posted May 15, 2021 04:22 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by VeronicaNicole:
Regarding the original topic, I read that story a few years ago and became interested in it, later catching the documentary. I must warn you I have a rather cynical view so don't be offended. I am a very just person & often times people don't see things the same way. Sometimes that human side of us blinds us from what is actually there. ....

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I actually agree with everything you said. I didn't quote the whole response. But yea, I concur.

Btw,for you there is clearly no love lost for Mark😂. He is definitely the "moo-mish" idiot in all of this imo too. Couldnt agree more.

I think the post may have come across more judgemental of Jennair and women like her? But it wasn't meant to be. I sincerely empathize and dont judge her at all.

From my perspective, i meant "loving too much" in the sense of having no boundaries between yourself and the partner i.e you are indivisibly bonded to them. And this leads you to "control" as a manner of fearing that they may abandon you.

And by "deep"(especially in Meredith's chart) I meant "all is not at all what it seems. There is more to the story than meets the eye."etc.

I found it very ironic that Mark was drawn to Meredith because (in time)I actually saw the possibility of Meredith "turning" into Jennair, as a probability.

She was going to "merge" herself to him like Jennair did. And I think that Mark seeing her as a sort of "victim" (Pisces) whilst Jennair is the jealous "villain" (Sco), is typical of the Nep/Pluto effect respectively effect on others.

In that Pluto is not readily understood and dismissed as the "villain" or the "crazy" one. Many people (mostly men) online saw Jennair as the "crazy b***h". Women empathized with her position. Many saw Meredith and Mark equally at fault.

Mark is going around giving talks on "Mebtal health", and yet he is not acknowledging how he contributed to Jennair's state of mental depreciation through his and Meredith's actions??? 🙆🏿‍♂️ There is a dumbness about him for sure.

And I think Meredith (as is the case with unevolved Pisces energy)was just oblivious and naive.She thought that Mark would walk away from his wife without consequence and they would live their fairytale(forgetting that she too was married)🤦🏿‍♂️

Its this gullibility that I think Mark( as her "Daddy") found attractive. Perhaps she made him feel like her "hero"? 💁🏿‍♂️ Who knows? But yes, they could have both handled the situation better.

posted May 15, 2021 05:00 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aries23Degrees:
Dsc ruler (Jup) in conj to Mars is def the agression part.But even without considering that conj, the ruler of the Dsc(Merc)square Mars.Yikes!🙆🏿‍♂️

I don't think its tenacity that has her hold on.She still wants to mantain control over the situation & dismiss the attempts from the partner to communicate anything "other" than what she wants to hear.

The acrion of putting the divorce papers from the partner away in a drawer is evidence of someone who willingly suffocates or ignores the partner.

The relationship is all about HER. There is no "relationship". Just a "feature" guest in the form of the partner.

Notice that ruler of her Asc is conj 7th. The relationship (7th) is all about her(Asc). And Sat in 7th(if ruler of the 12th house cusp of Aqua) suggests not being able to see/hear the partner. Distant from the partner emotionally and perhaps critiquing (Vir/Lib Sat) what the partner brings on their end.🤷🏿‍♂️

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Hmm, I haven’t thought about it but what you said made sense. She has strong need for control and by ignoring his divorce request, she is technically suffocating him. She kept asking him to go for counselling so he went and came back filled with more frustration. Also the counsellor said she feels that he still cares for her so this strengthens her resolve NOT to divorce, lol. I think one can still care about you even though they don’t love you romantically anymore, no? So now he has served her the divorce papers but isn’t forcing her to sign it. She thinks it must mean he isn’t serious about leaving her but IMO who will spend money engaging a lawyer if they’re just issuing empty threats? I believe he must have a plan B but she thinks he will change his mind (as long as she gets rid of the other external influences and he changes his job). But again IMO who the hell goes back to divorce their wives because they’re unhappy at work??

She’s a Christian who doesn’t believe in divorce, that it’s a sin etc. I don’t know if she really believes it or she’s saying it just to dissuade him but I know he feels put off by such talk and now he thinks he’s a sinner and he’s going to hell because he wants to leave his wife.

posted May 15, 2021 05:14 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:
didn't know that was a south node 1st house trait, hadn't come across that with vedic i figured it was because my sun is 12th house (placidus puts my sun into the 11th and it just rules the 12th) that i kind of need to go off and just isolate

was pretty trained though as a kid to not really be allowed to have feelings so it makes me feel very awkward and guilty on a certain level to share them when they're negative 🤷‍♀️ especially if they last a while then i'm inclined to disappear

i thought 7th house neptune had more to do with other people or just more relationship specific, this is even just like friendships and stuff for me so if you get it from everyone blame the south node

supposedly it makes you short too having it on your ascendant (i'm very short 5')

i'm doing that now, have been, the time alone **** figuring things out really want to avoid another huge mistake lol

it is supposed to get better but can make the first serious relationship go to hell essentially if it starts before that age

juno on the south node and 5th house pluto sounds annoying 😔

i have to look at that reading again, don't remember offhand most recent readings i've done have been on stocks and investments etc for a couple people

i'll check it out and answer in that thread

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I’ve Sun in 12H. That gives us need to isolate ourselves from others time to time. I think it’s why I feel so comfortable by myself alone at night. I also think better at night.

I get it from others in general, like they have all kinds of expectations on me. I also tend to get blamed for things I didn’t say/do so be seen as the ringleader.

posted May 15, 2021 05:51 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aries23Degrees:

I think the post may have come across more judgemental of Jennair and women like her? But it wasn't meant to be. I sincerely empathize and dont judge her at all.

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😆 oh goodness I wasn't thinking that. + Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I think in some weird small way I sympathized with jennair & I feel like she was demonized the most in this by the general consensus. The comments I initially heard when I first read about this were all attacking jennair the most. Like saying she should have just gotten over it and let them be. Wtf?!

Haha I wasn't implying I thought you had that perspective. Your post seemed pretty unbiased & you were just curious about planet aspects. I think I initially felt like I needed to be her voice. Since even her dirty husband can't totally do that because like you said it seems like he can fully grasp it for what it is. Like going around talking about mental disorders all while lacking perspective that she felt things more intensely than him and 11/12 of the population. But if it helps him get through the day then that's what matters. Plus I am sure the students that he lectures are happy that they can get out of class for a bit.

I felt like I demonized Meredith a little more than I meant to. What you said in you reply about her just being naive, I can't believe she really understood the weight of her actions.

It's just difficult for people who do not have our venus (you, jennair & myself) to really understand how difficult it can be to navigate. Like I have never been close to acting the way most of the people in all the horror stories I am seeing on this thread, but I can get it..to an extent, some of these people I think there may be a little more than their venus at play. Like they are just crazy.

posted May 15, 2021 06:43 AM            

He's got a venus in Scorpio to along with a bunch of other crap. So maybe I spoke too soon 🤔 perhaps that is a culprit as well. Too much Scorpio at home and Meredith had a little bit lighter chart?

It is clear that there was attraction in both charts but I haven't looked at them much yet.

Mark & Jennair:
http://imgur.com/a/zI8FBZ5 (composite)
http://imgur.com/a/aEhQ9NQ (synastry)

posted May 15, 2021 07:15 AM            

The composite charts have a little saturn though.

It's hard to seeing either relationship being close to a fairy tail. Jennair & his have more intensity with all that Scorpio. But they both got their nessus on the others stuff & both have natal Lilith conjunct moon.

posted May 16, 2021 05:54 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by VeronicaNicole:
I found marks birthday - 10/11/1968 somewhere in Indiana. Idk I just put Fort wayne.. doesn't really matter since we don't know the time anyway.

He's got a venus in Scorpio to along with a bunch of other crap. So maybe I spoke too soon 🤔 perhaps that is a culprit as well. Too much Scorpio at home and Meredith had a little bit lighter chart?

It is clear that there was attraction in both charts but I haven't looked at them much yet.

Mark & Jennair:
http://imgur.com/a/zI8FBZ5 (composite)
http://imgur.com/a/aEhQ9NQ (synastry)

Mark & Meredith
http://imgur.com/a/FIcLTCm. (Composite)
http://imgur.com/a/VYU6B0n (synastry)

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From Mark and Jennair’s Composite, it seems like they did enjoy real, romantic love (Sun conjunct Venus/Neptune/Valentine), but the stellium square Juno is showing difficulties in commitment or it may be highlighting their differing expectations (their Junos in opposition is showing a need to compromise). Their Mercurial Moons are in square signs. There was a lack of emotional understanding between them and likely emotional/security needs were not met. He may have felt that Jennair was too critical/over-analyse everything and she may have felt that he was flighty. Gemini cannot stay on something for too long. They need to keep moving/changing.

When Mark moved to Delaware, tr South Node was conjunct their composite Juno, possibly challenging their commitment. Tr Chiron was also retrograding square to their Juno/Jupiter midpoint and tr Uranus was opposing cJupiter quincunx their Scorpio stellium and Pluto. I think their issues were not formed overnight. When she eventually found out about the affair, tr Saturn was squaring their Mars/Uranus-Chiron opposition.

When Mark met Meredith he said he felt that she really understood him and that he could really talk to her. They have the same Moon so why am I not surprised? When you put Moon square Moon next to Moon conjunct Moon, you’re gonna feel a difference. I’m not saying he’s right to do what he did but I don’t fault him for feeling that way with Meredith. They had not been together long enough so I doubt outer planets influences played out before her untimely death. Mark and Meredith’s composite isn’t showing in your link so I can’t see more.

Anyway I don’t see Jennair being demonised. From the comments I read, most empathised with her being a jilted wife but felt that what she did was crazy. Most pointed their fingers at Mark and Meredith instead. One commenter went as far as saying Meredith should have known better than to mess with a married man. It’s true she shouldn’t have done that but did she deserve to be murdered? No. None of us has the right to take another person’s life. Also IMO she partly drove herself to madness by taping their conversations and transcribing each of them. God knows how many times she must’ve read and analysed them? This would drive anyone mad!

posted May 16, 2021 10:36 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Hikaru29:
Hmm, I haven’t thought about it but what you said made sense. She has strong need for control and by ignoring his divorce request, she is technically suffocating him. She kept asking him to go for counselling so he went and came back filled with more frustration. Also the counsellor said she feels that he still cares for her so this strengthens her resolve NOT to divorce, lol. I think one can still care about you even though they don’t love you romantically anymore, no? So now he has served her the divorce papers but isn’t forcing her to sign it. She thinks it must mean he isn’t serious about leaving her but IMO who will spend money engaging a lawyer if they’re just issuing empty threats? I believe he must have a plan B but she thinks he will change his mind (as long as she gets rid of the other external influences and he changes his job). But again IMO who the hell goes back to divorce their wives because they’re unhappy at work??

She’s a Christian who doesn’t believe in divorce, that it’s a sin etc. I don’t know if she really believes it or she’s saying it just to dissuade him but I know he feels put off by such talk and now he thinks he’s a sinner and he’s going to hell because he wants to leave his wife.

Yes, her 12th cusp is Aquarius and what you said made sense. She often neglected his emotional needs which is the main cause of their distance. Also after child birth she started to neglect her appearance and that further caused the loss of attraction.

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posted May 16, 2021 10:39 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by VeronicaNicole:
😆 oh goodness I wasn't thinking that. + Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I think in some weird small way I sympathized with jennair & I feel like she was demonized the most in this by the general consensus. The comments I initially heard when I first read about this were all attacking jennair the most. Like saying she should have just gotten over it and let them be. Wtf?!

Haha I wasn't implying I thought you had that perspective. Your post seemed pretty unbiased & you were just curious about planet aspects. I think I initially felt like I needed to be her voice. Since even her dirty husband can't totally do that because like you said it seems like he can fully grasp it for what it is. Like going around talking about mental disorders all while lacking perspective that she felt things more intensely than him and 11/12 of the population. But if it helps him get through the day then that's what matters. Plus I am sure the students that he lectures are happy that they can get out of class for a bit.

I felt like I demonized Meredith a little more than I meant to. What you said in you reply about her just being naive, I can't believe she really understood the weight of her actions.

It's just difficult for people who do not have our venus (you, jennair & myself) to really understand how difficult it can be to navigate. Like I have never been close to acting the way most of the people in all the horror stories I am seeing on this thread, but I can get it..to an extent, some of these people I think there may be a little more than their venus at play. Like they are just crazy.

But again, don't really care too much for any of the 3. At least the women are at peace for now. You know Mark is going to wander the earth in search of what he lost yet never being able to find it. I wish I could find his b-day. Seriously how is it not listed anywhere? 🤔

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posted May 16, 2021 11:27 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by VeronicaNicole:
I found marks birthday - 10/11/1968 somewhere in Indiana. Idk I just put Fort wayne.. doesn't really matter since we don't know the time anyway.

He's got a venus in Scorpio to along with a bunch of other crap. So maybe I spoke too soon 🤔 perhaps that is a culprit as well. Too much Scorpio at home and Meredith had a little bit lighter chart?

It is clear that there was attraction in both charts but I haven't looked at them much yet.

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Thank goodness lol.🙏🏾 Very helpful.

I see that on the 23rd of April 2018, his Sun was opposed his progressed Moon/Sat conj in Aries.

He was definitely in his feels I think and looked forward to starting a life with Meredith. Aries progressions tend to "compell" us towards "new" things. And with Sat in Aries, we may be stubborn about getting our own way.

I think maybe the oppo to the Sun may have suggested that he may felt "confined" by the marriage?

Perhaps he felt it (marriage) was an "impediment" to what was coming in the future and couldn't wait to get it "out of the way"?

Trans Mars in Cap conj Mark's progressed Venus in Cap. And both form a wider conjunction with Pluto in Cap. Once again the combustible passion of emotions. Motivations of love/career are merged.

I find it fitting that Ven is in Cap for Mark as the setting under which he met Meredith was "work" (Cap) related. And I also think he thought he was "upgrading" from Jennnair🤔

Mark lacks water. He is air and earth strong. Venus -Nep conj(wide) are in Sco. But I would say that this conjunction tends to have one be dreamy and idealistic about meeting that illusive "one true love".

Maybe the transit of Jupiter in Scorpio activated that Ven-Nep conj? In that it facilitated the outlook that his "one true love" was within reach?

This would explaine how swiftly things progressed between him and Meredith. I mean barely a year passed between them meeting . And already they were off to "forever after"🙆🏿‍♂️

Add to that, Mark is a gambler. Moon in curious Gemini is square to Jupiter in "let's play it by the book" Vir. He bites off more than he can chew. Then ends up with a lot of food in his mouth.🤦🏿‍♂️

I think if she(Jennair) had waited, the spell cast by this new-found romance would have cooled down. I think he may have been looking for an "escape" (at the time) to the normal everyday life he was living. And Meredith came along bright-eyed and bushy-tailed.

Uranus conj Jupiter indirectly tied to his Moon suggests that he was more than prepared to turn his world upside down. This without blinking.😶

Uranus conj Jupiter tends to have an "urgency" of chasing dreams/visions of a prosperous future that is(typically)a distance away.

The details of that future are sketchy with Virgo Jup and usually make this position nervous .

But one is motivated by a sheer force of idealism and promised "happily ever after" by the out of sign conjunction Ura in Ven ruled Lib 0 Deg. So this energy can compel one to act NOW.

There is "promise" with this particular "out of sign" aspect, that details will work themselves out🤷🏿‍♂️

posted May 16, 2021 11:54 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by VeronicaNicole:
I find it strange that Marks saturn makes absolutely no aspects to any planets in either synastry chart. Both girls have their saturn on his **** though not much.

The composite charts have a little saturn though.

It's hard to seeing either relationship being close to a fairy tail. Jennair & his have more intensity with all that Scorpio. But they both got their nessus on the others stuff & both have natal Lilith conjunct moon.

With Meredith it doesn't have anything real holding it together. There are much more easier aspects that probably felt like a relief. Their both air sun & moons & moons conjunct each others while jennairs squared his. Uranus is opposite her mars/Venus in Pisces but that is the only planet he has on those planets. Their is alot of Uranus from his to her charts and hers to his. Which makes complete sense.

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posted May 16, 2021 12:09 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Hikaru29:
From Mark and Jennair’s Composite, it seems like they did enjoy real, romantic love (Sun conjunct Venus/Neptune/Valentine), but the stellium square Juno is showing difficulties in commitment or it may be highlighting their differing expectations (their Junos in opposition is showing a need to compromise). Their Mercurial Moons are in square signs. There was a lack of emotional understanding between them and likely emotional/security needs were not met. He may have felt that Jennair was too critical/over-analyse everything and she may have felt that he was flighty. Gemini cannot stay on something for too long. They need to keep moving/changing.

When Mark moved to Delaware, tr South Node was conjunct their composite Juno, possibly challenging their commitment. Tr Chiron was also retrograding square to their Juno/Jupiter midpoint and tr Uranus was opposing cJupiter quincunx their Scorpio stellium and Pluto. I think their issues were not formed overnight. When she eventually found out about the affair, tr Saturn was squaring their Mars/Uranus-Chiron opposition.

When Mark met Meredith he said he felt that she really understood him and that he could really talk to her. They have the same Moon so why am I not surprised? When you put Moon square Moon next to Moon conjunct Moon, you’re gonna feel a difference. I’m not saying he’s right to do what he did but I don’t fault him for feeling that way with Meredith. They had not been together long enough so I doubt outer planets influences played out before her untimely death. Mark and Meredith’s composite isn’t showing in your link so I can’t see more.

Anyway I don’t see Jennair being demonised. From the comments I read, most empathised with her being a jilted wife but felt that what she did was crazy. Most pointed their fingers at Mark and Meredith instead. One commenter went as far as saying Meredith should have known better than to mess with a married man. It’s true she shouldn’t have done that but did she deserve to be murdered? No. None of us has the right to take another person’s life. Also IMO she partly drove herself to madness by taping their conversations and transcribing each of them. God knows how many times she must’ve read and analysed them? This would drive anyone mad!

I don’t think people should stay in unhappy marriages but Mark could have handled this better than to be the coward that he was. However, it’s easy for me to say... what would have been more palatable for Jennair ?because it’s clear that she absolutely hated the idea of Mark and Meredith together so I’m guessing even if he had cushioned the blow, would she have still done the act or destroyed their lives (and her own) in other ways? The last we knew she was seeking therapy but how do you recover if at the same time you’re still obsessing over what your husband and his mistress are doing/saying/going? It’s like putting yourself through a smoking cessation programme while still smoking non-stop.

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Yes, agree.👌🏿🙏🏾 And I didn't even think at looking at Juno.

When you said they (Jennair ans Mark) mat have had differing ideas of what to expect in marriage or what "commitment" means etc. You may be on to something.

His Juno is actually on Nep/Ven at 20 Sco. It was also activated during the Jup transit.

So Mark wants romance and "happily ever after" in marriage.A fairytale story that has no ending.

Jennair has Saturn in Tau conj Juno im Tau.For her, marriage is a BIG deal. Not something to be taken lightly or looked at as some wishy-washy arrangement.

Meredith has Juno in Lib sextile Ura and trine Sun. So with her if it works, it works. If it doesn't,it doesn't. She can take it or leave it🤷🏿‍♂️

I wonder if there is a significance between Mark's progressed Mars 12 Lib on 23 April 2018 to Meredith's Juno in Lib 13?

Were Mark & Meredith going to get married after the divorce with Jennair was finalized? 🤔 I think it would fit this aspect imo.

posted May 17, 2021 05:47 AM            

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Originally posted by Aries23Degrees:
Jennair has Saturn in Tau conj Juno im Tau.For her, marriage is a BIG deal. Not something to be taken lightly or looked at as some wishy-washy arrangement.

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And people with Juno conjunct Saturn (just like those with Saturn in 7H) should ideally marry after their Saturn Return. Quoting Bob Marks, “An early marriage (before the Saturn Return) will slowly decay until there is no affection left and the marriage collapses.”. Jennair’s Juno is also opposite Venus indicating that her partnership needs and ability to express love was constantly clashing. This is also indicative through her Saturn opposite Venus. These people often come across cold and critical when what they wanna express is actually love. Mark said Meredith made him feel good by complimenting him which was something he never got from Jennair. Not surprising.

Mark’s Venus is widely conjunct Neptune with Juno at the midpoint. He can get stuck in undesirable unions for the wrong reasons. He seeks romance like what you said and also for things to be always harmonious. Neptunians can get really affected by conflicts. He said they used to have epic fights over money - unsurprising considering Jennair’s Taurus Juno/Saturn. Also her Pluto square Sun... she’s a fighter and can be unrelenting. Mark also has Moon square Mars making him emotional and easily offended...and that square is triggered by Jennair’s Virgo Moon so likely she would say something and he got ****** off and they started fighting.

quote:

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Meredith has Juno in Lib sextile Ura and trine Sun. So with her if it works, it works. If it doesn't,it doesn't. She can take it or leave it🤷🏿‍♂️

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You’re right..and her Juno also trine Moon. She would be charming and nurturing. Her Venus/Mars conjunction sextile Mercury/Jupiter square Neptune trine Saturn. I think she knew how to charm people. She could get unrealistic at times but her Saturn trines grounded her.

quote:

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His Juno is actually on Nep/Ven at 20 Sco. It was also activated during the Jup transit.

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So love was in the air!

quote:

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I wonder if there is a significance between Mark's progressed Mars 12 Lib on 23 April 2018 to Meredith's Juno in Lib 13?

Were Mark & Meredith going to get married after the divorce with Jennair was finalized? 🤔 I think it would fit this aspect imo.

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I don’t really look at progressed Juno. Did they have any prog-prog or prog-natal Sun-Venus, Venus-Venus, Venus-Mars or Sun-Moon aspects? Even declinations?

posted May 20, 2021 04:57 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aries23Degrees:

Meredith has Juno in Lib sextile Ura and trine Sun. So with her if it works, it works. If it doesn't,it doesn't. She can take it or leave it🤷🏿‍♂️

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😆 yeah I got the same impression. Mark even made a comment @ one point saying how she had said "let's love each other til we dont." He thought it was like the wisest thing ever said. Sure buddy...w/e you say.

No doubt this relationship woulda gone belly up sooner than later. He was supposedly ring shopping & jennair knew about this. Ey ye ye 😑

Eh I don't wanna speak ill of the dead, hindsight is 20/20 but I do wish jennair just went "ehh **** it..I'm out" mark would have been back groveling within the year once meredith found herself some younger ****. Then none of us would be wasting our time on these fools. We would be talking about some other fools. Oh well!

The real crime though..naming your kid after a kitchen appliance manufacturer.

posted May 20, 2021 05:16 PM            

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Originally posted by VeronicaNicole:

The real crime though..naming your kid after a kitchen appliance manufacturer.

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posted May 22, 2021 10:13 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:
lmao

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posted May 22, 2021 10:27 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by charlie:
SMEG. Isn’t that a lovely name for a child?! LOL

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posted May 22, 2021 10:53 AM            

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Originally posted by Chanterelle:
True story... I wanted to name all of my kids for plants. For one of them, a beech tree was significant, so I looked up the scientific name — Fagus. Needless to say, we passed on that one and chose a different plant. I should have looked it up in some other languages, though.

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posted May 22, 2021 10:55 AM            

I will say my husband and I always make financial decisions together but I am open and flexible and want us both to be happy and get what we want so if we are doing good and can afford it I am open, if we are just getting by and accumulating debt while we are at it, I gotta set boundaries. I like to be generous if I can afford to, I also have venus conjunct mars in leo trine AC.

My husband gets attached to possessions and holds unto money more, can get caught up in that and wanting to make more ect...he has moon in cancer in the 2H and 2H ruler Mercury in scorpio but he also has Venus in leo ruling his chart so he has a generous side too so we tend to not have arguments about money.

We bought two new cars in 2019, our venus in leo were like yeah we finally can so lets just go for it and enjoy life and deciding which cars to buy we also came to an agreement on with ease.

posted May 22, 2021 12:41 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by hypatia238:
She has Ixion conjunct Mars in Scorpio under 3 degrees.

"Astrologically, Ixion represents ingratitude; the violation of social norms of conduct; being offered a second chance, only to waste it; betrayal; and murder, often prominent in the charts of murderers or homicides."
http://alexasteroidastrology.com/ixion/

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Good thing to know, imma put that on the aspects to avoid list.

posted May 22, 2021 12:43 PM            

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:
for the best

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