posted August 19, 2006 02:08 PM            

quote:

---

You really need to learn the difference between a
Personality trait and a
Karmic issue

---

Omg Yes Lala! For the last time, you personally identify with your nodes only when you have planets in the same sign(s) as your nodal axis. You can ressurect 100 old threads for all I care, that's my belief and I'm sticking to it. I only identify with my nodes because 1) I have a virgo moon 2) I have a strong neptune influence.

I find it hilarious that even two Astrologers are telling you that you can't generalize with the nodes and you re still going on about how everyone with Cancerian SN is overly sensitive like a Cancerian would be. My sister is not overly sensitive; she happens to have very thick skin thanks to her Scorpio rising and Pisces Sun.

posted August 19, 2006 04:30 PM            

I have always been overly sensitive since I could ever remember. I feel that's mainly the Pisces Moon square Neptune with 1'22 orb . I have Sun,Mercury,and Venus in Scorpio which is also a highly sensitive combo,but can be emotionally strong.. I did tend to control and hide my feelings a lot. This even is supported by Moon quincunx Pluto,Moon conjunct 8th house ruler(Mars), Moon square Saturn, Sun quincunx Saturn,Mercury contraparallel Saturn,Venus contraparallel Saturn. Saturn in aspect to Moon and planets in watersigns can indicate disciplining,structuring feelings.

posted August 19, 2006 05:24 PM              

I sometimes wish I wasn't so sensitive. I do need to try and ground my sensitivity. And maybe I wouldn't feel so lost at times. I have cried too many tears already in my life. I have been emotional crutches for people. I have been easily decieved and very hurt in the process. This is why my strong Saturn in my first house conjunct my Ascendant and oppose my Pisces Sun chooses to hide away and build a wall around herself. To shield myself from the pain.

I am realizing slowly that this isn't any kind of life for me. I feel like the most fragile person in the world, I try to act strong put up my defences. And pretend I don't need anyone. But I do, and I have to be careful I am not blocking out the good people in life who do care for me. I need to build myself back up again.

posted August 19, 2006 07:27 PM            

One "astrologer," can't seem to figure it out, and the other is in denial about it, because he doesn't want to see himself as having any Leo qualities. Lala continues to refuse to make any sort of argument to refute Cap NN/Cancer SN. Glaucus has only made an argument based on what he feels about his chart and his mother's chart.

Here are some links to information regarding North Nodes: http://www.astrologyweekly.com/astrology-articles/north-node-karma.php

The North and South Nodes of the Moon

The North node of the Moon by house and sign reveals an area of life and an approach that will benefit the individual. Life goals are easier to fulfill when the North Node is paid attention to. The person will have to be willing to stretch beyond the comfort zone which is represented by the South Node. See the North node by sign and the Noth node by house interpretations.

The South Node is a familiar past life pattern. When life gets tough we like to fall back into the comfortable pattern that the South Node holds. The South Node will not move you forward as the North Node does, but, it may reveal certain talents. Astrologers study the South Node when analyzing past life patterns. The Moon, Saturn and the twelfth house may also give insight into past life patterns to a certain extent. Karmic Astrology-the Moons Nodes and Reincarnation by Martin Schulman is a recommended library addition if you want to begin to delve deeper into the subject. http://www.skyviewzone.com/astrology/moonsnodes.htm

The sign and house placement of the South Node tells where you have a tendency to totally overdo things. There is a longing there, a craving that is very strong. The nature of this longing is shown by the sign of the South Node. For example, in Taurus, the craving is for material security. In Leo, for recognition. In Gemini, for information.

Your South Node indicates an area of massive talent. http://north-node.com/astrology-tutorials/nodes

The South Node will give you huge insight into what you have brought with you into this Life. You may have seen the South Node referred to as a “double-edged” sword. This is because you have already learned from the South Node, therefore they are considered talents and gifts you already have, so you can quit trying to gain them. So you can use these talents you've already learned to move you further into your North Node. http://www.drstandley.com/astrologycharts_northandsouthnodes.shtml

The South Node represents those experiences and qualities that come naturally to us, that are over-developed, and that we tend to fall back on. http://www.cafeastrology.com/northnodesouthnode.html

The theory behind the Nodes of the Moon (the North Node and South Node) suggests that we all come into this world with some underdeveloped and overdeveloped aspects of our character.

The Nodes of the Moon suggest personal karmic imbalance. Thus, consciously working on these "life lessons" can bring us to increased happiness and fulfillment. If we over-emphasize and fall back on the qualities of our South Node, at the expense of developing our North Node, we may have a difficult time feeling personally successful. http://www.cafeastrology.com/nodesofthemoon.html
http://karma.astrology.com/nodes.html
http://www.samsara-fr.com/noeud/capricorne-uk.htm

I just looked at people with my NN, and Eminem is one of them. His singleton water placement is Mercury in Scorpio. Dominant planet is Uranus followed by Saturn and then Moon (in Aqua). Dominant sign is Libra followed by Aquarius followed by Virgo (and closely behind that Gemini). If he has a Scorpio ascendant, then he would have an air grand trine in water houses, which could be justified as a sensitive chart. Otherwise, his Cap NN is the biggest likelihood of the origin of his ultra-sensitivity. Even if he does have a Scorp ascendant, the NN would merely reinforce the energies already present in his chart like Miss Saturn has said. Does he come off as Cancerian necessarily? No. Does he express his over-sensitivity? Yes, quite often. He has 6 planets in Air (Sun, Moon, Mars, Saturn, Uranus, and Pluto).

posted August 19, 2006 08:01 PM            

How in the hell does he insist that I am denying my Leo qualities.

After I explained to him about my Dyslexia,Dyspraxia and how it makes me very shy,humble,and insecure.....not some egotistical person who wants to take center stage.

I posted long explanation about my Dyslexia auditory processing problems and speech problems. That's how I really am.

Why can't he friggen comprehend that?

ugh!

This crap ****** me off

I am done with this thread.

He can think whatever he wants about me. It doesn't make it true.

posted August 19, 2006 08:20 PM            

You need to apologize to Dulce and Glaucus too
for assuming

posted August 19, 2006 09:39 PM            

Actually, mine's in the 12th.....yeah

**Capricorn Ascendant though

So anyone who disagrees with you is suddenly incompetent. I'm not putting words into your mouth but thats what you seem to be implying. Nice going, you're a real class act.

You know what,lets use AG's logic. Everybody born in....what year? '72?
Alright, everyone born in '72 is very sensitive and moody with no thick skin whatsoever because Acoustic God says so.

posted August 20, 2006 01:21 AM            

subscribe to the following Code of Ethics: I recognize that a precise astrological opinion cannot honestly be rendered with reference to the life of an individual unless it is based upon a horoscope cast for the year, month, day and time of day plus correct geographical location of the place of birth of that individual, and I agree not to render such an opinion without this detailed information, unless the horoscope of the individual has been rectified by accepted astrological methods, or unless I positively state to the interested party that such conclusions are reached by alternative methods.

I agree not to interpolate or to introduce into any astrological deduction, verbally or otherwise, any interpretation which my conclusions appear to warrant, that are irrelevant to the Science of Astrology without first stating definitely that such deductions are neither based upon the life chart nor identified with the science.

posted August 20, 2006 04:06 AM            

I won't give, and you don't deserve an apology for anything. I'm not going to say it again. You are a Moderator, and strangely the leader of the Free Astrology Course, and yet you not only disagree with common perceptions on Capricorn NN, but you also don't provide argument to disprove those perceptions. Instead, you instigate, goad, and act all around immature. It's nonsense. If I wanted to have a nonsensical conversation I'd go find Jwhop. I'm done. You're not worth my time or energy. You'll understand things when you need to understand things, and nothing will cause an Aries to learn earlier.

Glaucus,

I don't know what to say to you. I don't feel like I'm disrespecting you in the slightest. The reason is, from my point of you (if you're capable of looking at it), Nodes are true. You believe they're false, because your life experiences have caused you not to act in ways that you believe are Leonine. As you know I have a Gemini Ascendant as well as a stellium in Sag. I don't particularly display those attributes in my daily life, but when I read about them they most definitely ARE a part of my make-up. It shouldn't really be shocking whatsoever that a person who believes in Node interps would think that someone denying their NN interp is in some sort of denial. That's logical. If I'm wrong, and I and everyone else who happens to believe in Nodes's are believing in imaginary forces that don't actually exist, then kudos to you for seeing through it. Just please understand why misguided me would believe the way I do, and why I need a real argument to make me believe otherwise. Ok? I sincerely mean that. I'm not trying to demean you. I'm just being true to what I know (or what I think I know- if I happen to be wrong).

Dulce,

quote:

---

So anyone who disagrees with you is suddenly incompetent. I'm not putting words into your mouth but thats what you seem to be implying. Nice going, you're a real class act.

---

No, you're not putting words into my mouth. You've got the idea exactly. If someone disagrees with me, and can't bring a single compelling argument to the table to refute what I've said, then, yes, they obviously lack reasoning skills, and since this deals with astrology and they claim themselves astrologers it shows that they are basically incompetent. Do you think that if the astrologers who've studied North Nodes and created interpretations for Nodes were here that they'd agree that I was wrong and as far-fetched as you guys seem to believe?

quote:

---

Alright, everyone born in '72 is very sensitive and moody with no thick skin whatsoever

---

I agree with your assessment that we're sensitive and moody, but you may not realize the lack of thick skin. I myself can hide my emotions quite well when I feel it's appropriate.

Lala,

posted August 20, 2006 04:31 AM              

My partner has never grieved for the death of his father because of the terrible childhood he has had, and the task now is for letting this go. To help him to move forward with his life.

To me he is very emotional, he watches child abuse adverts and has to turn over because his eyes get tearful and he can't bear to look.

I feel with his South Node he has to learn to balance his emotions with his opposite North Node Capricorn. Develop his spiritual strength.

posted August 20, 2006 05:10 AM            

I have looked at nodes in an entirely different way. Vedic Astrologers use nodes in a different way. They are not significators of pastlife,karmic lessons. In Vedic Astrology, the whole chart is karmic.
That doesn't necessarily make them wrong nor does it necessarily make them right. They just have different views about the nodes just like I have different views about the Nodes. I don't believe the south node has to do with certain habitual patterns that are instinctive for us,and it's not personality traits per se. I believe the north has to do with our main destiny focus. I don't want to talk about South Node as pastlife stuff because not everybody believes in pastlives. My gal doesn't even believe in pastlives herself. She has Sagittarius South Node and her Neptune is on it. She already has strong Neptune influence with her Neptune being stationary. She also has Pisces Ascendant along with its ruler,Neptune sextile Moon and trine Mars. She has Sun,Mercury,and Venus in Aries, but she says that she is not a typical Aries. She has Moon conjunct Saturn in Scorpio along with Moon conjunct Pluto. She has a Moon-Pluto double whammy. She has Venus in Taurus in 2nd. She and I share a lot of things in common and are very much alike. I wouldn't dare pidgeonhole her just because of one placement nor because of numerous placements. I wouldn't do that to anybody,and I definitely wouldn't do it to you. It's just not ethical. I wouldn't want to assume somebody is violent and dangerous because of seeing a Moon square Mars...especially when Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. had that aspect. I have to take the whole chart into account. Yes..the Node is important..I can't just take the sign placement and say..oh..this dominates the whole life. I just don't feel that it's personal. The Nodes in the houses are more personal. Any point in a house is more personal than the sign that's placed in. I would take both the nodes in sign and house placement together to derive meaning from it. Not just focus on the nodes in signs.
Also cosmobiologists and uranian astrologers look at nodes differently too. I actually use cosmobiological techniques. Cosmobiology doesn't use signs. They don't use node sign placements,and so they see nodes differently from traditional astrology. That doesn't necessarily make them wrong nor right.It's just a different system

This is how uranian astrologers and cosmobiologists view nodes:

NO : Lunar Node :
MANIFESTATIONS : Connections. Relationships. Contacts. Links. Encounters. Touching. Couplings. Unions, Alliances. Common bonds. Togetherness. Personal relations. Bonding.
MED/CHEM: The navel. Body joints.

Here is some info about South Node called Ketu in Vedic Astrology.

South Node is called Ketu in Vedic Astrology, and it's the significator of moksha,enlightenment,detachment,loss

I have studied Vedic Astrology.
There is different way of at looking at nodes

my Ketu is in Cancer in the 12th house
It's like my Moon in Pisces square Saturn-Neptune opposition...especially my Saturn in 10th casts 3 houses away aspect on Ketu. The dispositor of Ketu which is also my 12th house lord,Moon conjuncts my 4th house lord which has similarities adds to that emphasis. Saturn casts a 10 houses away aspect to that conjunction.

Ketu is what remains of the body of Rahu.

Ketu is a headless half-planet, shadowy as Rahu and malefic, though not as malefic as Rahu. It is therefore considered a moksha-karak (cause of liberation from the cycle of birth and death). It bestows spiritual tendencies, ascetism and nonattachment to worldly desires and ambitions.

Ketu is also a half-planet that bestows wisdom, powers of discrimination, and gyana - spiritual knowledge, the knowledge of the self. It gives psychic abilities to its natives and makes them masters of the healing arts, natural healing, healing herbs, spices, foods, tantric healing, healing of persons possessed by evil spirits, ghosts and astral forces. Ketu natives also have the ability to go unnoticed or merge into the crowd of common folk.

Ketu's effects are similar to those of Mars, but this is only one way of describing the malefic effect and power of Ketu.

Ketu can be more destructive if it is inauspiciously positioned in the horoscopes. Ketu destroys the potency of the planet with which it is conjunct making the planet behave in an uncontrollable manner. It is tamasik, of hybrid generation, malefic, awful, and devious in nature.

posted August 20, 2006 09:50 AM            

I will say it once and will say again over and over. Not all Cancerian South Nodes are overly sensitive and moody; my sister is not overly sensitive like a cancerian. My stepmother is not overly sensitive like a cancerian. And if she ever is emotional that is because of her pisces sun-not her nodes. I don't see anything cancer-like about my sister. If my stepmother is ever "emotional" when she's angry that could be due to a Cancer Mars. Other than that, there is nothing essentially cancerian about her. You can not base the nodes on personality, that is very general. You have to take personal planets into account.

Oh and if you wanted a source, Glaucus just gave you one. Because obviously we need to copy and paste like you do in order to be competent enough to argue with you.

posted August 20, 2006 01:33 PM            

You name drop when you're losing an argument (what? hoping they'll take half the blame?)
and you talk about people who are not even here to defend themselves.
Don't you dare say anything about Jwhop.
He's got more class in his big toe than you'll ever have in this lifetime. (and I'm a liberal)

The reason I refuse to discuss Nodes with you is because your mistake was in saying the South Node carries personality traits.
We all know what a load of poo that is.

Grow up and apologize and quit acting like
a disgusting waste of space.

posted August 20, 2006 01:48 PM            

I know that I am far from incompetent as an astrologer. I am sure that there are people in here who would even verify my abilities. Also...I chat in #horoscopes channel on Undernet server on irc as Glaucus,and they can verify my abilities too. Also...I am a regular poster at Astrolife,AstrologyinAction,and Astrology newsgroups..they know me by my name,Raymond and my yahoo ID is astynaz. They can verify too.

He is very arrogant to refer to us as incompetent because we don't share his views about the nodes. It's ridiculous. We wouldn't do the same to him. We are entitled to have our own views about nodes without being put down. I already stated my reasons for my own views. I should have mentioned my cosmobiology,uranian astrology and Vedic studies that include different use of north nodes. Would he view cosmobiologists,uranian astrologers,and vedic astrologers(aka jyotishi)incompetent because they view the nodes differently from him. It seems like the case.

posted August 20, 2006 02:23 PM            

quote: "One thing I will attribute to his Cancerian Southnode is his issues with his mother.(Note: Not the same thing as a personality trait"

Glaucus,

I did want to post the Vedict Astrology Code of Ethics because it is closer to what I believe but I didn't want to confuse the issue.
I respect you Raymond.

AG
Quote:
Lala,
"Your code of ethics has nothing at all to do with this conversation/debate."

it has everything to do with it
thats the do's and don'ts in astrology
and what you're doing is a don't

posted August 20, 2006 02:35 PM            

This is how you waste my time. You never come back with an argument. You always comeback with some BS nonsense.

You think I'm losing an argument because I mention Jwhop? Where's the logic in that?

quote:

---

The reason I refuse to discuss Nodes with you is because your mistake was in saying the South Node carries personality traits.

---

If you can't show me anything that backs up your claim, then you've got no argument here. I do appreciate that you actually addressed the topic for once. Perhaps if you continue we can get somewhere in this discussion.

quote:

---

Grow up and apologize and quit acting like
a disgusting waste of space.

---

There's nothing to apologize for, Lala. You do realize that it's YOU who's brought us down this road, don't you? This thread didn't have any drama whatsoever until you showed up on the scene. This whole mess started on your initiation. I feel bad for going along with your nonsense, but it's only because you continue to childishly goad me into responses. I am going to have to stop responding before long, because this is truly pointless.

quote:

---

And that Code of Ethics should apply to all of us.
You misrepresent Astrology

---

posted August 20, 2006 02:47 PM            

I'm looking into the Vedic Nodes. Here's one article:

The Nodes

Western and Vedic astrology have two very different interpretations of the Moon's nodes. In modern Western astrology, almost everyone has based their delineations on the work of Isabel Hickey (Astrology – A Cosmic Science). Beginner's Note: the Moon's nodes are always exactly opposite to each other.

She introduced the idea that the sign and house position of the North node indicated the direction the soul was supposed to move towards in this lifetime, while the South node meant just the opposite. So that if you had the South node in the 10th house, for example, you had in past lives already mastered career, fame, achievement and were meant to put more energy into (North node) the 4th house affairs of home, family, and looking inside.

What she and those who followed her ignored was the fact that the Nodes carry the energy of eclipsing. Vedic astrologers have based their approach heavily upon observation of the sky, and understood thousands of years ago that if you have either Node conjunct a planet, that planet becomes in some way eclipsed.

They further understood that the planets most sensitive to eclipsing were the Sun and the Moon, who actually do get eclipsed during their contacts with the Nodes at the time of the Full or New Moons.

And yes, the concept of eclipsed means exactly what it means in English: overshadowed, invisible, self-effaced, etc.

But the Vedic understanding of the Nodes goes much further. Rahu, or the North node, represents the ideas of exaggeration, ambition, materialism, compulsion, and lust, and when it conjuncts a planet, it often amplifies (sometimes in a distorted way) the expression of that planet. If it is well aspected and well ruled (i.e. the lord of its sign is well placed), then the amplification can lead to success, achievement, directed drives, and fulfillment.

If it -- and its lord -- are challenged, then there can be patterns of ego blindness: difficulty facing oneself and hearing feedback from others, addiction, obsessive thinking, inaccurate perceptions, and/or materialistic grasping. But if the person stays grounded and spiritually aligned, and works on seeing themselves and others clearly, they can overcome the negative patterns and manifest the positive ones.

Ketu, the South node, in its early, afflicted or lower manifestation represents feeling like nobody, powerless, unimportant, ineffectual, invisible, low self-esteem, overshadowed or ignored by others, ungrounded, and escapist. Conjunct a planet, that planet is weakened, made insecure, and/or sometimes loses control (and goes to its other extreme, e.g. outbursts).

Well-positioned, or after self-work, Ketu manifests the highest form of Nobody, the ego-less, enlightened vehicle for Divine transmission. Conjunct a planet, it can help the planet direct its energies towards selfless service, spiritual devotion, and compassion. The urge to transcend, to serve, to give oneself away, in both their higher and lower aspects are the province of Ketu.

posted August 20, 2006 02:58 PM            

I told you, watch what you say about Jwhop.
The names you dropped were
Sun Child, Lauren/Aries Chick
Linda Goodman (you bombed with that)
Grow Up and Apologize

Edit to add; I goad you because thats how you deal with people like you.
You twist and confuse issues in an attempt to win an argument.
you don't play fair
so the only thing left is to outsmart you
I sincerely feel sorry for you AG