posted May 17, 2015 08:21 AM            

I am a person who has gone through abuse.

My answer to any emotional illness/issue/struggle is to FACE TRUTH. This is not really MY answer.

It is wisdom. The charts show truth.

People may not want to face it and that is fine, but *I* won't dilute it--EVER.

So, anyone who comes to me, asks me a question or an opinion will get truth.

If they don't like it, they can do elsewhere but *I* won't change because Truth is Love and this is ever enduring.

If a person has a hard chart and accepts it, he can change.

If he has a hard chart and denies it, he has no hope imo

I have had real change and it has always, always, always been from facing truth.

Hence, how could I compromise?

I don't do that.

For every one person who does not want to face hard things, there are nine who thank me profusely for having the courage to state things as they are, in a simple and direct way.

I live for truth because life has NO value without it--NONE!
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posted May 17, 2015 08:33 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ami Anne:
For me, as an astrologer, I don't go by self reports if I have done dozens and dozens of charts that tell me the same thing.

---

Ami,

please explain to me how, if you see NESSUS in a position you regard to produce an abuser, how do you know that plays out in the chart owner's life, if it is not by self-report?

Are you telling me that you have done dozens and dozens of charts of people that you KNOW personally are abusers, and found this NESSUS position?

How do you know these individuals ARE abusers if not by self-report?

How then can we say that self-report is invalid when it comes to those who DO NOT abuse?

posted May 17, 2015 09:11 AM            

Hence, if one person or two people on a message board tell me otherwise, I do not accept it.

If I have seen 1000 Yorkies as super friendly and one person tells me their Yorkie is a killer, I will not think all Yorkies are killers.

I will think the person is in error.

In most cases, it is denial not an outright lying to me or anyone else.

Denial does not make anyone a "bad person".

It is a defense mechanism given from God, so people will not go insane.

However, no one will ever heal if they have a high level of denial.

They will stay the same, forevermore.

I can't be part of that.

Hence, I am not for everyone lol

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posted May 17, 2015 09:24 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by popcorn:
I know AMI not write the whole truth about nessus most of the time...but I love to read about what she write...my fantasy triggs. Ive moon conj nessus in hard aspect and also checked out many chart....Im not an abuser and will nerver every be... The most of the people who have hard nessus in there chart are very intelligent and work hard... Many important doctors and professors got nessus in hard aspect... I cant believe all of them are abusers.... They seems to me more be angels who want help people...

---

You don't know what people are like behind closed doors, Popcorn.

They may be amazing doctors and this would not mean they were not.

However, Moon/nessus may not be abusive because Moon is a yin planet like venus.

The yin planets do not seem to abuse but to attract it.

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posted May 17, 2015 09:44 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ami Anne:
I have clients come to me over and over and over and they tell me how Nessus plays out for them.

---

THIS is self-report Ami.

SO, we can also consider self-report of those who do not abuse.

posted May 17, 2015 10:04 AM            

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posted May 17, 2015 10:35 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ami Anne:
Let's just say I had nessus conj the ASC, I would self reflect. I would listen to everyone who wrote on it. I would try to face myself. I would not argue with people. To me, I grew up with soooo many lies. I can't take lies. I have to face myself with all my darkness and we ALL have darkness. Mental and emotional illness is really an inability to face oneself imo.

---

I too grew up in the dark.

I have reflected.

I saw my potential for abuse through the rage I felt regarding my childhood, HOWEVER, I chose knowledge and healing instead.

To abuse is a choice.

This is why we cannot say that any NESSUS placements are a straightforward indication of an abuser.

No matter where a NESSUS is placed, anyone can chose to abuse others or not.

posted May 17, 2015 12:39 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
I too grew up in the dark.

I have reflected.

I saw my potential for abuse through the rage I felt regarding my childhood, HOWEVER, I chose knowledge and healing instead.

To abuse is a choice.

This is why we cannot say that any NESSUS placements are a straightforward indication of an abuser.

No matter where a NESSUS is placed, anyone can chose to abuse others or not.

This choice is beyond the power of one astrological placement (and an asteroid, no less) to predict.

---

posted May 17, 2015 04:01 PM            

The daughter had her Nessus conj the mother's Sun.

The daughter NEEDED a push back to the mother.

She needed this Nessus to balance out her mother, who was abusive.

In charts in which the child/other person does not fight back against abuse, the "victim" suffers much, much more.

Hence, Nessus can be a kind of Pluto and is needed, I think.

However, it is still abuse, imo, but one needs to stand up and "abuse" if you wants to call it that( and it really is not because it is self protection and assuring the abuser will be pushed back) when one is attacked.

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posted May 17, 2015 06:39 PM            

Maybe, your Nessus conj the NN is a power position that helped you to fight back.

Nessus may balance out abuse because a strong Nessus can "abuse/fight" back.

I struggle with fighting back, myself. If someone bullies you/harasses you/abuses you etc, do you fight back?

I think there comes a point that if the person does not stop and thinks he/she has a FREE RIDE to mess with you, you best let him know he is mistaken.

I do this, but I am not comfortable with it.

I wish I were. I think I struggle with what God wants from me.

Am I supposed to endure abuse? I doubt it.

How am I supposed to fight it off me?

I guess you have to fight it off you or it won't stop lol

Anyway, Nessus can fight and hence, he is needed.

However, I would never advise marrying a person in which there is a strong Nessus synastry.

With parent/child, you can't help it and that is the point I am making.

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posted May 17, 2015 07:43 PM            

I have DEJANIRA conj IC by 3 degrees. Not conjunct Moon.

posted May 18, 2015 03:53 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ami Anne:
You know, V. You have Moon conj Deja, pretty close in orb, if I remember correctly. Your awful childhood experience is what I see with Moon conj deja, which is the single hardest aspect in the entire chart imo

Maybe, your Nessus conj the NN is a power position that helped you to fight back.

Nessus may balance out abuse because a strong Nessus can "abuse/fight" back.

I struggle with fighting back, myself. If someone bullies you/harasses you/abuses you etc, do you fight back?

I think there comes a point that if the person does not stop and thinks he/she has a FREE RIDE to mess with you, you best let him know he is mistaken.

I do this, but I am not comfortable with it.

I wish I were. I think I struggle with what God wants from me.

Am I supposed to endure abuse? I doubt it.

How am I supposed to fight it off me?

I guess you have to fight it off you or it won't stop lol

Anyway, Nessus can fight and hence, he is needed.

However, I would never advise marrying a person in which there is a strong Nessus synastry.

With parent/child, you can't help it and that is the point I am making.

---

As I said before, my DEJANIRA is conj. IC 3'. Gabby's DEJANIRA is conj MOON 3'.

Yes, I do "fight" back. However, I will always try to "fight" with reason.

The only times I physically fought was in the home, to defend myself, my mother, my brother, or the cat, from my stepfather.
And once when I was 18 because a girl had severely hurt my closest friend.

I believe there is power in NESSUS, but I also believe that the owner has to be very mature to handle the energy.

There were also times when I should have fought back, but instead I internalised the energy - these are the times I would have met the criteria for clinical depression. So, I HAD to find healthy ways of expressing that energy.

Reason or walking away are the only options.
And after walking away, we must find a way to transform the energy, to find reason for OURSELVES. So we can truly let go.

I think NESSUS can teach us when to let go also. If we were to unleash the full power of our anger physically, we would really hurt people, so if we have conscience, and we do not want to do that, then we are forced to either reason or let go.

I have struggled with the same questions you ask yourself here Ami.
It became clear only when I had made the mistakes.

My partner and I have:

VENUS conj. VENUS conj. his DC conj. my IC
opposite my NESSUS/NN conj. his ASC

We have been together 3 and a half years, and still adore each other like the day we met.

posted May 18, 2015 03:56 AM            

you may also be interested in iQ's interpretation of Cancer NESSUS retrograde.

Gabby and I both have this.

iQ states this position indicates abuse in the home by those supposed to nurture the native.

This interpretation makes perfect sense in both cases, as has been documented on here in our threads.

posted May 18, 2015 08:40 AM            

I call things as I see them because that is the single thing that will heal people.

If people have a placement like Nessus conjunct the ASC etc, I call it as I see it.

That person will, likely, be an abuser but he MAY learn from that, if he has a true relationship with God.

I have not seen it but I am sure it exists.

I will never water down how I do Astrology, for no one, ever.

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posted May 18, 2015 10:21 AM            

it is not accurate to discount others' experiences because they may require a revision of your perception.

That is misleading yourself, and those you read for.

If I thought for one minute astrology was as black and white as this, I'd quit on it.

You constantly talk about having Jung conjunct the Sun - was he this black and white?

No. He was curious until the day he died, despite his enormous understanding and knowledge.

posted May 18, 2015 10:33 AM            

Anyhoo, you take care and I will leave your thread.

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posted May 18, 2015 11:10 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ami Anne:
Jung would NEVER compromise. Trust me.

Anyhoo, you take care and I will leave your thread.

---

We weren't discussing compromise, we were discussing the nature of knowledge, which is to grow.

If you read him, you will see the growth.

posted May 18, 2015 12:03 PM            

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posted May 18, 2015 01:20 PM            

You said yourself, it is not in your nature to stand up for yourself, you are hardly in a position to suggest that I walk away from any thread.

Walk into the fire, come out stronger, then we can talk about walking.

In the meantime, this thread is about NESSUS.

We disagree. No problem.

posted May 18, 2015 01:58 PM            

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posted May 18, 2015 02:50 PM            

that isn't what I meant.
I know you were abused, that has nothing to do with this conversation.

You brought a VERY sensitive thread into this conversation and implied I should have slunk away into a corner while my mental capacity was torn to shreds.

The Childhood Sexual Abuse thread went FAR beyond anyone "pulling my string".

Don't insult me, you haven't earned that right.

And quit attempting to hijack my thread by bringing up VERY sensitive and FRESH issues from elsewhere on the forum.

posted May 18, 2015 02:53 PM            

What was it you said, that you just deleted?

"Walk into the fire?????

My mother molested me, is that enough fire for you???"

(That's it in bold, just in case anyone comes along and thinks I am talking to myself, or upset about nothing.)

You are very, very manipulative Ami.

And considering what you watched me go through in Sweet Peas today and yesterday, downright nasty.