posted March 19, 2014 04:41 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by ayujegeg:
I don't like the word 'Ophiucus'. It doesn't roll off the tongue properly..

"I'm an Ophiucus"
.. "You're a what..Ophicususs?"

Yuck.
Another reasonable explanation of why it doesn't fit

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posted March 19, 2014 04:43 AM            

Instead of arguing about it why not try and understand Ophiuchus for yourself, and it's place in humanity.

Regardless of wether it's a 360 degree circle and fits in with traditions etc (Pisces opposite polarity is Virgo) look into it and see what is actually happenning.

posted March 19, 2014 04:50 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Mystic_Cat:

My own mother is a Leo using the original system but i know she is a Cancer and so does she! She is ruled by the Breasts

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posted March 19, 2014 05:02 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Mystic_Cat:
Is that a joke?

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What made you think that?

posted March 19, 2014 05:13 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Leorpio:
Mystic cat you really aren't making any sense. And to put ophiuchus in the zodiac does not make any sense either. All I've seen you do is constantly spam your own thread about how ophiuchus is real and reply to yourself, creating your own self generated positive feedback loop. It doesnt make sense for a variety of reasons, key among them how youre basically cherry picking certain aspects of other signs and applying them to one irrelevant constellation. The reason ophiuchus is a thing at all is because some astronomer tried destroying the legitimacy of astrology by claiming equinoxes have changed the where the sun travels through. But not even throwing in anything else logically how this could not be true, people's own subjective experience can tell this not to be true.

Trying to tell me that all of a sudden I'm cancerish is absurd and laughable I'm sorry to say. I am neither overly emotional like cancerians are nor am I homebound like they are. I don't retreat into a shell when I'm hurt. I display literally no cancerian traits whatsoever. My mom is a cancer and she has a strong sun and displays the emotional ups and downs very openly many a time. To say she is now a gemini who is all about logic is absurd to the maximum of absurdities. The very reason my super aquarian dad divorced her was because she was too emotional for him.

This would also then put many shy critical Virgos as Leos. I have seen way too many Virgos born in the days that are supposed to be "Leos" now in this new system that are. Still. Virgos. The criticism, discrimination, and, for the evolved ones, service is still there. They absolutely do not exhibit any characteristics of Leo. And Scorpio only lasting 7 days? Really? Come on! Now were just playing with Looney tunes! Sorry mystic but the zodiac isn't wrong

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By the way, is it not obviously that the reason i writ all that was to make it official and for people to see it? It is going to stay there and people are going to read it, so i don't understand what you mean by self generated feedback loop.

I am explaining information on Ophiuchus for people to see and thats it ..

posted March 19, 2014 05:19 AM            

I just want people to try and understand Ophiuchus and the fact people born in early december do exhibit powerful Ophiuchus traits.
Ophiuchus has two sides, the snake and the eagle.

It is completely different than Sagittarius!

posted March 19, 2014 05:48 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Mystic_Cat:
Ophiuchus is a Mutable Water Sign and it's opposite polarity is Orion, the most famous constellation in the skys

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If Ophiuchus is Mutable Water, then Orion would be Mutable Earth. But if you steal the quality and element from Pisces and Virgo, you have to come up with new qualities and elements for them. This is one of those mandatory balances that needs to be resolved in order for your theory to work with astrology.

Eventually you either end up with two sets of signs sharing the same element/quality (which would mean there is no energetic difference between the two signs), or you have to make up a 4th quality.

Lets say you make up a 4th quality...

Cardinal is the universal property of beginning or arising, Fixed is the universal property of maintenance or stasis, and Mutable is the universal property of ending or transition. So what would your 4th quality be? Remember, it has to apply to the traits of whatever sign you are assigning it to.

So now that you have created a magical 4th quality, that quality needs to be expressed through the 4 elements. If Ophiuchus is Water + 4th Quality and Orion is Earth + 4th Quality, you need Air + 4th Quality and Fire + 4th Quality signs too, otherwise your 4th Quality only manifests in the physical and emotional realms.

These are basic problems that need to be resolved before you can consider additional signs.

posted March 19, 2014 06:01 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Mystic_Cat:
Why does the system matter? What is more important to me is is what is happeneing astrologically on Earth, then we base the system around that, not the other way round!!

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The system matters, because astrology IS a system. Why don't we just skip the lungs and open our veins up to the external world? There is oxygen outside and blood that needs oxygen inside. Why is the cardiovascular system so important, when you can just expose your blood directly to the air?

The whole point of systems is also covered in understanding planets like Saturn. It is great if you are feeling Ophiuchus's energy in your life, whatever it is you are experiencing though is not on parallel with how astrology works. You can't just throw out the system, cause then it ceases to function properly. You have to either modify the system or create a new one based on your understanding of how systems work.

posted March 19, 2014 02:39 PM            

The problem is that you expect some people to share your views. And that's the same thing as asking people to get rid of their identity so you can feel better in yours.
In maybe 7 or 8 cases out of ten, astrology started to interest us the day we read a description of our Sun sign and thought to ourselves "HOLY COW!!! THAT'S ME!!!"
Our Sun sign is more often than not part of our identity as an astrologer, and has become part of our identity as a human.
You can't just come and tell people to throw it away just to validate a theory of yours.
I trust you when you say you're an Ophiucus, sure, why not, I don't know you and I don't know your system.
But you owe me the same respect when I tell you I am NOT an Aquarius.
I might be born in the Piscean Age, blah blah blah, whatever you say won't make me an Aquarius in my own eyes.
In yours, maybe. Once again, you are free to practice astrology according to your own methods.
But I think that expecting people here to follow you down this road will only expose you to disappointment.

Something else.
The reasons why people gather here, in the first place, is because they share the same system.
Sharing the system they share the board, and sharing the board, they end up sharing friendship.
That's what allows people to talk about the same thing even when they don't know each other's culture or experience.
Everyone, or almost everyone here came here with the deep conviction that the 12 sign system made sense.
Of course, everyone could suddenly decide to disagree and want to throw the old system away.
That's called a revolution. But what a revolution takes, is people frustrated or repressed by the old system
and wanting out of it. So far I haven't seen many people wanting or needing this revolution here.
You can go all uranian "let's break the house down, yaaaaay" if you want, but you'll be marginalizing yourself doing so.
You can't expect to want to destroy the old order and be part of it at the same time.
While I trust our lovely Mods to see that you stay free to express yourself and be respected as you should, I'm afraid you're going to feel extremely lonely here.

posted March 19, 2014 03:51 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Xiiro:
If Ophiuchus is Mutable Water, then Orion would be Mutable Earth. But if you steal the quality and element from Pisces and Virgo, you have to come up with new qualities and elements for them. This is one of those mandatory balances that needs to be resolved in order for your theory to work with astrology.

Eventually you either end up with two sets of signs sharing the same element/quality (which would mean there is no energetic difference between the two signs), or you have to make up a 4th quality.

Lets say you make up a 4th quality...

Cardinal is the universal property of beginning or arising, Fixed is the universal property of maintenance or stasis, and Mutable is the universal property of ending or transition. So what would your 4th quality be? Remember, it has to apply to the traits of whatever sign you are assigning it to.

So now that you have created a magical 4th quality, that quality needs to be expressed through the 4 elements. If Ophiuchus is Water + 4th Quality and Orion is Earth + 4th Quality, you need Air + 4th Quality and Fire + 4th Quality signs too, otherwise your 4th Quality only manifests in the physical and emotional realms.

These are basic problems that need to be resolved before you can consider additional signs.

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posted March 19, 2014 03:55 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Xiiro:
The system matters, because astrology IS a system. Why don't we just skip the lungs and open our veins up to the external world? There is oxygen outside and blood that needs oxygen inside. Why is the cardiovascular system so important, when you can just expose your blood directly to the air?

The whole point of systems is also covered in understanding planets like Saturn. It is great if you are feeling Ophiuchus's energy in your life, whatever it is you are experiencing though is not on parallel with how astrology works. You can't just throw out the system, cause then it ceases to function properly. You have to either modify the system or create a new one based on your understanding of how systems work.

Find a way to make it work with the system, or find a way to make the system work with it. Then you can explain to us why it is a viable option to apply to astrology.

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I don't see it like that atall. The system is what we have controlled and a blueprint for, we can then find what makes astrology work and base the system around that, the astrological system isn't to difficult to adjust and change.

I'm hoping i don't have to do this myself and it's an official update as the Aquarian generation grows and Pluto in Scorpio brings in its own developments and gets rid of the older ones in society.

posted March 19, 2014 04:00 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by ayujegeg:
Honestly, why don't you identify with sagittarius? Sagittarius is a beautiful sign! you wouldn't want to be pessimistic Scorpio like me.. trust me.

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I do "itentidfy" with Sagittarius i just know that i'm not one, on a basis i have some traits similar to that of a Sagittarius, Jupiter on the ascendant, Mars in the 9th house, sidereal Sagittarius Moon.
But the Sun was in Ophiuchus when i was born and therefor i'm not a Sagittarius.

In terms of my personal psychology i am not one, it's like telling a dog it's a cow because the systems says it is.

I have enough Scorpio haha
Scorpio ascendant conjunct PLuto in Scorpio, Jupiter in Scorpio, Ixion in Scorpio, a few asteroids.