posted February 25, 2019 06:45 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StubbornVirgo:
This reply says everything about your motivation in this topic. You want an argument, not a discussion. There are other places in this forum for political arguments, but this isn't one of them.

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nah i mocked you because i didn't care for you pushing your into a conversation i wasn't having with you to say something inane and try to control what was said to someone else (a question and when she answered me i said my bad and explained that i didn't catch the 2 thoughts as connected when she first wrote them because what she said came off disjointed to me) while proving yourself a hypocrite by doing what you attempted to call me out on

from what i can see you have no place to tell me what i can and can't say to another person in this thread to understand where they were coming from

from my view with limited information it's clear there were political tones to all of it (do i think he's working with kamala harris? unlikely which is why i never pushed that point) and i didn't understand why she was so insistent

good thing no one's testing you on your psychic abilities here because you have no idea what my motivations are and you and i don't have some history where you know me or some ****

acting like there was no political angle for this makes little sense when it touched on very political things a year before a highly charged election

me pointing that out isn't me trying to engage in a political argument and i don't even share politics with the first chick who said anything i just agreed it sounded politically motivated on some level given the sexuality angle and the "hate crime" ****

don't pretend you know why i say things when you don't know me

it had everything to do with you and nothing to do with politics, i didn't like your tone or your pressing need to stir **** while pretending you weren't over a legit question

posted February 25, 2019 07:07 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aries23Degrees:
Within the context of the 'attack', the 'perpetrators' apparently (according to his version) did hurl racial and sexual orientation verbal abuse. And I think his attack was primarily elevated not necessarily because he is famous, but because he is an out gay black actor(not manh of those are around)

There was a lot of politics from the onset. And I don't believe he was that naive to the above but may have underestimated the compounding effect within the present climate.

It is clear to me as I read comments & more "headlines", this whole thing snowballed & is now BIGGER than him.

The question I have is this; given that other celebrities have also told lies( ehem Ryan Lochte).Will the public be as equally forgiving to him?

Or will he be judged ever more severely(or perhaps even prejudicially) because of his race/sexual orientation? As those mentioned subjects are especially polarizing.

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i think his sexuality and race will likely lead to him being less harshly judged by one side and more harshly judged by another

you mentioned pluto and that's polarizing for better or worse usually both

that being said it's not surprising that he went the hate crime angle and that's going to have some level of repurcussions too

there's legit **** happening daily and he basically made a show of himself for attention and cash

he would've had better luck saying it was a politically motivated stunt and painting himself as an activist trying to draw attention to the situation as a celebrity etc and so on

there's people on some level who would have respected that

going about it in a manner that paints himself as self motivated comes off worse whereas saying he was purposefully shocking and then running with it from a political angle wouldve shifted the attention off him and onto a subject people find more palatable where it couldve been a more useful platform

even if he wasn't forgiven as an actor he couldve moved on to politics and so on

posted February 25, 2019 08:04 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi: i think his sexuality and race will likely lead to him being less harshly judged by one side and more harshly judged by another .

you mentioned pluto and that's polarizing for better or worse usually both

Yes absolutely. Agree with you there. Just the other day, some friends of mine refused to talk to each other because one felt the other was not "team Jussie" enough etc.

The other argued that he was waiting for all the facts and judging only when all the facts are gathered.For now, he is reserving his opinion.

Suffice it to say, enemy lines have since been drawn. Lol

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dumuzi: that being said it's not surprising that he went the hate crime angle and that's going to have some level of repurcussions too

there's legit **** happening daily and he basically made a show of himself for attention and cash

he would've had better luck saying it was a politically motivated stunt and painting himself as an activist trying to draw attention to the situation as a celebrity etc and so on

there's people on some level who would have respected that

going about it in a manner that paints himself as self motivated comes off worse whereas saying he was purposefully shocking and then running with it from a political angle wouldve shifted the attention off him and onto a subject people find more palatable where it couldve been a more useful platform

even if he wasn't forgiven as an actor he couldve moved on to politics and so on

isn't he back on the show though? that's more than roseanne got for doing less

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That would have been a good angle(had his intentions been "wider") But it seems that he was just thinking in small terms.

His appearance on the show has been reduced .And according to reports, will (in time) be completely written off. But its all speculation.

Roseanne is another kettle of fish.

In Roseanne's case, she looked like the evil "victimizer". So was the case with Mel Gibson.

Now is Jussie Smollet's painting of white male MAGA cap wearers as " homophobic/racist lunatics" as "victimizing"? Not so. I doubt white males who support Trump will be denied housing,jobs or wedding caterers etc.

The latter are not exposed to racial profiling, not met with immediate vehement fear or suspicion. Nor are they the types to be falsely accused and (in the past) were publicly lynched with people smiling and waving in pictures.

Being a white homophobic racist doesn't threaten your physical integrity within this society. It just makes you "despicable". But you can be "reformed" and be integrated back into society when you say "sorry" (ehem..Liam Neeson).

Being a black male/ gay etc. doesn't afford you the same luxury. As once someone out there has made up their mind to harm you physically or emotionally, they can and often do.

And you can't "apologize" away your colour or sexual orientation(as society "expects" you to). Because you don't see a reason to, you are happy being who you are.

Nor can you ever feel safe enough to be able to walk down the street holding hands with your same sex mate. Or be served properly in a restaurant where you see that you are the "only" black guy there.

posted February 25, 2019 09:22 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aries23Degrees:
That would have been a good angle(had his intentions been "wider") But it seems that he was just thinking in small terms.

His appearance on the show has been reduced .And according to reports, will (in time) be completely written off. But its all speculation.

Roseanne is another kettle of fish.

In Roseanne's case, she looked like the evil "victimizer". So was the case with Mel Gibson.

Now is Jussie Smollet's painting of white male MAGA cap wearers as " homophobic/racist lunatics" as "victimizing"? Not so. I doubt white males who support Trump will be denied housing,jobs or wedding caterers etc.

The latter are not exposed to racial profiling, not met with immediate vehement fear or suspicion. Nor are they the types to be falsely accused and (in the past) were publicly lynched with people smiling and waving in pictures.

Being a white homophobic racist doesn't threaten your physical integrity within this society. It just makes you "despicable". But you can be "reformed" and be integrated back into society when you say "sorry" (ehem..Liam Neeson).

Being a black male/ gay etc. doesn't afford you the same luxury. As once someone out there has made up their mind to harm you physically or emotionally, they can and often do.

And you can't "apologize" away your colour or sexual orientation(as society "expects" you to). Because you don't see a reason to, you are happy being who you are.

Nor can you ever feel safe enough to be able to walk down the street holding hands with your same sex mate. Or be served properly in a restaurant where you see that you are the "only" black guy there.

Not the same.

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yeah i'm not at all surprised that enemy lines have been drawn with people given his race and orientation

there's people who give a free pass based on attempts to be overly pc for one thing and then people who are going to blow it out of proportion due to their own prejudices for another, but that's how things always go

i would argue potentially faking a hate crime for selfish reasons is far worse than a washed up pill popping drunk comedian saying pretty much anything

to me roseanne just looked like a product of her time trying to recapture something in a different social climate that's unacceptable

it's like watching an old silent movie, you ever see broken blossoms? the other title for that movie was something like "the yellow man and the girl" and there's just slurs thrown in casually without any malice even to a point that's legit funny because it's so dated that no one would ever do that now without getting **** on

whereas what he did almost makes light of a legit issue because he didn't even have it in him to put a bigger picture spin on it to deflect

i would argue that the climate is changing to where being a white male has been stigmatized

i've seen so much white hate which gets looked over as somehow not racist because of history when the reality is it all is

people do see a white person and then have assumptions and excuse prejudice towards them

so it's sort of a weird climate right now where everyone is polarized against each other on a lot of different things

to an extent history while it does cause damage being thrown around in many cases now is invalid

that random white guy isn't the one who did that, but people treat him as if he has something he needs to pay for you get me?

whereas being black or being gay is gaining acceptance

there's a lot more people now who don't care and who are accepting and supportive that's why there's such a big shift in the climate

in a way though he's setting that back by being potentially dishonest for selfish reasons rather than using this all as a platform to speak out

this is all really limited by him just not being the right person, and that's got fuckall to do with his sexuality or his race

i'm in an odd position where i'm mixed (italian, puerto rican and cuban) but because my family is largely european heritage the way i look is treated very differently depending on where i am

i go back home to nyc and i'm "white" i stay where i am now in a more rural area in pennsylvania and i'm "hispanic" so while neither is black i have experienced very mixed treatment with race (and arguably worse sometimes depending on where i was when perceived as white funny enough, though i'm still not one to approach any stores where i'm hearing blue grass and seeing confederate flags outside lol)

i'm also bi, and openly so and i promise you i can't hide that because everyone knows always without it being said

and it really all just depends on where you are

here i haven't been bothered, in ny it's depended on neighborhood and time because it's gotten better but when i was a teenager definitely not and particularly in minority heavy neighborhoods not white ones

racism really is a two-sided issue

that all being said there are plenty of places where someone can be black and gay openly and no one cares, just like i've seen 2 people in mascot costumes skipping down st mark's place in the village with a kid between them and no one saying **** even though that definitely looked like some sorta ****** up pedo furry nightmare

and i've been on a date with two women at once and we were all clearly together no issue

it all comes down to being aware of your surroundings

yeah lynchings still happen, yeah racial tensions exist and yeah in many places black people do get the short end of things and being gay or bi or not fitting the standard of what a person should be comes with stigma

but at the same time there are places where it's a non issue and where that chip on someone's shoulder is unnecessary and the climate is changing

this wouldn't be a polarizing issue if that wasn't the case

edit: i'm not at all minimizing the dangers in some places btw

i've followed my fiancee into a gas station before when she had to use the bathroom just to make sure no one pulled any **** because she's mixed and definitely looks it and the people there were very much not

it was this run down old mining town

i know the way i'm treated sometimes and the way she is can vary, i've seen it

and i saw it with an ex fwbs who was black and i get the hang ups and stigma from a secondhand pov

posted February 25, 2019 01:23 PM            

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