posted March 13, 2016 01:38 PM            

I've known for a long time that I have problems with relating to people in a "normal" way. (Ever since I was a kid.)

The attachment theory is nothing new to me but I can say that whenever I think about it too much it creates a lot of turmoil in me.

It feels like I'm cornered, with nowhere to turn for help.

posted March 13, 2016 04:28 PM              

I was sure I am an Anxious-Preoccupied person - but I think the Fearful-Avoidant feels much more like me, there is definitely an avoidant component, even though I can act like the Preoccupied in the beginning (engagement in 4 days should say something about that), however the more the relationship progresses, the more avoidant I become. I crave intimacy yet resent it also. More or less this was the reason for my part in the fight I had with my bf a few days ago. I got too close too soon, then freaked out and started to think ill things about him which sadly I didn't keep to myself. Thanks for making me aware of this. Now I'm curious what his type is (he is an Aries with a Cap Moon like you, Odette, but he doesn't seem to be dismissive - not with a Libra Asc lol, he can't!). I can also become Dismissive though later in the relationship, probably after 6-12 months or so, when I am secure enough for my anxiety to drop somewhat. I can behave like all 3 unhealthy types, actually, and very little like the healthy one (as in, a few days in a month, if he's lucky) but the Fearful-Avoidant fits best for the most part. This link describes me very well.

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A narcissistic or demanding mother can cause a child to mold him- or herself to please the parent to the point where little remains of the child’s own feelings and personality; they have been trained to display a false personality to gain parental approval.

Children who have been brought up this way often become high-achieving, competent adults with a sense of hollowness at the core, and episodic low self-esteem. They are often from families where parents are highly competent and have high expectations, and parenting may have been so active that childhood selves were quashed by parental expectations, judgments, and signals. In other words, parental ego is so dominant that the child’s true feelings are buried to avoid their disapproval. What the child learns to display is a false persona more pleasing to the active and admired parents.

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posted March 14, 2016 03:52 AM            

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Originally posted by Odette:
Doux - To say that "I understand" would be an understatement.

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I feel you.
You're doing great, just keep going. Be aware of your mechanisms. That's an essential step. If you're aware, you can deal with it easier... And it is possible to change. I truly believe that.

Some venting... if you'll excuse me.

In my last relationship (my second one, I've only had two in my life, both lasted less than a year), I was confronted with someone who is a "secure" type, and it was so refreshing, although it was far from perfect (a lot of my anxieties were triggered regardless).

My first boyfriend was a Dismissive, and it scarred me badly (I'm a fearful-avoidant/anxious type), so on top of all the drama I had experienced in my family growing up (both parents acted like "Borderlines"... especially my mother), that was really bad. It was like I was reminded of how worthless I was. Trying to win the attention/affection of an 'absent' parent.

Then (3 years later, so it wasn't overnight), I came across my second boyfriend and there was no real spark... Maybe because his attachment style didn't "trigger" the "intensity" (as he is a secure type). There was anxiety on my side all along, because there always is... especially in the beginning, because I didn't know where it was going and how honest/reliable he was. There was some drama initiated by me (jealousy, insecurity, etc) but he was steady and very emotionally stable (whoa! something new!). We stayed together for half a year, then I broke up because I felt he was becoming distant - and that triggered my anxiety -> run away system, so instead of talking to him about it, I just broke up. I said "my feelings have changed" (which was true), just like that.

A few months later, after a short "friendship turned into romance" didn't work out (which again, affected me greatly), I tried to make it work with my ex again... We kept seeing each other and just taking it one day at a time, but unfortunately the feelings never came back as I hoped they would; he just didn't feel like "the right one" for me. Which made me extremely sad because I could see all his great qualities (stable, affectionate, loyal, confident, etc.) and I just kept crying as I was telling him that it couldn't work. I felt so miserable because I felt like I was letting go of something very valuable, just because my damn "feelings" weren't there. (How stupid!)

Now, I don't want to believe that that is because he's a secure type and that if he were insecure, it would have worked... I think I just wasn't meant to/incapable of loving him the way he deserved to be loved (he had issues around being loved, even if they were "minor"... I know somewhere in his subconscious they were there). But overall he was very emotionally "healthy", and that was so inspiring to me.

Now I think to myself, there is no way I'm going to fall into the trap of "unhealthy" relating again, after having experienced someone's emotional stability...

The problem is that I want to feel passion, and that "in love" feeling, and I'm afraid I won't be able to feel that way for someone who's actually "good" for me...

And so here I am. I still struggle immensely with the idea of "relationship" and don't feel capable of falling in love, but at least I'm aware of my tendency to get involved in "insecure"/"unhealthy" scenarios and I want none of that (Venus trine Saturn natally, I want to make it right and avoid the drama).

I have anxiety when I'm not in any way involved with someone, because it triggers the "what if I'll always be alone?" thought; and I have anxiety whenever I'm involved with someone: "what if it goes wrong?". It's very tiresome... I often wish I could just NOT care about all that stuff, but it looks like I can't, not really. I can function pretty normally in my every day life (it doesn't make me completely dysfunctional or depressed, etc) but it's always somewhere in the back of my mind. I have a Libra Venus conj. DSC ruler, and NN & Mars conj. DSC... Plus having a Scorpio stellium, I know I can't do without relationships. I'm just so tired of the anxiety and overthinking that goes with it...

Anyway, thanks for reading, sorry it was so long. Just felt like getting this off my chest (say thanks to tMoon on my ASC... it *always* coincides with verbal - or should I say, "written" - diarrhea for me, lol).

Ps. Thanks Vajra for the wishes. <3

And Mae

posted March 14, 2016 01:14 PM              

Odette,

Is this the Sag guy? I think I glimpsed a bit in one of your threads about him. I am glad you guys are working things through!

I am definitely the fearful-avoidant type. The more I read about it, the more it fits like a glove and explains why I can behave like both the preoccupied and the dismissive. I found this article in psychologytoday particularly helpful, they also delineate some advice on how to manage our emotions: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-freedom-change/201505/come-here-go-away-the-dynamics-fearful-attachment

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Recognize that your emotions may not be giving you accurate feedback about what is going on in your relationships. The distress you feel may have nothing to do with your present romantic partner or close friend; that person may simply be a trigger. Think about it as a post traumatic stress reaction.
Consider getting a therapist or use a self-help program like Adult Children of Alcoholics (link is external) or Codependence Anonymous (link is external)where you can disclose your true feelings and perceptions in a safe place (no matter how "off" they may seem) and obtain a neutral perspective and help in calibrating your emotional and behavioral responses. People with fearful attachment styles often do not know how they should feel or respond in emotionally charged situations.
Take a long time out (days perhaps) before you take action based on strong emotions. Be sure that you get all of the facts on the table and make a conscious choice for how you want to respond before taking action.
Practice setting healthy boundaries. You probably did not have good boundaries modeled for you in childhood so this may not come naturally. When you are in a calm emotional space, ask yourself what you need in your relationships and what behaviors you are willing to accept from your relationship partners; then communicate this information directly in a non-defensive manner. Of course, you should keep in mind that it is not in any other adults power to “make” you feel good inside. That’s your job.
Don't disclose too much of your inner turmoil or trauma history until you know that the listener is "safe." The vulnerability you will feel upon disclosing too much too fast might flood you with intense anxiety make you want to run away and cut off the relationship. In my work with people who have suffered trauma, I often try to slow them down if they attempt to disclose their most closely guarded secrets too early in the therapeutic relationship. I ask them why they think I am someone to trust with their well-being. I believe that I am trustworthy, but I like people to evaluate on their own when and how to lower their guard.
Practice standing your ground, not running away, and experiencing healthy endings. I usually tell my fearfully attached clients that we will know when we are establishing a close therapeutic relationship because they will start feeling anxious about coming to their sessions and thinking about reasons to avoid coming. This also applies to friendships and romantic involvements. If you have this style, you should simply anticipate this emotional reaction in yourself and refuse to run when it tells you to (of course don’t ignore signs of potential abuse or unhealthy behavior). When someone tells you how much they care, you should similarly force yourself to graciously accept the gesture. Remember, you give others a gift when you allow them to express their own goodness. Finally, try to stay through the relationship ending. No relationship lasts forever. They eb and flow like the tide. When it is time for a relationship to end, listen to the other, say your truth, and then release them. Don’t worry, you will still have yourself to love you.

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Doux,

posted March 15, 2016 03:48 PM            

I am embarrassed to say this is mine. I just realized how numb I am from all the trauma I went through.

The reason I am as sane as I am is because I have a very good chart.

If not, who know what would have happened to me.

Does anyone else have this one?

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posted March 16, 2016 10:09 AM            

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Originally posted by Vajra:
You know what I just remembered? When it all started, after we had just met and gotten just a little emotionally close to each other - he would sometimes deliberately "postpone" things, like NOT meet up at the next possibility, but only a week later - and explain to me it was "so it isn't all over quite so fast". It was as if he'd set up an expiration date for the whole thing from day one, and sought to prolong the process a little by extending the time between meetings. So very, very odd...

I wish now I had known more about this problem before I met him, because I might have steered clear of getting intimately involved with him, and could have become just a good friend, which might have benefited us both. But what was done can't be undone.

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I do this a lot with people, the whole "postponing" thing. Not necessarily to postpone things or because there's an expiration date, but so I don't get tired of them. By spreading out the times I see someone, it gives me time to recollect myself and also miss the person.

When I see someone I haven't seen in a while, things are great and I show my emotions more. When I see someone 2 days in a row, I'm not as pleasant to be around. I may be there physically, but I'm wishing to be somewhere else.

He may or may not be the same way.

posted March 16, 2016 10:10 AM            

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Originally posted by Odette:
Aww.... I wrote a pretty long post to you both Mae and Ami and somehow it seems to have vanished.

Did you see it posted earlier?

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I didn't see it, Odette.

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