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Author Topic:   WHOLE SIGN HOUSES
Heart--Shaped Cross
Newflake

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posted January 16, 2009 05:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Heart--Shaped Cross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I just got a reading from Austin Coppock (aka Baron Samadhi von Coppockalypse, PhD) and he was telling me about the Whole Sign house system, which he uses. He says he switched over (from Placidus) a couple of years ago, after resisting it tooth-and-nail. What he told me is that the Whole Sign system, which is the oldest (used by the ancient Greeks and Romans), and still used by the Vedic astrologers today, gives much more obvious and accurate results. He says that, while the other systems may give more insight into what is going on inside the person, at the deepest levels, the whole sign divisions reflect more overt and obvious manifestations. When he interpreted my Mars/Merc in the 12th house (rather than the 10th/11th cusp interpretation I am familiar with), it made a great deal of sense. And as I examined where my other planets and signs fall in the whole sign system, they also appeared to make considerable sense.

It's very simple.. The begining of the first house is zero degrees of whatever sign your Ascendant is in. So, if your Ascendant is at 12 Taurus, your first house begins at 0 Taurus.. and all the houses follow accordingly (2nd house would be 0 Gemini, and so on). The Ascendant axis and Midheaven axis remain the same and are still important, although they are not house-cusps, and are interpreted as planets. I encourage everyone to experiment with this system and see what you can find.


More information on Whole Sign Houses here:
http://www.librarising.com/astrology/misc/wholesignhouses.html
http://classicalastrology.tribe.net/thread/4f214879-77d3-41e2-8365-50f5f753761d

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savanna20
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posted January 16, 2009 06:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for savanna20     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I use the vedic system sometimes too. I find it more accurate.

Here's my vedic chart:

My Western:

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writesomething
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posted January 16, 2009 06:10 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Very interesting stuff. thank you.

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missneptune
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posted January 16, 2009 07:50 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oooooh, I got to check this out! I believe it!

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triplecancer
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posted January 16, 2009 07:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for triplecancer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you HSC. In my case, I don't identify with the whole house system. With this system, my sun and moon are in the first house while in placidus they are in the 12th house, and I definetly think that I am 12 house sun and moon. Jupiter would be in 2nd while in placidus saturn is in 2nd and I identify a lot more with saturn in 2nd since I have a low self esteem, I find it difficult to make money and I'm afraid of poverty.

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missneptune
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posted January 16, 2009 07:55 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wow, this is really interesting. I just casted my chart with the whole sign system, and all my planets literally shifted a house. Now my Sun and Mercury are located in the 9th house, which actually makes more sense to me than the 8th, I've traveled all over the world, and I plan to do a lot more of it. Maybe the whole house system reflects our external lives more, and the Placidus/ Koch shows are internal like you said!

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amowls
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posted January 16, 2009 08:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for amowls     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think Kick It is a fan of whole sign houses.

I'm not that sure about it though. I rely a lot on house overlays in synastry and whole signs throw most of those off.

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leapinglemur14
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posted January 16, 2009 09:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for leapinglemur14     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
i just read all my planet interpretations for whole signs vs. placidus and it just doesn't seem to work for me. some of the stuff i can relate to but it doesn't ring true...it doesn't have that OH MY GOD thatissotrue, feeling.

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Heart--Shaped Cross
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posted January 16, 2009 10:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Heart--Shaped Cross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You're welcome.
I'm finding it really interesting.


triplecancer,

I hear you. Hmm...

Maybe it can be explained by other means...

How is Neptune's position changed, if at all? Could it be stronger in the Whole House system?

You are a "triple cancer"?
Is there any possibility you may be mistaking Cancer traits for 12th house (pisces) traits?

I have a 1st house Moon and that, alone, accounts for a lot of my sensitivity and insecurity.

In the Whole House system, tho, there are other factors which could "explain" that.

I still plan on using Placidus, maybe more than Whole House, but I think this looks useful for me.

To each his (or her) own.

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MyVirgoMask
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posted January 16, 2009 10:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyVirgoMask     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I still don't get it. Mercury square Saturn is making me duuuuuh LOL.
I want to understand though

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Heart--Shaped Cross
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posted January 16, 2009 10:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Heart--Shaped Cross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote


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MyVirgoMask
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posted January 16, 2009 11:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyVirgoMask     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh ook, so you can do whole signs at astro? It moves the whole sign over to the following house...hm. Is that right?

Sorry, pretty slow over here

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leapinglemur14
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posted January 16, 2009 11:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for leapinglemur14     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
well basically instead of starting the chart at your ASC it starts int in your ASC's sign. so if you have 15 degree aqua asc it starts at 0 degrees aqua rather than 15 degrees.

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MyVirgoMask
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posted January 16, 2009 11:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyVirgoMask     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
AAHHHHHH ok. I'm gonna go do it now. Man, do I feel slow LOL.
Thanks

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MyVirgoMask
Knowflake

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posted January 16, 2009 11:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyVirgoMask     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yep. Makes more sense to me!
My Venus just got into my 7th and Neptune slid into my 8th. Nothing else has really changed planet-wise. I like this, it feels more fitting somehow.

Thanks HSC

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leapinglemur14
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posted January 16, 2009 11:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for leapinglemur14     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
have you tried equal? does it do the same thing?

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MyVirgoMask
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posted January 16, 2009 11:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyVirgoMask     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Not really, it moves the planets the opposite direction LOL.
I have no idea exactly how it works, but in this case it works well in some regards. I do like Equal though. But I'm thinking it depends on my mood at this point

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Heart--Shaped Cross
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posted January 16, 2009 11:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Heart--Shaped Cross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Equal never seemed to fit for me.

The more I read interpretations of these (Whole Sign) placements, the more enlightened I feel.

It's like MVM said, its just a better fit. I feel lighter. I feel understood.

I always related so much to Pisces/Neptune/12th house issues, and nothing in my chart really corroborated the emphasis.

Besides, that, I am seeing a lot of sense in the other changes too.

It would take too long to enumerate every thing, there is so much that makes sense.

I feel really good about this.

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missneptune
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posted January 17, 2009 03:37 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Heart--Shaped Cross, who've opened my eyes! Everything makes so much more sense, my chart is literally completely different, all I can say is I've got some Fire power, maybe too much with Aries Mars located in the 5th house and Leo Sun/Mercury in the 9th house, but I can be a homebody which is really reflected by my moon in the 4th house instead of the 3rd house. But the biggest discovery was that my Pluto is in the 12th house instead of the 11th, this makes so much more sense, I've never related to Pluto in the 11th house, and my Asc. ruler -Jupiter is in the 7th instead of the 6th, not sure what it implies, some Libra like tendnancies?

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Iqhunk
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posted January 17, 2009 04:34 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What you focus on always becomes stronger, that is the Universal Law of Attraction.
As an already evolved soul, it wont matter what your chart is because you will always feel highly Neptunian/Piscean/Connected to Spirit.
It is not wise to fit your chart to who you are when you have transcended the chart limitations. The "whole house system" is astrologically untenable as it undermines the following statistically provable aspects:
1. Ascendant conj Royal Fixed Stars in highly successful people
2. Ascendant conjunct Asteroid that imparts specific behaviours [Example Asc conj LUST in Gene Simmons and Bill Clinton]
3. 7 major Arabic Parts [proven accurate for centuries]
4. Saturn Transits on house cusps [proven for centuries]
5. Sabian Symbol of Ascendant.

------------------
http://www.tamsoft.co.in/articles.html

http://www.tamsoft.co.in/readings.html

http://www.tamsoft.co.in/samplereading.html

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Heart--Shaped Cross
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posted January 17, 2009 12:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Heart--Shaped Cross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:

I recently started courses to become a Certified Professional Astrologer and my professor insists on using the Whole Signs house system as opposed to the Placidus house system that is most commonly used because he says that in his 45+ years of experience it has proven to give a more accurate reading.
http://tarot.com/forum/topic.php?id=362

Can you boast 45+ years of experience, IQhunk?

I think Rob Hand (perhaps the most famous astrologer working today) uses Whole Sign Houses, too.

At least, I know he wrote a book or something about it.

I'm sure it doesnt work for everything, and there may be things,
like the Fixed Stars, for which other chart systems are more useful.

But, so far, I am finding a lot of "ah-ha!" moments with this system.
And, after all, isnt that what testifies to astrology's workability in the first place?

Moreover, I don't agree that people transcend their charts,
and, if I did, I would have very little use or interest in Astrology.

Lastly, so much of what you do accept about astrology, -- virtually the entire system, in its fundamentals,
comes down to us from the ancient Greeks and Romans, and it makes a lot of sense to me to use the house system they were using.


quote:

What you focus on always becomes stronger, that is the Universal Law of Attraction.

True, but we focus on things because they are already strong.

"Like attracts like" means they attract us, just as we attract them.

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Heart--Shaped Cross
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posted January 17, 2009 12:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Heart--Shaped Cross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Awesome, missneptune!

Jupiter in the 7th means a big appetite for love,
and, generally, good luck in relationships.

You are able to extract big lessons even from bad relationships.

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MyVirgoMask
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posted January 17, 2009 12:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyVirgoMask     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
HSC, it's really freakin' bizarre, but I feel released in some odd way from using that whole system. It makes sense in the oddest way. I always felt like my Venus belonged in the 7th, even though with it in the 6th it explains how I meet most of my boyfriends in a work setting. Still, this whole chart thing feels like it describes in a core way I can't describe...thank you

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Heart--Shaped Cross
Newflake

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posted January 17, 2009 12:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Heart--Shaped Cross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You're welcome!

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AcousticGod
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posted January 17, 2009 01:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I was excited about coming to the party, but the only thing that changed was the house of my Moon and Uranus.

The new interps do fit, though:

With the Moon in the Fourth House your feeling, instinctive nature will find expression mainly through your family and home environment. Your day-to-day response to circumstance is strongly conditioned by family relationships and domestic issues. To feel emotionally secure you need a meaningful and secure home life. http://www.astrologyweekly.com/learn-astrology/moon-in-4th-house.php

Uranus in 5th house:

You are uninhibited and have an outrageous, crazy sense of humor. You love to get loose and you're often impulsive or "wild". Even if you appear conventional, you are attracted to highly eccentric, creative, or unusual companions. (That's you guys ) In romance, you are happiest when there is an element of surprise, unpredictability, and adventure. You may choose unstable love partners.

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