posted November 23, 2007 12:46 AM         

I see people insulting each other all the time. Should we just accept the insult and move on, this is what Jesus or Buddha would do, right?

Or do we fight back, an old Jewish expression says that "to accept insult is to invite injury."

What if we turn the other cheek but they keep coming with insults or harassment?

“If you can't ignore an insult, top it; if you can't top it, laugh it off; and if you can't laugh it off, it's probably deserved.”

-J. Russell Lynes


“A wise man is superior to any insults which can be put upon him, and the best reply to unseemly behavior is patience and moderation.”

Moliere

“The way to procure insults is to submit to them: a man meets with no more respect than he exacts.”

William Hazlitt

posted November 23, 2007 11:30 AM         

You have one of the best combinations (Sag/Scorpio/Cap)
for expressing yourself in a way that gets others to consider things of themselves they hadn't before, by exploring the deeper subconscious psychology of things they do and say~~

unexpected jolting boomerang Truth.

Calm, direct, straight to the shadow depths of things. You have the power to leave people self-reflecting; speechless.

An offering of mercy and understanding can follow to temper
feelings of embarrassment and this follows through with what the good intentions are~ hopeful understanding of each other, awakenings, growth.
It's up to them. If it doesn't happen in that way, it's beyond you...but inside, you did your part.

It's been a wonder to me as well.
I think turning the other cheek is good,
but when it's an ongoing experience that
makes you feel uneasy, it's probably signaling something important that isn't meant to be ignored. Recurrent themes
are usually (I believe)
signaling of an important Soul lesson--
something that needs to be transcended
in some way.

posted November 23, 2007 03:07 PM         

your words usually hit me with such resonant truth that I don't even know how to respond for a while, and then I often forget to respond (my apologies for that)

Your responses seem to come from a place of intuition, channeling even...and I feel you deserve a response that's on the same level, but I usually don't function on that wavelength...

what is your sun/moon/asc if you don't mind me asking? I know your sun

Have there been times when you did not turn the other cheek? It's easier to just ignore things online, an instant response isn't demanded or expected of you, in the real world things function much differently.

quote:

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You have the power to leave people self-reflecting; speechless.

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posted November 23, 2007 03:26 PM         

quote:

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Mat 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth

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Rather a reference to reaping what you sow,you get what you give or Karma to some.

Turn the other cheek then would follow that train of thought.

------------------
~
What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world is immortal"~

posted November 23, 2007 04:22 PM         

I think we are somehow trained to view natural things as bad. Nothing is bad. Everything serves a purpose in our growth.

Since we cannot avoid conflict in life it must serve a necessary function in our human growth. Because we tend to learn the best lessons through conflict and confrontation. That is, if we choose to use it as a learning experience. We cannot learn a thing by passing the blame off on the other person(s).

Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind. Sometimes you have to just let things go and ignore them. Sometimes you have to be confrontational if your personal boundaries are being consistently disrespected.

It's all a judgment call. Choices we can only decide for ourselves. We do need to learn to balance things inwardly so that we express anger in more positive ways. For some people that is easier than it is for other people due to the temperment we are born with. But anger is not a negative emotion. No emotion is negative. It's just the way we express those emotions that can be seen as negative or positive. I personally don't think that anything that happens is either negative or positive, good or bad. I thing all things serve a purpose in our growth if we allow that to happen.

posted November 23, 2007 05:59 PM         

I agree, what she said was amazing.
I, too, wish I had the temperament to write with such care. -
Or care with such care, for that matter.

In response to your question,
I would only emphasize that what matters most
is probably the attitude one holds towards the other person.

If your attitude is right,
you may do away with rules and principles,
and trust to your basic intuition.

Every situation is unique,
and complications are all the more likely to arise
when we attempt to fit the world into comfortable theories.

When to speak, when to speak firmly,
when to raise the voice, when to raise the hand,
when to resist, when to use force,...
all of these questions are answered according to
very specific conditions unique to the given situation.

Wisdom is knowing how to answer questions like these,
and I dont think it can be communicated in the abstract.

My personal understanding is that people are innocent,
and, so, ideally, one would like to minimize the use of force.

Unfortunately, it is necessary to be firm
when encouraging personal responsibility.

The nature of the world is such,
and the good in the world is stretched so thin,
that people must be held more accountable than they truly are.

The Bhagavad Gita deals particularly with this question.
The warrior, Arjuna, is there on the battlefield,
and he sees on the enemies side men whom he loves,
and others whom he has no quarrel with.
Lord Krishna advises Arjuna to take part in the battle,
even though it is ultimately an illusion.
The thing is to play his part.

We must be firm with violent people,
but we must make clear that we abhor the sin,
not the "sinner".

We must remember that there is one Mover.
We say that a rock moves,
but, really, a rock is moved.
So, we say that a person sins,
when a person is really moved to sin.

It is the duty of conscious individuals
to make use their own motivations to do good.

That which moves the sinner to sin
also moves the good person to do good.
The two naturally attract,
since the business of each concerns the other;
the pervertion or convertion of the other.

In other words, I cant tell you how to answer this question.
I think you will answer it as best you can, no matter what.
The very fact that you are asking it is evidence
of the level of your consciousness of this dilemma.

I do think it is unfortunate, though,
that, often, the people well equiped to govern others
are the least inclined to pressume that liberty.

posted November 23, 2007 09:27 PM         

Love ain't the infinite truth. Wisdom is.

posted November 23, 2007 11:17 PM         

When you are in Love, you will radiate love. Others will tell you are embodiment of love. If you say yourself that you are embodiment of love , it comes from ego and you honestly don't know what love is.

posted November 23, 2007 11:22 PM         

What if we turn the other cheek but they keep coming with insults or harassment?

“If you can't ignore an insult, top it; if you can't top it, laugh it off; and if you can't laugh it off, it's probably deserved.”

-J. Russell Lynes

“A wise man is superior to any insults which can be put upon him, and the best reply to unseemly behavior is patience and moderation.”

Moliere

It's my best Medicine!!! Thanks!!!

So True for me!!!

posted November 24, 2007 12:01 AM         

Ok let me restate "I think (many times I omit "I think" because its assumed that the words came from my hands and hence it is my belief or opinion) LL readers interested in understanding the title of your post must read/study Gandhi. Sure theres no obligation.(Why should they?) Theres nothing wrong in reinventing the wheel. People like Gandhi are the people who walked on earth and lived the words that Jesus (spiritual master to many souls) taught".

Can we exclude Newton and his laws from Mechanical engineering department?

posted November 24, 2007 01:58 AM         

If your intentions are authentic you could. But should you? Would you? Also don't ask me what heaven and hell are - hehehe pun intended.

posted November 24, 2007 08:23 AM         

Perhaps wit? But what if you weren't clever or quick enough?

posted November 24, 2007 11:30 AM         

quote:

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I see people insulting each other all the time. Should we just accept the insult and move on, this is what Jesus or Buddha would do, right?

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Would like to share some thoughts on that.
I would not answer right to that question, BR. Because Jesus was at times confrontational. It's right there in Scripture.

Some examples:

Jesus used some harsh words at times when he called the Pharisees a "brood of vipers" and also on another occasion told them they were, "hypocrites." Jesus was confrontational when the Pharisees said to him, " Our father is God." Jesus responded saying, " Your father is the father of this world who was a liar and a murderer from the beginning." Jesus was confrontational when he dumped over the tables of the money lenders and merchants in the temple and told them all, " My Father's house is a house of prayer but you have made it a den of theives." He then ordered them all out of the temple. He displayed some righteous anger there.

Jesus could be confrontational but he was opposed to physical violence of any kind. Except against tables.

Jesus, hated the sin but loved the sinner. When he was confrontational it was always the sin he addressed not the person. He spoke truth to lies and deceptions.

There were also times when Jesus ignored questions that were asked of him. He did not respond at all. As it says in Scripture, " Jesus knew well the hearts of man." In other words, Jesus could see into the soul and know the intentions and motives of those who asked these questions. He could see the manipulations and the snares of those questions. He knew when it was a genuine sincere question and when it was manipulative baiting. We can't see into the souls of others but we do sense things. We do have intuitions and perceptions. Especially when it is a repeated pattern directed at us.

Since Jesus did not allow others to dump their garbage on him I wouldn't think he would expect us to do that either. I don't think Jesus ever intended that we be so lacking in self-respect and human dignity, knowing our full worth as Children of God, that we would allow others to make a doormat out of us or use us as a dumping ground for their own garbage.

The one thing you can say about the life of Jesus is that he was always in conflict with the authorities of his time. The religious authorites ( not the religion ) and the ruling authorities. He was seen by both as a threat. Not a physical threat, but one that perhaps caused them to doubt their way of life and their own beliefs and what they held to be truth. He also was a threat to their need for power and control over others.

Jesus didn't create the conflict. He attracted it because he was seen as a threat.

I think that is the case with our difficulties with some people in our lives too. I think the basis of any conflict we have with others is that we see them as some kind of threat to us or they see us a threat. It may be a real threat. It may be an imagined threat. But basically fear is at the root of conflict.

Fear was the root of the conflicts that Jesus attracted to himself. Jesus still attracts that conflict about who he was and what he said and did. Because the fear and perceived threat of Jesus is still there with humanity. Many times it is acted out on the disciples of Jesus as it always has been. Sometimes with just cause because even some who claim to be Christians are actually only using the name of Jesus and Scripture to control others and as a weapon against others.

This is why I am against all the practices of conversion ( or what is called "evangelization") that are taking place within Christianity today in the world. Conversion has to take place within each person. What this practice does is unleash a bunch of control freaks onto the world. People who want to control the beliefs of others.

posted November 24, 2007 12:44 PM         

quote:

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Why should Christians do what Jesus himself doesn't do?

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It's those control hungry people that give Christianity a bad rap.

Just...thanks Mirandee.

Hugs,
GG

posted November 24, 2007 11:14 PM         

>>>>I see people insulting each other all the time. Should we just accept the insult and move on, this is what Jesus or Buddha would do, right?

Jesus and Buddha were assertive people. Buddha was a king before he renounced and he had such a charm about him that he could convince anyone.

Jesus could have talked out of being murdered, but I guess he didn't chose to.
Perhaps he had a destiny to fulfil.

Both Jesus, Buddha and other great Masters didn't want people to be stuck on them. That has happened for 2000 plus years and its enough.
Some people assume I dump garbage on them. Its their conditioning. Let the past become clear to them. Let them reread what they wrote before. Truth hurts them because they have their own fears. There is nothing to fear but fear itself.

In time I will share whats coming for mankind in general and what future holds.
The time is not now. The time never will come. Do not wait for it. But I will share in general where mankind is heading towards. Its my own idea BTW.

>>words can hurt

Agreed. But its truth that hurts. Lies told 1000 times becomes truth and truth told first time appears a lie. When the towel of babel (ego) got shattered it became languages of the world. They revel in their collection of those bits and pieces and also revel in reading books that some people write that seem to collect those pieces. Some interpret scriptures with their pigeon headed brains. They become the book itself. Its like being lost in a maze with no exits.

They do not understand light itself how can they understand darkness. And on that philosophy they go after people condeming them. Brainwashed idiots. Their daughters and sons are always innocent and its always the world that is the culprit. Tell me, does an innocent soul ever get hurt? They have to vomit all that they learnt first. I wish they were suffering from indigestion of words cause then they will throw up naturally. Wise is the man who does not poop his words always for he knows he has to come back and clean it later on. Silence is golden for a reason. Fool is the person who likes to poop and poop forever talking garbage and misleading people. Nuff said.