound to find a lot of connections. If you use narrow orbs,you can focus on real connections that matter. The narrowest orbed aspect in the synastry often plays a dominant influence.

I also don't agree with the whole sign approach stuff that some astrologers use...it doesn't work well with the social planets(Jupiter,Saturn)and the outerplanets(Uranus,Neptune,and Pluto). Some astrologers use aspects like the quincunx which they often give no more than 2 degree orb. Quincunx is a whole sign aspect. So is the semisextile. Those aren't Ptolemaic aspects though. Modern Astrology is rather geometically based...looking for things like grand trine,t-square,grand cross,mystical rectangle,star of david,yods,isosceles trapezoid,and other aspect patterns.

posted August 18, 2006 02:49 PM            

All those minor aspects are from other harmonics that astrologers don't usually use. All aspects are based on harmonic.

1st harmonic is conjunction
2nd harmonic is opposition
3rd harmonic is trine
4th harmonic is square
5th harmonic is quintile
6th harmonic is sextile
7th harmonic is septile
8th harmonic is octile
9th harmonic is novile
10th harmonic is decile
11th harmonic is undecile
12th harmonic is semisextile

In my experience, the minor aspects are underrated. If they are tight orbed aspects,they could have some significance. Also...if there aspect patterns involving them can have significance. They can appear as midpoint configurations.

Adolf Hitler had Saturn quintile Neptune,and his Moon biquintile both or a 5th harmonic triangle. That indicate that he had talent,gift to put his emotional ideals into into reality. He was said to be good at architectural art. He also has Moon oppose Saturn/Neptune midpoint, and that is from the Moon biquintiling the quintile of Saturn and Neptune.

I have Moon oppose Saturn/Neptune myself,and its from my Moon squaring the opposition Saturn and Neptune.
I can relate to brain malfunctions(Dyslexia,Dyspraxia),lacking in self confidence,pessimistic,hopeless,melancholy,
mournful,emotionally distraught,insecure,
dissatisfied),discontented,insomnia,empathic,
sensitive,private,cautious,serious,dealing with medical issues,drawn to obscurities,secretive,seriously interested in metaphysical factors,problems due to uncertainty.
I was even misdiagnosed as having bipolar(manic depression)

MO.SA.NE.
+ empathic. sensitive . private; drawn to obscurities. serious. free of confinement or restraints. cautious. deals with medical issues. seriously interested in metaphysical factors.
Gynecology. Concern with obscure problems. [Responsibilities during night hours.]
- secretive. insecure. dissatisfied; discontented. hopeless. pessimistic. melancholy. contrary. lacking in self-confidence. dejected; mournful. emotionally distraught. manic depressive. emotionally cold.
Uncertainty of an older woman. Continual deceit of or due to the wife. Secret separation from a woman. Problems due to uncertainty. Unrecognized problems. Continual emotional weakness. Insomnia. Long illness. Chronic circumstances. Brain malfuctions. Uncertainty about or due to public problems. Deceit of a small nation.

posted August 18, 2006 03:31 PM              

and to a lesser extent, Venus Square Saturn. was I right about my observation?

posted August 18, 2006 03:42 PM            

The Moon square Mars can be very passionate...even too passionate. It could indicate irritations,anger,conflict between you two. Like you said,there can be good things about every aspect. Like I said before, it can be very passionate. This could provide a lot stimulation,excitement for you. Things can get very hot in the bedroom. Lunar aspects have to do with domestic connections. The only way to know all the true effects of the Moon square Mars is to live together.

posted August 18, 2006 03:53 PM              

Saturn Scorpio in 4th house
virgo moon in 2nd house
pluto in 4th house
sun in 10th house
Neptune Sextile Pluto 0°17

posted August 18, 2006 04:35 PM              

My Venus conjunct his ASC
His Moon (5th house ruler) closely conjunct my ASC and Sun/Moon midpoint
His Sun exactly oppose my Sun/Moon midpoint and ASC (meaning that his Sun is on my 7th house cusp)
My Sun exactly oppose his Mercury (his 7th house ruler)
My solstice Sun conjunct his Moon/Mar midpoint (one degree orb)
His Sun/Moon midpoint exactly square my Sun/Moon midpoint and my ASC
My solstice Moon exactly quindecile his Venus/Moon midpoint
My Sun exactly conjunct his Venus/Pluto midpoint
His NN/Vx midpoint exactly trine my ASC
His solstice Venus/MC midpoint oppose my Moon and quindecile my Sun and my Moon
His Venus/Vx midpoint oppose my Sun (2 degree orb)
My Moon exactly conjunct his Mar/solstice Venus midpoint
My venus quindecile his Pluto

For me, it is very strong attraction and love at first sight. I do not know what he actually felt. Do you think that the aspects above enough to make him attract to me too?

posted August 19, 2006 02:37 AM              

Glaucus actually anticipated my question to you and answered it all. I, too, wanted to ask you if there are severe challenging aspects in your synastry chart.
And even though I think, some squares and oppositions can be good for attraction, I would exclude Saturn and Uranus here.
Uranus can produce some sparks (I`ve experienced this several times), but it`s usually not lasting, and it`s very hard to get close to the Uranus-person. There would have to be excellent other aspects to balance that.
And Saturn, well he is very restrictive, isn`t he? Saturn-aspects are important in synastry to make people feel responsible for each other and stay together. But too many Saturn-aspectes speak of a limited attraction or produce the situation, where one rejects the other.
But I also have seen one hard Saturn-aspect in good relationships; I know one example, where the woman`s Saturn opposes the man`s Moon, and it`s a very lasting relationship. It`s not easy, no way, but they just stick together and work through her difficulties.
But I think if there are 3 or 4 challenging Saturn aspects, it could get too much. I personally am startled, when I see more than one Saturn-square in synastry. But I don`t like Saturn too much; that strange singleton planet in my chart; my sag-planets and Saturn are eying each other suspiciously, waiting who will attack first. Lol
So, maybe there are other opinions on Saturn, of people who are not so “Saturn-suspicious”.

boy o boy, funny that u guys ask...i really dont know how to start. its a really funny relationship..my mars sqaure his venus.

please explain to me, my uranus trine his venus + his uranus my sun. do u think its a challenging aspect??

and also my venus conjunct his saturn (whos tring to hold on to this relationship?)

lastly, his saturn sqaure my moon, lol, this one i can tell its a bad one for sure. but wht exactly does it mean?

posted August 19, 2006 05:38 AM              

yes, I think I start grasping the meaning of harmonics and minor aspects, even though I think I will stick to the major ones for now or maybe I will risk a glance into the minor aspects (if there are any) of my horoscopes.

I am starting to get really fascinated by midpoints. It`s something that has raised its head now and then, but now I feel like I want to learn more about it.
Where did you get the interpretation of the Moon-Saturn-Neptune? It`s not from Ebertin`s book, or is it?

However, I found something interesting. I have a Venus-Pluto-trine with a former crush of mine, and I never understood how it could affect me this much, since there must be many man out there, trining my Venus. His Pluto was trine my Venus. How can his Pluto have such a huge impact on me? Doesn`t it mean, that many men from his generation would have the same effect, which they clearly haven`t?
Well, looking at the midpoints, I saw, that my Venus is exactly opposite his Venus / Pluto midpoint. That does strengthen the synastry aspect, doesn`t it?
It also means that we have a grand trine of Venus (his), Pluto (his) and Venus (my). Well, according to your orb of 1 degree, we wouldn`t have a Venus-Pluto-trine, but I think I prefer an orb of 2 degrees (His Venus: 4 taurus; his Pluto: 8 virgo; my Venus: 6 Capricorn).
Oh yes, and another interesting thing about this Venus-Pluto-connection is that my Venus is ruler of my 5th house and his Venus is ruler of his 8th house.
Maybe such midpointconnection could be an explanation, why we sometimes feel the effect of a synastry aspect with an outer planet very clearly with one person, but not with some other.
What do you think?

Another questions about orbs:
What orb do you use with aspects, involving the Ascendant and midheaven?

posted August 19, 2006 05:55 AM            

Honestly..I am a bit skeptical about outerplanets in synastry. I have a theory that the outerplanet/personal planet midpoint has a strong noticeable influence that many feel is just the regular outerplanet aspects. A lot of them don't understand the power of midpoints. They are sensitive points when activated act like 3 point configuration. It doesn't matter if those points are not in aspect in regular chart.

I have some intense outerplanet energy with my gal. I will show in next post

the interpretations are from Ruth Brummond Rulebook. She's Uranian Astrologer. I don't like the COSI because it's so negative and old school. Ruth Brummond's Rulebook has modern and up to date interpretations that include both positive and negative meanings...even for Saturn and Neptune which are often intepreted very negatively in COSI and the old Rulebook of Planetary Pictures.

I use a 5 degree orb for all aspects in synastry except if they involve outerplanets. So ascendant,midheaven,sun,moon has the same 5 degree orb.

Also..I only use 1 degree for midpoints

trines,sextiles aren't supposed to be used for midpoints. they are not hard aspects that are intense and activate sensitive points.

that's why conjunction,opposition,square,semisquare,and sesquiquadrate are only used...Cosmobiologists use a 90 degree dial.

Uranian astrologers also use 16th harmonic aspects

posted August 19, 2006 06:02 AM              

In my opinion the positive uranus-aspects are no bad aspects, and not too challenging.
The Venus-Uranus and Sun-Uranus trine sound nice in my ears. But don`t forget I like Uranus to a certain degree, so maybe you feel differently about those aspect.
I think that harmonious Uranus-aspects bring a lot of fascination, stimulation and excitement into a relationship. But not so much that you can`t bear it. Maybe there´s something unusual about your relationship, your attraction or the things you do together. But even in positive aspects, Uranus needs some space, just in this case it doesn`t have to be a problem (with challenging aspects it is usually a big problem; Uranus and his selfish need for independence, no matter what the other one wants).
I have known some people, with whom I shared a positive Sun-Uranus-connection, and there has been a lot of good vibes, friendship and fun between us. And we usually both changed through the relationship, kind of grew with each other, made interesting experiences, that made me open up a little bit more. But even though there was attraction, friendship or a very stimulating exchange of ideas, there was always also some kind of "lightness". It was almost as if we were committed and free at the same time.
Those are my experiences with Uranus-aspects. I must say I love this feeling of "We are free togethere and nothing is impossible".

concerning the Saturn-connections I am not sure.
But Ì`d think that especially Venus-Saturn makes you very tightly bonded. Very committed, even thought there are certain problems. Maybe you sometimes feel that he is too cool, too reserved towards your, or you`re not sure how appreciated your display of affection is.
But I also think, even though Saturn may not always show it very openly, he desperately needs the affections Venus can give. And I think Saturn will care for Venus and tries to protect her.

Concerning the Saturn-moon-square: yes, I think it is a challenging one.
But there`s hope, even with that aspect.
I don`t have experiences with it in a romantic relationship, but my Saturn is exactly square my best friend`s moon.
It is difficult. I`ve often wondered why we`re still friends, why I don`t simply turn around and go away, because sometimes it would be easier than staying around her.
But I never could. And neither could she.
It`s strange. Sometimes I really can`t bear her emotionality, her depressions, her moodshifts, and her expectations that I will always be around to catch her when she falls. I don`t always understand her actions. For example when a boyfriend treated her bad, I couldn`t understand why she kept on going back to him again and again, expecting me to understand that she couldn`t leave and listen to her all night (for 2 years). But I did. I felt responsible for her. It frustrated me sometimes. Because she knew what was best to do (walk away from him), but she always said she couldn`t do, because of her emotions. Well, as I said I didn`t always understand her in that respect, but I stood beside her and just tried to support her as much as I could.
And she on the other hand sometimes complained about me being so cool and defensive. Like she really can`t get through to me. She once said that I sometimes am so independent, appearing as if I need just noobody, such a loner, that it scares her.
On the other hand there`s noone who knows me like she does. That`s what scares me.
And no matter, how many differences we have, we stick together. That`s just it. Best friends. so different in many respects, but growing together and learning from each other, through sometimes very painful experiences. Well, we`ve been friends for 16 years now; that`s more than the half of both of our lives. So I guess, that Moon square Saturn made our friendship very enduring, even though it`s sometimes not easy.

posted August 19, 2006 06:30 AM            

Here is a list of outerplanet/personal points activated by other's personal points
in my synastry with my gal. I use only 1 degree orb.

My Sun = her Venus/Pluto
My Moon = her Sun/Pluto
My Mercury = her Sun/Neptune
My Venus = her Mercury/Neptune = Pluto/Asc
My Mars = her Venus/Uranus = Pluto/MC
My MC = her Mars/Pluto = Uranus/Asc

Her Sun = My Mercury/Neptune
Her Moon = My Moon/Pluto = Mercury/Uranus
Her Mercury = My Mars/Neptune
Her Venus = My Uranus/Asc = Uranus/MC
Her Mars = My Sun/Uranus = Mercury/Pluto = Venus/Pluto
Her Asc = My Mars/Pluto
Her MC = My Pluto/Asc
Her Stationary Jupiter = My Sun/Uranus =
Venus/Pluto
Her Stationary Neptune = My Sun/Venus =
Mercury/Node = Uranus/Asc = Uranus/MC

my gal has stationary Jupiter and stationary Neptune which are strong planetary energy by themselves.....so I added the midpoint configurations involving them.