posted July 09, 2012 02:18 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by AcousticGod:
Ami,

Facts or stats aren't a smokescreen. You're making them out that way, but they don't inherently have the quality you assign them. All of communiction is dealing in information. Information can be accurate or inaccurate, and the only way to go about proving things is by using things we can all verify. It's as simple as that. The way to discredit facts I present is by providing alternate "facts" that verifiably undermine what I've presented. If they come from Heritage or Landmark Legal, so be it. We can look at those as well.

Also, I wouldn't characterize Kat as a bully. You refuse to put any effort into having a reasonable discussion here with anyone of an opinion different than yours, and for that you inspire the ire of a lot of people. You need to take responsibility for your role in all this.

---

Kat, to me, is simply a bully. I have no desire to interact with her, at all, and I won't other than to comment about her nasty comments to people who don't know. Other than that, I don't care.She showed me who she was with the Shylock comment to a Jewish person.. That is all I need to know about her, and all I care to know about her. I don't waste my time or energy with people like that.

I can't follow your line of thought, so I will just give up on that, as I don't have the motivation to try to do so, although I don't think you are trying to be a bully or nasty, for the sake of it. I just don't get it

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted July 09, 2012 02:19 PM            

and you hate me because i was there and i don't suck up.

you have been doing this since i first came across you stirring it up and you continue to do it, accusing, for instance, juni of doing exactly what YOU do.

GU was a contentious place when i got here and so it has remained...i have done my share of trying to cross the "lines" drawn in the sand but it hasn't worked.

but you come in here and bat your eyelashes at the originator, and try to make out that others are the crims...

and lmfao at you "ignoring" me..you came here and started with your little barbs when i didn't present myself for queen ami's approval in her own forums...having ignored you for over a year, all of a sudden you are here goading me.

posted July 09, 2012 02:25 PM            

I would like GU to grow, but I can't police your nastiness. I can just let people know to ignore it, which seems to be working

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted July 09, 2012 02:54 PM            

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted July 09, 2012 02:56 PM            

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted July 09, 2012 02:59 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by katatonic:
as to what i said about religion, yes of course there is good in religions too.

that does not change the fact that religion has been used as an excuse for warmongering power grabs for most of human history. most people think THEIR god is THE god, and THEIR interpretation of the bible is THE interpretation, like ami...i just happen to disagree with that.

many of the people and even rulers who thus used religion actually believed that GOD IS ON OUR SIDE, and therefore they were right to persecute those of all other faiths. isn't that what people came to america to get away from?

not entirely, since many appear to have come here with the same mindset and belief that the natives were "heathen savages" allowed them to dehumanize and destroy them...in short, the puritans were just as bloody-minded toward others as the place they escaped from was toward them.

some might say this is human nature. i say it is ONLY A PART of human nature, that not everyone needs to KILL THE OPPOSITION, and it is high time we turned away from war.

but to just declare unilateral disarmament, well, i have to agree with those who call this naive...

---

well...first of all people can freely state the way they belive the system should work...i guess thats why the forum is here... and if ami wishes to show her ideas using her faith why should we judge her on that?

second... zealotry exists in many fields other than religion... but i fully agree religion is sometimes used by the zealous as justification for their actions

there were times when the law allowed people to do horrible things to each other..and that was not so far ago... yet can we call the law evil? if people use it to their own agendas?

posted July 09, 2012 03:24 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by AcousticGod:
Ami, your response says, in essense, that your mind is closed on both items. When you're able to take responsibility for your part, then you might be able to get past the things you can't currently make sense of. People that are good mediators express the fact that they can see and understand the opposing viewpoint. I don't think you're even trying to see the opposing viewpoint. If you can't bring yourself to even try to see another person's point of view here, then what's the point? You're not bringing anything to the table. You're neither educating nor allowing yourself to be educated.

---

Well, I know what I believe, politically, and about God, so I don't care to really study another persons POV to teach, educate etc
I don't have a passion to do that, as I do with Astrology, for example.
I have certain gifts which I use on LL. That is not one of them. I like to encourage the people who have things to say, on here, with which I agree such as Jwhop or others who believe as I do.
I don't really want to teach, per se. I like to welcome people and encourage them to share.
I am starting to discover my gifts and places that I am, either not good, or don't care.
LL does allow one to grow and find one's gifts, as I feel I have.
Anyway, I don't have angst with you AG.

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted July 09, 2012 05:02 PM            

suffice to say that religion has been used by the powers that be to divide folk since time immemorial. and it is used by some to hide mental laziness.

posted July 09, 2012 05:08 PM            

then please don't. i didn't come into sweet peas to challenge you...as i told you months ago, you will not succeed in goading me.

posted July 09, 2012 05:22 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by katatonic:
[b]Kat, to me, is simply a bully. I have no desire to interact with her, at all,

then please don't. i didn't come into sweet peas to challenge you...as i told you months ago, you will not succeed in goading me.

this is not, as you like to think, your own site to propound your views and disallow any comments. sorry bout that.[/B]

---

Here is the deal. Don't be nasty to other people and I will have nothing to say to you, particularly new people.

If you can do that, I have no problem with you, as I don't care what you say to me, call me Shylock, or anything.
I consider the source.

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted July 09, 2012 05:54 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by katatonic:
ami this is the last time i will answer you. stop trying to curtail my freedom of speech. i am perfectly aware why you don't like me - it has nothing to do with how i talk to others - and you are not the mod of this forum.

as i said before, i don't follow you to sweet peas to make trouble. i don't make deals with snakes and i have no interest in anything further you might have to say.

---

If you attack ANYONE on here and I see it, I will speak up. If you don't, I won't. Debate is one thing. Calling people names, slurs like Shylock etc are not acceptable.

Bullying people and being nasty is not allowed on LL, in ANY Forum. I won't let new people be intimidated by you.

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted July 09, 2012 06:22 PM            

How in the hell do some people make it through the day without a babysitter? - jwhop

just a minor taste of the language those who disagree with jwhop are treated to.

posted July 09, 2012 06:45 PM            

If you're not here to learn or teach, and yet you find yourself making regular comments, you must be doing so in an effort to get a response.

It's remarkable that you don't have ANY trouble understanding me whatsoever if I'm not talking politics, but the moment I talk politics you can't make heads or tails of it. That's strange, isn't it?

posted July 09, 2012 06:54 PM            

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted July 09, 2012 06:56 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:
Frankly I don't understand you. There is no enmity, I am just telling you, you don't make any sense to me.

What I have said against Obama is not based on rumor nor hatred. However, I get the impression that you and AG both deem anything critical of the President "rumor" or conspiratorial sensationalism.

The commander-in-chief DOES have the constitutional power to bring the troops home immediately. For me to want that is not naive, it's based on how the law is written.

---

I'm reminded of back in 2000 when I said about the same thing to a Rush Limbaugh dittohead and what I called a Clintonista (she worked on the Clinton campaign and was currently campaigning for Gore) about individual liberty within a month of each other. The dittohead called me a "leftist loony" and the Clintonista called me a "right wing extremist." I asked someone about it and she said it was the "frog spell" in which they labelled someone as something and could then dismiss anything I said because they associated it with the most extreme and ridiculous drivel...and thus saved themselves the trouble of having to think about the message itself (as it was reduced to a "frog's croak" instead of meaningful words).

And I do recall back in 2008 I was on IMDB, I think, and somehow a thread got derailed on Obama. I listed some criticisms about him but I didn't display any particular hatred or fear of him, just that I saw him as a typical (and thus not trustworthy) politician and that "change" is a continually recycled campaign slogan that ultimately means nothing. I'm sure of was critical of Bush as well. But anyway someone on the crazier side posted how Obama was the Antichrist predicted in Revelations and that started a storm and one Obama supporter asked how anyone could believe that. Being an air sign who believed he was trying to understand I sent him a private mail linking to the Snopes that explained it (and why it was false) only to have the person mail me back saying my site was full of crap and for me to not try to convert him to Christianity because I was a false Christ, not a real Christian possessing a rational mind like him. I sent him back that he did not look at the site because Snopes examines urban legends and email hoaxes and I sent it because it shared the email that the poster had referred to. He did have the grace to apologize and say he figured I was a radical right wing Christian simply because I wasn't cheering for Obama and I was nice enough to not ask him about the part where he said he was rational (and that lying about having looked at the site wasn't very Christian).

posted July 09, 2012 08:36 PM            

Ami and I have not always gotten along perfectly, but I appreciate her having my back as I came up against a rather bewildering wall of opposition even on minor points (such as the FACT that Obama wanted the language in the NDAA to be LESS restrictive of executive power.)

I do feel badly for anyone who stumbles into this forum and is less equipped to deal with bullsh*t than I am, at my ripe old age of 36.

Pixie Jane, I really appreciate your comments. People ARE being conditioned to collectivize and label instead of THINK, and it's a potentially dangerous trend, as the consequences for falling under the terr*rist/extremist label are just amped up more and more.

You and I share an aversion to labeling even in astrological discussions, ie "It's a pet peeve when people dismiss others just because of their sign."

I AM what some would call a conspiracy theorist.

But to observe that our current POTUS is a total w*rmonger has nothing to do with conspiracy.

From kat & AG's comments, I get the impression they think w*r is excusable when O does it and reprehensible when it's done by anyone else. The notion is too preposterous for any self-respecting liberal to spell out just like that....but from I gather, that's their bottom line.

posted July 09, 2012 09:34 PM            

Here, a pic is worth a thousand words:

posted July 10, 2012 01:48 PM            

yes he does have the constitutional power, faith, however you may have noticed if you have looked at history, that one is not necessarily in possession of REAL power just because the law gives it to you.

do you think, really, that were the command given today, to pull out ALL the troops, that it would happen? do you think a)congress and b)the military would not band together to have the president who gave such a command offed, deposed or even put in a loony bin? i'm sorry but i do think this is naive.

it is NOT naive to WANT it. i would be right there with you if WANTING it were all it takes. again, notice what happened to the kennedys, not for the same reason perhaps, but for the same sin...breaking all the deals in place and threatening people's powers-that-be.

politics is a conspiratorial game. chess at best, murder at worst. the best president cannot act solo. he is in the middle of a spider's web.

perhaps randall is right and these "gestures" should be made. but a dead president, or a completely discredited one, can do NOTHING. so what good the gesture, except as a very last resort?