posted September 12, 2014 02:39 PM            

The Sun is our conscious mind, vitality and life-force. It is our ego; what keeps us going and burning with an essence for expression of our being by means of exerting our will. So in a sense, it IS our "purpose". Our purpose as to where we shall express it's willpower. And it's also our creative energy (similar to Uranus in regards to creativity, except Uranus is more of our mental faculty and creativity itself (creative and ingenious mind), for the Sun to carry out with it's will to creatively express it for the value of our being and existence). So Jupiter is the planet about creating a higher meaning and purpose for everyone's existence in the Universe to follow for the ultimate ideal, and philosophically and ethically correct or "right" utopia (in our own sense of philosophically "correct"), but the Sun is the planet (star, obviously, lol) about creating a purpose for our own, unique existence of our being (in our own mind and egocentric self).

The Sun is what makes us aware of our being and life; our willpower and conscious control over our self, while Chiron (or Mercury, but IMO it's Chiron) is what makes us aware of everything around us, environment and surroundings through our perception to gain a true understanding of things. Chiron also represents contemplative/pondering thoughts, as those thoughts signify consciousness because of the ability to think outside of the established filter and to question the truth of the matter with pure clarity.

While the Moon is our unconscious mind and Neptune is our subconscious mind. And in my opinion, Chiron being our higher conscious mind; consciousness, in terms of our level of consciousness and awareness; how we reflect our understanding of the Universe from our perception (the Sun is the lower level of our conscious and aware mind; our conscious self and knowledge that we exist and control our will, nothing more). If not Chiron (since it's my personal opinion), then it's Mercury which is our higher conscious mind; consciousness.

The Moon is our instinctual mind, emotions, feelings and unconscious nature; the behavior that we unconsciously picked up during our upbringing and development of our psyche. How we interpret and utilize that behavior is seen by our Moon sign.

And the Ascendant is also our subconscious mind (more of an integration of the conscious and subconscious self) ~ (but the lower level of our subconscious mind; our subconscious self) because we try to appear (we don't do it consciously, but rather subconsciously) a certain way by means of assertion of our ideal selves (our artificial personality that we want to integrate within our true, conscious being (Sun) so that we become a complete, natural and in-control version of our personality (Ascendant and Sun) so that we're perceived that way. So the Ascendant is essentially our subconscious, outward assertion of one of the sides to our personality (the Ascendant - our artificial self).

Or we could look at it in a much simpler way... The Sun is our conscious self, the Moon is our unconscious self, and the Ascendant is our subconscious self. But, Neptune is our subconscious mind, Chiron is our conscious mind and Mercury is our intellect; our rational mind and reasoning. The Sun, Moon and Ascendant are our own personal expression, internal feelings and emotions, and outward assertion; which altogether form our personality and psyche. While Mercury, Chiron and Neptune are our mental faculties. E.g:

-Conscious Self = Sun -> Conscious Mind = Chiron
-Unconscious Self = Moon -> Unconscious Mind = Pluto
-Subconscious Self = Ascendant -> Subconscious Mind = Neptune

Pluto is also the higher unconscious mind of the unconscious self: the Moon, because it represents survival by means of using our unconscious nature/behavior, instincts and psychological perceptual skills for the benefit of ourselves.

I explain the differences of Mercury, Chiron, Neptune, and even Vulcan (if Vulcan were to exist and have the representations that I interpret it to have, that is) ~ (and if you don't believe Vulcan exists (which I presume and completely understand, as I don't really either, tbh), then just take what I said about what it represents and attribute it to the rest Mercury's attributes) in the "why I like these five planets" part in my initial post of this thread, if anyone is interested to read it and understand what I mean better: http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/228807.html

posted September 12, 2014 02:52 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
I think you nailed it. By the way, are you familiar with the octaves?

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Thank you

And yes, I am. I also made a theory for additional octaves for the rest of the planets. If you are interested, I can post my document on it

posted September 12, 2014 03:13 PM            

I mostly agree, but I have some questions about when you refer to generational planets such as Pluto and Neptune- do you mean that each generation is influenced by the sign in terms of their environment/values/attitudes at the time?
E.g. Baby boomer generation- focused on finding their own destiny shown by Pluto in Leo, or the Millenial generation- idealizes material acquisition shown by Neptune in Capricorn

posted September 12, 2014 03:26 PM            

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Originally posted by socialgraffiti:
Interesting theory.

I mostly agree, but I have some questions about when you refer to generational planets such as Pluto and Neptune- do you mean that each generation is influenced by the sign in terms of their environment/values/attitudes at the time?
E.g. Baby boomer generation- focused on finding their own destiny shown by Pluto in Leo, or the Millenial generation- idealizes material acquisition shown by Neptune in Capricorn

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If I understand what you mean by that correctly, yes and no. The sign the generational planet is in influences them into the direction as to whatever that generational planet represents and is. I wasn't really trying to link the inner/personal planets with the outer/generational planets in my point with this thread is what I mean. Although they could, but that's not what I was trying to say

quote:

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Originally posted by socialgraffiti:

Also, how does Mercury come into play? Could you elaborate on how it operates on a "higher" octave than the Sun?

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posted September 12, 2014 03:28 PM            

Self: Apollonas-Artemis-ASC
Karma: Rahu(NN), Ketu(SN), Lilit, Priapos
Thought: Hermes-2 Pallas Athene-Chiron-Ouranos
Love: Aphrodite-1 Demetra(Ceres)-Pholus-Poseidonas
Drive: Ares-4 Hestia(Vesta)-Nessus-Hades
Grace: Dios-5 Astraea-???-Tyche
Control: Kronos-3 Hera(Juno)-???-Persephone

Of course, there's two centaurs missing and the Name Asteroid, Psyche and Eros, but I'm not sure where they would go.

The First Two I had formed on my own knowledge, but the others are pretty much talked about by every one.

posted September 12, 2014 03:34 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
@MercurianIntellect: Additional Octaves? Please do share.

Self: Apollonas-Artemis-ASC
Karma: Rahu(NN), Ketu(SN), Lilit, Priapos
Thought: Hermes-2 Pallas Athene-Chiron-Ouranos
Love: Aphrodite-1 Demetra(Ceres)-Pholus-Poseidonas
Drive: Ares-4 Hestia(Vesta)-Nessus-Hades
Grace: Dios-5 Astraea-???-Tyche
Control: Kronos-3 Hera(Juno)-???-Persephone

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I agree with you on them for the most part (I haven't really added octaves in between, but I should get to that, as I think there should be as well).

And alright, here it is:

Additional Octaves

Sun - Jupiter or Earth

Moon - Earth or Jupiter

Vulcan - Saturn

Mercury - Uranus

Venus - Neptune

Mars - Pluto

- Jupiter for the Sun because both Jupiter and the Sun contain generosity themes, but the Sun can get controlled by it’s ego and can become rather selfish and ego-driven in obtaining it’s popularity and status by “faking” it’s generosity, while Jupiter is always generous and expanding. Never looking for anything in return but expansion to create a better and more lively, generous, jovial and positive world with it’s uplifting and optimistic nature and expression.

- The Earth for the Moon because the Moon controls the water’s tide, so it governs marine life, specifically, but the Earth governs all life, it sustains life and allows it to bloom, thrive and flourish. The Earth contains water plus vegetation, and an oxygen rich atmosphere. The Moon even orbits the Earth and is much smaller than it. The Moon exalts in Taurus, which is even ruled by the planet Earth.

- The Earth for the Sun because the Sun is looking toward Earth to ground itself. The Sun is opposite from the Earth, so it’s looking for stability and security within the self of the individual. It has much to do with the Sun/Earth opposition and Sun trying to become a more stable and evolved individual by being complemented by the opposite sign of the Sun sign.

- Jupiter for the Moon because the Moon wants to nurture and care for the people or animals they love, while Jupiter wants to care and expand for the world as a whole. Jupiter isn’t limited by it’s own biased love of something because it loves the world and only wants to bring hope and optimism to it and every living thing on it. This is why Jupiter is exalted in Cancer, so that it can nurture (Cancer) the world as a whole and expand (Jupiter) the love and care to everyone.

- Saturn for Vulcan because Saturn can be more career-oriented than the more daily work-oriented Vulcan, which means we bring Vulcan’s logical, analytical, critical thinking skills and implement into a career. (Saturn) Vulcan has no drive or direction unlike Saturn, which has ambition for success and status. Vulcan only defines the world using logic, while Saturn creates it into a more organized structure in which it can then be implemented for one’s own work ethic and into the world to create what we know as, reality. (Saturn) This is a good reason why Saturn does good in Virgo, because it can implement it’s intellectual skills into a structured career with a methodical and calculating work ethic.

(I personally don't really like the Moon/Jupiter octaval link too much, tbh, though, as there is no real, direct link between them).

Or other possible higher octaval links:

(that I haven’t written about the connection/link between them yet).

Lower - Higher:

Sun - Chiron

Earth - Saturn
Earth - Chiron

posted September 12, 2014 03:53 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
A lovely theory, especially with bringing in the exaltations. As for Kronos and Hephaestus, I think I remember someone saying that Hephaestus rules Virgo because they (Virgos) revolve around the boss rather closely, like the orbit of Hephaestus and Apollonas. Also fits, given the fact that, as opposed to Hermes (co-ruler of Virgo) who can never be more than a sign away from Apollonas, Hephaestus can never be more that 8 degrees away. Oh, and a question for you;
If Chiron rules Virgo and Gaia rules Taurus, where would you say they exalted? Gemini or Sagittarius?

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Thank you. And haha, yes, I said that (well technically SSS said that specific thing, but I elaborated on it) about Vulcan and the Sun

posted September 12, 2014 03:58 PM            

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Originally posted by Mercurian Intellect:
I would say Chiron exalts in maybe Gemini and the Earth exalts in maybe Capricorn.

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posted September 12, 2014 04:12 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
I'd focus more on the main five and the other five I have up there.

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posted September 12, 2014 04:25 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
Whatever your fist name is, or, which I believe is closer to origin, where ever it was derived from, if there's an asteroid for it.

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Oh, okay.

posted September 12, 2014 04:33 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
I'm referring to the planet Neptune. I call him Poseidonas.
Maybe I should put that back on on my signature...

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posted September 12, 2014 04:34 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
^You might want to edit that out, but my own is 307.

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Yeah, I don't think there is.

And okay, yeah, I will, lol.

posted September 12, 2014 04:48 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
Try something else with it in the name? Or maybe try your family names.

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Well I tried others like the Greek origin, but it still didn't have it

Yeah, I looked for my last name, too, and I didn't find the origin name, but I found my family's original last name (the Italian origin of the name), but we had to change it because my Great Grandfather moved here from Italy and in order to get a job, we had to change it's Italian origin to more of an English name (I think we were discriminated against in the USA during that time, so that's why).

posted September 12, 2014 04:52 PM            

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Originally posted by Sailor Gemini:
Maybe 5905.

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