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Author Topic:   Been thinking about time/no time.
thirteen
Knowflake

Posts: 584
From: Rochester Hills, MI USA
Registered: May 2004

posted November 23, 2005 08:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for thirteen     Edit/Delete Message
The other day i was imagining what it is like on the other side. Since there is no time, i thought, its like a dream where many things happen but with out the linear thing going on . Then WOW , i could really feel it in my mind and immediately i was thinking that " i want my physical body" I would miss it. Then i thought well that probably has something to do with why I have one over and over and over. Then I thought the ideal would be immortality where you get the body but you can also at will, go to the other side too. Is that what immortality does??? Give you the ability to do both or is the ulitmate goal to not need a body at all?

I drive myself nuts sometimes with my spiraling thoughts.

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lotusheartone
Knowflake

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From: piopolis, quebec canada
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posted November 23, 2005 09:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lotusheartone     Edit/Delete Message
thirteen,

picture a wheel within a wheel
2 working at the same time
we have the opposite
and the same

yes immortality, you can go here and there
and achieve different body states
but, we still need to fix the Time Clock
13

Love and Light to YOU

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Svetlana
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From: USA
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posted November 24, 2005 07:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Svetlana     Edit/Delete Message
What's "spiraling" thoughts? I've seen that word over and over againg on these boards and I wonder what it means.

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sesame
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From: Oz
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posted November 26, 2005 10:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sesame     Edit/Delete Message
Easy one first, Svetlana, spiraling is the process of expanding you understanding exponentially from one thought to another. It feels as if the inrush of info will never end, and you get a little dizzy, and yet all things are related - hence the circular nature. It's basically a thought process (here's more info - http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum6/HTML/000308-3.html).

thirteen, I wanto explore more of these thoughts. When you say other side, do you mean the next dimension over? This is assuming you can skip from one to the next and retain your place to come back. Maybe like astral travelling - astral body and material one does its own thing. Then you'd miss your material body, so you're talking about you higher self comunication? Doesn't going to the other side at will occur during dreams? Why would you want to go there anyway? Isn't this world enough? Imortality is about experiencing the totality of life as it has to offer (IMO) - to realise that death is a waste of time, that to help the Earth from tearing you need to retain memory not lose it needlessly just to come back and start over. If we were all immortal, we would see our effects and live with them first hand, hence we would treat the world and each other with a lot more respect. Having no body at all is the opposite - it's death. Unless you mean astral travelling or teleportation which I think could be used as useful modes of transportation. This isn't a goal, but an aid. Make any sense?

Heaps of Love,
Dean.

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Svetlana
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posted November 26, 2005 02:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Svetlana     Edit/Delete Message
Thank you sesame!

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Kat
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From: Cleveland, Ohio
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posted November 26, 2005 02:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kat     Edit/Delete Message
I used to believe in an afterlife, but now I'm not so certain. There are some really phenomenal people, places, and environments on this planet. I'm not certain any of it's eternal. Maybe it is??? Linear time makes sense and tha's what we are dealing with in this life. So why is it important to consider something that's not impacting us right now? or is it?

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thirteen
Knowflake

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From: Rochester Hills, MI USA
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posted November 28, 2005 01:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thirteen     Edit/Delete Message
Ok more thoughts on this, i was resting over the holiday:
I guess i assumed that the ultimate goal is existance without a body. The other side is what I mean when i die and go to that other place. Maybe Im wrong on that. What is the end of all this? Is it an immortal body that can go to the otherside ( heaven if you will) at will. What if I don't like things about my body. Does immortality fix them? What if i want another body, say a male body? How do i get that. What is the grand purpose of existance. Maybe in the end I won't care about physical expression.

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fayte.m
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posted November 28, 2005 03:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for fayte.m     Edit/Delete Message
time is a perception..yet still is.
Like that tree falling in a forest...if no one is there to hear it...the sound waves were still there..simply nothing to recieve the waves and interpret it as sound. Same goes for time. Time is...but is different depending on your perception and point of reference to it.
Time exists even on the so called other side.

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sesame
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From: Oz
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posted November 29, 2005 06:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sesame     Edit/Delete Message
Kat, you know, I just realised why I never really like the word eternity. I think it's because it invokes images of sameness. I think this is inherantly impossible. Nothing has the ability to be eternal except humans (and other advanced lifeforms - IMO). You know rocks live for three million years? What happens over that time? Do they corrode, expand, shrink? Likewise the Earth. Is it living? Do you ever look at a building and wonder what it's thinking? Some buildings are beautiful but they are really just projection from humans. That's the beauty of Art. To evoke feelings based on a human-made creation. In uni I learnt a saying "Le art pour le art" - french for Art for Art's sake. I think about this sometimes. It's like, art that makes us feel has a purpose, but art for art's sake? Do you think this could be the meaning of life? Is it important to consider this? I guess it has to do with what you define as important. For me, this stuff keep sme breathing. Just thinking and pondering. The Conversations with God series are fantastic. It says that a persons life is anything they want, whether productive or not - it all has meaning. Picture one person helping thousands of people on a daily basis. Picture another that wakes, thinks, sleeps, wakes, thinks, sleeps, etc. Then the second one creates faster than light travel that allows us to inhabit other worlds. She has just helped millions. Now what if she didn't arrive at that thought, would her life be any less important? Life is for living and living the way you want to. If it involves sin on a daily basis, then expect to be sinned to on a daily basis, but once it's over, it's over. You might look back and reflect and see the patterns, and next life you're Mother Theresa.

thirteen, existance without body isn't really existance. Do ghosts exist? Can you prove they don't have a body? They have shape and colour, so maybe they have bodys that we don't see clearly. This is where other dimensions come in. Immortality supposedly can heal everything about your body, and maybe transform aspects, but if you wanted to change completely, then you're gonna look weird in the interim. And maybe not functional? If you wanna be a man, then I think you'd have to kark it. The grand purpose of existance is to create who you want to be now. Easier said than done. Takes determination. I'm still in a pretty strong TV phase which severely hampers my growth, but it's sooooo relaxing.

Faye, can time go backwards on the other side?

Dean.

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thirteen
Knowflake

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From: Rochester Hills, MI USA
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posted November 29, 2005 09:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for thirteen     Edit/Delete Message
Ok my final thoughts: I live, then I die, then i get another body, I die, then I get another body and so on..... the whole time learning and evolving more and more...
What is the final thing. When I am totally evolved and learned everything I can what will my existence be? Will i be in spirit form or will i be in physical form?

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fayte.m
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posted November 29, 2005 01:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for fayte.m     Edit/Delete Message
Quote:
Faye, can time go backwards on the other side?

>>>>From what I have observed...Not as a common thing. Now You are talking of quantum theory and time travel.
As a general rule the time on the other side is percieved in a linear fashion...and in some cases a stasis.
Now..time travel is a whole different matter.

thirteen:
You will keep returning to a body but as humanity moves out into space...or even as we evolve(humans in several millon years or more will not look as we do now)...you will be born into many different new bodies....
But eventually you will have the choice to be physical when you want and non physical when you want. Or take on a suitable form by force of will(call it creation/or generating) and be able to walk worlds that as a human being you could never do. It is about change..forever...never boring...
I believe it is an eternally changing dynamic universe and you can become in time anything you could possibly imagine..and things you cannot...nor could any human even begin to imagine at this time.

Dean:
Quote:
I'm still in a pretty strong TV phase

Ahh yes! We have discussed this before! I do not watch television (or listen to the radio...very rarely)I gave television up completely long ago. And before that did it very little. I would say that 90% of my life to date has been without television broadcasts.
It really does allow you to delve into other things when television is put out of your life.
I do not miss it nor want it. Folks have wanted to pay for cable or whatever for us! Just so they could have us to talk to about their favorite shows with them! Well they think we are weird. We thanked them and said no thank you...we have more than enough to do instead of vegging in front of the boob tube.
We do not have time for it.
Between psychic work..and writing we talk with each other constantly.
To Change and an eternity of experiences in the realm of infinity!

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thirteen
Knowflake

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From: Rochester Hills, MI USA
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posted November 29, 2005 01:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thirteen     Edit/Delete Message
Fayte. thats great.... one more issue. If we are all one then will we ever just be one and not be all divided up into so many physical entities. Is the ultimate to just blend back into the one and not have to do any more work???? ( im stressed today )

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beebuddy
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From: illinois
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posted November 29, 2005 01:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for beebuddy     Edit/Delete Message
The sensation of being (an entity) is a psychological illusion.

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fayte.m
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posted November 29, 2005 02:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for fayte.m     Edit/Delete Message
Ahhh...
This I have spoken of many times here at LL.
My views upset some folks.
I will try to find that thread...You will like it I think.
But...a short/simple version here:
God/the oneness...shattered.
Each part became all that has a soul.
Each a unique individual.
We are not supposed to return to the oneness again! That would mean that all we are..each as unique individuals...would be no more.
In time if all were to return to oneness...then it would be One great mega soul/mind again...not a collective of individuals.
In time that oneness would grow lonely. In time the loneliness would lead to madness and the another shattering...big bang..whatever.
That is from the information I have recieved/found...exactly what had happened in time backwards into perhaps eternty/infinity...who knows how many times the Oneness shattered...then all returned..and it shattered again and the cycle repeated.....
Seems rather wasteful to me.
So..I believe that this time there is to be no returning to a Oneness. Call it the Oneness/God...experiencing existance as a multiplicity of unique individuals...
Growing..changing..evolving..
Infinity is big enough to hold all of us... and more... as unique individuals.
And what is more challenging and non static...than nearly uncountless entities all working to get along and communicate as diversely unique individuals? To return to a Oneness is to return to stasis.. to give up your uniqueness...to be only a mindless surge of energy in the next big bang.
I prefer to walk the star trails of a universe without end..as me...myself...forever changing as the enviroment and places dictate or once I master it...as I choose.
Ok..I know that sounds wild.
It is the short/simplified version. Hope it made sense.

Beebuddy!
Quote:
The sensation of being (an entity) is a psychological illusion.

Elaborate please.

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beebuddy
Knowflake

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From: illinois
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posted November 29, 2005 02:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for beebuddy     Edit/Delete Message
It's simple really, YOU are thought. The physical body is not an illusion but the sensation of being autonomous is actually thought, and a very convincing illusion when taken as reality.

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fayte.m
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posted November 29, 2005 02:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for fayte.m     Edit/Delete Message
And that/those thoughts...our patterns of thought and perceptions...our memories..and so forth give to a empty pure energy a sense of uniquenes and awareness that makes us BE.
Without our thoughts, etcetera...our illusion,...we would all be simply energy.... mindless and just there...like any energy.
But add thought and that energy becomes self
aware.
So how else can we be sapient and self aware without thought?
I would not call it an illusion. It is too dynamic..flexible and constantly changing to be a simple illusion. An Illusion would have no forward or backwards motion...it would simply be.

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beebuddy
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From: illinois
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posted November 29, 2005 03:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for beebuddy     Edit/Delete Message
You are missing the point. There is no "our illusion", we are the illusion. Frightening as it is, it's reality.

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fayte.m
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posted November 29, 2005 03:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for fayte.m     Edit/Delete Message
So..are you speaking of like..
this movie...
The Thirteenth Floor?
Like... All that we see, or seem, is but a dream within a dream.

Are you speaking of a sort of holographic existence?
There is a physical body..
AND..there is energy within..
AND ...self awareness is infused with it all..or even just the energy..in respects to discarnates...

Then how can we be mere illusion?
By the way..cool debate!

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Lousianagrl
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Posts: 174
From: Leesville, Louisiana
Registered: Sep 2005

posted November 29, 2005 06:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lousianagrl     Edit/Delete Message
It makes my head hurt when I think about beyond the universe...(sort of off topic)

Does it just go on and on for infinity? If it does end, what's beyond that? Universe!
But then whatever is beyond the universe has to end also..

see what I mean?

I remember wondering these questions when I was 5! I was in line going back to class and I was thinking "It is so amazing that I'm here. Time is strange..How does it go by so quickly?" Just things like that. I've always contemplated those sorts of questions..

But I've always had some sort of answer for them. I've never believed in the devil for as long as I can remember. My preacher(s) would always holler "if you're not saved you will be doomed for eternity in hell" I never believed them...and still dont

------------------
aquarius!

And I can feel that, muddy water runnin' through my veins
And I can hear that, lullaby of the midnight train
And it sings to me and it sounds familiar..

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fayte.m
Knowflake

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posted November 29, 2005 08:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for fayte.m     Edit/Delete Message
It is all rather mind boggling isn't it!
Oh yes! I know those kind of preachers too!
I'd rather be overwhelmed with pondering of the nature of infinity /eternity than subscribing to such wild dogmatic superstition.
I am not saying I am right...but theory to me is better than mythos.

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beebuddy
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posted November 29, 2005 10:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for beebuddy     Edit/Delete Message
The "energy within" and movement is thought. The "we" spaces are thought. You and I are thought. The physical reality is not an illusion, the illusion is the entity that is seperate from the physical reality (you and I).

The human organism is in and of awareness, "self-awareness" is THE illusion.

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fayte.m
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posted November 29, 2005 10:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for fayte.m     Edit/Delete Message
Sorry..
Have to disagree. We are an amalgam of what you term the illusion. That self awareness is one thing that differentuates us from plants for example.
So you are saying that we are nothing but energy... and that thought and self awareness end with the death of the physical?
That would be an evolutionary waste. Why have our type of lifeform if physical death only releases pure energy and all else is gone?
The universe is not that wasteful. The fact that we think..and therefore are...is not something that logically would simply cease to exist. We could just as easily have grown roots and mindlessly lived if thought was worthless and illusion.
You are interesting at debate beebuddy.

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beebuddy
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From: illinois
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posted November 30, 2005 12:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for beebuddy     Edit/Delete Message
What is termed "we" is the illusion. It's purely a psychological phonomena.

Thought isn't illusion, the thinker is the illusion. This doesn't in any way point towards nihilism or pointlessness.

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sesame
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posted November 30, 2005 07:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sesame     Edit/Delete Message
Yeah, I disagree too. I think we are what we are. We think, we act, we exist. As entities. On every level of the fifth dimension a different existence prevails but they are necessary. An electron that zaps out of existance was needed elsewhere. We as unevolved people can't zap out of existance for we are needed here. I agree though that we are all the one, and there is illusion in where one body ends, and one begins, but this is also necessary. We are individuals on this dimension. On a higher one, we are all the same massive energy mass (is that an oxymoron?}. My point is that all illusions illustrate reality at some level, and in that level, their is no illusion - this reality is an illusion only on a higher dimensional reality. There. I'm sure this debate is resolved! HAHA! Ah, I'm getting sleepy...

Deab,

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thirteen
Knowflake

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From: Rochester Hills, MI USA
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posted November 30, 2005 08:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for thirteen     Edit/Delete Message
Beebuddy, Im not totally sure what your ultimate conclusion here is.
Fayte. Im more inclined to side with your theory. The illusion of separateness, yes i believe that, but if all of existance is an illusion ,, i say : Who's illusion? Which would bring us right back to Fayte's theory.

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