posted July 21, 2010 01:31 PM         

Great points as usual!

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted July 21, 2010 02:12 PM         

The BML's are strong in my chart too. Mean is square my Sun (0*) and trine my Venus (3*). True is square my Neptune, which rules my 5th house (0*).

I experience BML as being connected to sex, our own primal drives and our right to express those drives. It's kinda like Mars in lingerie. I believe this is part of BML's essence, but I also realize the way I experience BML is shaped by my own chart and the particular transits I've had that brought BML to the forefront. (In particular, t.Pluto square my BML while cnj my Sun.)

The myth reveals BML's nature. Lilith was kicked out of Eden because she refused to lie beneath Adam during sex. This is about sexual domination and the woman's right to enjoy sex just as much as her male partner. She's not a toy designed purely to please the man. She has her own will and her own desires, and she knows how to satisfy them. And she will get seriously p1ssed off if she's told they don't matter.

This scenario can represent power issues in general. Lilith was offering an alternate way to experience sex that would've taken into account her own sexual satisfaction. She refused to let her own primal drives be made irrelevant. So Lilith is about equal expression of power, but I think it's significant that the power issue is based in a sexual situation. Lilith and Adam could've been battling wills over anything. That it was over sex tells us something about Lilith's essence.

posted July 21, 2010 02:27 PM         

It wasn't until around the Middle Ages, stories of Lilith as the first wife of Adam came to existence.

Of course, Lilith was also thought to be a succubus too.

It's like how the lunar nodes are associated with a demon that was slain by Vishnu and cut in half. Rahu (North Lunar Node) and Ketu (South Lunar Node) in result of that.

I think that it's good to look at all aspects of Lilith when it comes to mythology and not just the one where she is the first wife of Adam.

The Persian had similar creature
Drug

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted July 21, 2010 02:49 PM         

quote:

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Free chaos, unperturbed by the harm it brings when being itself?

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This reminds me of a paragraph I posted elsewhere, from a book I'm reading. Something said at the end of the paragraph, reminded me of Pluto and Lilith - but I think I forgot to post the context. Several things had happened to stop this woman from putting her horse through a surgery that might have killed it - she had several warnings in the name of dreams (her own and those of a neighbour), and something else that I forget. She stood up for what she believed to be true, despite the opposition from friends and people in town, who believed that she was being silly.

quote:

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The sense if gratitude and affection I felt for Rasa grew stronger as I accepted our fate. Somehow, she had awakened a more intuitive, creative, and compassionate spirit in me, one that had been suppressed by the cold cult of reason for most of my adult life. It was, indeed, time for the old king to die. With his imminent demise on the horizon, a new perspective emerged, and it was limping across the desert in the form of a night-haired mare named Tabula Rasa. I sensed that someday the colour of sacrifice surrounding us both would blossom into the rich red hue of empowerment, and at that moment I understood why the patriarchal Bedouin tribes were so afraid of dark horses. When feminine modes of wisdom are banished to the nether regions of the collective unconscious, they tend to manifest in disruptive, vengeful ways, but sometimes vultures, black mares, whirlwinds, and savage hounds are exactly what a woman needs to define her form and show off her best features.
The Tao of Equus ~ Page 25.

---

That just reminded me of Lilith, when I read it.

posted July 21, 2010 02:57 PM         

quote:

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When feminine modes of wisdom are banished to the nether regions of the collective unconscious, they tend to manifest in disruptive, vengeful ways, but sometimes vultures, black mares, whirlwinds, and savage hounds are exactly what a woman needs to define her form and show off her best features.

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Phenomenal! Look at you popping in like a ninja with exactly the thought I was looking for! *bows*

(What happened last week? Are you ok? )

This thread was like magic for me. First Raymond letting me know about the other myths, and then you linking them for me.

posted July 21, 2010 05:25 PM         

I think there must be something significant with natal asteroid Lilith being conjunct N. Vesta in the 9th house. I sometimes have had visions of being from ancient Greece, especially as a child, but then again that could just be natal Pisces Moon in the 3rd sextile Neptune talking.

I love where this post is going!

I've always been in awe of the dark feminine that is often represented in mythology from Lilith to Kaali to Hekate, for several reasons. First of all its not revered in our culture whatsoever, just look at the Salem Witch trials. Or the fact that Lilith was Adams first wife, and then she wanted her own freedom and left Adam to his other creation -submissive Eve, who ended up not being so submissive after all. There is definitely a theme of women and disobedience, which only explains that women are in fact a blend of both yin and yang, not just yin!

In my own natal, my modalities are mostly fire and masculine. I have a hard time relating to Venusian energy, yet I'm quite feminine. Therefore, a feminine Lunar sign and placement can really have a hold on the female's external femininity. Then again gender roles are just a construct of our society, so what really is Venusian?

posted July 21, 2010 09:03 PM         

ummm

I wouldn't say that's fact though. There are others about Lilith

the older stories talk about Lilith as a Mesopotamian demon

other cultures had their own Lilith-like creatures in mythology.

In Assyrian mythology, The lilitū
In Sumerian mythology, it was Lamashtu

also
In Grecian-Roman mythology, it was Lamia
in Persian mythology,it was Druj
in Arabic mythology,it was Karina

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted July 21, 2010 11:00 PM         

Would Lilith transits cause a straight woman to have a fling with another woman..

I know someone that did this, in her transits she has
T Lilith conj AC in natal 11th
T MC conjunct N Lilith in the natal 8th.

posted July 22, 2010 04:26 AM         

For me "lilith " shows on a primal deep animal instinct and if it will brings strong sexual feelings it must triggs from someone else.

posted July 22, 2010 10:57 AM         

I have Lilith at 19 degrees of Scorpio, in the 1st. So... this means that I can be a jealous, ruthless female? That I exude sexual Scorpion energy? This makes no sense- you would think with this placement i'd be a blundering slapper. But i'm not. I'm very guarded with my sexuality.

posted July 22, 2010 01:30 PM         

I believe that they don't.

They are not astronomically related.

I just think of the Black Moon as the shadow side of the Moon which means that it's about emotions,feelings,sensitivity,unconscious,intuition,mother,and women but in an hidden,subtle way that's not in "your face"

I believe that Lilith is related to just social issues.

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted July 22, 2010 01:32 PM         

I don't think sign placement matters much.
I think that needs to have aspects to be felt.

If you're referring to the black moon, then even more so. After all, it's not a physical object. It's just an abstract point. It is just the furthest point of the Moon's orbit from the Earth.

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted July 22, 2010 01:56 PM         

By shadow side - I don't mean hidden. I mean it operates differently from our Moon. While our Moon is receptive and reflective, BML is dynamic and independent. She's a yang-ed up Moon. All those lunar drives that get pushed aside or held in check for social reasons (the Moon is linked with the public) find an advocate in BML. BML doesn't give a sh1t about propriety. She's fiercely independent and hungry. She's not here to please, but to get pleased.

Both of my BML's are in Virgo in my 11th house. I mentioned their aspects in an earlier post. One way I think that works is I've never desired affirmation of my sexual desirability from the public. In fact, for years I'd feel a flash of rage when strangers would compliment me in that way.

posted July 22, 2010 02:17 PM         

Yes, me too. I also know how I felt during t.Pluto square BML.

posted July 22, 2010 02:21 PM         

did you have any experience with Lilith conjunction or opposition Venus?

When I'm attracted to someone there is always something connected to my Lilith in Gemini. I think she really decribes the way I act when I'm in love, even more so than my Venus in Leo.