posted March 24, 2013 12:55 AM            

I don’t know if it is the same for other Caps, but for me, sometimes I find it difficult to find words to describe my feelings or my appreciation. I’m quite sensitive and many (I mean, many things) invoke feelings in me. Usually they come to me like a tidal wave and I have ifficulties to put them into words. It can be because of my poor mercury lol.

@ 4lifephrases: SaturnineMoth has responded to your points about Capricorn very well so I’d just like to add a tiny reply to your current *situation*.

I can relate a bit to the feeling of living in a society like that. For what it’s worth, I’ll tell you a bit about my experience. My birth country is under the sign of Venusian Taurus. It’s a tropical country where the sky is blue and the weather is hot. Apart from that, everything is pretty much like you described where you live. There is also a great great great pressure to conform to society norms. Almost everything is practical, the rigidity sucked the dreams out of me. I left.

posted March 24, 2013 01:12 AM            

1) yes I agree, Capricorns are lonesome miserable unimaginative individuals who cannot love. Typical descriptions don't describe me well because I'm heavily Scorpio and Pisces flavoured

2) 10 so what?

3) Yes, literature classes

4) Not massively

5) N/a

6) Yes but I'd rather get rewarded just like that, without working towards it

7) no, people use me, then I sit there like an idiot telling myself never again

8) Never had to choose. And well if they loved me they'd understand if I couldn't

9) Less!! But I am more artistic than other signs because I've got so much Neptune

10) 10, too much Neptune

11) Capricorns exist to stay away from them. I'd never get laid with one, never !!!!!

posted March 24, 2013 03:35 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
Don't you love Cap loyalty??? I scratch your back, you scratch mine. All this, and we just met!

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posted March 25, 2013 08:16 AM            

Oh and I forgot to hug you back the other day!

<belated hug>

@andstuff~ Thank you for responding. Sad to say I've been used in my life, as well. That's what we get for being too loyal sometimes, I think.

posted March 25, 2013 08:20 AM            

1. What is your opinion of typical descriptions of the Capricorn personality? Does it describe you well?

The overall picture fits me, and that's only in aggregate. I'm the stereotypical image of a Capricorn, with Sun in 10th, and Mars and Mercury in 11th.

2. On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being "extremely important," how important do you think regular schooling is?

I find it a total waste of time. Neither school nor college nor graduate school gave me the proper tools nor prepared me for career success, which required specialized technical knowledge. The pious professors don't know their anteriors from their posteriors, hacving never ever worked a single day in the real world outside their dainty ivory towers.

3. Did you learn about what you were really interested in, in school?

Absolutely not. I learned everything I needed to learn in school and made my money learning everything myself. With the money I earned as a sophmore and junior in college, I gained my own wealth. If the finance professors at the Ivy League college were so smart, why couldn't they have wiped out the stock market, and why did I as a 24-25 year old clean house and made a fortune just arbitraging stocks in LBO/M&A play?

4. In your opinion, do Capricorns tend to be very interested in metaphysical studies?

Not for myself. Never had such an interest.

5. If you answered "yes" above, do you think our interest in metaphysics is downplayed or ignored in most astrology books?

Not applicable to me.

6. Are you a hard worker?

Up at 5am. In the office by 7am. Out of the office on a normal day at 7:30 pm, occassionally 10pm. Home by 9pm to 10pm usually. I'm an insanely hard worker. Intensed, focus, aggressive and ambitious.

7. Be honest...do you use people to get ahead in life? If so, how? If not, does it annoy you to be accused of using people?

Most definitely. Latch on to successful and older people to get ahead. Use diplomacy to partner even with adversaries to succeed. It is how the game is played. I don't care what people think. I do care what God thinks.

8. Are you consistently there for your loved ones, even when you have to make great sacrifices to do so?

Always. Loved ones before self. Loved ones before anything and everything. Give my life for the sake of my loved ones.

9. In your opinion, is Capricorn more or less artistic than other signs?

No opinion. I have an immense appreciation for the arts but absolutely have zero artistic abililities. I rely on my family members to supply the artistic genes.

10. On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being the most sentimental, how sentimental are you?

About an 8. However, I'm only talking about love relationships.

11. What is the one thing about Capricorns that you wish other people would realize?

They should realize that I'm just simply better and they should just accept it... just joking

That Capricorns are not boring. They are humourous and witty. They are not stoic. They are innovative problem solvers. They are not just aggressive, for even the most fearsome warrior can be doting and empathic. They are not just egotistical and opinionated. They can be humble and observant and tolerant of opposing viewpoints.

posted March 25, 2013 08:54 PM            

Sun in Capricorn 4th house direct
Moon in Cancer end of 9th house direct
Mercury in Capricorn 3rd house direct
Venus in Saggitarius 3rd house direct
Mars in Scorpio 1st house direct
Jupiter in Saggitarius 3rd house direct
Saturn in Scorpio 1st house direct
Uranus in Saggitarius 2nd house direct
Neptune in Saggitarius 3rd house direct
Pluto in Scorpio 1st house direct
North node Gemini 8th house retrogade

Libra ASC

posted March 25, 2013 09:00 PM            

~ PC~

my chart is here - PBB's Post picture of yourself, chart, and age thread pg 33

house positions - Cusps

It's probably our Sagittarius planets at work here as well as our Sun!- so much of what you wrote, (you express yourself so well by the way), I would agree with myself, and are things I have thought over and over again myself! I think the few differences would be a combination of life experiences being different, and having different chart rulers.

I think that in itself says a lot about the accuracy of astrology and how two people of the same sign, and almost exactly the same chart layout - can be subtly different, and considerably similar at the same time!

Faith - love this thread! <3

It would be great if others could also look into their sun placements (other suns, I mean) and find universally shared ideals and distinctions. ^^;

posted March 26, 2013 03:01 PM            

1. While there are variations of the typical Capricorn description, I think a Capricorn can extrapolate some of their personality via the typical description. The caveat is that it doesn't always appear in the way the typical description describes. For instance, a Capricorn Buddhist might not appear very ambitious, but may well still have that mindset of tackling a goal in a practical manner. The way Capricorns get things done are seldom in anyone's face, unless they're a particularly aggressive sort, maybe a first born, or someone whose chart would otherwise be indicative of an aggressive personality. Perhaps that is why Capricorn is depicted as either a mountain goat or a sea goat, the climbing takes place away from the plane of most of the other signs.

2. I don't understand the question. "Regular" versus what? Why is there a scale? Surely, all of our experiences must be helpful in some regard. If I had a Capricorn child would they attend regular school? Yes, but they would also be exposed to a lot of other things.

3. Not always, and it was especially bad in college actually. BUT, on the other hand, it's difficult to imagine that we would be into anything we weren't ever exposed to, so if school brings something we like to our attention, then we've benefited.

4. No. (EDIT: Personally, I think am to an extent, but metaphysical studies is a pretty big umbrella. I'm interested in psychology. Growing up I always thought it would be cool to understand people better than most people do. Getting into astrology probably grew out of that curiosity. I also heard the story of Solomon, and I wanted wisdom, too, which has lead me down certain paths including philosophy. I don't have an all-consuming curiosity like some Scorpios do towards certain subjects.)

5. No.

6. Depends/Can be. The goat is going up the mountain, though, and that doesn't always require "hard" work. Sometimes it just requires good planning, or knowing which routes are available.

7. Do I use people to get ahead in life? Sometimes. Does it bother me to be singled out as a sign that does this? Not really. If you think about it, everyone uses people to get ahead. All of our teachers are people. All of the books we read are by people. All of the things we're interested in are generally also the interest of other people. Perhaps Capricorns have a particular practical style of using things that other signs don't understand or something. I don't know. Certainly, I do "use," though.

Also, it may be important to note that sometimes we Capricorns enjoy doing things the hard way. We may use people to an extent, but we're not gaming the system to a greater extent than other more charming, or more squirrely signs. At least I don't think we are.

8. No, not even with my servant Virgo Moon.

9. More, but that's because Libra is in our Solar 10th house, and Taurus is in our Solar 5th. (You get solar houses by putting your sun sign on the ascendant, and reading the houses accordingly. This is what Sun Sign interpretation is supposed to be based on.)

10. Depends on mood. I can be really sentimental sometimes, but I can also shut it off if need be in order to get on with life, or be happy. I'm the master of myself to the extent that I can be.

posted March 26, 2013 04:14 PM            

I think it´s too superficial.
The descriptions don´t describe me at all, sorry.

2. On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being "extremely important," how important do you think regular schooling is?

Well, I think the most important thing in life is to be true to your soul, and if the school tries to guide the child in being true to his/her soul and make the best of his or her unique potential then 10. Otherwise - I guess zero.

3. Did you learn about what you were really interested in, in school?

No.

4. In your opinion, do Capricorns tend to be very interested in metaphysical studies?

Yes.

5. If you answered "yes" above, do you think our interest in metaphysics is downplayed or ignored in most astrology books?

Most of them, yes.

6. Are you a hard worker?

Yes. I do the best I can. But if work isn´t enjoyable I won´t work.

7. Be honest...do you use people to get ahead in life? If so, how? If not, does it annoy you to be accused of using people?

I have never used anyone to get ahead. I can´t do that even if I tried.

8. Are you consistently there for your loved ones, even when you have to make great sacrifices to do so?

Yes (much to my own disadvantage often)

9. In your opinion, is Capricorn more or less artistic than other signs?

I think less. But if they are artistic they are often succesful, because they have a powerful presence so sometimes people think they are better artists then they are. If they´re artistic they are usually musicians, I find.

10. On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being the most sentimental, how sentimental are you?

9.

11. What is the one thing about Capricorns that you wish other people would realize?

That meny of us have issues with socializing. (Specially if we hav alot of water in our chart)

posted March 26, 2013 04:15 PM            

I liked the Scorpio's comments. Sure, some of them weren't flattering, but there is a reason for those opinions.

quote:

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Capricorns are not socially awkward but socially lazy.

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It's too pithy a statement. I'll agree to not being socially awkward, but the reason it comes off as social awkwardness sometimes is that Capricorns doesn't see the value in the interaction. If a Capricorn is not engaging with people (well, it could be for any number of reasons), but I think that with regard to what you're saying it's not a matter of laziness, but of usefulness. If it's not useful, why bother?

quote:

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I guess things which comes naturally easy to most signs is so difficult to Caps.

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This is true of all signs. Each has gifts and deficiencies.

quote:

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Sometimes Caps has no f*king clue or are so afraid to show emotions, have logical and rational explanation for everything that suddenly they do not even sound human.

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It does seem uncomfortable to be a non-Capricorn human to Capricorns, it's true. That's what I was alluding to above. It's not being lazy, so much as avoidance because there is no perceived enjoyment to be gained.

quote:

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Capricorn is the sign if they be able to tame their ambitions and balance their life better. Every sign works hard and still balances their life and do not fail to do their social obligations.

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That's all that Capricorns are looking to do. Not the taming ambitions part. There's nothing wrong with that, but Capricorns want their lives balanced. The ambition serves as a vehicle towards that end.

quote:

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A) Caps can not see themselves how forceful or hard taskmaster they have been, due to rules and regulations they believe in. The reason and practicality with which they argue is impeccable where illogical reasoning,intuition and emotions wouldn't be entertained.

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Yes. We are difficult on people sometimes. That is sad even to us. My wife recently said I was overly harsh (in different words) for suggesting that she could do something she'd rather believe she can't do. We're Cardinal signs, and we have energy for the things we'd like to see other people do. Other people don't necessarily have the energy to entertain us, though.

quote:

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B) Most Caps get their calculation completely messed up or are not very honest about them. Caps strongly believe what others have done for them,it isn't for them. Instead Caps think they have been helping them to achieve their goals all along whereas the other party believes that they were helping Cap.

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This sounds like a particular quarrel that might not be typical. If it is, the Capricorn is saying that by you helping the Capricorn, you're also helping yourself, which may be true.

quote:

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C) Caps are unwilling to do same what others might have done for them.

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Depends on the Capricorn, and whether they're able and comfortable doing the same.

quote:

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D) Caps do not even at time appreciate it and yet expect appreciation from others, for things which they haven't even done.

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I'm not sure what this means. The object is something other people created, which the Capricorn has disparaged (perhaps privately), but which the Capricorn hails as good publicly without having contributed anything to it?

quote:

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If logic could save all the problems in life, then you shouldn't have any problems but that is not always the case.

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True. Life is illogical.

quote:

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Capricorn values himself/ herself by competing with others. Capricorn gains power by defeating others and suffers insecurity by not believing in himself/herself however pretends to be completely in control of situation. This pretence is visible.

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Largely right. We do cherish our reputation, and that reputation is gained by being a certain way around people. It's not always consciously competitive with other people, but I can see where you'd say that because it might very well be rooted in that. We are interested in proving ourselves, even if only to ourselves, and it gives us great joy when we're able to accomplish things.

quote:

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They do not make substantial amendments to their own behaviour.

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Either this is true of everyone, or this is true of no one. Capricorns do adjust in order to gain a better station in some way. It may not be a "substantial" amendment to their behavior, but a Capricorn couldn't amend their behavior in such a way that their basic personality would go away. I just don't think that's possible. On the other hand, I think Capricorns can have the discipline to make rather drastic behavior changes in the pursuit of their goals. They can sacrifice greatly for what they're working for.

quote:

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The truth is that at times Capricorn have emptiness to offer.

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To a Capricorn, it seems like we're offered emptiness. If we're offering emptiness to you, then either we don't value you, or you don't value us. If the value is there, then there won't be emptiness.

quote:

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If Caps can offer emotional empathy and spiritual fullness which another soul desires, the relationship would be much easier.

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That's a perception thing. I am drawn to emotional people. It gives me the opportunity to see how they live life. Conversely, emotional people are drawn to me, because I offer solidity and practicality. They want to see how a person lives without drama. It's a give and take sort of thing. Yes, a Capricorn could be too stoic at times, but so could an emotional person be too emotional. There is value in both qualities. Yin and Yang.

posted March 26, 2013 05:50 PM            

He or she reminds me of a younger version of myself.

posted March 26, 2013 10:06 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by SaturnineMoth:
[B] *sigh*

I believe forums are for discussion (absolutely do), but if the discussion is not directed at you - and one is so interested in the subject, they should actually be listening and not trying to instigate arguments and since the matter is being discussed straight from the goat's mouth, contradicting the claims made is a bit... disruptive - and does seem petty.

If this person were to actually read the posts by the Capricorns here - they'd be able to see very clearly that each of their misconceived sentiments against Capricorns is far off from what Capricorns here are actually stating they are like.

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I was nothing but respectful with stating clearly and fully being aware that I have chimed in despite it being Capricorn thread.
I found all the answers were shallow and it didn't answer questions until Acoustic God answered.

If you read my post then you would know why I had written it. If it isn't clear to you then

a) This is public forum and not private forum
b) My intend was to show you a different perspective and to help you grow.

quote:

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There's nothing to gain here - we're all speaking our truth - if you can't read what we're saying - don't subject us to reading what you "think" is truth. It's like a child arguing that they're right, just because they say they are right even though they don't even know what they are talking about, and the adult is calling their bluff, but the child still thinks he is right... (my nephew does this all the time, he kept demanding everyone was wrong about how potatoes are grown, even though he's never seen a potato growing, or learned how they are grown... or my other nephew insisting that the term used for handcuffs is jailcuff~ oh he's adorable he tells some zingers - but they don't know these things, they just think they do, so they think and often insist they are right...) basically, this is the same thing...

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Yes what's wrong with "jailcuff"?
Just because you are an adult doesn't mean in future they might not say it ? How many words have changed in English language. There is a possibility??
You are entirely right in doing what you are doing by today's rules.

quote:

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It is "my opinion" that judging from the way you have written as well as what you have written, that you have spent far too long trying to relate to what your own sign is supposed to be like, that you are actually mirroring those stereotypes... time for some soul searching, Scorpion. Maybe make a thread on the topic like this one, and ask for just other Scorpion suns to answer the same questions or something similar~ That way you can find out how much you are like what those books and articles have described, and how alike (or not) other Scorpions are.

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I am not entirely like in the books and from time to time I do make it a point to explain and understand my own traits. It even at times gets so frustrating that I realize when you start using astrology you are taking it to heights of judging someone without giving them a chance. However as we all humans do make judgements to make sense of things. I hate astrology stereotypes as well but it helps me to understand myself better and I completely understand that there is a generalization for a reason. There is x% of majority thinking this way.

quote:

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Other than that... yes, we've noted your unearned contempt of Capricorns as well as your distaste with living where you do. Thanks for sharing.

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Contempt NO ! Frustration YES !
I find it frustrating. Some places I find it more frustrating then others.

quote:

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Oh, and Jupiter... yes, he was so awesome when he swallowed Metis whole just so that his next born would not take over his lordship of Olympus. Good times, eh? Oh... wait... and ordering Hephaistos be thrown off the mountain... Giving humans a short lifespan and weapons... Punishing Prometheus for giving us "light". Ordering Pandora's creation as well as the "box" she held... I mean, what says "all-loving supreme being" better than a gift that you know will end in disaster~ ! YEAH!!! We just love Zeus/Jupiter.

(Like I'd mentioned above, there are so many things lost to time within astrology)~ It's wonderful that you love Jupiter~ I love my dominant Jupiter too, but I'm not gonna sweep all the negative sides of his character and blessings under the carpet just to make his presence anymore worthy than some other ruler. And, having Mars-Pluto as a ruler... wooh~ we can go on for days with all the negatives they embody too... Neptune, yeah he has them too, also in abundance... The Moon, yup even the dear ol' Moon has been naughty... Venus - of course... hah >.>; dirty deeds! Mercury, if you aren't familiar with his character, you'd be surprised~ ^^;

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Yes, I wouldn't profess I have clear understanding for all characters and I would look into it. Thanks for that.

quote:

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Bottom-line - every sign has negative traits, and every planet has negative traits - both can present themselves in a natal most are not permanent (progression - nothing ever stays the same) - but there is and will always be free will. It is the generalizing and stereotyping that we all want done away with. So if you want to base your entire opinion on any person of any sign's supposed traits based off of those references, or on a "few" characters you may or may not have personally known who did you wrong somehow (if only in your mind or to some other) who had some of the placements mentioned somewhere, that only shows that this kind of study is needed for you to view, and for people like you to recognize how erroneous those false interpretations and misrepresentations can be and often are.

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What is Astrology ? A judging tool and if you have problem with people judging you stop following astrology as you are pretty much doing the same to others.

I am not basing you just on your Sun Sign but for this conversation you have chosen to fight being on Capricorn side.Each of you Capricorn are as different as another one and I fully understand that.

quote:

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Not so you can meander by with passive animosity, and clearly not taking anything herein under account, babble on with your supposed resentment issues towards your sign or the sign of someone else, not stating your experience or what expertise you have in order to judge them so. That is exactly what wasn't asked for...

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Say for instance I hadn't mentioned that I was a Scorpio and I still saw Capricon had all these characters, would you still think I am being troll ?
You have just proved your inflexible ways. I am sorry.

quote:

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It's counterproductive and malicious to insert yourself into a peaceful crowd with no intent on giving the people there already any respect (reading their insights maybe, letting them sink in, asking them questions)... well unless you really are here to sabotage, and that is your intention - in which case -if you are that bored with your board viewing, you can probably find more entertainment elsewhere... well... unless you were trying to troll... hmmmm... Faith we may need to put trollbane in the corner of every post! Just in case!

While nothing truly heinous was said, it is still uncalled for, and not what was requested by the OP.

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I do not think it is counter productive.
Would you stop politicizing by rules.
I appreciate post from Acoustic Guitar as he already realized what was wrong and he clarified.I think what is counter productive is to decide to be stagnant and not grow. Yes, with similarity you can be happy and peaceful but with differences you grow.
I was respectful in my ways and I didn't think I was fighting at all. I said my piece, if you do not like it. I appreciate it and I am already realizing my waste of energy.

quote:

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But, more likely than not, you're miserable yourself, and felt like blaming your misery, (doing some mirroring) on someone else~ I hope it was cathartic enough for you~ And, I hope you have your eyes checked. I could understand why other Capricorn placement-ers are lured in, but who invited the Scorpio? (half-jest) lol Where did I miss that!? (Maybe I need my eyes checked too, eh?) But, the title clearly states, "Survey for Capricorns"

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Personal attack was completely uncalled for.
It is survey for Capricorns it didn't say please don't participate if you are any other signs. I do not think I have to say anything more as I know you are a grown up and would grow. I have full faith in you.

posted March 26, 2013 11:20 PM            

quote:

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That's a perception thing. I am drawn to emotional people. It gives me the opportunity to see how they live life. Conversely, emotional people are drawn to me, because I offer solidity and practicality. They want to see how a person lives without drama. It's a give and take sort of thing. Yes, a Capricorn could be too stoic at times, but so could an emotional person be too emotional. There is value in both qualities. Yin and Yang.

Capricorn is a feminine sign, though, so you should recognize that there actually is a lot of sensitivity there. It just gets turned off in order to accomplish things in the masculine world.[/B]

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Thank you Acoustic God.
I very recently, in fact only yesterday realized that. I understand that Capricorn stands for solidity and practicality.
To expect emotions is asking too much. Accepting it might be the best thing. They are great gatekeepers or taskmasters. I understand ambition bit as well. I understand need to have structure including hierarchy as well.

I guess most reasons there are this Sun Sign debates are only because people do not understand the sign completely , do not know how to deal with it and want to change their traits. I think instead of taking an offense to why sign is bad we just need to explain point of view.

Honestly my intentions are not here to make you look evil creatures but I have some relationship based questions which frustrates me /confuses me :

quote:

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To a Capricorn, it seems like we're offered emptiness. If we're offering emptiness to you, then either we don't value you, or you don't value us. If the value is there, then there won't be emptiness.

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1. If someone isn't value to you then are you saying the only way to built relationship is by providing value? If not, what is exception to rule. What do you value?

2. By saying "OK ! I want you to do this then only I would value you, creates you as an automatic authority but it also creates power struggle." Do you consider that people might be looking for value in you as well and how would you feel if roles were reversed ?

3.Isn't by asking "what's in it for you?" from very early stage you might be ruining your chances of future possibilities?

4. I do not mean to say in negative way but
"Is everything series of transactions"? How good are you at score keeping? Personal relationship has transactions as well and if so should your loved ones be weary of asking a help if it is just going to be another transaction? Really people can transact with anyone, why do you then still need family?
How do you deal when scores doesn't match?

Apart from Libra,this whole give and take rule can be a rude shock as with other sun sign it is very subtle and at times non existent.

5. Would you be capable of Unconditional Love or would it be too much to ask as it might conflict with your sense of justice and score keeping?

6. How do you show your feminine energy?
Do you feel apologetic about showing your feminine energy?

7. Do you find social relationships difficult ? Any internal reasons apart from not having enough time or thinking they are unimportant, while you are busy chasing your ambitions?

posted March 27, 2013 12:57 AM            

1. What is your opinion of typical descriptions of the Capricorn personality? Does it describe you well?

I think they kind of focus on the money, career and discipline aspects of Capricorn a little too much. No, it doesn't describe me very well. (I think many plain sun sign descriptions are probably inaccurate to that sun sign to be fair.)

2. On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being "extremely important," how important do you think regular schooling is?
6

3. Did you learn about what you were really interested in, in school?

Hmm. Well actually I took the classes that interested me but due to a lack of discipline I did not attend my classes and failed them for the most part. I am hoping to remedy the situation.

4. In your opinion, do Capricorns tend to be very interested in metaphysical studies?
I don't know that many Capricorns it seems. I would say off the top of my head that yes they do.

5. If you answered "yes" above, do you think our interest in metaphysics is downplayed or ignored in most astrology books?

I think our interest in metaphysics is kind of hidden. I don't know if we necessarily dress or speak in a way that would make you think "metaphysics". I do think it is mostly ignored.

6. Are you a hard worker?
It is all or nothing. Either I do not even attempt something at all or I give it my all. Usually not that many risks however. Lots of twisted pride.

7. Be honest...do you use people to get ahead in life? If so, how? If not, does it annoy you to be accused of using people?

Hmm. I think I may have used people in the past to not feel socially anxious in a room. I mean I liked the person well enough so I am not sure if it is really using them but I know that they made me feel less nervous.

8. Are you consistently there for your loved ones, even when you have to make great sacrifices to do so?
I think so.

9. In your opinion, is Capricorn more or less artistic than other signs?
I would say the same.

10. On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being the most sentimental, how sentimental are you?

8

11. What is the one thing about Capricorns that you wish other people would realize?

That we are not all extremely mature and serious all of the time. We have a sense of humor and we are silly and we are dynamic people. (Like every other sun sign.)

posted March 27, 2013 02:08 AM            

I actually read what you wrote initially, and I didn't think that it was strictly condemning Capricorns. You were expressing what you see, and I'm self-aware enough to recognize what you see. There was clearly some frustration with how Capricorns act, but I believe your frustration was born out of your desire for a better interaction with Capricorns.

quote:

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1. If someone isn't value to you then are you saying the only way to built relationship is by providing value? If not, what is exception to rule. What do you value?

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I'm not sure if there is an exception. It would be nice if there were. I don't mean for that to sound harsh, though. If theoretically you were a person I don't like to engage with, I would still be impressed if I saw you express qualities that I find valuable. For instance, maybe I normally think you're obnoxious or something, but then I get to witness a really touching act of kindness or servitude, unless I have very good reason to suspect your motives I would let that reshape my opinion of you.

What do I value? Lots of things. A good sense of humor, an easy going manner, an informed mind, a rebel streak, self-control, self-awareness, not being manipulative, cleverness (I have Gemini Rising), a discerning eye, having style, seeing the value in me.

quote:

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2. By saying "OK ! I want you to do this then only I would value you, creates you as an automatic authority but it also creates power struggle." Do you consider that people might be looking for value in you as well and how would you feel if roles were reversed ?

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I agree with your first sentence, and I wouldn't want someone to perform for me in exchange for my favor. I don't like that kind of interaction either. No, I'd prefer you be yourself, and give me the opportunity to notice your value.

If the roles were reversed, I would just try. Not all the time probably, but I would stay friendly even in times when I wasn't in the mood to really play around in an effort to be charming. I won't let myself get into the position where I'm just worshiping someone, though. It wouldn't do me good, and it probably wouldn't do my manipulator good for me to just always be seeking their favor.

I don't seek a lot of people's attention. I'm remarkably ok with myself at this stage in life. I don't want to burn bridges, though, and I don't want people to think I stopped caring for them just because I'm being aloof. I know it's hard on some people that I just can't be engaging all the time. Particularly since getting married I feel like I have to have a little more boundary in place.

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3.Isn't by asking "what's in it for you?" from very early stage you might be ruining your chances of future possibilities?

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I don't think I was thinking about what's in it for me at a very early stage. My chart has a stellium in Sagittarius in the 7th (Libra's house), so I have an "others" kind of mindset. When I was young I would see friends that I sometimes thought acted inappropriately in their selfishness. I can't say that I followed all the rules myself, but there was always a sense of right and wrong.

With regard to future possibilities, I like to think that Capricorns are always gearing up for future possibilities. We become younger and looser as we get older. I think we go through these long blocks of adulthood creating the systems that are going to allow us to relax someday. I don't know of any friend that's spent more time debt free than me. I lived modestly for sure, but I didn't like the stress of debt, so I got rid of it. I'm now back into debt through marriage, but I'm still equally anxious to be out of it again. I'm learning all I can about investing, so that one day I can retire in peace. I hope that something like this illustrates that it's not just being competitive with people, but it's also having a purpose. I do think that a person with no debt is superior to a person with debt generally, but that's not my sole consideration for why I don't want debt.

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4. I do not mean to say in negative way but
"Is everything series of transactions"? How good are you at score keeping? Personal relationship has transactions as well and if so should your loved ones be weary of asking a help if it is just going to be another transaction? Really people can transact with anyone, why do you then still need family?
How do you deal when scores doesn't match?

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This is another one that is not great for me to answer. Not only do I have a chart focused on others, but I also have a Virgo Moon, so I show my appreciation for people by doing nice things. In personal relationships, my partner will probably always get away with far more than I do. I can keep score yes, but I hope to never use it, and especially now that I'm married. It just wouldn't make sense for me to upset her in that way despite the charges often levied at me. The relationship as a whole is more valuable than a momentary interaction.

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5. Would you be capable of Unconditional Love or would it be too much to ask as it might conflict with your sense of justice and score keeping?

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I try to be as fair as they come. I grew up Christian, and kind of grew disillusioned with it when I realized that Christians don't really follow Christ. His example was to hang out and love the sinners. He gave two commandments, and the second was to love everyone as he did. I still like to think that I'm trying to do that. I don't know how objective I am about how I'm doing. There are a lot of annoying traits out there, and sometimes it seems like I can't handle the stupidity of some people. But my personal sense of justice is tied to my planets in Libra and Sagittarius. I've got Pluto and Uranus in Libra, and Neptune, Venus, and Mercury in Sag. That's half of my planets.

posted March 27, 2013 09:13 AM            

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Originally posted by SaturnineMoth:
Faith - love this thread! <3

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Me, too!

Thank you everyone for replying.

I have a lot of comments and observations that I want to make, I just need time to pull it all together.

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Originally posted by SaturnineMoth:
It would be great if others could also look into their sun placements (other suns, I mean) and find universally shared ideals and distinctions. ^^;

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I would love to read something like this for every sign. First of all, it would be interesting to see what topics would come up in the survey. For example, I'm guessing that if it was written by an Aries for other Aries people, different questions would be asked than if I created the list of questions.

So far this thread has demonstrated that we are all sentimental (your 5 rounds up to a 10, according to standard mathematical practice. *wink*) I think that if a person from another sign created this survey, it wouldn't have even occurred to them to ask whether we are sentimental or not-- the reigning assumption is, we are not.

Now we have *proof* that we unanimously are.

Who knows, maybe others will be inspired to create surveys for their sign? Not to flatter myself...I just would genuinely like to see what would come of it.

posted March 27, 2013 09:19 AM            

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Originally posted by SaturnineMoth:
I love reading everyone's responses here - we have so many different goats here - the iron hide, mountain goat, the satyrs, the grumpy billy goats, the mystic seagoats, I think we have a little bit of every side of the Sun sign present! lol

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i hope you hadn't noticed my answers, because I don't wish to be an object of your ADORABLE label-sticking

posted March 27, 2013 09:30 AM            

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Originally posted by andstuff:
I am not even a goat, despite my sun sign.

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