posted April 08, 2013 03:46 PM            

This is our draconic chart. Hope I got it right.

posted April 08, 2013 08:28 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
This is the Draconic synastry with a guy who undeniably has a tremndous impact on me (and triggering more psychic experiences, growth and Kundalini rising that I sometimes think I can bear. lol)

BTW I never go beyond 3 degree orb with Draconis, and focus on conjunction/ opposition.

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0_0 is that real?? wow you have so many tight aspects between very important points and planets involving the draconic and tropical, I don't even want to imagine how it must feel with this person around! And I see you didn't even include asteroids there except for BML.
Have you looked at the sidereal?
I'm not sure how to understand the sidereal in relation to the tropical, and even less to the draconic. I remember iQ mentioned it bring the completion of karma, and I've been paying attention to it ever since, but unfortunately without understanding much of it.

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:

"I wonder just how rare it would be for two persons to have many overlapping aspects from one type of chart to another. "
It depends on your set of objects. If you use a dozen asteroids (and I LOVE asteroids, you know that!) and orbs of 5 degrees or so, then not that rare.

However, if you reduce the set of objects and the orbs, much more rare.

"I have a weird case in my own chart where all of my angles aspect each other if I compare the draco to tropical to sidereal."
Might mean that the draco and sidereal experiences manifest more easily in your life now and here. Angles are like gateways or portals.

my Draco Moon is exactly conjunct my tropical DESC though (and conjunct SN by 3 degrees).

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Isn't your tropical vtx conjunct your draco MC? Unless it's to wide an orb to be considered?

My tr ASC: 24 cancer, dr VTX: 24 capricorn, sidereal NN: 24 capricorn (and tr mercury: 25 cap, tr moon: 26 cap dr mars: 21 cap)
tr MC: 0 aries, sidereal ASC: 1 cancer
dr ASC: 7 virgo, sidereal MC: 6 pisces, dr moon: 9 pisces, tr mars: 8 sag, tr VTX: 11 sag, sidereal uranus-jupiter: 11 sag-gemini
tr NN: 17 aquarius, sidereal VTX: 17 scorpio, dr IC: 14 scorpio, dr uranus-jupiter: 18 aqua-leo, sidereal mars: 14 scorpio

Also it seems like we have a few degrees in common.

posted April 09, 2013 04:23 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by ueharaa:
[B]
I'm not sure how to understand the sidereal in relation to the tropical, and even less to the draconic. I remember iQ mentioned it bring the completion of karma, and I've been paying attention to it ever since, but unfortunately without understanding much of it.

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There is more in your post I want to address, but not here (am still at work).

The sidereal zodiac is said to relate to the "completion of karma", meaning you sort of pack up the karmic residues, and after it`s done, it`s done.
Which means, if you are NOT twinflames/ soulmates/ or whatever, it means you probably will not meet again. It is sort of the finishing line.

Unless there will be other things to learn from each other further down the line of course.
(Maybe it just means that certain things are being finished up, and others are still there to work on.)
This was being mentioned in Blashkes book on relationships (HIGHLY recommend it btw!).
http://www.earthwalkastrology.com/images/Secrets%20of%20the%20Zodiac.pdf

The Draconic is related to "ongoing emotional and soul attachments".
And IQ interpretes them predominantly in the light of past life interaction.

While this is all valid and true, it is not where the Draconics end.
they are NOT just an image or storybook for what has been in the past.
Instead they might highlight past life incarnations that are still HIGHLY important for the present incarnation (or they would not come up at all).

however, my approach to Draconics, while incorporating all this as well, is a bit different, very subtly different only.
For me the meaning is derived from its calculation, the combination of Sun, Moon and Earth.
The merging of Spirit/Mind (Sun), soul (Moon) and body (Earth).

In this understanding it can lightly be termed a chart of the "soul", a deeper layer, underneath the expression of your tropical chart.
however, the tropical chart is the one, mostly tied to "Earth" and thus representing how we are anchored in the Here and Now, in the physical Dimension (with all the emotional stuff that is going on here of course, too), and the Draconic chart (or the sidereal or the heliocentric chart) is being experienced ON or THROUGH the tropical level.

Example:
my Draconic Moon conjunct my tropical DESC.
I experience that deeper layer of my emotions through the DESC, through encounters and relationships.

Or phrased differently; through encounters and relationships in the Here and now (tropical DESC) I connect to my soul in a deep sense (Draco Moon). Probably one of the reasons I feel strong emotional familarity, soulmate-like, to quite some people.
I also find it interesting that it falls into Gemini, the sign of the Twins, and as a child I would be pestering my parents, cause I felt, no KNEW deep inside, that I was a twin, or had a twin, and I accused my parents of hiding my twin from me. LOL
I even dreamed of him, even as a child.
the funny thing is that some of my relatives in other generations actually have twin-children, and actually it would have been my momīs "turn" to have twins as well. But I turned out to be, well, just me.
Of course I had no idea of that when I was asking and craving for my twin as a child.
But yeah, Draconic Moon in Gemini, definitely makes sense to me.

posted April 09, 2013 04:55 AM            

But speaking of Moon and Venus, there was only his Venus square her Pluto and her Venus square his Jupiter; while Venus/Pluto is passionate and Venus/Jupiter is great in bringing joy, it really seems not enough imo.

The Dracos open up this image a bit, and it is interesting, at least:

his Dr ASC conjunct her Dr Venus
his Dr Moon opposite her Dr Sun exact

his tropical ASC conjunct her Dr Veus
his tropical Moon conjunct her Dr Saturn exact
his tropical NN and Antivertex conjunct her Dr Venus as well.

posted April 09, 2013 05:39 AM            

Draconic sun opposite Tropical Sun exact
Draconic mercury conjunct Tropical SN 1 degree
Draconic PoF conjunct Tropical ASC, exact

Tropical moon&ASC conjunct Drac Mars 0&4 deg
Tropical sun conjunct Draconic ASC 4 degrees

posted April 09, 2013 07:41 AM            

(NATAL = TROPICAL = what I mean )

His > mine.

Natal Sun conjunct Draco Moon (orb 0'33)
Draco Sun conjunct Natal descendant (0'43)
Draco Mars conjunct Natal Venus (0'10)

We don't have any of that in synastry normal.

In normal synasty we have an exact Pluto/Mars trine, which connected to both our Draco Chiron;

his > mine

- Draco Chiron conjunct Natal Pluto (0'09)
- Natal Mars conjunct Draco Chiron (0'52)

also,
Natal Venus/Nept. conjunct Draco Jupiter/Nept. (orb 1-2)

To name the most outstanding aspects.

posted April 09, 2013 11:53 AM            

"Yea I was also pretty flabbergasted when looking at this draco-draco/natal comparison in our synastry once."
My first reaction, even when years ago just seeing my DRaco chart alone.

I found it interesting how I have this loner chart (everything on the Eastern side, except for Saturn in 8th), and then having this Draco Stellium of Sun, Mercury, Venus (in Aries) falling into my tropical 4th house, and Draco Moon falling onto my tropical DESC.

"Didn't have to look far as those outstanding ones are usually the *main indicators* .."
#That is my guideline for a strong synastry actually. If I have to start searching, it can`t be that great. lol
And then with other synastries, you feel like everything is just jumping out at you, and you are tempted to duck for cover.

"Natal Sun conjunct Draco Moon (orb 0'33)
Draco Sun conjunct Natal descendant (0'43)
Draco Mars conjunct Natal Venus (0'10)"

That is really amazing.
Yes, it is only three aspects, but look WHAT is aspected and at what tight orb!

For me aspects to the angles, nodes, luminaries, Saturn and Venus (and probably Mars, too) are paramount.
And in my particular case Mercury, as it rules my DESC.

While I donīt have the Sun-Moon or Sun-Sun combo in DRacos (and it seems to come up often; Snorkel has it, too. The Brownings had it, the Newmans etc.), we have it in tropical with my Sun conjunct his Sun-Moon-conjunction.

"- Draco Chiron conjunct Natal Pluto (0'09)
- Natal Mars conjunct Draco Chiron (0'52)"
Wow, that sounds intense.

I forgot to mention Chiron. But as a matter of fact my tropical Chiron is conjunct his Draco DESC (though the orb is generous with about 3 degrees).
It is significant, because his Draco ASC is conjunct his tropical Pluto.
And in the composite the nodal axis runs along it, connecting his Pluto on composite NN, with my Chiron on composite SN, and now also his Draco ASC-DESC-line.

Also, his Draco Chiron is 8 Sagittarius, and falling right onto my tropical stellium of Mars (5), ASC (7), Neptune(9) and NN (10) and his own tropical DSC-ruler MErcury on 9 Sag.

It means that there is a Chiron aspect to each other`s ASC-DESC-line both ways, just that it is his Draco chart and my tropical. In the book by Pamela Crane i read, she said that it is the Draco person who feels it more strongly; or actually she said, the Draco person might feel it like it is more "meaningful".

I donīt know if that is true. I do think that it probably depends a little on the planet involved. A hyper sensitive tropical Moon might be more strongly feeling like a super detached DRaco Uranus for example (though for the Draco Uranus detachment might actually be part of their "soul-desire". lol)

Regarding his tropical Venus and Juno conjunct and opposite my Draco Pluto; and his Draco Sun, Moon and Draco IC opposite and conjunct my Draco Pluto, I DEFINITELY feel that damned Draco Pluto. In a very deep, penetrating, transforming way.

posted April 09, 2013 09:02 PM            

Well yea, sometimes I look.. but how and why this would *WORK*? NOoo idea.

But I took a ride to the ASC+DESC-rulers in **DRACO ONLY** this time. Just knowing about the significance of these specific rulers.
Well, you know what they always say about an aspect between them in synastry...

Ok, his asc/desc = Gem/Sag;
would make;
- ASC-ruler > Mercury Pisces 5
- DESC-ruler > Jupiter Libra 15

Ok, my asc/desc = Libra/Aries;
would make;
- ASC-ruler > Venus Virgo 15
- DESC-ruler > Mars Aries 5

At first I thought, ok a semi-sextile from his ASC-ruler to my DESC-ruler and vice versa. Nothing special.

Then I saw the Antiscia signs in both cases and the equal degrees.

So a bit calculating for the midpoints of those rulers in both cases, and you get this..

- Midpoint of his ASC&DESC-ruler = 25 SAG
- Midpoint of my ASC&DESC-ruler = 25 GEM

opposite midpoints!

(in truth án orb of 0'20)

posted April 09, 2013 11:53 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by mir:

Carry those rulerships more weight than I thought possibly? Feels almost crrrrazy!

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posted April 10, 2013 10:29 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:

It means that there is a Chiron aspect to each other`s ASC-DESC-line both ways, just that it is his Draco chart and my tropical. In the book by Pamela Crane i read, she said that it is the Draco person who feels it more strongly; or actually she said, the Draco person might feel it like it is more "meaningful".

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posted April 10, 2013 11:46 AM            

I am torn on the subject who feels it more strongly.

I was quoting this author, and I also think that since the Dracos relate to the soul-level, it will "hit" deep, if something hits your Draco placements.
BUT it could be a totally internal process, maybe you are not even aware of what is happening, jsut that somethng is "rumbling underneath".

I think good arguments can be made for the tropical planet feeling it definitely, as the tropical is the level through which we filter and experience everything.

Well, I def. feel something Plutonic about that connection I mentioned. But is this because my Draco Pluto is conjunct his tropical VEnus or because his Draco Mars is opposing my tropical Pluto?
I can`t tell for sure. (well what I can see is that it is his personal planets and my Pluto in both cases though. lol. But then again his tropical Pluto is widely oposite my Draco Venus as well (but the orb is beyond what I usually consider inDracos: 4°34).

"my asc axis and moon, mercury are activated by that person's draco venus and pluto (and most likely moon). I definitely felt the draco pluto on my natal moon-mercury-dsc conjunction. Didn't like it all that much neither. "
Why didn`t you like it? What was wrong with it?
And also, were there exact squares or oppositions to the conjunction by planets that would explain why you did not like it?

posted April 11, 2013 08:52 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Uehaara,

I am torn on the subject who feels it more strongly.

I was quoting this author, and I also think that since the Dracos relate to the soul-level, it will "hit" deep, if something hits your Draco placements.
BUT it could be a totally internal process, maybe you are not even aware of what is happening, jsut that somethng is "rumbling underneath".

I think good arguments can be made for the tropical planet feeling it definitely, as the tropical is the level through which we filter and experience everything.

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I think you're definitely onto something when you describe the draco as something rumbling underneath.
I see it as describing part of ourselves that we have not control over and are not aware. Sort of subconscious reactions and behavior, while we're very aware of our tropical placements. At one point I had been confused about how duads, draco and tropical plaement express themselves but right now I feel like the tropical and the duads really describe your outward behavior and reactions, while, just like you said, the draco is more something internal that we're not really aware. I don't think yo ucan guess draco placements of soemoen like you can guess their tropical placements and sometime duads.

But you're right, just like you even though it appears more logical to me that the tropical person would be more affected by the whole experience than the draco one. I don't have proof it does so.
Like I said I really felt the draco pluto hitting my moon-mercury conjunction. But my draco pluto was also opposite his mars, so maybe this could also explain why I was rather (really) obsessed.

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Well, I def. feel something Plutonic about that connection I mentioned. But is this because my Draco Pluto is conjunct his tropical VEnus or because his Draco Mars is opposing my tropical Pluto?
I can`t tell for sure. (well what I can see is that it is his personal planets and my Pluto in both cases though. lol. But then again his tropical Pluto is widely opposite my Draco Venus as well (but the orb is beyond what I usually consider inDracos: 4°34).

"my asc axis and moon, mercury are activated by that person's draco venus and pluto (and most likely moon). I definitely felt the draco pluto on my natal moon-mercury-dsc conjunction. Didn't like it all that much neither. "
Why didn`t you like it? What was wrong with it?
And also, were there exact squares or oppositions to the conjunction by planets that would explain why you did not like it?

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posted April 11, 2013 09:25 AM            

quote:

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I see it as describing part of ourselves that we have not control over and are not aware. Sort of subconscious reactions and behavior, while we're very aware of our tropical placements.

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That's exactly what I thought.
I mean,
HIS natal Sun conjunct my draco Moon.
HIS draco Mars conjunct my tropical Venus.
HIS draco Sun conjunct my tropical Descendant.
(don't forget all orbs within 1* here!)

HIS are ALL masculine planets and MINE only feminine ones.

Pretty normal if you like/love the more manly type (which most girls do).. but ME??
PLZZ NO! NEVER!

posted April 13, 2013 12:39 PM            

My details:
Sun: Capricorn
Asc: Scorpio
Moon: Cancer
Venus: Capricorn
Mars: Sagittarius
Saturn: Capricorn
Vertex: Gemini
7th House: Taurus
5th House: Pisces
PoM: Aquarius 13d 33m