posted August 17, 2015 09:36 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
Thanks, I just don't understand why 225 and 135 both are called sesquisquare *and* sesquiquadrate.

Why not... ...

Have ONE name for one aspect, and another name for the other aspect?

Would that just be spoiling the Virgo in all of us rotten?

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Lol. I think Sesqui-Square applies to 135, and Sesqui-Quadrate applies to 225. Although they're essentially the same imo.

posted August 18, 2015 05:11 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Free Leon:
A 225 degree Sesqui-Quadrate can be seen as a 135 degree Sesqui-Square plus a 90 degree Square, or a 135 degree Sesqui-Square subtracted from a Circle.

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Sesquisquare and sesquiquadrate are the same aspect, 135 deg, one using the Latin denomin.

It's the phase that can be either 135, or 225, the same as the Moon.

Faith, actually I was right the first time, about yours disseminating...it's not easy to visualize. I will get back to your post, I laughed like crazy about Jeffrey's hair

The difference from the post I wrote for you: wherever you see embodiment, assimilation (your Saturn assimilating through your Moon) you actually have dissemination, spreading, showing, preaching it

Anyway, here is the thing: a gibbous sesquis would be Saturn in Leo, Moon in Cap. We always look at the slowest planet and see it as the Sun, while the other one becomes the Moon. So Moon here (in the case of Moon in Cap) is moving away (from the conj to Saturn - New Moon) towards a Full Moon (that would be Moon opp Saturn for your pair).

But in your case, the fastest planet the Moon, being in Pisces, is waning, moving towards a conj to Saturn (New Moon)

It's easier to understand with visuals, so here in the pic, Saturn is the New Moon (when and if your Moon would be conj Saturn)
You can see the gibbous - which is waxing gibbous - and disseminating phases - that would be waning gibbous)

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted August 18, 2015 08:51 AM            

Yes, the descriptions resonate with me.

I feel this is an energy which I am not aware of. I mean it's more on a subconscious level which still manifests and makes me learn and evolve from it, I am just not consciously activating it.

I think minor aspects are often overlooked and especially when the orbs are tight enough (mine is at 1), they can actually provide a lot of meaningful information.

Edit: I just realized I have another one: my Venus sesquiquadrate Saturn exact......

posted August 18, 2015 09:28 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:
Sesquisquare and sesquiquadrate are the same aspect, 135 deg, one using the Latin denomin.

It's the phase that can be either 135, or 225, the same as the Moon.

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Ahh thanks for clarifying! This aspect just became more interesting

posted August 18, 2015 11:45 AM            

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posted August 18, 2015 12:56 PM            

Sun Sesquisquare Mars- I am very impatient. I am constantly changing my goals and desires as I am not in touch with my desires.

Mercury Sesquisquare Jupiter- I do have trouble asserting my feeling.

Mars Sesquisquare Neptune- Again I have trouble asserting myself and standing up for myself.

Jupiter Sesquisquare Juno- I am not sure how to interpret this one.

Great post Faith!

posted August 18, 2015 01:11 PM            

@Free Leon: I see the LL goblins did not return my post from last night, so I'll have to re-type that later.

@Lee

quote:

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Sesquisquare and sesquiquadrate are the same aspect, 135 deg, one using the Latin denomin.

It's the phase that can be either 135, or 225, the same as the Moon.

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Thank you. I am familiar with likening aspects to moon phases, it just took a while to make this click.

New moon = conjunction
Waxing gibbous = square; fast planet applying to an opposition
Full moon = opposition
Waning gibbous, aka "disseminating phase" = more or less square; fast planet separating from an opposition and applying to another conjunction

So in my case, the moon was at opposition with Leo Saturn when it was at 0 Aquarius, a few days before I was born. Now it is waning back into a conjunction.

Either way, it'd be 225 *and* 135 from Saturn, if it were a perfect sesqui.

But we just focus on 225 because the moon has already passed the opposition (at 180).

I think I got it.

quote:

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The difference from the post I wrote for you: wherever you see embodiment, assimilation (your Saturn assimilating through your Moon) you actually have dissemination, spreading, showing, preaching it

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So my moon will behave in a saturnine, sesqui fashion? My sensitive little moon acting like an irritated goat? I thought that was just my sun.

quote:

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I laughed like crazy about Jeffrey's hair

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Haha...have you seen it? I just looked at it again. I'm still incredulous and offended.

*edits hair rant

posted August 18, 2015 01:14 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:

Ask about a very minor aspect, draw in the experts and all their knowledge!

T

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posted August 18, 2015 01:16 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by florence:
Venus sesqui pluto 0
Jupiter uranus 3
Neptune chiron 0

I feel venus/pluto (& neptune/chiron) actually quite a bit but part of me can't believe this small aspect can have such an effect. It does feel a bit like a hangover or maybe a trailer of another life though - something that's not meant to fully emerge in this life

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posted August 18, 2015 01:18 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
That is the thing though: I suspect the 8th harmonic aspects are much less minor (or more major) than we give them credit for.

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Revision:

Draw in the experts and get corrected for every little mistake!

Kidding kidding you know I appreciate it.

ETA:

I should clarify for beginners that the sesquisquare is "8th harmonic" because it's based on 45 degree increments.

360 degrees (full zodiac) divided by 8 (as in 8th harmonic) = 45

posted August 18, 2015 01:20 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Sunnya:
Sun in Leo sesquiquadrate Neptune in Capricorn.

Yes, the descriptions resonate with me.

I feel this is an energy which I am not aware of. I mean it's more on a subconscious level which still manifests and makes me learn and evolve from it, I am just not consciously activating it.

I think minor aspects are often overlooked and especially when the orbs are tight enough (mine is at 1), they can actually provide a lot of meaningful information.

Edit: I just realized I have another one: my Venus sesquiquadrate Saturn exact......

Oh the joy of being stalked by Saturn!

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Hmm...so maybe you are dreamier than a regular Leo, and maybe it's dreamy in a kind of problematic way, yet it helps you evolve...in a way that you can't actually pinpoint and verbalize.

posted August 18, 2015 01:24 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Meatballzzzzzz:
Sun Sesquisquare Mars- I am very impatient. I am constantly changing my goals and desires as I am not in touch with my desires.

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I have the quincunx and can relate. :-/

quote:

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Originally posted by Meatballzzzzzz:
Mercury Sesquisquare Jupiter- I do have trouble asserting my feeling.

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So, as a communication issue, you might feel something in a large way and have to pack it down and that's kinda irritating?

quote:

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Originally posted by Meatballzzzzzz:
Mars Sesquisquare Neptune- Again I have trouble asserting myself and standing up for myself.

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*nods* I can see how that might work out that way.

posted August 18, 2015 02:46 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
Revision:

Draw in the experts and get corrected for every little mistake!

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Pfft

posted August 18, 2015 03:20 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
Hmm...so maybe you are dreamier than a regular Leo, and maybe it's dreamy in a kind of problematic way, yet it helps you evolve...in a way that you can't actually pinpoint and verbalize.

And what do you make of Venus sesqui Saturn, any guesses?

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Yes and I have a very active dreamworld, including lucid dreaming. . I have got more Neptune aspects including with Moon, Venus and Mars.

Venus sequis Saturn... Hmmm I feel it has undermined my self confidence relating to the way I see myself. It took me awhile to find myself beautiful, I struggled with self image especially in my teenager years (Saturn is also on the ASC). In addition since Venus rules money and values, I think I also had some "subconscious" blockages to resolve in order to be set free of Saturn limitation on those regards too.

My self-image has already changed awhile ago thankfully, but the financial freedom and change of values is happening right now. Thanks to Saturn return.

So I mean a change of values, a change of approach to attain financial gain and a change of perception on how I see myself. All this on a very deep level, coming from my subconscious mind. Not something I used to think about, but something I realized I had to fix after banging with my head on the wall many, many times so to speak lol or after having an unfortunate life event (or fortunate event since it lead me to learn what I needed to ).

I hope this makes some sense, it is not easy to explain.
Experts feel free to correct me .

Edit: Just to add an (extreme) analogy that maybe helps clarify what I mean:

Let's pretend the square is an assassin, so the sequis would be the silent assassin, the stealthy one. It is there, but you don't see it or are aware of it's existence consciously.

(Squares are not bad really, please don't take the word "assassin" literally. It was just used as an example to illustrate this.
I just feel I needed to add this for people that take semantics too literal and seriously ) .

posted August 18, 2015 04:15 PM            

I prefer the term 'sesquisquare', as it is a reminder of its relationship to the square. This aspect can be seen as a 'mini-square.'

LeeLoo2014 is right:

The aspect of 180 + 45 = 225 is also 180 - 45 = 135. They are both sesquisquares of 135 degrees. Once an arc has exceeded 180 degrees we do not continue counting past the zenith, but acknowledge its axis with the 0-point, thus starting over. So an aspect of 180 - 15 = 165 (not 180 + 15 = 195).

These aspects are all in the 15-degree sequence: 0, 15, 30, 45, 60, 75, 90, 105, 120, 135, 150, 165, 180. The 'angular', strong aspects (in bold) are those points that correlate to the New Moon (conjunction), Quarter Phase (square), and Full Moon (opposition). While each of the other aspects represents some type of opportunity, their energy is simply not as great as the angular 'crisis' points [0, 90, 180]. Therefore, it is important not to over-dramatize them as if they were as powerful as these other angles. It is also important not to over-specify interpretations of them, but to allow room for variation due to what planets may be involved.

Faith, some of what you've posted of astrologers' opinions on the 135/sssq aspect in my view is some of this over-dramatization and/or over-specification. It is common amongst astrologers to do this in the attempt to make such abstract, metaphysical matters more tangible and germane to daily living. However, I much prefer to simply look at the sssq/135 as a 'mini-square' without need to further specify.

My view of planetary aspects is kinda deist/agnostic. I mean that the aspect is a purely mathematical/geometric energy 'plug-in' between two or more planets/points that has a certain dynamic and potential in one's purposeful living. We make it personal by how we put them to use, and specify exactly how this energy dynamic will be used to create something(s). There is no divine metaphysical magical meaning in my view. Astrologers over-reach when they speak of aspect interpretations in terms of particular human actions, mental dysfunctions, or situational outcomes.

As to orb, for natal 135 aspects, 3 degrees may be okay, but I have not personally come to a conclusion on that. I would tend to lean to 2 degrees. I have 4 sssq/135 aspects in my natal chart (all within 2* orb) , so it gives a good basis for more specific study.

I don't know what other astrologers are doing, but I'm thinking the best way to study these is to look at when the aspect progressed to exact (orb = 0*00') and look for events that happened during the period the aspect was within close range of exact.

posted August 18, 2015 08:18 PM            

Even though it's the same aspect, more or less.

I do think the distinctions between 135 and 225 that Lee introduced are valuable for practical purposes, though I haven't fully grasped what Jeff Wolf was saying yet.

@Kannon,

Thanks for you thoughts.

I also like simplicity, and I agree that some of the interpretations I posted seem over-the-top. I posted them anyway ~ the diversity of opinions says something in itself (it's too subtle an effect to create a consensus?) But I also honor expertise wherever I find it, and if Jeff Green and Dane Rudhyar see something subtle-yet-potent in the sesquisquare, I'm bound to listen.

As Free Leon said:

quote:

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Rudhyar says it is an aspect of willful activity, and represents a deliberate type of struggle in which personal issues are forced for the sake of a gradually clarified goal. The native seeks to crush obstacles in his path. The aspect belongs to the Eighth Harmonic group of “hard” aspects, and is important in directions as a trigger point. It is this aspect and pairing of planets that define your psyche, or "contain, hold, bind and limit -- define" your psychic form and structure -- and therefore your destiny.

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That's very intriguing, to say the least.

And you wrote:

quote:

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My view of planetary aspects is kinda deist/agnostic. I mean that the aspect is a purely mathematical/geometric energy 'plug-in' between two or more planets/points that has a certain dynamic and potential in one's purposeful living. We make it personal by how we put them to use, and specify exactly how this energy dynamic will be used to create something(s). There is no divine metaphysical magical meaning in my view. Astrologers over-reach when they speak of aspect interpretations in terms of particular human actions, mental dysfunctions, or situational outcomes.

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I see what you mean, but it may become an issue of splitting hairs, since it can be argued that when we discuss the possibilities for how an aspect may be "coming to life" through us, we are essentially just talking about how we are "making it personal by how we put [the aspect] to use" (in your words.)

posted August 18, 2015 08:51 PM            

Sorry this re-print took so long, I didn't have any great insights worth repeating, which is part of the reason I was dragging my feet. But just so you know I was reading closely and with interest...

quote:

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Rudhyar says it is an aspect of willful activity, and represents a deliberate type of struggle in which personal issues are forced for the sake of a gradually clarified goal.

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To me "Rudhyar says" is like "God says..."

If Rudhyar puts that much emphasis the sesquisquare, I'm no one to differ.

Recently I found another reading online that somewhat matches:

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The Waxing Sesquiquadrate, 135 Degrees

Here is the second 45-degree aspect, one of four aspects that in the Tibetan tradition are called "Tomb Signs." These, and not the Squares, are perhaps the real turning points in the aspect wheel, the places where the rubber meets the road. Each 45-degree aspect presages or comes before a major turning point, and by that fact perhaps may be more important as beacons of forthcoming events than the more major aspect that is still to come. In this case, the Sesquiquadrate comes before the Opposit tion or 180-degree point. In this waxing 135-degree aspect, the building part of the waxing cycle is essentially complete, much like we reach our physical peak as young adults, but continue to mature until our Saturn return, almost like a ripening.

The waxing Sesquiquadrate marks the point where further pushing forward or driving to create or build can actually be detrimental, and if it has any difficult qualities it would be if we failed to heed that warning, which is: to ease off.

This is the point where we should pull back on the throttle, stop driving forward, and rather continue working with whatever we have achieved up to now. If we do that, then we avoid what can be a more friction-filled experience of this semisquare-type aspect. We change our attitude, and adjust or direction, and thus avoid problems. That is the challenge here.

Waning Sesquiquadrate, 225 Degrees
This is a point where the shift is away from going along with whatever is being experienced, and, instead, turning away in favor of getting a handle on or developing an awareness of the situation at hand - a perspective

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Free E-Book, Astrology's Mirror

To me that all looks like a reiteration of Rudhyar.

You wrote:

quote:

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So I'm just going to copy/paste and throw in some comments here and there

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Will you tell us where you got this report? In case anyone wants to seek or purchase one.

quote:

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Moon Sesqui-Square Mercury (1 degree)...There is a strong connection with 'the public' and takes an active interest in psychology and cultural studies. Gains support when it comes to writing, speaking and teaching. Restless. Good memory and strong powers of recall.

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You haven't even been here that long, but this matches the impression of you that I've gotten from your posts.

quote:

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Moon Sesqui-Square Pluto (2 degrees)

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Enjoyed this reading ~ it sounds like a typical reading for a Scorpio moon, but I suppose we just need to keep the emphasis on phrases like..."You may feel rather confused" and "Blocks desire to control a partner" showing a kind of flickering on and off of the awareness of the impulses that compel you to act like a Scorpio moon.

quote:

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Jeff Buckley, Steve Jobs, Friedrich Nietzsche, Warren Buffet, and Richard Dawkins have this aspect so it must be pretty good ..oh, wait, Joseph Stalin, OJ Simpson, and Donald Trump have it too

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Impressive list! Makes you wonder, honestly.

I liked the reading for semisquare but won't quote it.

Just wanted to say I love this:

quote:

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Heal. Guide. Enlighten.

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Sounds even better than Eat. Pray. Love!

Really enjoyed your comments, thank you. And yes I'm copying this in case the thread glitches again.

posted August 18, 2015 09:43 PM            

Thanks for elaborating! It's interesting when you try and get into the process by which something subconscious sort of gets "born" and maybe you only realize after you see a change, that you were changing subconsciously?

And maybe the sesquisquare can play into those processes...or they describe the gradual dawning of awareness about how we are morphing outside of our own usual mental habits of observation, and then the shaping of our intentions, with the subconscious in mind.

You know, it's one way we connect with our Higher Selves...by looking at what we've manifested and sometimes seeing how or why we did it, from the vantage point of hindsight and added wisdom.

(Not to put too fine a point on it or talk above my station!)

I also relate to a lot of what you said ~ I went through some similar changes with my Saturn Return, for one thing.

posted August 18, 2015 10:34 PM            

TriOctile

Waxing TriOctile
KEYNOTE: A driving force to overcome all obstacles on the road to attainment.