posted March 07, 2010 12:29 PM         

Dervish,

katatonic, I relate to his example, and his realizations.
I guess I am concerned with those lost 30 years, and with
what he might have become under different circumstances.

Solutions are important, but it seems like even the people
focused on solutions haven't comprehended the full extent
of the problem.

koiflower --

The thing is, "trying your best" is a value promoted
in dominator cultures -- that is, promoted to the detriment
of other values, just as worthy of recognition.
Competition, busting your @ss, the Protestant work-ethic...
all of that is fine for some, but it shouldn't be glorified.
There is much to enjoy if we just look around and enjoy it.

We are often far too focused on our ambitions,
on acquiring something, or getting somewhere,
and we neglect to honor what it means to just chill.

Sometimes, the teacher in the room is the one who just sits there,
and if you get too worked up, or too talkative,
the teacher says, "Shut the f-ck up, and hit this sh-t,"
and hands you the joint, and you take a hit,
and then you shut up and chill out and let go
of your neurotic drives for a little while and Voila!

Sometimes.

It takes all kinds.

That's all we're saying.

posted March 07, 2010 06:25 PM         

I'm sure this wouldn't work for everyone, but I'm also pretty sure that those who'd never learn anything this way are also the same ones who don't learn anything in the current system either. Furthermore, schools destroy the love of learning so that more turn away from it as something unpleasant. One of the the greatest epiphanies I had as a kid was that I loved learning and hated school because school got in the way of my learning.

But as for alternative school systems that minimize fascist tendencies, here's an idea from Ecotopia:

quote:

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"The only controls on the schools, aside from a maximum-fee rule and matters of plumbing and safe buildings, stem from the national examinations which each child takes at ages 12 and 18. Apparently, although no direct administrative controls exist, the indirect pressure from parents to prepare children for these exams--as well as for life--is such that schools make a strong effort to educate their students effectively. The exams are made up yearly by a prestigious committee, compromising some educators, some political figures, and some parents--a partly elected and partly appointed body whose members have tenure of seven years and are thus somewhat insulated, like our senators and judges, from short-term political pressures.

"Indeed there seems to be a brisk competition among schools, and children switch around a good deal. On the secondary level the situation is apparently like ours; one school near San Francisco, which has produced a large number of scientists and political leaders, consequently has a long waiting list.......

".....Do Ecotopians accept the idea that poorer parents might not be willing or able, given the tuition costs, to send their children to school at all? In this crucial area, Ecotopians have not allowed their thinking to revert to that of harsher ages. Rather than a scholarship system, however, they give outright sliding grants to families with incomes below a certain level, and one component of these is marked for tuition. Thus the Ecotopian state, while not willing to lift the burden of education entirely off the parent's backs (thus encouraging larger families!) is still willing to force citizens to educate their children in some manner. The possibility of 'kickback schools,' such as arose in the U.S. when tuition vouchers were first tried, does not seem a great worry in Ecotopia, where the welfare of children is discussed constantly--and where the children themselves generally run school newspapers that are, if anything, ridiculously critical of their own schools, and would surely spot anything sneaky going on."

Ernest Callenbach, Ecotopia [Bantam Books Ed], pp 152-3

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posted March 07, 2010 06:38 PM         

quote:

---

and one thing i always wonder about, is how do you create a system that works for EVERYBODY? even a "partnership" society is going to have to deal with those who want "more" ...what will it do with them? without being guilty of totalitarianism?

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posted March 07, 2010 07:23 PM         

I have this problem with my eldest. He's a typical crystal child and feels everything and everyone... his scorpio AC works overtime. I took him out of school and in 4 months, the difference is just incredible. He's now confident and smiling again from lack of stress to perform.

posted March 09, 2010 05:45 PM         

She's a perfect example of how early intervention can work well for people with autism and other neurodivergent conditions.

I benefited from early intervention too.

also

the stuff in her video seems very familiar like I heard it all before

I did

from reading this site: http://www.grandin.com/inc/visual.thinking.html

I first read it back in 2005.

Raymond

------------------
"Nothing matters absolutely;
the truth is it only matters relatively"