posted November 27, 2012 08:00 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by PixieJane:
religion is ultimately an ego trip.

---

After 13 years of Catholic school, 5 years of Christian fundamentalism, countless masses, rosaries, sermons, and religious books...

posted November 27, 2012 04:03 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lexxigramer:
Without ego;
you are nothing but a mindless creature, self unaware.

quote:noun, plural e·gos.
1.
the “I” or self of any person; a person as thinking, feeling, and willing, and distinguishing itself from the selves of others and from objects of its thought.
2.
Psychoanalysis . the part of the psychic apparatus that experiences and reacts to the outside world and thus mediates between the primitive drives of the id and the demands of the social and physical environment.

It is "egotism";
as described in definition #3;
not basic ego/individuality/self awareness that drives the delusional and holier than thou persons.

quote:
egotism;
conceit; self-importance: Her ego becomes more unbearable each day.

Self pride/confidence when justified are not egotism.
The other definitions below (along with #1 and #2 above;
are related to an individual's self awareness/personal identity

quote:4.
self-esteem or self-image; feelings: Your criticism wounded his ego.
5.
( often initial capital letter ) Philosophy .
a.
the enduring and conscious element that knows experience.
b.
Scholasticism . the complete person comprising both body and soul.

More definitions below.

quote:World English Dictionary
ego
— n , pl egos
1. the self of an individual person; the conscious subject
2. psychoanal the conscious mind, based on perception of the environment from birth onwards: responsible for modifying the antisocial instincts of the id and itself modified by the conscience (superego)
3. one's image of oneself; morale: to boost one's ego
4. egotism; conceit

quote:Medical Dictionary
ego e·go (ē'gō, ěg'ō
n.
In psychoanalytic theory, the division of the psyche that is conscious, most immediately controls thought and behavior, and mediates between the person and external reality.

quote:Cultural Dictionary
ego [( ee -goh)]

The “I” or self of any person ( ego is Latin for “I”). In psychological terms, the ego is the part of the psyche that experiences the outside world and reacts to it, coming between the primitive drives of the id and the demands of the social environment, represented by the superego.

Note : The term ego is often used to mean personal pride and self-absorption: “Losing at chess doesn't do much for my ego.”

---

Excellent explanation of "ego" and the very necessary distinction between it and "egotism."

We need healthy ego to stay grounded and function in this 3D world.

It is egotism we have to worry about as an ego gone haywire can actually cause a disconnect with 3D reality, giving new meaning to the phrase, "Ignorance is bliss."

posted November 27, 2012 04:07 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by juniperb:
The "ego" is one of the most misunderstood concepts in human history. And the rapture follows close to it.

The history or invention of the rapture was about 1800 years after the death of the physical Jesus.

The Christ has existed since time began and will continue Ad infinitum.

Rather will there be another physical embodiment of the Christ is the question I see rather than a "rapture" that is a creation of John Nelson Darby, a 19th-century theologian.

I see no harm in people beliving in the rapture per se but the problem arises when they try to foist it on others and condem those who don`t agree. That`s sad and very unChristian like . Love your neighbor as your self makes no "rapture " distinction.

A failure of this opens the path to ego or a superiority over others.

---

posted November 27, 2012 04:21 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by PixieJane:
... because religion is ultimately an ego trip

---

I agree with this, however, with a caveat. I think of religion as a tool to teach ourselves basic principles of spirituality. Using the myths present in all religions can be very handy in understanding the nature of the Universe, for example. Or in the all important furthering of the self discovery process.

I think the problem arises with the interpretation of a particular religious text, and its misuse by people who have agendas of power, control, and manipulation over others. Here religion becomes an ego trip.

And unfortunately, there's so much of this misuse of religion happening, that all religions tend to get branded as pandering to the ego.

posted November 27, 2012 06:39 PM            

Religion basically says, if you do this, you will go to this wonderful place. If not, you will be like them, the forsaken ones, who go to the bad place.

As soon as that distinction is made, I want to rebel and be one of the forsaken ones. My sympathy is with them.

To be a "real" Christian, according to some people, I have to accept this idea that the majority of the world is going to hell, simply because they are not Christian. How could I accept those terms? What comfort do I gain for my own "salvation" in this scheme, if I am also accepting the damnation of the majority??

And this religion teaches we ought to feel solidarity with the rejected people (ie parable of the Good Samaritan & Jesus eating with the tax collectors) while also demanding exclusivity ("abstain from the appearance of evil.") So how am I supposed to talk to "evil" people without it being assumed that I am one of them?

It's irreconcilable in my brain.

posted November 30, 2012 10:44 AM            

I can't tell you how many times I've been told (every single time by a Born Again), that if I don't accept Christ as my Savior, I'll assuredly have a place in hell. This began in college. Initially I would just respond with "prove it ... that I'll go to hell." When I countered each "proof" with reasoning, the conversations usually ended with me being branded as some sort of a heretic.

If I mentioned that Jesus and I've had a discussion in a dream (which is true), and He didn't once mention that I'd be going to Hell, I was told that it was because He didn't need to say it ... His presence in my dream should be indication enough that I need to accept Him.

Eventually, I got bored with repeatedly having my hellish future revealed to me, along with some of the other rubbish that goes along with closed minded/irrational/blocked thinking, so I stopped getting into convos with BAs.

And yeah don't even get me started on using religion to suppress women. In those conversations, I've been labeled a feminist who will never be happy with a man, because I secretly hate men.

So women who use their intellect and can reason are undesirable feminists. This very labeling is an attempt to suppress independent thinking!

Despite all this, I find the myths in different religions helpful in understanding God and the Universe. So I just ignore the bs and hone in on asking questions of people who make sense, including those who do metaphysical interpretations of the Bible. I also find the eastern religious viewpoints more satisfactory. And I'm big on learning to experience God outside of any religious context, i.e., through meditation.

To give you an example of the advantages I've had of keeping an open mind ...
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum29/HTML/000173.html

This is a thread in which I asked iQ about some spiritual experiences I've had (and continue to have). Until now, no one ... certainly not a Christian... has been able to explain my experiences.

For the first time ever, I'm beginning to see that my experiences, which have affected my life in huge ways, actually make sense and do not need to be dismissed as random events, or worse ... considered demonic.

------------------
I have a DO NOT DISTURB sign on my imagination

*******

The moment I cease to seek the truth, or settle for the truth in the moment ... that is the moment I cease to be a seeker, and become a fundamentalist instead.

posted December 01, 2012 08:41 PM            

2. Kundalini discussion!!! I'm reading the thread now; will have to re-read when my retention is better, it's been a long day for me.

3. The horizontal light that you saw...I have seen two flashes of light that I have no explanation for, that I discuss here: http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/004569.html

Care to join us at that thread?

If not, do you mind if I link to the Kundalini thread, or quote you?

posted December 02, 2012 01:32 PM            

I've gotta pop out now but I might join you on your thread in the next couple of days, if I feel I can offer something constructive.

------------------

I have a DO NOT DISTURB sign on my imagination

The moment I cease to seek the truth, or settle for the truth in the moment ... that is the moment I cease to be a seeker, and become a fundamentalist instead.

posted December 18, 2012 10:53 PM            

For example, why would God condem people who were born in a geographical area in which Christisnity doesn't exist? How could a "loving" God create people only to condem them? Even if you add the free will deal, how could a person born/living in a remote area untouched by Christisnity have a will to choose what doesn't exist to him/her?

posted December 20, 2012 08:41 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Randall:
Snoring?

---

posted December 20, 2012 08:44 AM            

Exactly. Don't tell me God is loving when he is sending the majority of humanity into a state of permanent torture if they don't say the magic words: "I accept Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior."

This makes Stalin look like Mother Theresa.

posted December 20, 2012 08:58 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:
PhoenixFire,

Exactly. Don't tell me God is loving when he is sending the majority of humanity into a state of permanent torture if they don't say the magic words: "I accept Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior."

This makes Stalin look like Mother Theresa.

---

That is ridiculous. People have choice. Anyway, I can't fight this because I am busy

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 20, 2012 11:31 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ami Anne:

That is ridiculous. People have choice. Anyway, I can't fight this because I am busy

---

Hi Ami,

With all due respect, the Bible itself says people are not given a choice. God chooses who is going to heaven and hell before they are even born.

quote:

---

Those who come to Christ become His children by His will, not by theirs. “They were not God's children by nature or because of any human desires. God himself was the one who made them his children” (John 1:13 CEV).

God, before the foundation of the world, chose to make certain individuals the objects of His unmerited favor or special grace (Mark 13:20; Ephesians 1:4-5; Revelation 13:8; Revelation 17:8). These individuals from every tribe, tongue and nation were chosen by God for adoption, not because of anything they would do but because of His sovereign will (Romans 9:11-13; Romans 9:16; Romans 10:20; 1 Corinthians 1:27-29; 2 Timothy 1:9). God could have chosen to save all men (He certainly has the power and authority to do so), and He could have chosen to save no one (He is under no obligation to save anyone). He instead chose to save some and leave others to the consequences of their sin (Exodus 33:19; Deuteronomy 7:6-7; Romans 9:10-24; Acts 13:48; 1 Peter 2:8).

There are many verses in both the Old and New Testaments that speak of election, and, when one looks at all the Bible teaches about election and predestination, it becomes obvious that God’s choice was not based on any foreseen act or response, but was based solely on God’s own good pleasure and sovereign will.

---

posted December 20, 2012 01:46 PM            

With all due respect, the Bible itself says people are not given a choice. God chooses who is going to heaven and hell before they are even born.

No, that is the doctrine of predestination which you have WRONG lol

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 20, 2012 02:05 PM            

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 20, 2012 02:08 PM            

quote:

---

No, that is the doctrine of predestination which you have WRONG lol

---

I always find it interesting that Christians believe Adam, Moses, John the Baptist , the Christ et al were predestined but....

They pick and choose What is considered predestination so it all fits neatly in one package.

posted December 20, 2012 02:11 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by juniperb:
and isn`t it predenstined who will inherit the earth? Or the fate of the Jews?

---

There is a doctrine of predestination which is it's own thing. You mix up lots of things, Juni, that do not go together. That is why you are confused, with all due respect

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 20, 2012 02:16 PM            

Ages have to be distinct--Age of the Law, Age of Grace, the Tribulation, Millenium

If people squish these together, the Bible will not make sense

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 20, 2012 02:17 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ami Anne:
There is a doctrine of predestination which is it's own thing. You mix up lots of things, Juni, that do not go together. That is why you are confused, with all due respect

---

with all due respect, how about the 144,000 elect?

No I`m not mixed up. I am familiar with predestination and so I know how it is used to turn things around. Not that it matters one whit but it always seems kind to point life out and how it is used to further ones beliefs. That includes all having beliefs.

posted December 20, 2012 02:18 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by juniperb:
with all due respect, how about the 144,000 elect?

No I`m not mixed up. I am familiar with predestination and so I know how it is used to turn things around. Not that it matters one whit but it always seems kind to point life out and how it is used to further ones beliefs. That includes all having beliefs.

---

The 144,000 are ONLY in the Tribulation in the last three years

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 20, 2012 02:21 PM            

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 20, 2012 02:30 PM            

YES

but they were predestinely choosen ie by God from the beginning of time. . It doesn`t matter what time period later they will go.

posted December 20, 2012 02:52 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by juniperb:
The 144,000 are ONLY in the Tribulation in the last three years.

YES

but they were predestinely choosen ie by God from the beginning of time. . It doesn`t matter what time period later they will go.

---

Right. So? There is prophecy and there is the Doctrine of Predestination. These are two different things, altogether

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal