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Author Topic:   30 Reasons To Become A Vegetarian
Valus
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Posts: 1399
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posted September 12, 2009 05:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message
lol

Before you lost sight of me.

"One must begin upon the heights
to ascend beyond the clouds."
~ Valus


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Azalaksh
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From: New Brighton, MN, USA
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posted September 12, 2009 05:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
It has nothing to do with losing "sight" of you -- it has to do with losing something else.

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 05:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message

This has been real fun, 'Zala.

Take care of yourself.

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Azalaksh
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posted September 12, 2009 05:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
PS: I would deem it more of a "success" and worthy of more respect to begin upon the ground and ascend beyond the clouds.....

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 05:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message

I'm sure you would.

"If you have built castles in the air,
your work need not be lost;
that is where they should be.
Now put the foundations under them."
~ Thoreau

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 05:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message

But, by all means,
keep trying to tear me down,
and poke holes in my confidence.
Whatever floats your little boat.

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Xodian
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Posts: 158
From: Canada
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 12, 2009 05:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Xodian     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
I really have no interest in winning your admiration, since you've made it clear that what you value is the ability to make money (which, in an ignorant and backwards society, generally involves the excercise of ignorant and backwards values) and perform feats of physical prowess (which don't impress me). You probably think its reasonable that athletes make millions while teachers, nurses, and firefighters scrape by. As for universities, dont make me laugh. The ability to memorize and regurgitate someone else's ideas, assertions, and theories is what universities reward, and not something I especially esteem. What impresses me is the ability to think independently and to do independent research -- two things which are positively discouraged and punished by academia. For my part, I've coined numerous aphorisms that rival almost anything you can find in the Western Canon, and more than several people have referred to me as their favorite writer. Countless times, I've been told how I put into words what they've always suspected or known but never been able to really conceptualize or articulate, and that I reveal things to them which they felt they were on the verge of grasping, and keys that unlock questions they've always wrestled with. I'd say those are accomplishments which rival your impressive hand-eye coordination, any day of the week. But who's counting? Incidentally, if there's anything I've done worthy of respect, its that I stopped torturing and killing animals for the sake of my lower appetites, and until you do likewise, you dont have much of a chance of impressing me with your gamer skills.

Mr. Valus, through a personal POV, I doubt that your mindset and argument against the set notion of Profits and Institutions isn't about their lack of articulating the idea free thinking or a moral standard but I will give you the benifit of the doubt and debate your POVs on a more technical term.

a) Each and every business and corporation follows the basic idea of the "triple bottom line" two of which happen to be Profit AND Community contribution. Incase you have not realized it yourself, its usually private organizations around the world (except for internationally recognized NGOs like Oxfam and UNICEF) that have contributed the most for the unfortunate. Furthermore, those who athletes you speak of contribute more to social programs in terms of financial aid and the like then you or me. It is ridiculous that they make more then most doctors but if the healthcare system was more privatized, we wouldn't be seeing that problem now would we . Furthermore, many of the hospitals which contribute most to the advancement of healthcare and medical breakthrough happen to be privately assisted in one way or another.

And about Universities; If anything, they rarely teach regurgitation. Infact (in the words of my economics professor) if you are a regurgitator, chances are you are gonna flunk the given course (unless you are doing biology Lol!)

b) Being a professional gamer is a good but relitively least important aspect in my personal portfolio of accomplishments. I hate to list out such things in public forum since its usually not important to the given convesations but in this case I'll make an exception. Like I said, I have worked with NGOs and actually done logistics work for Oxfam. Furthermore, I have numerious academic awards and recognition everywhere from minor things like TSX stock challenge, National Chemistry and Biology competition, and track and field events to having an honours degree . I am currently doing my masters in the prestigious near Ivy Leauge status business school.

The best way to make change in a given system is to understand how it works so you can technically point out its faults. That means actually LEARNING the key concepts of the given system. So when someone questions my credentials, I can verily say that I have the financial and academic status to prove them wrong.

But offcourse, that might be a more... mainstream position for you am I right? Lol!

But on with the given topic:

I also posted the falacy behind raw food diet and the research supporting it. Infact, out of thousands of Medical Journals, very few support its findings and even then, the supporters themselves have contradictory statements presented in their reports like the one I pointed out in that exerpt. Furthermore, Cooking is a form of predigestion in which heat is used to hydrolyze nutrients which would otherwise be hydrolyzed at body temperature by digestive enzymes. The end result is the same, but one raw food author seems to obliquely suggest that another reason for leaving food enzymes intact is so they can be absorbed intact into the blood stream to continue their digestive work there. Such a process would be catastrophic as the absorbed enzymes would be peptide fragments and would be more likely to generate allergic and autoimmune reactions than robust good health.

And BTW: You were called sick for not warning people about the given image you put up and how it went against forum T&C. Though yes I personally wouldn't condone it and it will be kept in check in the future. Though do us both a favour and keep the given thread in the appropriate topic that it belongs in (GU and Health and Healing would have been more prominant for this given topic.)

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Valus
Knowflake

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posted September 12, 2009 05:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message

Xodian,

I may or may not bother reading all that.

It really doesnt interest me that much.

Sorry.

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Xodian
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Posts: 158
From: Canada
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 12, 2009 05:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Xodian     Edit/Delete Message
Then pray tell Valus, why are you demanding people to focus on YOUR given posts at hand and try to understand your given points when you don't want to return the favour?

You still think you are not being a hypocrite by calling others egotistical ?

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 05:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message

If they're going to respond,
I invite them to respond to
what's being said.

I'm not responding, though.

I'm not misrepresenting you,
taking everything out of context,
and just delivering personal insults.

That is what they did,
and why I told them to
focus on the issues.

If they dont want to respond
to the issues I raised,
that is perfectly fine.

As long as they dont just respond
with personal insults and attacks.

Understand?

Who did I call egotistical???
Can we please stop with all the
"ego", "egotist", "egotistical" comments?

You said some very self-assured things, too,
and I never harped on you about it,
though I found your claims unfounded.

But here you are harping on me for nothing.
A simple misunderstanding on your part.
Please, try to calm down and be cool.

Walk away.


peace,
V

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Azalaksh
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Posts: 702
From: New Brighton, MN, USA
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posted September 12, 2009 05:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
But, by all means,
keep trying to tear me down,
and poke holes in my confidence.
Whatever floats your little boat.
But I'm not trying to tear you down Stephen -- you don't see that, and there's nothing I can do about that.
And "poking holes" in your self-esteem is not my aim nor my goal. You used to appreciate Libran balance in all things. I mourn that.
And my boat is not floated by your boat sinking, whereas your boat seems to be floated by a goal of "converting" others to your viewpoint, rather than letting them find their OWN way.....

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 05:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message

Whatever, 'Zala.

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Xodian
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Posts: 158
From: Canada
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 12, 2009 05:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Xodian     Edit/Delete Message
Mr. Valus, your given quotations were taken as a whole and your ideas were debated as a whole until you decided to shift the focus of the given rebuttles without any basis of debating them. I gave medical and scientifically backed reasons as to why your sources were wrong. You did not return the favour back to me. It seems to me as if you are avoiding a more technically supported and sound argument with valid reasons. If this is the way an independent thinker is supposed to think then it seriously lacks any logical coherency.

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Azalaksh
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From: New Brighton, MN, USA
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posted September 12, 2009 05:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
Whatever, 'Zala.
This ("whatever, Stephen"), then, will be my response to your future thoughts.

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 06:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message
Gimme a break.

I dont need your balance.

As if you know what is balance for me.

You have no idea how I see myself.

Or how that changes daily.

How little belief I have in myself.

To the point that I am paralyzed.

Suicidal half the time.

Asserting myself only on messageboards.

Or how much belief I have,
in things that I value deeply,
but which I fear the world
has forgotten how to value.

You dont know me.

You arent in any position
to balance my self-image.

I am so many things.

And I know that
better than anyone.

I AM a genius.

And a fool.

One who performs valuable work.

And shirks what the world values.

You dont know me.

And I need a break now.

I need a rest.

You all need to back off.

I'm asking you nicely.

All I tried to do was defend
innocent animals against cruelty,
and show people how they might
acheive optimum health.

I dont deserve all this bullsh!t.

You should have some understanding.

Maybe my tone is too cocky at times,
but it comes from a very human place.

An almost desperate compulsion
to be real and honest with everyone.

I'm tired now.

I'm tired of being misunderstood,
and having all my words twisted
and subjected to scrutiny
by people who are too upset
to be fair-minded with me.

And I admit I'm too upset now
to be fair-minded with all of you.

But I'm not a bad person.

I honestly wanted to bring awareness
and compassion for the suffering I see.

Maybe my frustration got the better of me,
but was it fair to focus only on my tone?

And to slander my character and intentions?

Like so many of you did.

Can't a guy be frustrated with cruelty
and indifference to suffering??

Is that so bad?

Must such a person be silenced,
and ridiculed into silence??

So you can all go back
to business as usual.

Business, bloody business.

Nevermind.

If you dont understand by now,
you won't understand this.

You'll just use all this honesty
and vulnerability against me.

That's what you people do.

No understanding.

No compassion.

No empathy.

No sense.

No wonder you exhaust me.

And my sincerity.

I have to have a sense of humor.

To withstand it.

But I wanted so badly
to be serious about this.

And I wanted so badly
to be taken seriously.

Not me --
but the plight of these animals.

I thought we could discuss it
and take it seriously for once.

I was wrong.

About that, I was wrong.


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Yin
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posted September 12, 2009 06:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Yin     Edit/Delete Message
Valus!

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Azalaksh
Moderator

Posts: 702
From: New Brighton, MN, USA
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posted September 12, 2009 06:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
You arent in any position
to balance my self-image.
I wasn't putting myself in that position, and that isn't what I said -- I said that you used to *appreciate* balance.....

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 06:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message
Xodian,

Give it a rest, will you? Can you?

Here, you want this:

Medical sources are biased, for a number of reasons. Medical students are offered one or two classes on nutrition, which most of them elect not to take. The real interest of the medical industry, which is run by the pharmaceutical companies and, by extention, the FDA (the wealthiest corporation in the world today), is to keep people sick. There is no money in curing people. What they want is to treat symptoms, and supress symptoms, so that the disease never goes away entirely. They have no interest in making you well, but in selling you drugs and cutting you up.

The evidence on my side is recorded by numerous independent healers, working outside the mainstream, who have amassed thousands of testimonials in support of their work. They healed "incurable" people. The evidence is out there. I've pointed you in the right direction. where you go from here is your business. If you want to learn, watch Paul Nison's lecture. Hear him tell you how he cured himself by doing the opposite of what the medical industry told him. And when he asked his doctor about the connection between nutrition and his condition, she would say, "There are no known medical studies connecting...". They are not taught this stuff. And when it is shown to them, they look away. You want evidence, watch:

The Formula For Health
Part1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKf7NwWJ-r0
Part2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukS4DkCf0Y0
Part3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xLHIvdR23g
Part4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJ5KKc2fouE
Part5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsU_owGaV9I
Part6 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fERSCjGjcR8
Part7 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q46n_01evfA
Part8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbWwDGp7txQ
Part9 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcFptUF6VYY
"We all have discipline for what we love." ~ Paul Nison

You arent getting any more out of me.
We've had enough. Go digest this stuff.
And if you have something to say after
watching Nison's lecture, I'll listen.


peace

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Valus
Knowflake

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posted September 12, 2009 06:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message

balance,...

as in 'Zala's Libran wisdom

yes?

which can balance

my self-image

(what we were discussing)

thats what you think
i need to appreciate.

dont lie

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Azalaksh
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From: New Brighton, MN, USA
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posted September 12, 2009 06:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
I am so many things.
And I know that
better than anyone.
I hope that you discover a stronger faith in your value someday, Stephen.....

Signed,
A person without compassion

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 06:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message
why do you have to add that?

"signed, a person..."

then its like you are only being nice
to prove your little point.

you ruin it.

dont you see that?

its not compassionate.

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Azalaksh
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Posts: 702
From: New Brighton, MN, USA
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posted September 12, 2009 06:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
balance,...
as in 'Zala's Libran wisdom
yes?
which can balance
my self-image
No! Not necessarily me. Anyone with that energy as part of their makeup.
And who said *I* was wise??
No one can balance your self-image but you, Stephen.

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Valus
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posted September 12, 2009 06:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Valus     Edit/Delete Message

I'm not saying anything,
but....

even Nazis have compassion
for other Nazis

try extending your circle
of compassion

beyond your species

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Yin
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posted September 12, 2009 06:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Yin     Edit/Delete Message
Valus, you have brought up plenty of reasonable evidence to support your claim that eating meat is unethical.
I really appreciate it as I continue to explore your links, read up on the topics mentioned and watch the videos.
It has been quite an enlighting experience for me.
I'm learning new things.
That's the bottom line for me.
Thank you.

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Azalaksh
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Posts: 702
From: New Brighton, MN, USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 12, 2009 06:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
why do you have to add that?
"signed, a person..."
then its like you are only being nice
to prove your little point.
you ruin it.
dont you see that?
its not compassionate.
Stephen, I was responding to your indictment below. And you impute malicious (?) motives where there are none (to a Scorpio, everyone has ulterior motives??). I am as sad to be misunderstood as you are
quote:
You'll just use all this honesty
and vulnerability against me.
That's what you people do.
No understanding.
No compassion.
No empathy.
No sense.

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