posted November 01, 2007 03:33 PM            

I would like to start by quoting some of our cohorts here at LindaLand to start this discussion/debate.

posted November 01, 2007 03:33 PM            

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To me, God is Energy, and hence, mass, and hence, all things, and yet, this isn't enough to live with as the most important species on this planet (I am being facetious), the most intelligent (sorry dolphins), enlightened beings, etc, etc, therefore, we have to personalize God and make it a He as Da Man! Not just that, but we make God into everything, look at the number of Gods in Rome or Egypt, or the ones that loved sacrifices and still think people are lowly because that don't believe certain things, or "understand certain" facts. I'm sure you are not refferring to texts, but if not, then what would you use to back up your understanding of God, unless you do believe it is the "All". If it is the all, then what good can we do from understanding that? Sometimes I envy the atheists that say "We live because we were born". I love the Spiritual more than anything as they say "I am because I have inner being", whereas the religious seem to say "I have the words, and therefore, the proof". Granted, if we never created words, then there would never be religion - only spirituality, It is my belief that religion was created to make man superior - to create a hierarchy where God is the CEO. The lowliest give a ten percent tithe, and the highest reap the harvests. However, there is a massive BUT. It was also created as a means to understanding ourselves. All manner of religions say the same thing. They all want us to respect one another and live in peace, but we can't rest with that. As the benevolent beings we are, we have to say We are the Best! We created these religions because our God is behind us and is more powerful. Our savior is directly related, or was given visions, or wrote such a great book, you should read it! See, it says this right here!? Humans are my issue with religions, not religions themselves. We have to realize that All people have their own views on everything. Religions are belief systems that could also be highly spiritual, and extremely social, which cannot be a bad thing, unless the "leaders" start saying "Hmm, this other group is threatening our numbers, we better stamp them out". If only we could understand that the uniqueness of everyone's view is EVERYTHING. The TRUE all. Our perspectives all point at God. Think of God as looking through every pair of eyes from every ant on Earth. Every angel that is seen is from God. And yet, how can God see if it doesn't have eyes? How can Energy have consciousness or real intelligence? Anyone seen an inconvenient truth? What will our discussions be about in one hundred years? I feel they will be more stressed as our environment continues to scare us, but that's life. Where is God's plan? For me, living today, I saw God in the clouds, the green grass, the friendly people who said hi and tried to mean it. They were convenient hi's. In any case, God is everything, but our perceptions of how we view the World and Life creates our own life, which in turn may procreate into other life, and so on. The more we try to understand how to better ourselves and involve ourselves in ways that benefit mankind, the more mankind will benefit, but it all comes from us - each as individuals. I do not really wish to debate who is right, I'd like to continue with what is God, but feel it may never go anywhere. They're all angels / angles.

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posted November 01, 2007 03:37 PM            

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You could dispense with the word "God", and substitute a variety of terms in its place. There are indeed some things which may be inferred about the Infinite from the nature of the Finite. We may not be able to prove the existence of whatever it is you have in mind when you say "God", but we can prove by reason that the inference of certain propositions regarding the nature of the All is incontrovertible; at least as incontrovertible as many of the most firmly established laws of dynamics we observe in the physical world.

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First, we redefine the word "God".
We do not postulate something "out there".
We gather the precepts of philosophy,
those gems gathered over time,
which catch our eye time and time again.
We arrange them in order according to
the self-same Reason out of which they arose.
This our jewel-encrusted temple, built to the Most High.
Does this process end?
What is it to prove a thing,
when every thing directs you
to some new thing beyond itself?
In this case, proving is an ongoing process,
but because progress is made,
it is indeed a process of proving.
You see, in a sense, the very fact that we are proceeding,
that our view leads to other perceptions,
that it does not choke and die in the lab,
but integrates organically with the universe, -
not leading to a closed system,
on which we may slap the label "proof",
but, leading to ever more frontiers of discovery;
this is how we know that we are on the right track.
Everything confirms the principles of true wisdom,
we see them reflected everywhere,
and as we increase our understanding,
there are more and more of them,
all reflecting off of one another.
This is how we "prove" them.

"The proof is in the pudding," as they say.

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posted November 01, 2007 03:39 PM            

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Spiritual enlightment is like (as an example) climbing (say) Mount Everest. With all the hardships and fatality rate, while someone asked Sir Edmund Hillary why he keeps going back to climb Mount Everest, he said "You haven't seen the view from the top, have you?". This hold true here too. Unless a person takes the same route of spirituality they would never come across what I (or you or them) have encountered, so an explanation would be futile in most cases. So I believe providing a conclusive evidence is next to impossible.

But there is also a bigger picture when it comes to spirituality - that the end point is the same for everyone.

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posted November 01, 2007 03:41 PM            

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It cannot be proven or given as evidence to others can it? It is an individual personal experience and until we all become immutably telepathic, empathic, no one can truly share or prove their own eurekas, epiphanies, and experiences. But perhaps that is the point..no one gets it handed to them on a silver platter,
no easy grab it free for all without going through the process, the journey of self to God alone. We find what we need when we are ready, when we are no longer afraid to let go of what we think for at least a moment. But there is still no way to prove it to others.

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posted November 01, 2007 04:07 PM            

And can understand where you come from.

posted November 01, 2007 04:27 PM              

Then there is the true God Consciousness/ Love/ Christ Consciousness.

Then there is the mystical Nirvana....isness....being....oneness.

Who knows.

I find I am just completely disillusioned these days and unable to have "blind faith" in anything.

posted November 01, 2007 04:28 PM            

>>>>Acoustic God is my God.

Don't mind. I am saving it because some people have an habit of eating (sorry editing) their words after days. And I don't mean you are one of them. Really.

posted November 01, 2007 04:31 PM            

>>> can't help thinking that every action causes an equal reaction in the opposite direction; a loving action creates an equal force of hatred somewhere else on the planet and so on.

posted November 01, 2007 04:35 PM            

The corn dog:

posted November 01, 2007 04:40 PM            

All posters with screen-names that begin with "A", "B" or "M", may NOT be excused.

posted November 01, 2007 04:44 PM            

He's the wolf screaming lonely in the night
He's the blood stain on the stage
He's the tear in your eye
Being tempted by his lies
He's the knife in your back
He's rage
He's the razor to the knife
Oh, lonely is our lives
My head's spinnin' round and round
But in the seasons of wither
We'll stand and deliver
Be strong and laugh and

[Chorus:]
Shout shout shout
Shout at the devil
Shout shout shout

He'll be the love in your eyes
He'll be the blood between your thighs
And then have you Crying for more
He'll put strength to the test
He'll put the thrill back in bed
Sure you've heard it all before
He'll be the risk in the kiss
Might be anger on your lips
Might run scared for the door
But in seasons of wither
We'll stand and deliver
Be strong and laugh and

Shout shout shout
Shout at the devil
Shout shout shout
Shout at the devil

He's the wolf screaming lonely in the night
He's the blood stain on the stage
He's the tear in your eye
Being tempted by his lies
He's the knife in your back
He's rage
He's the razor to the knife
Oh, lonely is our lives
My head's spinnin' round and round
But in the seasons of wither
We'll stand and deliver
Be strong and laugh and

Shout shout shout
Shout at the devil x6
Shout shout shout x5 (fades into background)