posted June 30, 2015 02:44 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aubyanne:
Hmm. That's curious, Lee. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

I'll have to find why it is that iQ relates it to the past / soul. My reasons are different, but similar. His explanation is that it's what is 'static' within us -- that comes in with us -- inborn, in a sense. That the sidereal will give way to the tropical over time -- rather than the opposite.

Why do you feel it's future-oriented?

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In fact, you are right, it is a past/future continuum, sidereal is like a soul print trying to reach manifestation in the more "earthy" charts.
I do believe sidereal astrology belongs to the future though, so I think the connections sidereal/tropical are future oriented. But if two or more people travel in the future together, they most certainly have done so for many lifetimes; so they will have both past life connections, and future life connections.

------------------
I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted June 30, 2015 03:20 PM            

I think this is what I may be trying to articulate:

from iQ (here: http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/203274.html)

'I am inclined to agree with Blaschke, as there is a pattern of event completion when a planet's sidereal position reaches the tropical position. You will notice this in a simple way: Visualization/Manifestation exercises.

Emotional Reality Visualizations for simple things in life will occur within 2 days because the Sidereal Moon reaches the tropical point in 2 days [24 degrees approx].
Certain material objects desired will take 3-4 weeks, that is the Venus Sidereal coming to Venus Tropical in transit.
Bigger and sincere plans needing hard work will manifest in a couple of years, that is the Saturn movement of 24 degrees.

Again, this is from my personal experience that helped me understand Blaschke's theories.'

posted June 30, 2015 05:47 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Peluches:

07° SAG 28' : his dVENUS
08° SAG 42' : my nPLUTO

08° VIR 28' : my nVENUS
08° VIR 47' : his sPLUTO

07° SAG 33' : our vVENUS ?

His dASC is also involved, as well as other asteroids, but I've not yet checked whether they repeat themselves.

Thanks.

---

Thanks, Pel. I've been formulating this one for a long time. It's taken a lot of work, research, meditation, and understanding of many disparate concepts which, according to my bizarre brain, felt finally able to lock together and work in synthesis. We'll see, eh?

Okay, well, in terms of a pattern, I'm not quite sure; there might be a beginning of one. The future-direction of his VENUS -- personal love and the concept of beauty, which can include art and aesthetics -- is affected by PLUTO -- your natural (and generational) ability to transform or regenerate; his aesthetics could go through a rebirth, or his concept of art may undergo a transformation of some sort through your association.

I'm not sure what might be underlying his VENUS, however, or what karmic or multidimensional pattern may exist beneath it which he's either moving towards (Draco) or that remains from the past (sidereal) likely needing healing or, at the very least, completion of a cycle.

While these synastric aspects are hardly useless in and of themselves -- and do denote the likelihood of something either from the past (sidereal-tropical) or preparing for future development (tropical-Draco) we can't know their importance or multidimensional significance without first identifying natal correspondence or transposition.

Simply stated: unless a point is transposed, it carries no multidimensional weight. As such, we can instead attribute a soulful relationship: one soul is offering guidance in a particular area to another. Whether this is a 'new meeting' for future development, or a continuation from the past through other dimensional relationships, we can't say.

Let's look at my boyfriend's SATURN again. There's a growth-oriented, future-directed energy underlying it due to the conjunction with his sidereal NNODE. Here we have a complex mix of energies: past (SATURN, sidereal point conjunction) and future (NNODE) existing simultaneously in the present (tropical). Were it say, MERC, it wouldn't have this automatic relationship -- but it's SATURN which innately denotes karma, and even time itself.

But it doesn't stop there.

His tropical SATURN is also in a future-oriented superposition, by way of the energy of Draco TISIPHONE-HADES. And yet, like a boomerang, we get slammed back again into the past -- potentially even further back this time -- given how HADES represents deep karma. HADES is also a multidimensional point given its being Transneptunian; it is already very much 'at home' with existing in multiple dimensions of time. And so we're able to glean that the energy of TISIPHONE shares this innate quality, creating a kind of 'multidimensional vengeance'. Were that all HADES were about, we might even muse that it's some sort of mark of one who 'avenges' temporal aberrations. But HADES is more faceted than that, incurring a relationship to criminality, that which is sinister and 'evil'. TISIPHONE/HADES then might relate to a vengeful nature against that which is deemed 'evil' or sinister -- potentially.

So there's a very locked pattern between these three, existing simultaneously in the past, present, and future by way of the energetic display. SATURN (present-past) to sNNODE (past-future), and dTISIPHONE/dHADES (future-past).

... Yeesh!

Oh, and don't get me started on his TARDIS-DNA. It transposes to his sidereal ASC. TARDIS is a fascinating point which I've discovered operates a bit like HADES without the basis in deep karma. Rather, it acts as a temporal bridge; in some cases, the only way we're able to observe multiple eigenstates. Still existing or 'based' in one, but able to experience / travel to others ongoing, either as a means of information-gathering, or for some greater purpose.

This superposition tells me a lot about his basic energy, actually: underlying his tropical TARDIS-DNA is a direct relationship to the very approach he took, and lens through which he experienced the past. A part of his intrinsic essence, no doubt, (being conjunct DNA) which directly described the 'face he showed the world'. (And I may have just received a strange confirmation that that was true. We'll see.)

Hardly surprising it's in his tropical 12H, either; almost a remnant of his 'prior existence' when viewed via the sidereal. This may even be a latent ability, locked away in the 12H. As it was once such a central part of his being, one has to wonder if it shouldn't be reintegrated somehow. Let's not forget the man has a 0º00 NNODE conjunct SCHRODINGER in tropical! There are few more blatant ways to have the multiverse shouting, 'multidimensionality is crucial to your soul's evolution!' Which, really, got me started on this whole thing THIS seriously and in-depth. Too many experiences of such a nature with him that my traditional science could NOT explain.

Now, when we're discussing patterns across time, so to speak, I've got a theory when there isn't a point which links two sidereal-Draco point in one's tropical. Naturally, TARDIS, incredibly bridging energy that it is, might have the answer there. It might.

His sidereal TARDIS goes to 18º LIBRA, which is conjunct his Draco NEPTUNE. And, a-bloody-gain, we've got time getting all, erm -- wibbly-wobbly -- in his natal. NEPTUNE is 12H, no matter how it's sliced, and carries with it 'past' energy with relationship to karma. So his dNEPTUNE is doing quite a lot, pulling sidereal TARDIS into the future -- even though it's a bit locked into the past somewhat; a tad 'stuck', if you will.

Mind, it's sidereal TARDIS, so it's carrying with it karmic influences, past connexions, and 'that which came before' when viewed via the tropical.

... but there's nothing IN the tropical!

Not a single thing!

We can't view his TARDIS correspondences via the present, because it has no present correspondence! It's quite strong in both past AND future contexts, but unreachable via the present! A pity, too, because I've not found much outside of it and MADHATTER to carry true multidimensionality WITH the ability to bridge temporal states. But, of course, I'm still looking. (INTERKOSMOS seems hopeful; HEKATE might be, too. We'll see.)

What do you do with TARDIS in the past, and TARDIS in the future (which, curiously, IS linked to TARDIS in the past -- 12 dNEPTUNE conjunct sTARDIS) with no TARDIS in the present?

... You could, theoretically, have someone with their natal tropical SUN there to 'bridge' the temporal gap.

Thus the circuit is completed -- albeit through synastry -- but ONLY because there's a DIRECT relationship from a sidereal point to a Draco point in the natal alone.

And we end up with:

sTARDIS conjunct SUN conjunct dNEPTUNE

My SUN is 2H, too, which is the house of Soulmate Relationships. Being that it's his sidereal TARDIS to my tropical SUN, one has to wonder if there's a completion of karma going on; where something central to my identity and the very nature of my being was contracted to recreate his multidimensional nature and bridge the temporal gap. I get that feeling, given it's rounded off by his Draconic NEPTUNE -- in his 12H, and my 2H.

Something rather lovely about that.

posted July 01, 2015 01:21 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Aubyanne:
Lee,

I think this is what I may be trying to articulate:

from iQ (here: http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/203274.html)

'I am inclined to agree with Blaschke, as there is a pattern of event completion when a planet's sidereal position reaches the tropical position. You will notice this in a simple way: Visualization/Manifestation exercises.

Emotional Reality Visualizations for simple things in life will occur within 2 days because the Sidereal Moon reaches the tropical point in 2 days [24 degrees approx].
Certain material objects desired will take 3-4 weeks, that is the Venus Sidereal coming to Venus Tropical in transit.
Bigger and sincere plans needing hard work will manifest in a couple of years, that is the Saturn movement of 24 degrees.

Again, this is from my personal experience that helped me understand Blaschke's theories.'

The bit of that which really 'speaks to me' is [b]pattern completion. It's as if the sidereal is moving towards the tropical. I've noticed myself the sense of 'pattern completion' in this regard, which strikes me as more of something from the 'past' manifesting / materialising / completing in the 'present'.[/B]

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Very nice explanation, Auby, because I believe everything incarnates in the tropical, every other type of chart converges towards it: it's the result in this life, in this time and space, of all influences from past and future.

------------------
I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted July 02, 2015 05:27 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by alegna:
Hi Auby, I've been checking your theories out, using my own chart, and that of my s.o. I noticed something really interesting.
My sidereal ascendant is EXACTLY, to minute of arc, conjunct his draco ascendant.What do you think that might represent?

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That's fascinating! My dASC is 0°05 conjunct his MOON. I do feel these very close synastric transpositions have great meaning. And I have a new budding theory.

Taking into account what Lee said, I agree that we must always launch from the tropical, so to speak. It's the Now; it's all we have. Thus, sidereal is the past we are extrapolating upon -- regardless of content, context, or even chronology -- with the Draconic representing the future we perpetually move towards, projecting upon it the fears and hopes of today.

The sidereal need not be distant, however. The second which just passed is recent memory, though past; though, curiously, not as strong in my mind as certain events even fifteen years ago. The principle of salience orders this sort of categorisation -- and hierarchy. Thus, I'd hesitate to feel the sidereal is a true 'snapshot' of the 'past' intact and complete. However, should anything of it superposit upon a tropical point, it's infused with its 'memory' and experiences.

The Draco, on the other hand, is altogether different. Being the Rahu chart, essentially derived from the NNODE directly, is our soul's 'future' plan when viewed from the vantage of the tropical. But, upon my research, I began to wonder if we might not go a step further -- towards healing.

Perhaps, cultivated with the powerfully transformative and growth-oriented NNODE energy, points that are Draconic superpositioned (corresponding to a conjunction between tropical and Draco) -- could we not imagine that there's a kind of forward-directed, positive, growing and evolving energy attached? That, when it locks into a tropical point, the present is motivated -- even drawn -- into the future?

Were I to be so bold, I'd say that's exactly been my experience with my dMOON conjunct his SUN. He's nearing 50 now, and is only very recently getting a real insight into the solar Cancerian gig. Far be it from me to teach a Cancerian how to be such, and yet, it's through my love, nurturing, protection, guidance, and deep intuition that he's felt safe enough to be vulnerable long enough to explore his own long-since disowned emotions. And, by also allowing myself to be vulnerable, emotional, insecure, and a tad moody, he has just as immediately risen to the occasion, displaying support, stability, devotion, and great empathy. We're introverted homebodies who really do generate a lot of lunar energy together.

Which is a bit funny, with my being a lunar Scorp and solar Libran; he's got an ARIES MOON, besides! I'd never truly seen him be even remotely Cancerian until quite recently. And he fully 'credited' (or was it blamed?) me for being responsible for his transformation underway. He'd never fallen in love before, or desired to feel domestic and romantically devoted. And I've never thought of myself as a lunar Cancerian. A few of my very dear friends are; I've always felt we're still night-and-day. Because we are. It's only him why really brings that energy about.

Now, that's Draco -- where we're 'going'. When a tropical point becomes attached to a Draco point, it begins an evolutionary transformation to embody more of the Draconic traits.

But this is sidereal, which calls back to our 'past' rhythms and experiences. And there's no tropical link to anchor it in time.

You're both related to each other's general outward essence -- approach to the world, and the way it views you. We might even say he's heading where you've been. The trouble is, without a means to manifest it in the present, it's a nebulous idea. He feels powerfully drawn to something that's intrinsic to your nature, because you've been through it so many times; you aspire to something within him that feels like a greater and more complete version of yourself.

But you can't quite realise it. There's no foundational anchor.

Is there, perhaps, a tropical point in either of your natals which can stabilise it?

posted July 02, 2015 09:07 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Aubyanne:

What of a [b]composite point? It's a lovely idea to think that something created only by your energy together can manifest something from your past and his future direction.[/B]

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I think that is really important to check and so undervalued in today`s astrology.
Granted, I only understood the meaning and mechanism of composites myself when reading the book by David Cochrane, which was a real eyeopener in terms of the underlying net and interconnection between natals and composites.

Nevertheless what I want to say is that I would now always pay extra-attention to those synastric superpositions which are also conjunct a composite-planet. it`s just awesome to see that coming together.
(you have to include the oppositions here, too, though, as composite planets are actually midpoints and those are always on an axis, though we could debate about the comparision between near and far midpoint of course.).

In our case there is a bit of an onesided thingy, as c-Valentine is exact on his natal Uranus on 23 Scorpio, while I don`t have anything on 23 Scorpio exact.
(in the composite his name asteroid is conjunct c-Uranus by one degree, too, though it just seems so fitting that he delivers the Uranus-vibe, possibly because or after his own Uranus has been activated by that shared Valentine-thing. Or it is his Uranus-side that is actually activating the Valentine much to both our surprise. Almost like something detonating and us then looking at each other and saying both after a stunned silence: "YOU? I did not expect YOU!"

however, then there is c-DNA on 20 Scorpio and c-ALMA on 20 Taurus (pulling in c-LUST and c-ANGEL on 22 Scorpio and c-JUNO on 22 Taurus).

Why is that even important? Well of course it is a pretty obvious composite-stellium, and those ALWAYS want to tell us something. So what does this one want to point out, where does it want to turn our attention to?
What is going on synastrically?

Well what is going on in tropical is this:

my ANTEROS 19 Scorpio
my PENELOPE 21 Scorpio
my ODYSSEUS 21 Taurus
my CHILD 19 Taurus

his VALENTINE 19 Scorpio
his ODYSSEUS 19 Scorpio

underneath or overlaying these are:

his Dr Pluto 20 Taurus
his Dr ANTEROS 20 Taurus

my Dr PRIAPUS 19°59 Scorpio
my Dr ANUBIS 18 Taurus

interestingly there is a noteable empty space in sidereal at these 20 degree of Taurus-Scorpio, like a black hole.

we have some superpositions around 15/16 Scorpio/Taurus, and then starting again at about 25/26 Scorpio, but nothing right there. Funny isn`t it?

posted July 02, 2015 09:36 AM            

But truth is, looking back on our history of the recent years, even though I was not able to see it or respond in a normal way, he was always very nice and kind to me, he never quite rejected me (of course I never really gave him a real chance to do so either, by just assuming he would ).

But that`s always been a problem for me anyway, not just in terms of him, but generally assuming anyone I like WOULD reject me (Even doing so politely), so the solution was to simply never admit liking anyone at all. No matter how much I did.
Which does not really is a progressive way of living. lol
More the ivory-tower-kind.
Thinking that if you don´t play, you cannot lose, not realizing that you have already lost by NOT playing at all!

Funny enough, I think in my own very reserved way I changed a little and it became obvious that I indeed like him (still using the very general phrase here, and doing so deliberately. I am still a coward after all. lol); and no the world did not crash down and covered me beneath it, no dragon spittin fire appeared (though Mrs X came pretty near to it, though looking more like an ice-queen than a fiery dragon, a sulking ice-queen actually).
But the weirdest funniest thing about is, that I still can`t wrap my mind around, not only he seems to at least have gotten a bit of a hunch that my bizarre behaviour was not really meant as a rejection but had more to do with my silly insecure shy irrational personality (I wonder if that is not worse actually! ), but he seems to be pretty happy about it.
Which surprises and amazes me.

It is still just very "general", but for me that had been quite a leap. And I had not expected such a positive reaction. (I had expected not-noticing, because it did not matter to him, but he surely noticed, no doubt about that. lol)

posted July 02, 2015 12:42 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Aubyanne:
Thanks, Pel. I've been formulating this one for a long time. It's taken a lot of work, research, meditation, and understanding of many disparate concepts which, according to my bizarre brain, felt finally able to lock together and work in synthesis. We'll see, eh?

---

Wow ! What a story ! Thank you, Aub.

There's something I thought of while contemplating your NN/SAT/HADES-TISIPHONE interaction : taking into consideration what I've gathered about your boyfriend, wouldn't it also be fitting to interpret his SATURN as a repressing force (for the present lifetime) of the multidimensional cycle of violence you discovered ? Correct me if I'm wrong, but, from what I've read, I don't believe these energies of his have ever played out in this present reincarnation. Besides, you'd always have his sidereal NN as a sort of 'multidimensional marker' to this linkage.

As to mine, well, I did find this :

22° LIB 49' : my sidereal MERCURY
24° LIB 18' : my natal SUN
22° LIB 28' : my draconic VERTEX

24° LIB 15' : his sidereal VERTEX
18° LIB 05' : his natal MARS
19° LIB 45' : his natal URANUS

24° LIB 26' : our natal IC
24° LIB 30' : our draconic MARS

Ugh. That's also on Mr. Scorp's skipped step, MARS-URANUS. (NN at 20° CAP 02'.) Not to mention, my SUN's position has always been sensitive ; it was right on my mother's VX and exactly conjunct our cMARS-PLUTO. She's also been playing an important role in every one of my ... 'exchanges' with Mr. Scorp, and unfortunately, most of the time involving MARS/PLUTO stuff. These involve a definite link to our present lifetime's MERCURY, although I didn't notice it in the abovementioned list. (Mr. Scorp does have his VX on my MERC, though. And on the cMARS.)

Could it be that the past MERC-VX issues remained unsolved and were carried to this lifetime ? It seems they have, and perhaps also intertwined with my mother. Maybe I'll have to include her placements.

posted July 02, 2015 04:58 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by alegna:
Hi Auby. Yes. My sidereal asc and his draco asc, conj Is opposed my natal sun and his natal neptune/alma conjuntion- 1 degree orb.

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posted July 02, 2015 05:27 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by alegna:
Which would mean my natal sun and his natal neptune/alma are conjunct my sidereal decendant and his draco desendant, wouldn't it?

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That's where there might be a stronger link, yes. I'm presently investigating the potential for a link to be made via synastry from one point in the tropical to other points across the sidereal and Draco. It's a work-in-progress, however, and I've not tested it with anything outside of points that possess verified temporal significance.

For example, I'd love to know that a light is capable of carrying the same weight as a temporal point -- but I just can't say for sure. Not yet. More research is warranted.

Now, let's break down what this might mean.

Your tropical SUN carries with it energy of your 'past DSC' -- relationships, especially those of a committed, even legal, nature. No doubt, you would be carrying some bit of unresolved business, or something intrinsic to these past experiences or commitments. Now, the fact that his Draconic DSC is also conjunct this point? Interesting. You may feel his concept of committed relationships is 'pulling' your SUN (identity, ego, sense of self) into a future relationship or association.

SUN-ALMA is a very deep connexion, too; that's here in the present, being a tropical conjunction. The fact that we see it relates to your past concept of a relationship, with his future concept of a relationship might -- though I hesitate when I say this, as, again, MUCH needs to be researched first in this area -- but it may indicate the presence of a loop. Closer, in-depth analysis is needed to arrive at that conclusion.

I say this because you are both contributing to this connexion HERE, through SUN-ALMA. However, you're also both related to two opposite temporal directions: past and future.

I'm not sure what to make of this yet. It's as if you're pulling from the past -- you might have memories, dreams, recalls and experiences -- and he's drawn towards the future.

I'm going to make a cursory 'diagnosis', that a relationship might prove healing, or merely completing, to your sidereal DSC, as it lingers behind your SUN and his ALMA.

The bigger question is WHY is it infusing your SUN? What about your sidereal DSC is 'hanging onto' your SUN? Is it? Or is it just 'echoes' of the past?

posted July 02, 2015 06:53 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by alegna:
Sorry. My sideral asc , his draco asc, natal neptune and natal alma, are 1 degree aquarius. My natal sun is 1 degree leo.

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So, we've got:

1º AQU | sASC (you)
1º AQU | dASC (him)
1º AQU | ALMA-NEP (him)

posted July 02, 2015 07:07 PM            

Other possible significant connections i;ve found are my draco mars at 1 aqua, my draco aphrodite on 6 aqua,His draco chiron on 29 cancer, his draco pluto close , at 3 leo

posted July 02, 2015 07:38 PM            

So, then let's take the LEO points into consideration, given we are dealing with an axis.

1º LEO | sDSC (you)
1º LEO | dDSC (him)
1º LEO | SUN (you)

Your SUN still contains the aforementioned DESCENDANT energy, from your 'past', which connects to future energy he's cultivating in this area -- or needs to, or is seeking to do so.

LUST there is intriguing. A LUST-SUN tends to be very vivacious and deeply connected to the wilder energies of the human experience. 'Lust for life' we might say -- the joie de vivre.

Since your sidereal DSC relates to your tropical SUN-LUST, there is more than likely the indication of a past relationship of great importance to you contained therein.

posted July 03, 2015 12:59 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by alegna:
I have just found his sidereal spirit is in 0 degrees aqua. It's not one that i use all the time , but was checking. lol .

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A-ha! SPIRIT (37452) is definitely a good one to use! Especially in these sorts of synastries. So, there we go. That helps to complete the circuit.