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Author
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Topic: Amanda Knox convicted of murder in Italian retrial
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Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 63433
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted January 30, 2014 09:45 PM
  
Astrologically, what do you think of this? Is she guilty?------------------
Want To Ask Any Question About Bible Prophecy? Go For it. It is Free, of course.
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IP: Logged |
Randall
Webmaster Posts: 54937
From: Saturn next to Charmaine
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted January 30, 2014 09:57 PM
Not sure about the Astrology of it, but legally, she was acquitted. You can't just keep taking someone to trial till you get a conviction. It's doubtful that she will serve a sentence, because she isn't likely to be extradited due to how the US frowns upon double jeopardy.IP: Logged |
LucieLemonade
Knowflake Posts: 1577
From:
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 02:23 AM
This who case is a joke! And I agree with Randall. It's criminal to keep trying someone for the same crime. It's a part of the US system that really is a gem; no double jeopardy. I don't know about astrology, but according to what I've read of the case, I strongly believe she did not do it. IP: Logged |
charlie
Knowflake Posts: 3175
From:
Registered: Jun 2012
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posted January 31, 2014 04:12 AM
Flame me all you want but I took one look at her and my whole gut said "guilty". Not that it matters...just want to stir the pot  IP: Logged |
summerlite
Newflake Posts: 0
From:
Registered: Jun 2014
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posted January 31, 2014 09:26 AM
http://www.astrotheme.com/astrology/Amanda_Knox IP: Logged |
fauxcoat
Knowflake Posts: 547
From:
Registered: Jan 2014
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posted January 31, 2014 12:57 PM
Jupiter in 12th house; Neptune and Part of Fortune in Capricorn (Saturn rules) in 8th house; Saturn in 7th; Pluto in Scorpio. These stick out to me. Power/restriction/delusion connected to sex/death and also relationships. Interesting the sex game gone awry and murder are connected to her. IP: Logged |
Orange
Knowflake Posts: 2431
From: Georgia
Registered: May 2009
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posted January 31, 2014 12:59 PM
quote:
Originally posted by charlie:
Flame me all you want but I took one look at her and my whole gut said "guilty". Not that it matters...just want to stir the pot
ditto one look
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Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 63433
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted January 31, 2014 01:13 PM
quote:
Originally posted by charlie:
Flame me all you want but I took one look at her and my whole gut said "guilty". Not that it matters...just want to stir the pot
I agree with you, emotionally, Charlie but Randall knows the law, so that is that lol
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http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 63433
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted January 31, 2014 01:14 PM
Thank you Summerlite for the chart  ------------------
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http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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StarlightSmileSupreme
Knowflake Posts: 9091
From: neptune
Registered: Nov 2012
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posted January 31, 2014 01:23 PM
I used to think the same thing but it's so wrong to condemn anyone without evidence. So many people have been convicted then exonerated after years of their life had been snatched away. Some have even been rescued from death row, all because of DNA evidence.
Believe it or not, more than one woman in Italy has that size foot and the man who was convicted of this crime (through DNA) partied and seemed to know people so, the evidence is very circumstantial and I have seen this type of evidence be completely misleading before. If one website could have convicted people on it after the Boston Marathon bombing, they would have. Point is, many people have similar backpacks just like many women have the same size foot.
You simply cannot tell if someone is guilty just by looking at them. What if you were in a similar situation, didn't commit a crime yet you were accused and complete strangers who never even met you in person, just saw your photo in the media, said "I took one look at her and instantly knew she was guilty" when you in your heart knew you did not do it. How would that make you feel? IP: Logged |
SunMoonStars
Knowflake Posts: 166
From: Mercury
Registered: Aug 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 01:31 PM
I totally agree that is is wrong to condemn her without knowing which I why I wonder all the more why I get an uneasy feeling about her - I mean I live in Northern Europe and have not at all followed the story (I read a bit on the net in 2011 and that's all before just seeing the news of her retrial).What is it in her behavior that makes me uneasy and not trust her? I really hope that whatever the final verdict will be that it is fair and just. IP: Logged |
filleaspirant
Knowflake Posts: 2045
From: Rio de Janeiro
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 01:41 PM
I thought it really weird that the Italian judicial system would retrial someone without some legal justification, since italian criminal law and procedure is very close to the ones in my country. Sure enough, the Supreme Court of Italy nullified the first trial and determined that the defendants go through a new trial. The list of legal possibilities for a nullification of criminal sentence (at least in my country) is very short, and usually involves some heavy procedural issue that cannot be condoned by the courts. There is still hope for the both of them (after all it's not only Amanda Knox that was convicted). They'll have their case reviewed by the court of appeals and might even get the Supreme Court to analize the issue again. It's really not a question of double jeopardy if the first trial was determined to be violating the material or procedural law and the first sentence was nullified... What's nullified doesn't exist in the judicial system or under the law. IP: Logged |
StarlightSmileSupreme
Knowflake Posts: 9091
From: neptune
Registered: Nov 2012
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posted January 31, 2014 01:43 PM
quote:
Originally posted by SunMoonStars:
I totally agree that is is wrong to condemn her without knowing which I why I wonder all the more why I get an uneasy feeling about her - I mean I live in Northern Europe and have not at all followed the story (I read a bit on the net in 2011 and that's all before just seeing the news of her retrial).What is it in her behavior that makes me uneasy and not trust her? I really hope that whatever the final verdict will be that it is fair and just.
I used to hate her based on what I read about her in the media. They made her look like this girl who was getting away with murder and that angered me. It wasn't because of how I felt when I looked at her picture. It was based on what I read about her. Now I don't feel anything except pity for them all, her, her family, Meredith Kercher and her family, and Knox's Italian boyfriend, Raffaele Sollecito and his family.
This case has made me very aware of how the media tries cases and how wrong it is for the case to be talked about with such abandon in the press before the trial.
There is no way Knox or her boyfriend can ever get a fair trial now and without that you cannot convict. Innocent until proven guilty is how it's supposed to be done in America. What's done is done. Let go and move on.
I wonder if this had never happened and Amanda Knox would have stayed in this country, never gone to Italy, and her path just somehow happened to cross yours, would you even remember her? You haven't read anything about her, she is a complete stranger, no infamy or anything. She is so nondescript and ordinary I seriously doubt you would even remember anything about her. She doesn't look like the boogie man, sorry. IP: Logged |
LucieLemonade
Knowflake Posts: 1577
From:
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 01:43 PM
I looked at the evidence not her chart. (Although I'm too new at this to be able to tell). And the evidence is beyond poor. Did anyone (who knows how  ) check the progression/transits/whatevs for the day/time the murder happened? IP: Logged |
LucieLemonade
Knowflake Posts: 1577
From:
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 01:45 PM
quote:
Originally posted by filleaspirant:
I thought it really weird that the Italian judicial system would retrial someone without some legal justification, since italian criminal law and procedure is very close to the ones in my country. Sure enough, the Supreme Court of Italy nullified the first trial and determined that the defendants go through a new trial. The list of legal possibilities for a nullification of criminal sentence (at least in my country) is very short, and usually involves some heavy procedural issue that cannot be condoned by the courts. There is still hope for the both of them (after all it's not only Amanda Knox that was convicted). They'll have their case reviewed by the court of appeals and might even get the Supreme Court to analize the issue again. It's really not a question of double jeopardy if the first trial was determined to be violating the material or procedural law and the first sentence was nullified... What's nullified doesn't exist in the judicial system or under the law.
Ah. Ok. I didn't realize the first trial was nullified. I thought she was "aquitted" which I guess is not the same thing. Anyway, we all know Italy is "special".  IP: Logged |
filleaspirant
Knowflake Posts: 2045
From: Rio de Janeiro
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 01:51 PM
quote:
Originally posted by LucieLemonade:
Ah. Ok. I didn't realize the first trial was nullified. I thought she was "aquitted" which I guess is not the same thing. Anyway, we all know Italy is "special".
Sentence nullification is when the court determines that EVERYTHING that was said and done in a trial gets dismissed and disconsidered in order that a new trial be done. It's like the first one never happened, only you can't really erase people's memories when a case is so openly publicized. Every country deals with the media messing up their judicial system, unfortunately. Er, why do you say Italy is "special"? IP: Logged |
SunMoonStars
Knowflake Posts: 166
From: Mercury
Registered: Aug 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 01:57 PM
"Let go and move on" - do you mean me? (Because you quoted me).Like I explained, I have not followed the story, but I am interested why a total stranger makes me feel uneasy, because there are similar stories around the world which don't affect me the same way. That belongs to the realm of astrology here. Edited: with similar stories I mean other criminal cases where we just can't know the truth. IP: Logged |
filleaspirant
Knowflake Posts: 2045
From: Rio de Janeiro
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 01:59 PM
quote:
Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
Innocent until proven guilty is how it's supposed to be done in America.
You tell that to everyone that is currently being held in Guantanamo Bay on the flimsy legal basis of suspicion of terrorism. The US has some very admirable principles and certainly inspired many countries' human rights advocation but it's not paramount of fairness and squareness. You can read on how the Ancient Greeks dealt with their justice to get the closest experience people has ever had with Just and Fair. IP: Logged |
StarlightSmileSupreme
Knowflake Posts: 9091
From: neptune
Registered: Nov 2012
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posted January 31, 2014 02:00 PM
quote:
Originally posted by SunMoonStars:
"Let go and move on" - do you mean me? (Because you quoted me).Like I explained, I have not followed the story, but I am interested why a total stranger makes me feel uneasy, because there are similar stories around the world which don't affect me the same way. That belongs to the realm of astrology here.
I meant the justice system in Italy. They are so crazy! One minute she is innocent the next, guilty! No wonder America's system is so different! It's not perfect but that kind of thing made our founding fathers cringe so they made it an impossibility. I wonder if they were thinking of the Italian justice system at the time? IP: Logged |
filleaspirant
Knowflake Posts: 2045
From: Rio de Janeiro
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 02:18 PM
quote:
Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
I meant the justice system in Italy. They are so crazy! One minute she is innocent the next, guilty! No wonder America's system is so different! It's not perfect but that kind of thing made our founding fathers cringe so they made it an impossibility. I wonder if they were thinking of the Italian justice system at the time?
Again. It's not double jeopardy if the first trial was nullified/invalidated (as the Americans like to call it). Please, you have that mechanism in your own judicial system... why are you beating up so much Italy's? IP: Logged |
StarlightSmileSupreme
Knowflake Posts: 9091
From: neptune
Registered: Nov 2012
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posted January 31, 2014 02:20 PM
quote:
Originally posted by filleaspirant:
Again. It's not double jeopardy if the first trial was nullified/invalidated (as the Americans like to call it). Please, you have that mechanism in your own judicial system... why are you beating up so much Italy's?
The entire case is nullified/invalidated, not just one trial, due to shoddy police work, mostly. Too many mistakes. IP: Logged |
filleaspirant
Knowflake Posts: 2045
From: Rio de Janeiro
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 02:40 PM
quote:
Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
The entire case is nullified/invalidated, not just one trial, due to shoddy police work, mostly. Too many mistakes.
Have you read the case in its entirety? Seen the evidence and read the transcripts? Because if you haven't, you're basing your opinion on media's assessment of the trial and THAT's always a mistake, for or against the defendants. To be more clear on how this thing might've gone, let me expand a little more. The first time the case was tried, it probably used evidence wrongly collected/preserved by the police; once that happens, IF a sentence is based mostly on evidence that is clearly not well collected/preserved, then it gets nullified/invalidated and a new trial is possible. It is up to the Prosecutors to take the case again to court or not, if they believe they have enough to convict based on authorship and materiality (sorry, this is a loose translation from my own language). They are prohibited, however, to use the evidence that was considered tainted. That's what you americans call Fruit of Poisoned Tree. It's certainly legal and legimit to retrial someone if the first time there was illegal/improper evidence presented to the court. Oh, and I'm sure your founding fathers are cringing over the possibility of holding someone in prison without a conviction under suspicion of a possible crime. Yeah, because that really translate the principle of "innocent until proven guilty".  IP: Logged |
StarlightSmileSupreme
Knowflake Posts: 9091
From: neptune
Registered: Nov 2012
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posted January 31, 2014 02:45 PM
quote:
Originally posted by filleaspirant:
Have you read the case in its entirety? Seen the evidence and read the transcripts? Because if you haven't, you're basing your opinion on media's assessment of the trial and THAT's always a mistake, for or against the defendants.To be more clear on how this thing might've gone, let me expand a little more. The first time the case was tried, it probably used evidence wrongly collected/preserved by the police; once that happens, IF a sentence is based mostly on evidence that is clearly not well collected/preserved, then it gets nullified/invalidated and a new trial is possible. It is up to the Prosecutors to take the case again to court or not, if they believe they have enough to convict based on authorship and materiality (sorry, this is a loose translation from my own language). They are prohibited, however, to use the evidence that was considered tainted. That's what you americans call Fruit of Poisoned Tree. It's certainly legal and legimit to retrial someone if the first time there was illegal/improper evidence presented to the court. Oh, and I'm sure your founding fathers are cringing over the possibility of holding someone in prison without a conviction under suspicion of a possible crime. Yeah, because that really translate the principle of "innocent until proven guilty".
Everytime it's been in the media, I have studied it some and from everything I have read and after seeing a ridiculous website that did similar things as most media does, which is convict people without a fair trial, I reached the conclusion the DNA evidence is what matters. I only hope they did a good job collecting the man they convicted's DNA without someone contaminating because, from what I have read, they didn't have the experience or expertise in this small town due to seldom or never having a murder in their community before to correctly process the evidence and that's a very big deal in a murder case where people can spend a good deal of their lives in prison if convicted.
It has been noted by Knox's family and experts in this country the evidence could be contaminated. IP: Logged |
summerlite
Newflake Posts: 0
From:
Registered: Jun 2014
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posted January 31, 2014 03:00 PM
Her behaviour on tv seems shady, but it could be because of how media ruined her life for past few years.
Can't read her chart but i did asteroid reading. (read it with a pinch of salt because i invented this. lol).
Links with Paris asteroid.
Paris was asked to choose most beautiful between Hera, Aphrodite, Athena. He chose Aphrodite who promised to give him Helen. His decision led to the Trojan War. I thought the first part sounded like something happened during their "games" (favoritism). lol. She might not have murdered someone but her actions sparked it off. And now it's literally war between italy and US i suppose. IP: Logged |
filleaspirant
Knowflake Posts: 2045
From: Rio de Janeiro
Registered: Sep 2013
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posted January 31, 2014 03:01 PM
quote:
Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
Everytime it's been in the media, I have studied it some and from everything I have read and after seeing a ridiculous website that did similar things as most media does, which is convict people without a fair trial, I reached the conclusion the DNA evidence is what matters. I only hope they did a good job collecting the man they convicted's DNA without someone contaminating because, from what I have read, they didn't have the experience or expertise in this small town due to seldom or never having a murder in their community before to correctly process the evidence and that's a very big deal in a murder case where people can spend a good deal of their lives in prison if convicted.
It has been noted by Knox's family and experts in this country the evidence could be contaminated.
A murder case is much more than a single evidence that could be contaminated. There are probably tons of other proof collected (e-mail, phone transcripts, people's testemony, etc) that contributed for the guilty sentence. Anyhow, if you've got a good counselor, he'll argue that DNA can be left at any time, prior or after the crime has been comitted and it stands for nothing else than the presence of the person in the crime scene (which can even be explained by her finding the body [I think this was the case in here, wasn't it?]). Unlike America's system, where the jury convicts based on their conviction, Italy's system is based in a Code where it specify that you can only convict when the conduct falls under the crime's abstract norm. It's the same in my country. Circustancial cases are taken to court every day. If the defense lawyer wasn't able to argue and give a plausible explaination for DNA presence other than "it might have been contaminated", then she had a poor choice of lawyer. I have no opinion whether they're both guilty or not, because the case hasn't reached the last instance and can still be reversed by appeal, AND I haven't studied the evidence and transcripts. I'm a lawyer, I know better than to pass judgement like that. I just find it reckless and a bit insulting that people are bashing another country's legal system without studying its laws and procedures first. IP: Logged |
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