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Author Topic:   What REALLY happened on 9/11?
Rainbow~
unregistered
posted March 31, 2006 03:31 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Actor & Director Ed Asner Shares 9/11 Concerns

Highlights story of hijackers still alive and well

Paul Watson and Alex Jones - March 31, 2006

Award winning director, producer and actor Ed Asner is the latest high profile public figure to voice his support for Charlie Sheen's stance on 9/11 and share his own concerns about 9/11, the war in Iraq and the Neo-Cons.

Speaking to The Alex Jones Show Asner, best known for his Emmy-winning role as Lou Grant on The Mary Tyler Moore Show, echoed Charlie Sheen's sentiments in stating, "I became suspicious of 9/11 on the day it happened."

"I will always be that suspect of it and challenge it and challenge various points of it," said Asner.

Asner agreed that the official story of 9/11 and the Kean Commission investigation was a fable and a fraud.

"I do not buy it and I would challenge it, I know all of these points....the standing down," said Asner.

Asner questioned why no authority figures had been fired for their inability to prevent 9/11.

"Nobody in high office has ever paid the penalty for keeping us unprepared for 9/11, no one has paid the price and I cite the fact that Abu Ghraib was another typical example of the way this government works," said Asner.

"It's very easy to think of 9/11 to think of being yet another cause of being able to generate war in this country, " said Asner as he compared 9/11 to past examples of manufactured provocations such as the Gulf of Tonkin incident, the attack on the Maine and Pearl Harbor.


"Many of the purported hijackers are living persons elsewhere," said Asner highlighting a story reported by BBC and others that several of the so-called perpetrators of 9/11 visited their embassies in protest that they had been identified as terrorists.

Asked who gained from 9/11 Asner answered, "Certainly the military has, Halliburton, Brown and Root, Mr. Cheney's old outfit....the oil companies of course now with record highs, and the White House is of course involved with oil and the military and always has been."

Asner doubted that another terror attack needed to be staged in order to accomplish more of the same agenda.

"They don't have to have another attack, if they indeed launched the first one they have screwed up our country so badly they could just let us sink in upon ourselves."

Asner questioned why CNN chose to cancel his scheduled spot on Showbiz Tonight. After speaking to inside sources within CNN we were able to confirm that the order came down from a higher office to "kill" the story, despite the fact that the issue had generated the most interest Showbiz Tonight had ever encountered.

Asner is a true humanitarian and is an activist in the fields of missing US PoW's, depleted uranium, which Asner suggested was a deliberate population reduction method, and the fight to get the FDA to eliminate deadly thimerosal mercury additives to vaccines.

His public stance on 9/11 and his support of Charlie Sheen helps in the ongoing effort to encourage public figures with large media platforms to step forward and become prominent voices for the 9/11 truth movement.


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Rainbow~
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posted March 31, 2006 03:02 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here is your must-read for the month


by Mark Morford - 3-31-6


Here is your oh-my-God-I'm-sending-this-piece-to-every-smart-person-I-know hunk of outstanding, distressing, disquieting media bliss.

Here it is: an absolutely exceptional inside scoop on the white-hot world of Sept. 11 conspiracy theories, writ large and smart by Mark Jacobson over at New York magazine, and it's mandatory reading for anyone and everyone who's ever entertained the nagging thought that something -- or rather, far more than one something -- is deeply wrong with the official line on what actually happened on Sept. 11.

See, it is very likely that you already know that Sept. 11 will go down in the conspiracy history books as a far more sinister affair than, say, the murky swirl of the Kennedy assassination. You probably already know that much of what exactly happened on Sept. 11 remains deeply unsettling and largely unsolved -- or to put another way, if you don't know all of this and if you fully and blithely accept the official Sept. 11 story, well, you haven't been paying close enough attention.

But on this, the third anniversary of the launch of Bush's illegal invasion of Iraq by way of whoring the tragedy of Sept. 11 for his cronies' appalling gain, what you might not know, what gets so easily forgotten in the mists of time and via the endless repetition of the orthodox Sept. 11 tale, is the sheer volume, the staggering array of time and via the endless repetition of the orthodox Sept. 11 tale, is the sheer volume, the staggering array of unanswered questions about just about every single aspect of Sept. 11 -- the planes, the WTC towers, the Pentagon, the fires, the passengers and the cell phone calls and the firefighters and, well, just about everything. It is, when you look closely, all merely a matter of how far down the rabbit hole you are willing to go.

Verily, Jacobson, in his New York mag piece, encounters crackpots and fringe nutballs and those who think Sept 11 was connected to aliens and electromagnetic fields and the Illuminati. It can, unfortunately, get a little crazy. But there is also a very smart, grounded, intelligent and surprisingly large faction -- which includes eyewitnesses, Sept. 11 widows, former generals, pilots, professors, engineers, WTC maintenance workers and many, many more -- who point to a rather shocking pile of evidence that says there is simply no way 19 fanatics with box cutters sent by some bearded lunatic in a cave could have pulled off the most perfectly orchestrated air attack of the century. Not without serious help, anyway.

Whose help? This, of course, is the biggest question of all, one which many of the more well-researched theories go a surprisingly long way toward answering You have to sift and sort. There are disturbing questions about collapse speeds and controlled demolitions and why the towers fell when the all-steel infrastructure was designed to easily withstand the temperatures of any sort of fire, even burning jet fuel.

There are questions of the mysterious, media-documented blasts deep in the WTC towers that took place after the planes hit. There are questions of why there was such a short-selling spree on shares of American Airlines and United Air Lines the day before the attack, huge doubts about the failures of NORAD and the FAA, the bizarre case of the missing plane in the Pentagon crash, and also the downing of Flight 93 where, according to the coroner, no blood or major plane wreckage was actually found. There is, ultimately, the stunning failure of the entire multi-trillion-dollar American air-defense system. Just for starters.

There is also the very big question of what happened to 7 WTC, the only building not hit by anything at all, but which collapsed anyway, in a perfect controlled-demolition sort of way, for no reason anyone can sufficiently explain. But which just so happened to contain vital offices for the IRS, the Department of Defense, the CIA, the Secret Service, the Securities and Exchange Commission and more.

But perhaps Jacobson's article is insufficient for you. Perhaps you have heard much of it before, or you're more of the visceral type and need to actually see the proofs in order to delve deeper, have them laid out like gruesome body parts in a mesmerizing autopsy. Fair enough.

For you, we have the surprisingly compelling indie documentary "9/11 Loose Change" (Google it), freely available on the Internet and produced by three very astute and very young and very strong-willed dudes who managed to cobble together a truly astounding array of proofs and interviews and evidence, a full 1 hour and 20 minutes' worth of mesmerizing footage you will not be able to easily forget.

Or maybe you should peruse one of the countless Sept. 11 conspiracy sites, many of which link to relevant video and one of which -- scholarsfor911truth.org -- claims to be "a non-partisan association of faculty, students, and scholars, in fields as diverse as history, science, military affairs, psychology, and philosophy, dedicated to exposing falsehoods and to revealing truths behind 9/11." Start there.

Now, it's very true that some of the more specious conspiracy claims have been largely discredited and proved false. Some of the more radical "evidence" gathered by theorists is quite suspect and easily placed in the category of no-way-in-hell. This is valid. This is as it should be. You have to chew through a lot of skin and gristle to get to the real meat.

But oh the meat. The overwhelming quantity, the bloody, deadly stench of it. Fact is, it is quite impossible to watch the entire "Loose Change" documentary and not come away just a little shaken, a little awed by the sheer number of perversely interrelated facts and aberrant coincidences-that-aren't-coincidences, shaking your head at how it all seems to irrefutably prove there is far, far more to the Sept. 11 tragedy than just crazy Osama and his band of zealots, as you begin to sink into a sighing morass of rage and frustration and suspicion and mistrust. You almost can't help it.

Of course, there is another option. There is another way out. You may, as is the standard cultural default, simply ignore it all, scoff and roll your eyes and shrug it all off because it's just too bleak and distasteful to entertain the idea that the dark Sept. 11 thread winds all the way through the NSA and the FBI and the White House and the Project for the New American Century and Dick Cheney's mangled soul and God only knows where else.

But then again, no. You have to look. You have to try. Knowledge is power, and while the truth may be spurious and slippery and messy and deep, the pursuit of it is just about the only thing we have left. Give that up, and all that's left is spiritual numbness, emotional stasis and death. So what are you waiting for?


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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted March 31, 2006 06:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hey Rainbow

I've found another convert for your 9/11 conspiracy...2 if you want to count Louis Farrakhan. You remember Louie? He's the one with proof Bush blew up the levee and flooded New Orleans.

A few more celebrities and you'll have your case proved. You should try for Robin Williams, George Clooney, Alec Baldwin and Barbara Streisand. That would prove your Bush conspiracy for sure.

ON CAPITOL HILL
Who is Cynthia McKinney?
Meet, perhaps, most controversial U.S. congresswoman
Posted: March 31, 2006
12:56 p.m. Eastern
WorldNetDaily.com


Rep. Cynthia McKinney
WASHINGTON – When Rep. Cynthia McKinney, D-Ga., was issued an arrest warrant today for allegedly slapping a Capitol police officer, it was just the latest development in a stormy political career that saw her chased from office by scandal once – only to be sent back to the House.

The 50-year-old representative of Georgia’s 4th congressional district held her post from 1992 through 2002, when the 10-year veteran of the House was upset in a primary election.

The way she explained it: The "hostile corporate media," allied with Republicans, "repeated falsehoods" about her, "distorted" her positions, and drove her from "my seat."


McKinney is, without doubt, one of the most radical members of the House Democratic Caucus – having appeared with Louis Farrakhan and promoted the reign of Zimbabwean dictator Robert Mugabe.

But it was a March 25, 2002, interview on KPFA Pacifica radio that may have done her in politically that year.

"We know there were numerous warnings of the events to come on September 11," McKinney said. "What did this administration know and when did it know it, about the events of September 11? Who else knew, and why did they not warn the innocent people of New York who were needlessly murdered? What do they have to hide?"

McKinney thought she knew the answer.

"What is undeniable," she explained, "is that corporations close to the administration have directly benefited from the increased defense spending arising from the aftermath of September 11th."

Try as she might to distance herself from the remarks, McKinney only succeeded in digging herself a deeper hole.

She released a statement admitting she was "not aware of any evidence" proving "President Bush or members of his administration have personally profited from the attacks of 9/11," but "a complete investigation might reveal that to be the case."

But it got worse.

A list of campaign donors was found to include some with links to terrorism – Abdurahman Alamoudi, the former executive director of the American Muslim Council, and former college professor Sami Al-Arian.


Also coming to light was her fawning Oct. 12, 2001, letter to Saudi prince Alwaleed bin Talal, in which she rebuked New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani for his refusal to accept a post-9/11 gift of $10 million. She urged bin Talal to donate the funds to "charities outside the mayor's control," especially those that dealt with "poor blacks who sleep on the street in the shadows of our nation's Capitol."

When McKinney won her seat back, she didn’t soft-pedal her conspiracy theories or tone down her rhetoric. In fact, she boasts of being a follower of Michael Ruppert, the former L.A. detective who insists the Bush administration actually orchestrated the Sept. 11 attacks.

Since returning to her seat, McKinney is fond of repeating this line – borrowed from Ruppert: "The American people might have a criminal syndicate running their government."
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=49528

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TINK
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posted March 31, 2006 07:18 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't travel in fanatical circles. (well not anymore ) Just about everyone I know is a moderate type. Some dems, some repubs, some independents ... but all of them normal, run of the mill, middle of the road types. Honestly, I can't think of one of them who buys the official 9-11 story hook, line and sinker. Everyone believes something shady happened. It's just a question of what and why.

I guess that makes us all crazy, jwhop?

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Isis
Newflake

Posts: 1
From: Brisbane, Australia
Registered: May 2009

posted March 31, 2006 07:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Isis     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I keep tellin you guys, it's an alien conspiracy...

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TINK
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posted March 31, 2006 07:44 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm confident you're not teasing me, Isis.

For the record, I'm not much of a believer in aliens.

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Isis
Newflake

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From: Brisbane, Australia
Registered: May 2009

posted March 31, 2006 08:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Isis     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted March 31, 2006 08:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You want me to pass judgment on your sanity tink?

OK, you're a little paranoid but watch yourself or They may get you.

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TINK
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posted March 31, 2006 08:41 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
you're calling me paranoid?! Mister there's-a-commie-behind-every-tree himself? okey-dokey.

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Rainbow~
unregistered
posted March 31, 2006 08:42 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Verily, Jacobson, in his New York mag piece, encounters crackpots and fringe nutballs and those who think Sept 11 was connected to aliens and electromagnetic fields and the Illuminati. It can, unfortunately, get a little crazy. But there is also a very smart, grounded, intelligent and surprisingly large faction -- which includes eyewitnesses, Sept. 11 widows, former generals, pilots, professors, engineers, WTC maintenance workers and many, many more -- who point to a rather shocking pile of evidence that says there is simply no way 19 fanatics with box cutters sent by some bearded lunatic in a cave could have pulled off the most perfectly orchestrated air attack of the century. Not without serious help, anyway.

wha se talkin' 'bout?

They're ALL crazy loons....

Everybody knows Saddam Hussein was responsible for that! But we showed him, didn't we?

Like he gives us SHOCK AND AWE....and we give it right back to him....

T1t for tat...

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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted March 31, 2006 08:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
But tink, there is a commie behind every tree

If you don't want to be mistaken for a commie babe, stay away from trees.

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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted March 31, 2006 08:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What, you're still here Rainbow

After I gave you the names of 6 prime candidates, I thought you'd be out recruiting them for your Bush conspiracy cadre.

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Rainbow~
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posted April 01, 2006 12:26 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
jwhop.....

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lotusheartone
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posted April 01, 2006 12:41 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Progress..humph. ...

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Rainbow~
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posted April 01, 2006 02:56 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Lotus......

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Rainbow~
unregistered
posted April 01, 2006 02:59 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Love you too, jwhop....

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Rainbow~
unregistered
posted April 01, 2006 03:15 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
AND THIS IS NOT APRIL FOOL!

IT'S GENUINE....

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lotusheartone
unregistered
posted April 01, 2006 04:09 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ggod Day Rainbow..love you too!

Sending everyOne..lots of LOVE. ...

NO April Fool's..

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Rainbow~
unregistered
posted April 04, 2006 03:32 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Former Head Of Star Wars Program Says Cheney Main 9/11 Suspect

Official version of events a conspiracy theory, says drills were cover for attacks

by Paul Watson and Alex Jones - April 4, 2006

The former head of the Star Wars missile defense program under Presidents Ford and Carter has gone public to say that the official version of 9/11 is a conspiracy theory and his main suspect for the architect of the attack is Vice President Dick Cheney.

Dr. Robert M. Bowman , Lt. Col., USAF, ret. flew 101 combat missions in Vietnam. He is the recipient of the Eisenhower Medal, the George F. Kennan Peace Prize, the President’s Medal of Veterans for Peace, the Society of Military Engineers Gold Medal (twice), six Air Medals, and dozens of other awards and honors. His Ph.D. is in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering from Caltech. He chaired 8 major international conferences, and is one of the country’s foremost experts on National Security.

Bowman worked secretly for the US government on the Star Wars project and was the first to coin the very term in a 1977 secret memo. After Bowman realized that the program was only ever intended to be used as an aggressive and not defensive tool, as part of a plan to initiate a nuclear war with the Soviets, he left the program and campaigned against it.

In an interview with The Alex Jones Show aired nationally on the GCN Radio Network, Bowman (pictured below) stated that at the bare minimum if Osama bin Laden and Al-Qaeda were involved in 9/11 then the government stood down and allowed the attacks to happen. He said it is plausible that the entire chain of military command were unaware of what was taking place and were used as tools by the people pulling the strings behind the attack.

Bowman outlined how the drills on the morning of 9/11 that simulated planes crashing into buildings on the east coast were used as a cover to dupe unwitting air defense personnel into not responding quickly enough to stop the attack.

"The exercises that went on that morning simulating the exact kind of thing that was happening so confused the people in the FAA and NORAD....that they didn't they didn't know what was real and what was part of the exercise," said Bowman

"I think the people who planned and carried out those exercises, they're the ones that should be the object of investigation."

Asked if he could name a prime suspect who was the likely architect behind the attacks, Bowman stated, "If I had to narrow it down to one person....I think my prime suspect would be Dick Cheney."

Bowman said that privately his military fighter pilot peers and colleagues did not disagree with his sentiments about the real story behind 9/11.

Bowman agreed that the US was in danger of slipping into a dictatorship and stated, "I think there's been nothing closer to fascism than what we've seen lately from this government."

Bowman slammed the Patriot Act as having, "Done more to destroy the rights of Americans than all of our enemies combined."

Bowman trashed the 9/11 Commission as a politically motivated cover-up with abounding conflicts of interest, charging, "The 9/11 Commission omitted anything that might be the least bit suspicious or embarrassing or in any way detract from the official conspiracy so it was a total whitewash."

"There needs to be a true investigation, not the kind of sham investigations we have had with the 9/11 omission and all the rest of that junk," said Bowman.

Asked if the perpetrators of 9/11 were preparing to stage another false-flag attack to reinvigorate their agenda Bowman agreed that, "I can see that and I hope they can't pull it off, I hope they are prevented from pulling it off but I know darn good and well they'd like to have another one."

A mainstay of the attack pieces against Charlie Sheen have been that he is not credible enough to speak on the topic of 9/11. These charges are ridiculed by the fact that Sheen is an expert on 9/11 who spends hours a day meticulously researching the topic, something that the attack dogs have failed to do, aiming their comments solely at Sheen's personal life and ignoring his invitation to challenge him on the facts.

In addition, from the very start we have put forth eminently credible individuals only for them to be ignored by the establishment media. Physics Professors , former White House advisors and CIA analysts , the father of Reaganomics , German Defense Ministers and Bush's former Secretary of the Treasury, have all gone public on 9/11 but have been uniformly ignored by the majority of the establishment press.

Will Robert Bowman also be blackballed as the mainstream continue to misrepresent the 9/11 truth movement as an occupation of the fringe minority?
Bowman is currently running for Congress in Florida's 15th District.

.

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proxieme
unregistered
posted April 04, 2006 09:16 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
DD - You may be totally right - he could very well be off his ever-lovin' rocker.

Yesterday after the jury delivered that he was eligible for the death penalty, M. waited until they exited and then screamed to the courtroom, "You will never get my blood! God curse you all!"

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Rainbow~
unregistered
posted April 08, 2006 01:16 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
why Moussaoui confession doesn't add up

Daniel McGrory,a Times expert on al-Qaeda, examines the inconsistencies behind Zacarias Moussaoui's confession that he was part of the 9/11 plot

"From the start of the hearing to decide whether he should be executed or spend the rest of his life in jail, Zacarias Moussaoui made it clear he regarded the proceedings as a joke. He mocked the judge, shouted obscenities at the jury and has repeatedly shown his contempt for the court, saying he only recognises Islamic law.

"His exasperated defence lawyer, Gerald Zerkin, admits he has no idea what his client is going to say or do next as he has no control over the former London university student.

"Asked why he signed a guilty plea as "the twentieth hijacker", Moussaoui smirked and said: 'Because everybody used to refer to me as the 20th hijacker and it was a bit of fun.'

"Prosecutors have no interest in demolishing Moussaoui’s extraordinary confession as the self- proclaimed al-Qaeda terrorist seems to have done their job for them. It does not appear to matter to them that Moussaoui’s testimony contradicts their own evidence.

"The CIA has in custody the man who orchestrated the attacks on the World Trade Center, and he has told his interrogators that Moussaoui was not part of any 9/11 cell. That handpicked team came from similar backgrounds and bore little resemblance to the Frenchman of Morrocan descent who was too indisciplined to be trusted on such a crucial mission.

Al-Qaeda did pay for him to take flying lessons in America, as they did for dozens of others, but, unlike the pilots recruited for 9/11, Moussaoui proved incompetent. He not only raised suspicions by refusing to be taught the basics of how to take off or land a Boeing 747, but in the flight simulator he couldn’t even steer straight and instructors told the truculent Moussaoui that he was wasting his money.

"Defence lawyers argue he has repeatedly changed his story about his supposed role in a deliberate attempt to confuse US authorities.

"First he claimed he was to be used in a plot to free a blind Egyptian cleric, Sheikh Omar Abdel-Rahman, jailed in the US in 1996 for an earlier attempt to blow up the World Trade Centre. Moussaoui told how he was to pilot a plane carrying the freed sheikh to Afghanistan.

"Then he changed his mind and said that he was to take part in a second wave of aerial attacks in the US. He did not give a date, but claimed he was to crash his aircraft into the White House.

"The question to be asked about his latest confession is, why would he implicate Richard Reid, his friend from their days at Finsbury Park mosque? Both men were at training camps in Afghanistan at the same time but, as evidence has shown, Reid, and another young Briton, Saajid Badat, were being groomed for an entirely different role.

"FBI agents are expected to question Reid, who is already serving an 80-year jail sentence for trying to detonate a shoe bomb on an American Airlines flight from Paris to Miami in December 2001.

"Investigators know that Reid’s path never crossed that of the 9/11 cell. Before he was ordered to carry a bomb onto a plane, Reid had other uses for al-Qaeda. Using his British passport, he was sent on reconnaissance missions across Europe and the Middle East at the time the 9/11 hijackers were finalising their plans.

"In July 2001 he was in Amsterdam obtaining a new passport from the British Consulate, claiming that he had ruined his original document by leaving it in his trouser pocket which he stuffed into a washing machine.

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Iqhunk
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posted April 08, 2006 05:50 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
<<..and the fight to get the FDA to eliminate deadly thimerosal mercury additives to vaccines...>>
This is a very important point....

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Iqhunk
unregistered
posted April 08, 2006 05:51 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
http://www.evidenceofharm.com/

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Harpyr
Newflake

Posts: 0
From: Alaska
Registered: Jun 2010

posted April 09, 2006 03:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Harpyr     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Evidence of Harm... Interesting book. I'm about halfway through it right now.. Alittle off topic, though.

Thought I'd drop a link to a video about the unanswered questions about 9-11.. Very interesting..
Loose Change 9-11 Alex Jones Conspiracy

JW, I double dog dare you to watch the whole thing..

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13anshee
unregistered
posted April 09, 2006 09:52 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
lol

GOVERNMENT

NOT TO GOVERN MEN OR wOMEN

lol
sorry lotus but the word itself says

if you are naieve enough to beleave the government on anything as big as 9/11 then i am sorry

bush is a cowboy, he's from texas lol

he's got a complex about things, his daddy went to war so he did too

oh whats that bang bang bush? you don't have an excuse to mobilise nearly a million troops?
you need an excuse to go to war against the arab nation of islam?
hey why don't you do a "shock and awe" show on your own country
think of all the benefits if the great AMERICA gets attacked

more money to spend on guns and cool stuff
more money to use those guns to "acquire" even cooler stuff from other people
an excuse to cover up your short fallings

why, i say billy bob bush, thats a WIN WIN situation

sorry lotus, the facts speak for themselves, you honestly think that they pulled something so convient off without ANY help at all?

in the words of Mr T

"i pity the fool"

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