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Author
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Topic: Lilith in Synastry
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MyVirgoMask
Knowflake Posts: 3671
From: Bay Area, CA
Registered: May 2009
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posted May 11, 2010 08:15 PM
  
Interesting point about the media, Benedict.
Right on target with what I was thinking as well, actually. Reclaiming sexuality has become a trend lol
I guess there are worse trends but it's almost like it goes against the whole point of the thing anyway. You don't tell people what to reclaim. They do it on their terms, right? IP: Logged |
Benedict Moon*
Knowflake Posts: 2791
From: Avendesora
Registered: May 2009
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posted May 11, 2010 08:34 PM
Yeah, don't get me wrong...I'm sure for some people out there taking control of their sexuality is a very real Lilith issue for them (like those who have been sexually abused or repressed). And Jane, I did not mean in anyway to discount your experience.
But when I hear the Lady Gagas, the Beyonces, and the people who blindly follow them talk about how they feel 'empowered' by dressing sexy I just want to roll my eyes. Because for them it's not about that and more about attention or selling their products. That's not Lilith at all.
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Ami Ann
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posted May 11, 2010 08:35 PM
I think Lilith is everything that nice girls should NOT be--angry,lustful,jealous, intense, wanting, needing ,pure want, pure need, pure drive, pure desire, raw passions, raw emotions, nothing refined, nothing polished.
Ami
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Benedict Moon*
Knowflake Posts: 2791
From: Avendesora
Registered: May 2009
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posted May 11, 2010 08:40 PM
Yes, Lilith can be raw and a bit selfish, but it can be a very good rawness and selfishness.
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Ami Ann
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posted May 11, 2010 08:41 PM
Yes--You HAVE to be raw and selfish. Take it from me whose life went down the tubes cuz I could NOT be.
Ami
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DD
Knowflake Posts: 7072
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posted May 12, 2010 01:47 AM
Ami, 
Pluto is concerned with sexuality in the way that transforms you, makes cross your boundaries.
It`s the transformation that matters, and sex is just ONE way to reach it.
And of course Pluto has nothing to do with Venusian or Martian sex for example. IP: Logged |
staborgi
Knowflake Posts: 471
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Registered: Aug 2009
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posted May 12, 2010 02:16 AM
DD
would you mind telling me a little more about how those BML to BML and Mars hard interaspects manifested? Super curiousIP: Logged |
staborgi
Knowflake Posts: 471
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posted May 12, 2010 02:30 AM
Jane- totally agree with your description of Lilith and why those bonds in synastry are so powerful. I remember initially trying to google Lilith in synastry and remember coming across someones post that said they had a Lilith conjunction with someone (her Lilith I believe, can't remember the planet of the other person though :/ might have been sun) and that she never felt so deeply bonded to someone before. Couldn't totally wrap my head around why that would be exactly at the time but getting there now I think! IP: Logged |
Ami Ann
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posted May 12, 2010 05:09 AM
Got it, DD. Thanks for sticking with me x o x Ami
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Ami Ann
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posted May 12, 2010 06:46 AM
Advertisement for Lilith Counseling Center
Does your mind feel like it is walking in old lady shoes???
We understand at Lilith Counseling Center.
Leave those old lady shoes behind.
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DD
Knowflake Posts: 7072
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posted May 12, 2010 07:01 AM
Actually, with the comment about the "old ladies shoes" you hit the target for me, Ami.my most prominent Lilith-experience made me suddenly aware that my life is not over yet and that I must not give up on myself, and that I am actually MORE than just a mind on legs. It sounds banal, but it was a real epiphany to me. IP: Logged |
Ami Ann
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posted May 12, 2010 07:04 AM
Throw out the Old Maine Trotters, DD IP: Logged |
DD
Knowflake Posts: 7072
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posted May 12, 2010 07:07 AM
I did, Ami, or actually I am still doing this. They are kinda sticky and try to get on my feet now and then again.  IP: Logged |
Ami Ann
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posted May 12, 2010 07:08 AM
Those damn things are persistent
 Ami
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DD
Knowflake Posts: 7072
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posted May 12, 2010 07:10 AM
Staborgi,the Lilith-aspects didn`t transfer into any kind of actions, if you mean that.
I can only speak for myself; but it triggered a very visceral response in me, that was intoxicating and compulsive and yet at the same time I felt uncomfortable and very vulnerable about it. And I also felt some sort of hardly to determine "anger" to that instinctive emotional reactions,t hat I seemed to be powerless against, even though these feelings didn`t seem appropriate to me, at least not under these circumstances. IP: Logged |
DD
Knowflake Posts: 7072
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Registered: Apr 2009
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posted May 12, 2010 07:16 AM
Found that excellent (in my opinion) interpretation of Black Moon Lilith in synastry. As a matter of fact I like the whole site.
"Black Moon Lilith is not about any of the above. Her bad reputation may have come about because of her electric magnetism, psychic abilities and power to mesmerize. Obviously, these gifts are wonderful unless they are used for manipulation, mind control and promoting evil deeds. But in herself, she is not “evil.” However, she is bewitching.
Lastly, of course, she is highly sexual. Her sexuality is not primarily used for procreation, which for some religions is deemed as sinful. So, its power can be used for spiritual enlightenment and finding the god/goddess within. This is very threatening for Western religions that place Godliness outside the human body and Mother Earth. This is how Lilith became demonized. Black Moon Lilith
Harmonious Lilith aspects between partners will show how you can bring magic into each other’s life. Like a good Mars/Venus connection, it will show how Tantric your sexual relations could be. It also shows how magnetically attracted you are to each other – the all important chemistry. Hard aspects to the personal planets may show an irresistible, obsessive attraction, the sort that hypnotizes you into abandoning your more regular Moon/domestic commitments. Hence, her reputation as a “bunny boiler.” On the other hand, she can break the spell of entrenched habitual behavior. Therefore, synastry connections with Black Moon Lilith show where you feel this magic and how it plays out. Double whammys (for example, your Lilith aspects their Sun and their Lilith aspects your Sun) are great because they give each partner the opportunity to be “The Lilith,” and that makes them the most powerful of all. Black Moon Lilith/Sun aspects
Harmonious: The Sun partner will flood the Lilith partner with magical sunbeams, amping up their power. The Lilith partner will inspire creativity in the Sun partner, making them feel like a King or Queen.
Stressful: The Sun partner will feel their ego undermined by a manipulative Lilith. Lilith could feel dominated and crushed by a bossy Sun and respond by attempting to darken their light. Black Moon Lilith/Moon aspects
Harmonious: The Moon partner will resonate with the Lilith’s nocturnal magical world, inspiring dreams and heightening their intuition. The Lilith partner will shake the Moon out of bad habits and inspire them to focus on their own magic and not let them get bogged down by domesticity.
Stressful: The Moon partner could smother Lilith’s sexuality and want to tame their animal magnetism. Lilith could manipulate the Moon partner emotionally and tempt them away from domestic responsibilities. Black Moon Lilith/Mercury aspects
Harmonious: The Mercury partner can inspire magic words and poetry from the Lilith partner. The Lilith partner can read the Mercury partner’s mind. Together, they can amplify each other’s psychic abilities and turn each other on with words.
Stressful: The Mercury person could use logic to demean the Lilith person’s intuitive reasoning. The Lilith partner could penetrate and brainwash the Mercury person’s mind. Black Moon Lilith/Venus aspects
Harmonious: The Venus partner will give pure love to Lilith’s raw sexuality, refining to its highest vibration. The Lilith partner can ignite a fire in the Venus partner and push their love to tantric ecstasy.
Stressful: The Venus partner could feel overwhelmed and threatened by the Lilith partner’s powerful sexuality. The Lilith partner may feel trapped by Venusian materialism and be unimpressed by the Venus partner’s weakness for surface beauty and bling! Black Moon Lilith/Mars aspects
Harmonious The Mars partner will be firing on all cylinders from the Lilith’s partners sexual enthusiasm, a recipe for releasing the Kundalini if ever there was one. The Lilith partner will be constantly “on heat” from their ardent Mars partner.
Stressful: The negative side of this contact is if the aspect is not played out sexually. The Mars partner’s rage will be ignited by the Lilith partner, resulting in possible violence or verbal abuse. The Lilith partner’s frustration and sexual jealousy could result in Lilith psychically attacking and directing too much energy toward the Mars partner, draining their own creativity. If played out sexually, it is one that could enflame fiercely, then burn out. Black Moon Lilith/Jupiter aspects
Harmonious: The Jupiter partner will feel spiritualized and uplifted by the Lilith partner. The Lilith partner will feel their magic expanded by the enthusiastic Jupiter partner, and in return will worship them as a God or Goddess!
Stressful: The Jupiter partner may feel constricted by the Lilith partner’s sexual demands. The Lilith partner may feel the Jupiter partner overly judgmental of their wild and less than ecclesiastical behaviour. Black Moon Lilith/Saturn aspects
Harmonious: The Saturn partner feels poetic, loosens up and inspired to break the rules when the Lilith partner waves their magic wand. The Lilith partner crystallizes their magic into solid form, thanks to Saturn’s discipline.
Stressful: The Saturn partner could put the Lilith partner’s sexuality on a leash, constricting them too tightly and thereby trapping their creativity. The Lilith partner may enjoy teasing and tempting the Saturn partner out of their responsibilities – and seducing them away from their work. About the Author
Marina Caruso is an Astrologer and Illustrator. Her work is inspired by symbolism, synchro-mysticism, myths, the fixed stars and constellations, pop culture, psychology and Lilith. Learn more about her at Funkastrology." http://sasstrology.com/2010/03/black-moon-lilith-in-synastry.html Interestingly in the first case I mentioned, whre his Lilith was squaring my Lilith.
His Mars was squaring my True Lilith exactly (and was squaring my Mean Lilith by 4 degrees), and my Mars was conjunct his Mean Lilith exactly.
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DD
Knowflake Posts: 7072
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Registered: Apr 2009
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posted May 12, 2010 07:29 AM
Maybe we could look at Lilith interaspects in relationships?IP: Logged |
jane
Knowflake Posts: 1277
From:
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted May 12, 2010 02:17 PM
BM -
I don't think "claiming sexuality" is a superficial interpretation of BML at all. That phrase may be trite, but that experience, when genuine, is one of the most meaningful and fulfilling experiences someone can have. At least it was for me.
But yeah, like with anything true, that experience can be imitated in a shallow and superficial way that completely misses the point.
For me what happened is that I *finally* felt at home, at all times, with my own sexual power. Before this transit, I had rigid rules for when I felt comfortable feeling that part of myself. It had to be with someone I wanted sexually and who I knew cared about me.
I have Eros in the 4th house cnj my SN. That shows how I like to keep my sexual side safe and secure, underneath the surface.
But then it's gotta go and trine my Asc. My Sco Asc, no less! Fourth house "planets" aren't too fond of that, since the Asc-trine brings out into the open something the house would rather keep private.
There's a lot more that points to being sexually private; there's always a theme when a trait is so pronounced. But that's enough to illustrate what I mean.
So take that need for privacy, and now add WAY TOO MUCH Neptune. On my Sun, trine my Moon, semisquare my ASC. On my 5th house cusp. SN cnj Eros in Pisces. Chart ruling Pluto in my 12th house on my Sun/Moon mp. All of that makes me have the flimsiest boundaries. I feel - viscerally feel - other people's emotions. Lots of good comes from this, but damn so does a lot of torment.
It can't help that I also have my 4th house ruler cnj my 8th house ruler in my 1st house. In Scorpio. That merges me even more.
The result is I would feel others feeling me as someone sexual, something I didn't want them feeling. I wanted that part of me private, and b/c of Neptune I was constantly aware whenever it wasn't private. Aware in a way that felt horrible to me.
So I did what I could to minimize those experiences. And one way was to dress like the Michelin Man. 
This was an issue for years. Thousands of days. Feeling too much of what I didn't want to feel. Controlling myself so as to control others.
Then I had the transit to my magnificient BML! *lays flowers at BML's feet*
I didn't elaborate on tantric sex but maybe I should have, since I can see how that directly contributed to my fashion change.
During sex I started spending so much time in a powerful sexual state, pushing past every plateau/wall into an even more powerful state. To do that, I had to give my sexual energy permission to push itself as far as it could go. I had to actively, willingly make BML more and more strong. Before this transit, I felt at home with sex, but since this transit, that person I am during sex feels at home with me. When sex is over, that part of me doesn't hide back in the 4th house now but rests on my skin and sits in my lungs. Which I guess gives me wicked bad Sex Breath.
So it's not that I changed the way I dressed in order to be perceived as sexual. I changed the way I dressed because it was no longer an issue to me that I was sexual. That raw and vulnerable part of me was now so strong, so present, and so ME that so what if my Neptune makes me feel another person feeling that part of me? I don't need to keep that part of me separate from the rest of me now, so I'm much more at ease with being reminded of it by other people.
I wrote this to clarify how my inner transformation affected me externally (through clothes), but also so people can see how BML can work in a particular person's life.
Understanding how BML works for me helps me know how it's working in my synastry, which I hope to return to talk about. Muahaha, more words to come! What a terrific soporific!
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jane
Knowflake Posts: 1277
From:
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted May 12, 2010 02:22 PM
DD -
Your epiphany doesn't sound banal to me at all. IP: Logged |
cooljen
Knowflake Posts: 298
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted May 13, 2010 12:57 AM
quote:
Black Moon Lilith/Sun aspects
Harmonious: The Sun partner will flood the Lilith partner with magical sunbeams, amping up their power. The Lilith partner will inspire creativity in the Sun partner, making them feel like a King or Queen.
Stressful: The Sun partner will feel their ego undermined by a manipulative Lilith. Lilith could feel dominated and crushed by a bossy Sun and respond by attempting to darken their light.
Would someone's BML conjunct your Sun be a harmonious aspect or stressful? What about BML opposite BML? Here's a better description of it because I dont know if the conjunction of Jupiter to the BML makes a difference...
Person A's BML (conjunct Jupiter) is conjunct Person B's Sun, POF, and Karma
Person B's BML (conjunct IC and Ceres) is conjunct Person A's Juno
Both BMLs are opposing each other
------------------
Leo with Scorpio Rising & Moon in Taurus.
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staborgi
Knowflake Posts: 471
From:
Registered: Aug 2009
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posted May 13, 2010 01:48 AM
DD- I'd be curious how aspects like that would play out over a longer relationship! sounds intense! That site you posted is great...they also have an article about Lilith and addressing the gender stereotype of it. Will have to find that one again and post. IP: Logged |
MyVirgoMask
Knowflake Posts: 3671
From: Bay Area, CA
Registered: May 2009
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posted May 13, 2010 03:42 AM
I don't know that I would isolate a Lilith aspect TOO much...it feels more like part of a larger theme in the synastry. Maybe harder aspects involving Pluto, Mars, to each other and to Moon and/or Venus would radiate a bigger theme. She's definitely there and demands attention. But I feel paying too much attention to her would make her power-hungry My ex husband's sun and Venus were conjunct my Lilith. Yeah, there were a lot of power struggles, a lot of his trying to de-claw and de-fang me. But then my Pluto was also square his Venus almost exactly, while his Saturn squared my Sun, and we had Moon/Sun square double whammy. All those aspects can feel like power struggles. Lilith/Sun just added fuel to the fire, especially with my own Lilith sq Pluto and oppose Saturn in my own chart.
I would say look at the whole synastry and see where Lilith aspects fit in to a broader theme.
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DD
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posted May 13, 2010 05:35 AM
Staborgi,yes I think it`s a great site. I also think I remember the owner writing here some posts. But am not entirely sure.
MVM,
I absolutely agree. We have to look at the whole synastry. And I think if there is basic compatibility the intensity of Lilith aspects may be easier to handle and to integrate, and maybe in these instances they could even point to these strong soulbonds that are sometimes mentioned with Lilith. If I remember it right Paul Newman`s Lilith was exactly conjunct his wife`s DESC! Now that is interesting.
Also interesting, Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie have an ASC-Lilith DW. And I think one of the aspects was a square.
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Ami Ann
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posted May 13, 2010 08:40 AM
This thread has really helped me. I think if I could say ---in a word--how I got screwed --it would be cuz I blocked my Lilith.
In my family--any strong emotion was frowned on--even joy.
If it was strong--it was BAD.
Everything had to be stiff upper lip, tight,shut down.
That was the way that a person behaved.
All else was crude ,flamboyant etc.
So, everything about me got shut down.
Talk about clothes---never an inch of skin LOL
That was a metaphor for my life --Never an inch of skin 
Ami
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Happy Dragon
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posted May 13, 2010 09:28 AM
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Lindaland
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