posted September 28, 2009 10:19 AM         

NOW MOVE ON TO THE NEXT POSTER AND DONT READ THIS IF YOU DONT WANT TO BE INTELLECTUALLY CHALLENGED. U DISGUSTING PEOPLE.

i agree with carl, the numbers speak for themselves. regardless of the right to own a weapon, death penalty is NOT stopping violent crime, on the contrary, i think it makes everyone more tolerant toward "organized, institutionalised" crime. criminal are not object, or at least considering them as such only extend the inhumane attitude into the rest of the society.

"yay, one down, let's open the champagne"

also, u are not personally involved, so how do u justify your anger?

if it was a relative that had been shot, i understand the reaction entirely but here, on GU, what is the purpose of your reaction? demonstrate that you are fine living in a society closer to hell than any other free country?

where killing is part of everyday life?

enjoy your world then

nah, the US are not leading by example for that kind of reason.

DONT BOTHER REPLYING TO ME, I WONT BOTHER READING YOUR STUPID COMMENTS.

posted September 28, 2009 01:56 PM         

Study Finds Racial Gap on Death Row
More black convicts face capital punishment than whites. Activists call for a federal moratorium on executions.
by Robert L. Jackson

WASHINGTON--A Justice Department study has found that black convicts in the federal penal system face the death penalty much more often than white prisoners, confirming the arguments of those who say that capital punishment is not applied uniformly.

The statistical survey, the first comprehensive study of the federal death penalty since it was reinstated in 1988, found a wide racial disparity in recommendations for capital punishment from federal prosecutors across the country. Roughly three-fourths of federal defendants recommended for capital punishment over the last five years were minorities.

President Clinton said that the figures raise concerns "since we're supposed to have a uniform law of the land." But he added that there had been "no suggestion, as far as I know, that any of the [federal] cases where convictions occurred were wrongly decided."

With the fairness of capital punishment figuring in the presidential campaign, the findings promptly led to renewed calls from some members of Congress, legal groups and human rights organizations for a federal moratorium on executions.

Atty. Gen. Janet Reno, however, rejected a moratorium on the federal death penalty, saying that such a delay "goes to the issue of people who were wrongfully charged," which the department's survey does not address.

Instead, Reno called for additional research and said that overrepresentation of minorities on federal death rows reflects racial and economic disparities throughout the criminal justice system and points to the connection between crime and higher rates of economic and social problems in minority communities.

More than anything, Reno said, the survey's findings may reflect that "our system, our society, is not fair to a large number of minority children . . . who do not have equal opportunities."

While the figures "should be a concern to us all," she said, so long as poverty, drug abuse and unequal opportunities continue to take an especially heavy toll on black youths, "we will continue to see disparities in the number of minorities in the criminal justice system." The study found that, of 682 defendants charged with federal crimes subject to the death penalty, 20% were white and 80% were minorities. U.S. attorneys recommended that the death penalty be sought for 183 of them--26% of them white and 74% minorities.

Reno approved seeking death penalties for 159 of those 183 defendants--28% of whom were white and 72% minorities, the majority of them black.

Deputy Atty. Gen. Eric H. Holder Jr., who supervised the study, said that he was "personally and professionally disturbed by the [racial] disparity," which showed that "minorities are overrepresented" on federal death rows.

The study also found geographic differences in application of the federal death penalty. Just nine of the 94 U.S. attorney districts accounted for 43% of all death penalty recommendations. They are Puerto Rico, two in the New York region, western Missouri, western Tennessee, northern Texas, New Mexico, and parts of Virginia and Maryland.

Although state systems were not included in the Justice Department's survey, Reno said that she believes the racial disparities "may be roughly the same."

Study Based on Recommendations

During the latest five-year span, 20 defendants have received death sentences from federal judges or juries. Only a fifth of them are white.

But the Justice Department study focused on the recommendations of its own officials in Washington and its top prosecutors in the field, not on actual death sentences meted out in the federal system.

In the federal system, capital punishment is reserved for such offenses as terrorist bombings, violence in some drug crimes, violence at international airports, assassination of government officials and violent crimes in aid of racketeering activity.

To achieve more uniformity, Reno established a new system in 1995. U.S. attorneys now must submit cases to a review committee in Washington. Reno herself then has to approve the death penalty when it is sought for federal defendants. Neither the review team members nor Reno are told the race of a defendant.

The report noted that "overall, the federal government continues to play a relatively small role in administering the death penalty in this country." From 1930 to 1999, state governments executed 4,400 defendants, mostly for murder convictions, which generally are state crimes. In the same period, the federal government put to death only 33 defendants and has not carried out any executions since 1963.

Leaders Urge Delay of Executions

The Supreme Court in 1972 struck down state death penalty laws on grounds that they were being applied unfairly, a ruling that also brought federal executions to a halt, even though there had been none during the previous nine years. The court later reinstated the death penalty after the adoption of new procedures.

The federal government revised its procedures in 1988, when Congress passed the Drug Kingpin Act, making the death penalty a possible punishment for some drug-related offenses.

Under the previous system, which was in effect from 1988 to 1994, 52 defendants were submitted by U.S. attorneys to their Justice Department superiors for approval of death penalty recommendations. In that period, racial disparities were similar to those of the last five years, the study showed.

About 13% of those defendants were white, 75% were black, and most of the remainder were Latino.

Sen. Patrick J. Leahy (D-Vt.), a chief sponsor of bipartisan legislation to guarantee DNA tests to certain federal inmates, called the Justice Department study "more clear evidence that the death penalty system is broken" and that "this is a national problem."

Sen. Russell D. Feingold (D-Wis.) renewed his demand and that of five other members of Congress that Clinton postpone any federal executions until a commission can study the issue.

Rep. Jesse L. Jackson Jr. (D-Ill.) called for a moratorium similar to the one imposed in Illinois last January by Republican Gov. George Ryan. "We should not have business as usual," Jackson said.

William F. Schulz, executive director of the human rights group Amnesty International, said that "no one should be surprised that the federal death penalty is displaying the same lottery-like qualities that plague capital justice at a state level." He also urged a national moratorium on executions.
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines/091300-02.htm

Raymond

------------------
"Nothing matters absolutely;
the truth is it only matters relatively"

posted September 28, 2009 02:47 PM         

It's more along the lines of "intellectually challenged".

You are a typical leftist Pire. You want to be heard then run away without taking the heat your comments deserve.

katatonic, I was drawn to your statement that Hitler figured out it was cheaper to execute murderers...and lots of others than to house them for life.

Does that make Americans smarter than Hitler? We've had capital punishment since the beginning of the United States...and even before that in the colonies and later during the period of the Articles of Confederation.

It takes a very confused mind to believe it's OK to kill a baby because it's inconvenient to it's mother..right up to the time it's being born, or kill perfectly innocent adults because they too have become inconvenient to their families or the state...but object to executing a mass murderer.

These minds are doubly confused when it's known those who hold these views would object vehemently to having a mass murderer executed by stabbing the prisoner in the back of the skull and sucking out their brain or have them run through a chipper/shredder procedure..as babies are killed OR strapping prisoners to be executed to a medical gurney and starving and dehydrating them until they die...13-20 days.

It's very funny some of those who advocate for killing babies and screech at the top of their lungs..."Hands off my body" and "Women's heath care is between women and their doctors"...are totally down with O'BomberCare with which the government will be "Hands on your body", telling you what medical services you can have, what drugs you can have or that you can't have either at all...and you and your doctor will be cut out of that decision making process.

posted September 28, 2009 03:37 PM         

jwhops my dear, please realise kat is not a leftist. non partisan or bi partisan...perhaps... she is a mis-truster of all that is govermentalized, such as myself. although more articulate and versed in the rights and wrongs of proper debate than i am. with a slant of a liberal edge.

many times you agree, but don't see it becasue of styles and penchant for ruffling each others feathers. she isn't ready to string obama up quite yet and without merit, but that does not make her a kool aid drinking liberal.

posted September 28, 2009 06:02 PM         

jwhop,

"typical leftist"

you make it sound like i should Be ashamed!

CPN,

i do believe that people who consider ethical to build a society on the rule of force (and death) are stupid.

may be you are just reacting to the form of my comment instead of the meaning. i was being forceful indeed. if your reaction has to do with the content of my point of view, then I simply disagree with you.

we have the society we deserve

posted September 28, 2009 06:03 PM         

Raymond

------------------
"Nothing matters absolutely;
the truth is it only matters relatively"

posted September 28, 2009 06:22 PM         

the last time the guillotine cut the head of someone judged guilty was in 1977 if i'm not mistaken.

posted September 28, 2009 06:42 PM         

i'm glad you came back to finish talking about it pire.

glacous, to be a proclaimed leftist is fine, i don't have a problem with what anyone else thinks. i ride the fence on a lot of issues. i see both sides and both sides make sense sometimes. or both sides have very valid points anyway, of course they both have shortcomings too. and the truth is something you have to dig for and i usually don't have the time unless so i come here check it out and look it up if i care enough.

posted September 28, 2009 07:04 PM         

and i don't have any grudges against the US either, on the contrary

i have an outsider point of view (like carl), that's all;

i didn't read the replies beyond carl's because I got upset that the truth was not obvious to everyone.

my bad

posted September 28, 2009 11:28 PM         

The only things I would change is the amount of time it takes to execute murderers AND a forensics review of all the physical evidence including DNA evidence by a highly competent...and independent forensics lab not connected to the prosecution.

It's still funny that those who are in favor of killing babies..who are totally innocent of any crime whatsoever and by the most gruesome procedures possible find it unacceptable to execute convicted murderers, even mass murderers.

There are a lot of very loose screws fastening their judgment and moral clarity together.

How about you pire? Are you in favor of killing inconvenient babies by medical procedures called abortion? How about killing inconvenient adults by denying them food and water while they starve and dehydrate to their deaths?

posted September 29, 2009 03:09 AM         

u will make it sound like i said i eat foetuses every morning for breakfeast but nevermind;

i def think that condoms and/or contraception is essential in birth control; abortion is NOT a solution except when there is indeed no other choices.

what pushes me to say that?

i'm gay so no risk of that happening to me, and i guess you are an old grumpy man, so you too are not much at risk, therefore we discuss in an abstract way; but if i was concerned and had to resort to abortion, i would feel concerned and saddened and would not do it with pleasure but with the understanding of the gravity of my action;

people on their high horses lecturing me would sound bitter and out of touch with what im going through, therefore i wouldnt care less about their supposed moral highground;

as for the people dying of thirst and hunger, i don't see what you are talking about;

how far are we from discussing the subject of death penalty and the famous US snipper?

posted September 29, 2009 03:16 PM         

But in favor of sparing the lives of convicted terrorists, mass murderers and those others who have forfeited their right to live.

Get your loose screws tightened pire.

posted September 29, 2009 04:23 PM         

tell me one more time something insulting or remotely condescending in a debate and you'll taste the sharpeness of my tongue and see how gross i can be.

mods can ban me, but U CAN'T ADDRESS ME LIKE U DO.

i hope it's understood.

posted September 29, 2009 05:18 PM         

How about these kinds of comments? Will you tolerate these?

"i can't be bothered to read all the replies, feeling sick already; my true feeling? u bunch of sick people;"..pire

"NOW MOVE ON TO THE NEXT POSTER AND DONT READ THIS IF YOU DONT WANT TO BE INTELLECTUALLY CHALLENGED. U DISGUSTING PEOPLE"...pire

"DONT BOTHER REPLYING TO ME, I WONT BOTHER READING YOUR STUPID COMMENTS."..pire

I understand perfectly pire.

You believe you can say anything you like but others must show deference when addressing you. You've got that leftist disease I've talked about here for a very long time.

I don't need to be convinced of your grossness.

With all due regard for you self identified "sharp tongue" put a sock on it pire.

posted September 29, 2009 05:20 PM         

very few women go through abortions just because they can't be bothered to look after a child. and you would be surprised how many VERY responsible people get pregnant anyway. i have a cousin who tried to prevent her last SIX children with birth control. needless to say it did not work for her.

i am not in favour of abortion as a method of birth control. however, it is a hangover from the catholic church tradition that the unborn child has not been "baptized" (ie enlisted into the church) that created the insistence on all pregnancies being brought to term. never mind that the child very well might be motherless!

posted September 30, 2009 05:13 AM         

u are shoked by my words?

i could find hundreds of YOUR post where u say more outrageous things.

i've hurt your feelings here ?

posted September 30, 2009 09:12 AM         

You're the one whining about how you're addressed, not I.

I merely reprinted your own words to make my point.

You must live in some alternative universe if you actually believe I found what you said "shocking".

I don't find you sharp tongued at all pire. In fact, that tongue is more like a dull tool.

If this is the rhetorical style you've decided to pursue here then here's an aid to sharpen that dull tool.

posted September 30, 2009 09:31 AM         

Your friend notwithstanding, birth control is very effective in all it's various forms.

In the alternative, abortion as a form of birth control for convenience of the mother is both a gruesome and barbaric practice.

One other thing, please don't attempt to blur the lines of argument by bringing up rape and incest. These comprise the smallest fraction of reasons for abortion.

Let's not forget why I brought up abortion here.

posted September 30, 2009 09:48 AM         

I was born about ten thousand years ago
There ain't nothing in this world that I don't know
I saved king David's life and he offered me a wife
I said now you're talking business have a chair

I was born about ten thousand years ago
Ain't nothing in this world that I don't know
Saw Peter, Paul and Moses playing ring around the roses
I'll lick the guy that says it isn't so

I was born about ten thousand years ago
Ain't nothing in this world that I don't know
I saw old pharaoh's daughter bring Moses from the water
I'll lick the guy that says it isn't so

I was there when old Noah built the ark
And I crawled in the window after dark
I saw Jonah eat the whale and dance with the lion's tale
And I crossed over Canaan on a log