posted April 26, 2010 12:12 PM         

I could, if I chose to, get very offended by what appears to be your implication that anyone who is not your "one and only" is just another Tom, Dick, or Harry. Can you only appreciate your loved one by devaluing everybody else? Of course not. But that's how you sound, and if I was already looking to take you the wrong way, I very easily could, couldn't I?

posted April 26, 2010 12:14 PM         

It's nice when you actually share
your perspective on these things,
and give me a chance to explain.

posted April 26, 2010 12:41 PM         

quote:

---

before any agreements...

---

That is an very important distinction. If there are no agreements, then it's not any of my business who you see.

I've had the renegotiation of parameters discussion on several occasions, and let me tell you, it goes much smoother if you discuss before you act, opposed to the other way around. And btw, the acting is not exclusive of any gender.

------------------
We cannot seek or attain health, wealth, learning, justice or kindness in general. Action is always specific, concrete, individualized, unique. --Benjamin Jowett

posted April 26, 2010 01:09 PM         

But, more to the point, this thread is not
about prediscussion or postdiscussion liasons,
or the innocence of one and the guilt of the other,
but, about the reasons we give for limiting others.

posted April 26, 2010 01:27 PM         

quote:

---

The gender question that came up just now had nothing to do with the topic, but with people's reactions to how things are communicated. There was a gender question earlier that related to the topic, though, and maybe that's what you're refering to? I disagree with you, sort of. I think it has a lot to do with masculine (electric, aggressive, or outgoing) and feminine (magnetic, defensive, or receptive) energies, but this is not the same thing as men and women. I'm sorry if I didnt make that clear. It's not always very clear to me.

---

posted April 26, 2010 01:29 PM         

Sometimes my faith
is so strong
and I can see so
clearly.

Sometimes...
THESE times,
we all make sense,
you and you and you...
and me.

Sometimes
the muses
speak to me

my rock
my fire
my childhood dream

romance - adventure - and sweet serenity ♫

His sun is trine my moon... his sun and saturn in my 4th and my stellium in his 5th. We had a connection long before he met his wife and our connection remains. There is no denying it and over the years we simply become more intertwined with one another. He and his wife are what they are meant to be and he and I are what we are meant to be. We have propelled each other toward our dreams from the very beginning, and our lives before we met laid the groundwork for many of our connections as well.

If I know a man has a s.o., I avoid the interaction that would give power to any strong aspects that might "step on her toes" so to speak. However, if the bond has already been established she just has to deal with it, as I have to deal with her.
I've noticed that it is the insecure women who will become jealous and end friendships with me because they are worried about something between me and "their man" when nothing is actually present... at least from my end. The men I care for and admire the most in my life choose strong, wise women who respect them... and their chosen friends.

I used to look at my romantic aspects with this friend as unfortunate and even tormenting and then as I walked miles and miles for my job last week, on the 19th, listening to the songs he wrote and lyrics he wrote, after being with him on an important night in his career, the beauty of what we had chosen together as soul friends became clear to me.

He and I had never had physical sex or any other physical contact other than touching hands (which often had more meaning in it than most sex between couples) other than the very first night we met when he held me as I cried over a three year relationship that had just ended. I had said to him in writing that I would never disrespect his wife in that way... yet often felt that our unspoken and physically unexpressed feelings would have to be even MORE disrespectful of her. I struggled with this often and at times even wondered if he and I were meant to be as a couple... feeling justified that after all... I "saw him first". I know now that we are not. And I know this because what he and I are meant to be is just what we are to each other. It is all part of what our Souls chose... the classroom drama we chose to participate in... the beauty of life.

So, he doesn't "technically" cheat on his wife (in the sticking in of the protuberances and causing std's sort of way). And do they have an "arrangement" that he is not to have love for someone else? That he is not to enjoy the feeling of having someone admire him and believe in him since he was a child? Is it possible to GET that technical with our "agreements" with our s.o.? Is it desirable? How far do we go?? Are the promises we make to one another EVEN POSSIBLE? Can you avoid what your Soul has set up for you? The Holy relationships that are meant to cross your path? Is is more realistic to try to GET TO KNOW our s.o. and their true challenges and work with all our mights to create a nurturing and open and accepting environment where our s.o. might be able to share with us the stories of their lives... the feelings they might have for others... the aspects they might share or come across in life?

Anyway, that is what I was thinking about the weekend before Valus posted this topic and I knew EXACTLY what he was talking about. I think Uranus was beaming the same signal to us both.

posted April 26, 2010 01:45 PM         

(Where'd I get that third hand? lol)

This is exactly the sort of response,
and the sort of understanding, that
I was hoping to get from somebody.

Thank you, Melody,
for being the right person
at the right time.

Gotta love your Aquarian Mars
and Venus/Uranus conjunction.

Also, if bunnies reads this:
I was too busy minding the "bullocks"
to acknowledge the person who got it.
You have an Aqua Moon, too, right?
Thank you for your response, also,
either on this thread or the other,
where you said "i agree with everything
you just said, Valus" or something.

posted April 26, 2010 02:14 PM         

I love you.

Melody, you said it so beautifully...

Of course, we need to explore our soul connections.
Of course we need to get understanding from our loved ones about it.
Isn't that what it's all about?
I think it is.
That's the way I try to live.
But it's hard.
As I said on the other thread: Blessed are the ones who have the capacity to love like that.

posted April 26, 2010 02:30 PM         

You're too cool for this forum.

Almost.

posted April 26, 2010 02:35 PM         

Who said anything about
failure to communicate?

Do you mean, like,
if you are in a relationship
and you meet somebody else
who sparks your karmic interest,
you should talk to your partner?

Because that's an excellent point.

And I would agree that,
if you are with somebody
and you feel something for
somebody else, you should
not keep it to yourself --
it definitely is the business
of the person you are with.

But, then,
isn't it also their business
to understand, and to provide
an atmosphere where you can
talk about such a thing,
without ultimatums and threats
and demands being thrown around?

Communication is HUGE.

posted April 26, 2010 03:06 PM         

quote:

---

Do you mean, like,
if you are in a relationship
and you meet somebody else
who sparks your karmic interest,
you should talk to your partner?

---

Exactly. You should be able to share these things with your other, without fear. I think it takes a strong person to hear from a partner, that one feels a karmic attachment, for another.

Unfortunately, humans being humans, this isn't always a calm or positive experience.

quote:

---

Can you avoid what your Soul has set up for you? The Holy relationships that are meant to cross your path?

---

No. When Kevin was in the hospital, we had some very long honest conversations, regarding this subject, and we found that it was comforting to know that other people care for us like we care for each other.
(This doesn't make any sense to me as I re-read it, but I'm leaving it out here.)

This has set the foundation for us for the whatever else may come, we are able to have these types of conversations without fear and anger or jealousy. I consider this a positive thing.

------------------
We cannot seek or attain health, wealth, learning, justice or kindness in general. Action is always specific, concrete, individualized, unique. --Benjamin Jowett

posted April 26, 2010 03:07 PM         

See the love they get from me,
and I from them?

I must be doing something right.

Melody,

You have a talent,
not just for diplomacy,
but for distinguishing
concrete examples
capable of illustrating
the more abstract points
made by people like me.
That's the Virgo and Cap.
And that Saturn makes your
Saggie Jupiter/Neptune work
to put it's honest insights
into language everybody
can understand (Gemini).
You have a lot more than that,
too, with your Sun/Pluto and the
Uranian energies mentioned.

It's funny...

I can't recall ever meeting
a person who has their Sun
conjunct an outer planet
who didnt understand me.

It took shura a while,
but I think she gets me
better than most now.

And I know a lot of people
with their Sun in Trine, Square,
or Opposition to an outer planet
who pretty much always get me.

I wonder if it's that simple.

Anyway, thank you again.

Also, for what you said to Yin.

posted April 26, 2010 03:09 PM         

quote:

---

This has set the foundation for us for the whatever else may come, we are able to have these types of conversations without fear and anger or jealousy. I consider this a positive thing.

---

posted April 26, 2010 04:37 PM         

I don't know your personal story Melody.
My first relationship was very controlling, very possessive, and loaded with fear & jealousy. I was at least half responsible for that dysfunction. I'm so lucky and blessed that I broke that cycle at 17.
I've naturally got "kick against the traces" in me. I've got to have my Aquarian freedom to explore wonderland as well.

posted April 26, 2010 04:49 PM         

open relationships are great, for those that want them.

posted April 26, 2010 05:37 PM         

If you like and trust someone enough
to have sex with them in the first place,
then you should trust them to be careful
enough not to contract and transmit an STD.

I don't know what kind of shady people
you're used to getting into bed with,
but I sort of assumed that if you trust
them enough to sleep with them, you also
trust them enough to be safe with people
other than yourself.

That seems pretty basic.

And, anyway,
disease is part of life.

You take precautions,
and you take your chances.

Sh!t happens. You deal with it.

Mostly, though, sh!t doesnt happen.
People just fear it and talk about it.

But you do your best to avoid it
by any means that seem ethical.

Does it mean you live in fear,
and tight-fisted control over
the affairs of the ones you love,
or the ones you f*ck?

No. Not necessarily.

It means you learn how to trust.

And, if necessary,
you learn how to mend a broken heart.

Nobody said loving was easy.