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Author Topic:   Help with Determining ASC
Barbee
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posted April 04, 2013 12:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Anyone good at determining or even giving it a good guess as to the ascendance if I give you a picture and moon and sun placement?

This is the woman who is divorcing my son and her personality has done a complete 360 and we don't know why. As far as we know there isn't someone else. I want to see if whatever is affecting her will pass by and bring her back to us.

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 04, 2013 12:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I will try.

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Barbee
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posted April 04, 2013 01:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by anonymidarkness:
I will try.

A little about her. She used to be meek, but now is stern and in control. She has halted speech as if she is thinking of her words carefully. She is a math teacher. She had one brother and has one daughter. She suffers from acne but has been having scraping chem peels lately so her face is clear. She loves animals. She cries easily unless the situation has her too mad to cry.
Her parents are not separated or divorced. She is never home... she flies here and there like a butterfly. Not a good housekeeper because she is never there. Very careful about making decisions and often even asks for opinions and advice. I actually loved her like a daughter until now... I would love for them to go back together and be a family.

<a href="http://s1324.photobucket.com/user/barbee1944/media/MM_zps9ce776ba.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/u607/barbee1944/MM_zps9ce776ba.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo MM_zps9ce776ba.jpg"/></a>

She was married to my son back in June 1998 and her baby was born on 10/11/10. Her birthdate 1/11/74

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 04, 2013 08:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Looks like she is a gemini moon,flying here and there like a butterfly and asking for opinions before deciding sounds like gemini moon.She seems to have gone through a big transformation,T saturn or pluto in first house or aspecting her personal planets would do it.T. saturn is conjuncting her sun,mars and venus.Her scorpio stellium should make her intense in one area,does she show it to you or is it hidden?

Saturn has transitted lot of her planets in past few years,that must have been pretty hard.Being stern and in control sounds saturnian.Saturn does not seem strong in her chart,actually it does not aspect anything.A person with a weak saturn has gone through so many transits,I think that’s the reason for the complete 360.

Where was she born?Her moon seems to be gemini rather than taurus,that makes things tricky.No merc-saturn or anything that suggests speech problem,my guess would be either sag or cap(more likely considering her speech problem and acnes) ascendant for now.I will continue later.

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Barbee
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posted April 04, 2013 09:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
To protect her privacy, instead of her place of birth I'll post the chart I set up for her using 2:55 PM because I thought she might have Pisces rising because she is very sensitive.

When our granddaughter was born and we agree to babysit for her while she worked, she asked if we'd use sign language. Well I'm from the old school and the baby was very very smart and I told her she didn't need sign language and that it would hinder her speaking. She started to cry!!! So hubby and I said we would. As it turned out we only got as far as one sign...MORE. She started talking a blue streak. Didn't need it. But that's how sensitive she is. But I dont' know if it's really her ASC or not.

But when it comes to being mean to my son and how horrible she treats him... not too sensitive there. She wants him out of the house and he refuses to go. His thinking is, she's the one who wants to split up not him so let her leave. So for now they are living under the same roof but not talking and just texting each other for important things. Or talking through their daughter.

I also thought that bunch of planets now in Pisces and Aries might be changing her personality as well. She has also had big changes at work.

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Barbee
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posted April 04, 2013 09:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by anonymidarkness:
Looks like she is a gemini moon,flying here and there like a butterfly and asking for opinions before deciding sounds like gemini moon.She seems to have gone through a big transformation,T saturn or pluto in first house or aspecting her personal planets would do it.T. saturn is conjuncting her sun,mars and venus.Her scorpio stellium should make her intense in one area,does she show it to you or is it hidden?

Saturn has transitted lot of her planets in past few years,that must have been pretty hard.Being stern and in control sounds saturnian.Saturn does not seem strong in her chart,actually it does not aspect anything.A person with a weak saturn has gone through so many transits,I think that’s the reason for the complete 360.

Where was she born?Her moon seems to be gemini rather than taurus,that makes things tricky.No merc-saturn or anything that suggests speech problem,my guess would be either sag or cap(more likely considering her speech problem and acnes) ascendant for now.I will continue later.


Moon in the 3rd would give her the constantly going here and there too. Although she is also very stubborn so it could be a Taurus moon, definitely.

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Nine
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posted April 04, 2013 11:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Nine     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
She has a bunch of planets in Scorpio, this will make her stubborn.

As a guess I'd say Libra rising.

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Nine
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posted April 04, 2013 11:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Nine     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Scorpio-Taurus Female

One thing about this woman, when she sets her mind to something, it's set. While not inflexible, she's committed. She's also not the least bit gullible in case you had any schemes you'd planned to put over on her. She learned early on about life and the unscrupulous few. She's one of the women who have endured much - loss of family, loved ones, a child, even. She doesn't dwell on these things. She intuitively knows that the only way to survive is to put the past behind her and keep her feet moving forward one step at a time. She's no saint though, and I must tell you, she's an awful nag with her husband even though she'll give him more devotion than he dreamed possible. She's practical and down to earth, but in her heart of hearts, she'd love to be a Libra, or wear the gaudy silver dress and spend the evening at the best restaurant with the most influential dining companions. This may never be for her because she usually comes from poverty or a lower social class, and often marries a difficult man. She acquires money eventually, but the style, breeding, and elegance she so much admires is always a touch out of reach. A conscientious co-worker, she's not afraid of hard work. As a mother she brings, quite naturally, some of her difficulties to the children. She'll try to be as protective as possible, but it may not always work. To describe her as a mother let me tell you a story: I read there was a mother who was raising her children alone. It was Thanksgiving and they didn't have enough money for a turkey, so the mother baked a meatloaf carefully shaped like a turkey. She asked her oldest son to carve it. It was the most memorable Thanksgiving the children would ever have. It was a holiday of spirit and pride and yes, love. It's rather like the silver dress she could never afford for herself. I hope a rich Cancer marries her. A Libra or Taurus would understand the longing for beauty in an ugly world.

Her Illumination: Dignified
Her Dark Side: She rages

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Barbee
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posted April 05, 2013 12:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Very good Nine. Most of that is evident. Some may be yet to come. Of course I didn't like that she may marry again because I want so much for their marriage to mend. I love their daughter to pieces and she deserves better. I'm praying so hard.

You may be right about Libra. Her daughter is a Libra and very often a child has a moon or ASC same as mother. I'll set up a chart with Libra rising and see how it works. I just wonder where her sensitivity comes from. She cries very easily.

My son is an Aries with Pisces Moon and Taurus rising, Venus in Aquar. Mars in Gemini.

Thank you Nine.

------------------
Aries ASC Aquarius Sun
Moon in Cancer in 4th house. Mercury and Saturn in mutual reception. Venus Conj. MC

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Lonake
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posted April 05, 2013 01:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lonake     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hmm she already has Sun Scorp trine Pisces Jup, that's pretty sensitive enough.
To throw out a guess based on looks maybe Sadge which puts Jupiter in 4th Pisces, maybe. Maybe the Sadge Neptune/NN is on the ASC as to me, she looks fiery.
But I'm pretty crap at guessing signs by looks /laughs/

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 05, 2013 01:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
She may be a libra rising,they do ask for opinions before deciding something but then again she has sun conjunct venus and she does not really look like a libra rising.She would have looked Scorpionic if she is a libra rising.Libra rising may also place her pluto in first,she does not sound like a 1H Pluto person so far.I wonder where that scorpio stellium comes out,she seems calm from all your descriptions so far.

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 05, 2013 01:20 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
She looks like a Sag rising to me as well.She has that face shape and cheekbones.That would also place her Scorpio stellium in 12th.

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 05, 2013 01:20 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
..

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somethingexcellent
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posted April 05, 2013 01:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for somethingexcellent     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
anonymidarkness: Looks like she is a gemini moon,flying here and there like a butterfly and asking for opinions before deciding sounds like gemini moon.

Funny thing, I was going to put my bid in as her being a Gemini AC! I like that she's an earth void...

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Barbee
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posted April 05, 2013 10:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm going to set her chart up with your suggestions and see which one seems right. I often see charts of famous people, how do they get these birth times? If we were on better terms right now I'd ask her but things are strained right now.

She has always seemed to me like the type of person who wouldn't hurt a fly... yet she is treating my son like dirt knowing he is sensitive and prone to emotional stress. (Pisces Moon) When they first started having problems I asked her what the problem was... she said that he said some things to her that she can't forgive. My son says that everyone says things they don't mean when they are fighting. He apologized but she isn't having any of it. She said the apology means nothing because she KNOWS he really meant what he said.

anonymidarkness thought her moon might be in Taurus and I think she is probably right so that would make her born earlier than 2:55 pm. How much is the question.
------------------
Aries ASC Aquarius Sun
Moon in Cancer in 4th house. Mercury and Saturn in mutual reception. Venus Conj. MC

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Doux Rêve
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posted April 05, 2013 10:43 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
She looks like an Aquarius rising, to me.
And that would put Pisces in her 1st house, intercepted - which could explain the sensitivity.

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 05, 2013 11:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
^^Neptune in first or conj. asc and 12th house stellium may also give her that sensitivity.I don’t get where that speech problem comes from.

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StarlightSmileSupreme
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posted April 05, 2013 11:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for StarlightSmileSupreme     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Maybe Mercury/Uranus conjunct is responsible for speech problem?

I am going with Jupiter ruled Asc, possibly Sagittarius based on the fact Jupiter has so many aspects. A lot of times the chart ruler is alone and heavily aspected.

Second choice would be Cancer.

Third choice would be Capricorn.

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 05, 2013 11:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Does she have temper problems?Mars conj uranus,mars conj merc,mars conj sun and mars trine jupiter should make her pretty assertive unless it is in the house where it is uncomfortable.

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StarlightSmileSupreme
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posted April 05, 2013 11:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for StarlightSmileSupreme     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sounds to me like it's a matter of not communicating with each other and living under the same roof.

She could have a temper because look at Mercury/Mars/Uranus, you are right about that, so her temper could have a lot to do with this and it might be a twelfth house thing. Not sure if Sag Ascendant would put the Mercury conjunction in the twelfth house but it might explain a lot of unconscious tension manifesting in subtle yet destructive ways.

There is good news! A lot of times, when people are under the same roof, just not talking, they can get past the feelings at some point and work toward resolution. Much more of a chance of it happening when they are under the same roof than when living on their own.

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Barbee
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posted April 05, 2013 01:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by anonymidarkness:
^^Neptune in first or conj. asc and 12th house stellium may also give her that sensitivity.I don’t get where that speech problem comes from.

I wouldn't call it a speech problem. It just she may stop mid sentence as if reviewing what she is going to say before saying it. Ummmmmm is her trademark. Even her baby daughter has picked it up. When I ask her a question she says Ummmmmm before picking.

Anyway I think she may have a bit of a communication problem rather than speech.
She can snap and come out with sarcastic remarks when provoked. Thankfully never at me.. yet.

When the baby was small and I babysat, she'd make me write down everything the baby did... ate, drank... how many ounces, poop.. how big what color etc. etc. etc. She was Anal when it came to that baby. Saturn in the 5th? Her baby will be an only child since she is 38 and her marriage is splitting up.

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Barbee
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posted April 05, 2013 01:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by anonymidarkness:
Does she have temper problems?Mars conj uranus,mars conj merc,mars conj sun and mars trine jupiter should make her pretty assertive unless it is in the house where it is uncomfortable.

Very assertive and she always did the driving and my son the passinger. He said she didn't like his driving so he said... go for it. She does everything in that house. I asked my son, why and he says because she jumps up to do it first.

She was definitely the boss in the house.
I have never seen her temper being MIL but my son claims she has a terrible temper and is why he can't talk out their problems. He is a timid Moon in Pisces and says she gets very angry and yells at him so he just won't even try to sit down and discuss their problems. My son also doesn't want to argue in front of the baby. If she starts something, he goes for a walk.

------------------
Aries ASC Aquarius Sun
Moon in Cancer in 4th house. Mercury and Saturn in mutual reception. Venus Conj. MC

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Barbee
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posted April 05, 2013 01:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You guys are great. You've given me some really good advice and I'm off to try them all out.

One thing I forgot to mention about her that might be important. She comes across as a timid little girl type. She has a tiny cutsie voice and often sounds like a child when greeting you... So she gives others the impression that she is naaive but she is far from it. When she first started teaching I wondered how she would keep control of a classroom because her voice and demeanor is anything but assertive, but when it come to her marriage and her home... she is very assertive.

Jupiter can't be conjunct her ASC as I have it because she doesn't fit this description I found on that aspect: Jupiter conjunct the Ascendant would typically give a larger than normal physical frame. People with Jupiter in their first house can often have weight problems at some point in their life.

She is small boned, no fat, she works out at the gym very hard to keep her figure. She take courses that are tough workouts.

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Barbee
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posted April 06, 2013 12:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Barbee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Considering all your input and some fiddling of my own, this is what I come up with. Remarkably her daughter has the same mercury, venus and mars placement. She does resemble her mom and that gave me the Libra clue since her daughter is a Libra Sun. Her fine bones and thin willowy body, her love for jewelry and beauty. She spends mega money and time on her appearance. Her sensitiviy would come from the Scorpio and her stubborness from the Taurus Moon. Saturn on her MC would be the "teacher". Jupiter in the 5th is a puzzle to me... I really wanted Saturn there... She has one child, lost one (miscarriage)... hmmmm

Of course no one is right or wrong because I still don't have her birth time, but if and when I discover it I'll surely post it.

Nine, you are spot on.
------------------
Aries ASC Aquarius Sun
Moon in Cancer in 4th house. Mercury and Saturn in mutual reception. Venus Conj. MC

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Cherri
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posted April 06, 2013 12:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Cherri     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
When I first saw the picture of her above, I immediately thought of a girl I know (she's an ex-friend) who looks very similar. As I read the personality description and then saw this girl's chart, I was dumbfounded. Her chart is almost EXACTLY like my ex-friend's, except a day apart. Her birthday is November 2, 1974, born at 3:25 p.m. in eastern PA! And her mother at first said her birth time was 2:50!

And then reading about the sensitive personality, yet unkind and cruel way she's treating your son, it is EXACTLY like how my ex-friend behaves.

Since I've studied my ex-friend's chart extensively and have known her for more than 10 years, I can tell you that I've suspected the Scorpio Sun, Venus and Mars (especially that Scorpio Mars, it creates a lot of jealousy) to explain the cruel behavior. She is very jealous, and when she either doesn't like someone or if someone offends her repeatedly, she turns ice cold. She cuts the person out of her life.

She is also sensitive and will cry easily - BUT - she will not do so openly. She is very private about it (Scorpio). She is one of four children so I suspect her birth time could be earlier, giving her a Pisces ascendant instead of Aries. However, she likes to come across as very strong-headed, extroverted and "tough" so the Aries ascendant does fit her.

But with the Jupiter in Pisces and Saturn in Cancer, there is the different kind of sensitivity than the Scorpio Sensitivity. There definitely is a difference.

Another important thing is that both girls have the same house placements! My ex-friend's Pluto in the 7th makes her VERY sensitive to others, and in your DIL's case, Pluto in the 7th is affecting her marriage. I have experience with this placement because in addition to the ex-friend having it, I have it as well. I think that is why we are not friends anymore - because she annoyed me and I annoyed her! Two people with Pluto in the 7th need to be careful with each other!

But I have Moon in Pisces so I just couldn't relate to her jealous, cold vengeful personality so for my own sanity, I just had to "lose touch" with her.

Anyway, of course your DIL just may be very different. I am going by what you wrote and it seemed to fit what I know of my ex-friend. Plus, I find the similarity of the two charts quite amazing.

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