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Author Topic:   Nessus–The Abusive Relationship as Purifier
Ami Anne
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posted August 26, 2015 09:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My clients are my teachers. I consider it a great honor that they allow me into their lives and their most private thoughts. I form my theories based on them, myself and the charts. There is not much written about asteroids, so one is a sort of intrepid explorer. I explore the asteroids that resonate with me the most.

Nessus is the abuser. We all have one. Dejanira is the victim. We all have one. The asteroids are very personal to each natal chart. They are very personal to each relationship. If a person does not have a prominent Nessus in the natal chart, she will experience Nessus in synastry. This is true for all asteroids. Hence, one can experience them through relationships.

I have come to know when a client has a Nessus/Deja relationship. She will call me “unglued”. She will be desperate to get the man. She will feel that she will die if she doesn’t.The urgency tells me that it is a Nessus/Deja relationship. I have always been right, so far.

I will look at the chart and his Nessus will be conjunct her ASC, Sun, Moon, Venus, Mars or DSC, usually. Deja will be involved too. These asteroids seem to work in a pair, like a tag team. I may get the client while she is in the throes of a Nessus/Deja relationship. I may get the client after it is over. In this case, the client is much wiser. That is the subject of this article.

I used to think that people should run from Nessus/Deja relationships. However, they would not. They could not. The power is too overwhelming. Picture the sexy vampire in a movie. You want him to take the girl. You know it is going to happen. It is inevitable. That is the feeling of a Nessus/Deja relationship. The passion must run it’s course. There is nothing I, or anyone, can say to stop it. I know from experience, as I know most of the things I write about.

Once the passion cools, the Nessus/Deja relationship seems to fall to ashes. The people wonder how they were so bewitched. They are in a stunned state of disbelief. Many have lost things that were important to them, such as money and possessions. If not, many have lost other relationships with people who warned them, but they would not listen.

I missed my central point which was how Nessus/Deja relationships can be purifying. They seem to be very, very purifying. This surprised me. I did not come to this conclusion until I had enough experience counseling people. Now, I see that these relationships are life changing. The person is burned, as if from an actual fire. A fire can burn away dross. The Bible talks about this. We will lose all our material possessions and all out ego achievements when we die. We come to God with only the good deeds we did out of a pure heart.

In the same way, a Nessus/Deja relationship will burn off ego layers. Let me say this. The pain will be incredible. You will feel as if you have a knife in your guts. You will cry as if your heart is breaking. The tears will be like fire. However, after it all, you will be changed. The change could never come by talk therapy, meditation or any New Age methods. The change has come from pure upheaval of your ego.

Ego reduction is the worst sort of pain. It feels as if one is melting. Most people will avoid this pain. However, the pull of the Nessus/Dejanira relationship makes it impossible to leave, just like the kiss of the vampire.

My conclusion is that one must respect the power of these relationships. They have a power unlike little else. Should I person walk away? I will let you be the judge.

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Belage
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posted August 27, 2015 11:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you, Ami for sharing your thoughts on this asteroid pair with us. I can see a progression on how you used to relate to the Nessus-Dejanira placements.

In my own chart, Nessus and Dejanira are insignificant. I tested your theory by looking up my aspects with someone responsible for one the most painful relationships I ever had. In synastry, our Nessus Dejanira contacts were insignificant. However in the composite, we had an exact opposition of Nessus and Dejanira.

I am totally over him now and I wish him well. Yes it was very purifying experience of the most unpleasant kind, like going through a fire.

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Belage
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posted August 27, 2015 11:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I just wanted to add that there was no physical violence, or verbal abuse in this relationship. Just total psychological pain.

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Ami Anne
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posted August 27, 2015 11:32 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks Belage!

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DopGang
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posted August 27, 2015 11:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I had the works in my relationship. Psychological, sexual (her rx mars in my 8th), physical. It was crazy.

But as you say, it did kind of purify me and make me stronger.

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Ami Anne
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posted August 27, 2015 12:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yea, Dop

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Belage
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posted August 27, 2015 01:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ami, have you also checked what can be learned from Heracles's position in the chart?

Imo, looking at Nessus-Dejanira as a pair leaves out an equally important third party, Heracles. After all, it was not a pair, it was a triangle. In the composite with the person I mentioned above, Heracles is square the Nessus Dejanira opposition!!

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Gabby
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posted August 27, 2015 01:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gabby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Belage:
Ami, have you also checked what can be learned from Heracles's position in the chart?

Imo, looking at Nessus-Dejanira as a pair leaves out an equally important third party, Heracles. After all, it was not a pair, it was a triangle. In the composite with the person I mentioned above, Heracles is square the Nessus Dejanira opposition!!


How do you feel they, the 3 work together in a chart?

Hercules(5143)-Dejanira(157)-Nessus(7066)

I ask because I have these aspects with an ex...

My Dejanira virgo@15
His Hercules pisces@16
His Nessus gemini@14
My Psyche gemini@15

Our 7th house comp-
Juno gem@20
Vertex gem@21
Saturn gem@22
Dejanira gem@20
Nessus gem@23
Making a grand trine with....
Comp Sun aqua@19(in his Sun/Moon midpoint)
Comp Uranus libra@20(on my anti-Vertex)
My Vertex aries@21 makes a kite....
His Vertex leo@21 makes another kite...

Comp Hercules pisces@10.33
His NN pisces@10.25

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DopGang
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posted August 27, 2015 01:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Belage:
Ami, have you also checked what can be learned from Heracles's position in the chart?

Imo, looking at Nessus-Dejanira as a pair leaves out an equally important third party, Heracles. After all, it was not a pair, it was a triangle. In the composite with the person I mentioned above, Heracles is square the Nessus Dejanira opposition!!


Hmmm... Excellent point!
I wonder what it would signify.

Perhaps nessus is the sign and place that the abuse happens and Hercules is the sign/house where the sort of "death/rebirth", purifying, growth happens?
Nessus is the means?
Dejanira is why it happens, where we are victimized, and allow the abuse unintentionally?
LOL

Idk. 😕

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DopGang
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posted August 27, 2015 01:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hmm.

Nessus cancer, conjunct Mc (9th house side)

Dejanira 1st house

Hercules 8th house

I'll have to think about that. LOL

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Ami Anne
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posted August 27, 2015 01:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I never did Hercules in the chart, B. I am just scanning this thread and trying to do a chart, so forgive me if I missed something. How do YOU see Hercules in the chart? Thanks

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Gabby
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posted August 27, 2015 01:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gabby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DopGang:
Hmmm... Excellent point!
I wonder what it would signify.

Perhaps nessus is the sign and place that the abuse happens and Hercules is the sign/house where the sort of "death/rebirth", purifying, growth happens?
Nessus is the means?
Dejanira is why it happens, where we are victimized, and allow the abuse unintentionally?
LOL

Idk. 😕


That's a great thought and very interesting Dop!!

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Belage
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posted August 27, 2015 02:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Heracles, Nessus and Dejanira were part of a mythological triangle so we have to go back to mythology to understand the significance.

There were different versions/myths of Dejanira, but in the one where she is violated by Nessus, she is actually rescued by Heracles who shoots Nessus with a poisoned arrow. As Nessus lay dying, he tricks Dejanira once more. He persuades her that if she saves some of his blood and rubs it on Heracles, she will ensure that Heracles will be faithful to her. The background of the story is that Heracles has been notoriously unfaithful to previous wives and will possibly be unfaithful to Dejanira. Anyway, Dejanira believes Nessus (don't know why) and at one point later, she had philandering Heracles put on a tunic that had Nessus' blood on it, and Heracles is burned by the poisoned blood and dies. Dejanira then commits suicide.

Yeah, I know, very gory and sad tale.

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Belage
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posted August 27, 2015 02:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
In that triangle involving Heracles, Nessus and Dejanira, everybody dies. So in a way, nothing of permanence comes out of it. Except for the purification of death. Relationships that have these strong aspects are very painful, deathly painful, but ultimately are not meant to last.

Dejanira's character is complex. She is supposed to be raped or violated by Nessus, yet she trusts what he says to her on his dying bed. Which leads me to believe that she must have had some feelings for Nessus and was not the total victim that is portrayed. Perhaps she enjoyed the "ravishment" Nessus provided, as a counterfoil to the insecurity of being the wife of a philandering Heracles. That would explain a lot of the emotional complexity of Nessus Dejanira relationships, and the compulsive aspects of it.

I am not quite sure how Heracles fits in because I am just beginning to explore this. Perhaps he represents the way out of the Nessus-dejanira pair. But does he? He kills Nessus. but in the end, Nessus blood kills him... go figure. I think it's worth exploring what he adds to our learning.

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DopGang
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posted August 27, 2015 02:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
And Zeus, if I'm recalling this correctly, warned Hercules that he would be killed by an enemy who is dead. (Nessus)

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Ami Anne
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posted August 27, 2015 02:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Great summary. Thanks, B!

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Belage
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posted August 27, 2015 02:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DopGang:
And Zeus, if I'm recalling this correctly, warned Hercules that he would be killed by an enemy who is dead. (Nessus)

Interesting. A dead enemy killing you sounds like something Pluto would do. There is a very strong Plutonian quality to Nessus.

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Gabby
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posted August 27, 2015 03:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gabby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DopGang:
And Zeus, if I'm recalling this correctly, warned Hercules that he would be killed by an enemy who is dead. (Nessus)

Weird...

My Zues virgo@16.49 (h42)
My Dejanira virgo@15.18
His Hercules pisces@16.48
His Nessus gemini@14.01

Comp Zues virgo@12.55
Comp Hercules pisces@10.33
His NN pisces@10.25

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Gabby
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posted August 27, 2015 03:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gabby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Belage:
Heracles, Nessus and Dejanira were part of a mythological triangle so we have to go back to mythology to understand the significance.

There were different versions/myths of Dejanira, but in the one where she is violated by Nessus, she is actually rescued by Heracles who shoots Nessus with a poisoned arrow. As Nessus lay dying, he tricks Dejanira once more. He persuades her that if she saves some of his blood and rubs it on Heracles, she will ensure that Heracles will be faithful to her. The background of the story is that Heracles has been notoriously unfaithful to previous wives and will possibly be unfaithful to Dejanira. Anyway, Dejanira believes Nessus (don't know why) and at one point later, she had philandering Heracles put on a tunic that had Nessus' blood on it, and Heracles is burned by the poisoned blood and dies. Dejanira then commits suicide.

Yeah, I know, very gory and sad tale.


Wow!! That's so sad....what if all this had played out, we both nearly did commit suicide from the pain of it and then slowly recovered and remained very close?
Could the purification lead to anything else?

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Belage
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posted August 27, 2015 04:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gabby:
Wow!! That's so sad....what if all this had played out, we both nearly did commit suicide from the pain of it and then slowly recovered and remained very close?
Could the purification lead to anything else?


I am not sure how to answer that question. I would guess it would depend on the people involved...

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hypatia238
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posted August 27, 2015 06:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Belage:
In that triangle involving Heracles, Nessus and Dejanira, everybody dies. So in a way, nothing of permanence comes out of it. Except for the purification of death. Relationships that have these strong aspects are very painful, deathly painful, but ultimately are not meant to last.

Dejanira's character is complex. She is supposed to be raped or violated by Nessus, yet she trusts what he says to her on his dying bed. Which leads me to believe that she must have had some feelings for Nessus and was not the total victim that is portrayed. Perhaps she enjoyed the "ravishment" Nessus provided, as a counterfoil to the insecurity of being the wife of a philandering Heracles. That would explain a lot of the emotional complexity of Nessus Dejanira relationships, and the compulsive aspects of it.

I am not quite sure how Heracles fits in because I am just beginning to explore this. Perhaps he represents the way out of the Nessus-dejanira pair. But does he? He kills Nessus. but in the end, Nessus blood kills him... go figure. I think it's worth exploring what he adds to our learning.


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hypatia238
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posted August 27, 2015 06:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Belage:
Ami, have you also checked what can be learned from Heracles's position in the chart?

Imo, looking at Nessus-Dejanira as a pair leaves out an equally important third party, Heracles. After all, it was not a pair, it was a triangle. In the composite with the person I mentioned above, Heracles is square the Nessus Dejanira opposition!!


Oh wow then you had a composite TSQUARE!!

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hypatia238
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posted August 27, 2015 09:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gabby:
Wow!! That's so sad....what if all this had played out, we both nearly did commit suicide from the pain of it and then slowly recovered and remained very close?
Could the purification lead to anything else?

This is a hypothetical question right?

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Gabby
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posted August 27, 2015 10:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gabby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
No...I had a relationship like this.

My Zues virgo@16.49 (h42)
My Dejanira virgo@15.18
His Hercules pisces@16.48
His Nessus gemini@14.01

Comp Zues virgo@12.55
Comp Hercules pisces@10.33
His NN pisces@10.25

Our 7th house comp-
Juno gem@20
Vertex gem@21
Saturn gem@22
Dejanira gem@20
Nessus gem@23
Making a grand trine with....
Comp Sun aqua@19(in his Sun/Moon midpoint)
Comp Uranus libra@20(on my anti-Vertex)
My Vertex aries@21 makes a kite....
His Vertex leo@21 makes another kite...

And it nearly killed us both, the intensity was beyond crazy and what happened was a massive catipult for healing some of my deepest wounds. I was already so far down and that relationship pushed me to my lowest depth.

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hypatia238
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posted August 27, 2015 11:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gabby:
No...I had a relationship like this.

My Zues virgo@16.49 (h42)
My Dejanira virgo@15.18
His Hercules pisces@16.48
His Nessus gemini@14.01

Comp Zues virgo@12.55
Comp Hercules pisces@10.33
His NN pisces@10.25

Our 7th house comp-
Juno gem@20
Vertex gem@21
Saturn gem@22
Dejanira gem@20
Nessus gem@23
Making a grand trine with....
Comp Sun aqua@19(in his Sun/Moon midpoint)
Comp Uranus libra@20(on my anti-Vertex)
My Vertex aries@21 makes a kite....
His Vertex leo@21 makes another kite...

And it nearly killed us both, the intensity was beyond crazy and what happened was a massive catipult for healing some of my deepest wounds. I was already so far down and that relationship pushed me to my lowest depth.


Holy Cow Gabby, quite a mix you got there..

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