posted October 16, 2014 11:42 AM            

Can you give examples from people you know or charts you have done. I am always ready to learn new things!

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posted October 16, 2014 11:59 AM            

However, as I observe them, I can see how they are exactly like water voids.

No other void argues about their void. They accept it. The air void does, once in a while, but the water void( or low water) does almost all the time lol

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posted October 16, 2014 12:00 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
I don't mean this to start a fight but when I have discussions on voids and I have had many, the water void always argues that they are not like water voids lol

However, as I observe them, I can see how they are.

No other void argues about their void. They accept it. The air void does, once in a while, but the water void( or low water) does almost all the time lol

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What do you mean?
How so?

posted October 16, 2014 12:06 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
I don't mean this to start a fight but when I have discussions on voids and I have had many, the water void always argues that they are not like water voids lol

However, as I observe them, I can see how they are.

No other void argues about their void. They accept it. The air void does, once in a while, but the water void( or low water) does almost all the time lol

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What do you mean?
How so?
Argues that they are or are not a void..?

posted October 16, 2014 12:09 PM            

The water void does not have the same empathy and same ability to pick up subtext as a high water person.

ts is the nature of the chart and not anyone's fault.

However, they will argue and argue that this is not true, not everyone but many people.

However, then I will observe actions and see that it is lol

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posted October 16, 2014 12:39 PM            

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posted October 16, 2014 12:52 PM            

I can't waste my time with people who do not want to learn what their chart actually says

Everyone has hard things in his chart. The Water Void is one of the hardest imo

I, personally, tell things as they are.

I can't talk around things.

Now, if a person has a Void like a Fire Void, he may really try to overcome it BUT he must face it first and not deny he has it.

That is my point, here.

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posted October 16, 2014 12:52 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Vajra:
My oldest male friend, a Leo sun, is a total water void, the only such person among my acquaintances. He's also a near Earth void with only the AC in Capricorn, but no planets. I've known this guy intimately for 25 years, and he is without a doubt the single most empathetic and emotionally deep person I've met, even though he's a man. He's a counselor and psychiatrist by profession and has a strong ability to provide emotional support to people. He's let me cry on his shoulder and held my hand many a time. Since according to Popper only one contrary example is needed to disprove a hypothesis, I guess it's clearly not right, based on this example of my friend, to say water voids are automatically unemotional, cold, or what not. Because fire (which he has in abundance) is emotionality too, just a different kind.

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Ok. I hope this isn't straying too far off the path.
I may have my idea of empathy all wrong also but this is what I think of.
When I think of an empathetic person, I think of someone who feels and identifies with others feelings. Joins you in tears or cries more easily during movies, etc.
I think of a less empathetic person as looking at another's situation and feelings with more logic, reason, and analytically. They can still care for people, Imo, and want to help, but don't get swept away in the emotion and circumstances so easily.

What do think?
Yay or nay?

posted October 16, 2014 01:04 PM            

Anyways, I have been looking through my charts and I am pretty shocked. I do know another Water void person, she was one of my besties in college. I haven't looked at her chart in a long-long time and I don't think I paid attention to voids back then. Oddly, also a Leo with a Libra rising. Her only water was her MC, no planets in water signs. She was neither insensitive, nor unfeeling. She used to cry A LOT and had a lot of anxiety about her studies and her future; she was quite withdrawn and shy (especially for a Leo!) and loved deeply a boy she had known since they were little - he was her neighbor, they got married, had two beautiful twins, then the idiot cheated on her - she suffered a lot. By that time I had moved from her city but we used to talk a lot on the phone and she cried all the time.. So she was quite able to feel and express emotion, but did second guess herself a lot about reading people's intentions. She might have been a bit gullible there. Like in the case of Mr. Cap, the divorce stoke her like thunder, she had NO explanation for it (same with him), could not fathom to understand the other person's point of view. She tried to understand him, she reached out to him, but he didn't give her an explanation.
Here's why. He's an EARTH void! His only Earth is Chiron, no angle, no nothing. He was in the military, so he had to have the discipline.. from somewhere! But I guess he flanked the commitment test.. He wasn't good with money, though, he actually launched a few schemes at some point, but only ended up in debt. The funny part is he's also a Water singleton, his only Water is Jupiter (well, an NN). Him, as opposed to my friend, was pretty unemotional! Rarely, if ever, would show him feelings, I thought it was all his time in the military, because my friend was delighted about their intimacy - he was kind, tender, affectionate.

Wow..

I'm going to keep looking, who knows what I'll find next!

posted October 16, 2014 01:05 PM            

People say they don't have it but the chart says they do lol

DF

The Water Void processes emotions differently. That does not make them bad or not having feelings.

It is that the language of emotions is not really their language. It is kind of a foreign language.

For me, as an earth void, the world of the practical is that way for me.

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posted October 16, 2014 01:18 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by DeepFreeze:
Ok. I see.
Interesting....

Maybe I'll have to research it and try to understand better. I like detail!

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I am gonna do an article on it. I may not put it up because I don't really want to get into fights.

I am going to write about the 2 most defended placements.

Chiron in the 12th and the Water Void

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posted October 16, 2014 01:28 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by DeepFreeze:
Ok. I hope this isn't straying too far off the path.
I may have my idea of empathy all wrong also but this is what I think of.
When I think of an empathetic person, I think of someone who feels and identifies with others feelings. Joins you in tears or cries more easily during movies, etc.
I think of a less empathetic person as looking at another's situation and feelings with more logic, reason, and analytically. They can still care for people, Imo, and want to help, but don't get swept away in the emotion and circumstances so easily.

What do think?
Yay or nay?

Heck I don't want to feel my own emotion half the time. They are difficult enough to deal with. I don't need to feel other people's also!

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Hmm... I don't know, Deep Freeze. Someone who's not empathetic normally wouldn't even notice another's emotional distress so much, much less feel prompted to help out. Those people tend to be annoyed at another's emotional displays more than touched, in my experience.

The friend I mentioned has a very deep natural empathy. He has no idea he's a water void, since he's not into astrology, and so he doesn't "defend" himself against anything here, not that there would be any need to defend himself in the first place for being a deeply emotional person.

posted October 16, 2014 01:32 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dancing Maenad:
they know pupici well, don't they?

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posted October 16, 2014 01:52 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Vajra:
The friend I mentioned has a very deep natural empathy. He has no idea he's a water void, since he's not into astrology, and so he doesn't "defend" himself against anything here, not that there would be any need to defend himself in the first place for being a deeply emotional person.

I mentioned this example in order to show that a faulty conclusion can easily be drawn from someone having a water (or any kind of) void. Sorry if some favorite theory does not conform with this evidence, that's really too bad, but rather than claiming the evidence is wrong and the theory always right, wouldn't it be more enlightened to take this as an indication that the theory might need some mending? Putting one's own personal judgment on a pedestal in a matter as complicated as astrology is hardly advisable. No one has seen, much less understood, enough charts to make such absolute judgments.

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Very well said, Vajra! One should always test their opinions and subject their theories to experiment. I'm shocked to see I have been living next to quite a few voids, I'm not even through half my database and I have found a bunch of Air and Earth voids, as well as another Water. One of the Air voids is a speaker for a multinational company. The other two Air voids I found are very, very intelligent, but not very good communicators. One of the Earth voids has been my best friend for more than a decade and she was very organized, she always made lists about everything. My Grandfather was an earth void and one of his hobbies was gardening (Ami, you also have this, no? Working with the earth's fruits, what can be more satisfying to an Earth void person?). One of my dearest colleagues in high school is an Earth void and he took the BEST, most organized notes, ever. Everyone was asking for his notes. He was very disciplined and very reliable. My mom would not let me go to a party unless he would come to pick me up and bring me back home. He inspired trust and dependability. He was a Pisces he's a doctor now and a very meticulous one too.
The other Water void I have found was my first crush ever, I was 7-8 years old and my crush lasted for ~5 years. He didn't share my feelings but was able to reject me with such delicacy for such a young age! His mom liked me a lot, he wanted us to get married I hanged out at their house a lot. He was very attached to his mom, they were very close. He and I are still in contact, he is married now and loves his wife very, very much. They have quite a few tender and affectionate pictures on their FB lol.

So far, no Fire voids in my database.. Are these that rare?!

posted October 16, 2014 02:04 PM            

I have an organic garden which I love as much as a person

The thing with Voids is that one cannot make linear conclusions like I know a water void and he is empathetic.

First of all, one must question THAT person and one must OBSERVE that person.

One cannot go by self reports to get good data.

One needs to observe, too.

One can gather enough self reports to make theories but this has to be augmented by observation.

After all this, if a person tells me he is NOT like something, I do not accept that.

Like if an exact Chiron conj the ASC tells me he was not bullied, I would not believe that.

I would think he is in denial.

The Void CRAVES it's Void element. I crave being in the dirt. I crave touching my dog who is earth, as are animals.

The fact that I am a really good gardener does not negate that I am an Earth Void.

You can't draw external conclusions like that imo

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posted October 16, 2014 02:29 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
DM
Randall is a Fire Void, as is Doux Reve.

I have an organic garden which I love as much as a person

The thing with Voids is that one cannot make linear conclusions like I know a water void and he is empathetic.

First of all, one must question THAT person and one must OBSERVE that person.

One cannot go by self reports to get good data.

One needs to observe, too.

One can gather enough self reports to make theories but this has to be augmented by observation.

After all this, if a person tells me he is NOT like something, I do not accept that.

Like if an exact Chiron conj the ASC tells me he was not bullied, I would not believe that.

I would think he is in denial.

The Void CRAVES it's Void element. I crave being in the dirt. I crave touching my dog who is earth, as are animals.

The fact that I am a really good gardener does not negate that I am an Earth Void.

You can't draw external conclusions like that imo

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Stubbornness is an Earth quality too!

Ami, how you draw your conclusions is your business. But I would use a bit more caution and common sense when advising clients.

posted October 16, 2014 02:41 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dancing Maenad:
Well, in respect to his ex-wife at least, he is blaming her for everything. He was oblivious to the fact that the relationship got sour, perhaps he did miss those cues, and he was also working too much back then. I can see it from his pov too: he thought he gave everything to the relationship (mainly money and his hard work.. but as we all know, it is not enough) and found himself 1. cheated, 2. divorced, 3. without his kids, 4. without half of his assets. I would be red angry too, anyone would. But I still think at some point he will have to own up to the fact that he neglected her because of his work and she looked elsewhere for her happiness (to be quite frank, I don't blame her too much for it, because he is simply inaccessible when he is in the work "zone"). He is purely oblivious to that fact, he thinks he's done nothing wrong. I think this is one way in which his voideness manifests.

Funny you should mention Capricorn singers, this whole madness started with one. Well, he's Sag Venus, not Cap, but his Sun is around the same degree as this guy's (mainly conj my Asc). I was disinterested in guys and relationships for a while, then I had a tiny obsession for this singer and soon after, I met Mr. Cap and started obsessing about him lol. I did a little search on astrotheme and surprisingly I like almost everyone on that list. Ha. I will take your advice. Well maybe not Jamiroquai much lol (or Pitbull eww). Mr. Cap reminds me a bit (physically) of Bradley Cooper, they have quite a few placements in common, but well, he's not THAT good looking lol. I still like him though.

Can you answer another thing for me, regarding his psychology? He seems to have friendzoned me and now he's giving me dating tips, as in who to date etc. Funny thing is he is kinda describing himself (older, financially stable, different profession than mine etc) - I kept silent because quite frankly I don't get it, I thought I was dating HIM lol. Is this some sort of twisted test Cap Venus does?!

I know Taurus mind frame quite well, these I have dated, lol. I am Taurus Venus myself (conj his Moon). I get the Taurus, I sometimes get the Cap too, maybe even his Virgo rising. But at the end of the day, I'm still mostly Fire and must act like it.

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Hey there,

there are a few things I want to note here. A man is typically less likely to blame himself, regardless of sign. Also, cap do blame others internally but we do not go out and make a scene. A lot of cap people can be materialistic jerks. A cap man can be so devoted to career that he does not see other things as important (I have seen this a lot). THIS is more than just a cue, it is conscious effort to dismiss several cues. Furthermore, this man and his ex-wife seemed to want different things in relationships, so we should look at their synastry and composite for signs.

A heavily earth person, especially with a lot of cap, would think of him/herself as a solid rock that the world relies on. So he/she doesnt see emotional matters as important; their response would be: "Babe, you can get a hug and consolation from any one but at the end of the day, when you are rotten and weak, whom do you rely on? No one but me."

On his response to you, I think he is friendzoning you. I would only say things like that to people I am not interested in any more. However, you can have an open discussion with him that you think you two can work out because a, b, c, d. Cap influenced people do not like small talk and do not talk things out. This is a BAD tendency and it goes nowhere if the other person decides to stay quiet too.

Cap venus is also known for having to learn hard lessons about love. Love, flirting do not come naturally to us. If you care enough about this man, have an honest conversation with him, let him talk things through.

That is my advice any way lol.
Here is a good blog post about that: http://astroskies.blogspot.com/2008/04/venus-in-capricorn-in-music.html

posted October 16, 2014 03:04 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by theunknown:
Hey there,

there are a few things I want to note here. A man is typically less likely to blame himself, regardless of sign. Also, cap do blame others internally but we do not go out and make a scene. A lot of cap people can be materialistic jerks. A cap man can be so devoted to career that he does not see other things as important (I have seen this a lot). THIS is more than just a cue, it is conscious effort to dismiss several cues. Furthermore, this man and his ex-wife seemed to want different things in relationships, so we should look at their synastry and composite for signs.

A heavily earth person, especially with a lot of cap, would think of him/herself as a solid rock that the world relies on. So he/she doesnt see emotional matters as important; their response would be: "Babe, you can get a hug and consolation from any one but at the end of the day, when you are rotten and weak, whom do you rely on? No one but me."

On his response to you, I think he is friendzoning you. I would only say things like that to people I am not interested in any more. However, you can have an open discussion with him that you think you two can work out because a, b, c, d. Cap influenced people do not like small talk and do not talk things out. This is a BAD tendency and it goes nowhere if the other person decides to stay quiet too.

Cap venus is also known for having to learn hard lessons about love. Love, flirting do not come naturally to us. If you care enough about this man, have an honest conversation with him, let him talk things through.

That is my advice any way lol.
Here is a good blog post about that: http://astroskies.blogspot.com/2008/04/venus-in-capricorn-in-music.html

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Ah, I do not have the ex-wife's chart! I'd like to look at their synastry and comp too. I don't even know her sign. I haven't asked him many questions, he seemed like he needed to vent so I let him do that, it seemed more important to have someone listen to him rather than give him advice.

Nah, if he friendzoned me, I'm not gonna do anything about it. My pride is too big! I went out on a limb for guys before, but as I get older I am less willing to do that. Not only I can clearly see everything that is wrong with him, lol, but I also know there's plenty of fish in my sea. No need to get aggravated by one pair of pants. I do care about him, but I am fine with being friends too. I have doubted from the start that he would be able to give me the relationship I want.
He's the one that keeps calling though, and wants to see me. I would prefer, if he truly did friendzone me, that he'd send less mixed signals.

posted October 16, 2014 03:12 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by hypatia238:
Older generation has pluto in Leo and the younger has Neptune in Sag..finding a fire void will be challenging .

Even the Neptune in cap generation; they have uranus in Aries right??

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Noo, they had it in Cap or Aqua. I did find a Fire void, my youngest cousin actually. A Virgo with Sun in the 12th. When she was younger, she really did seem to lack confidence, she was very shy and introverted. She changed though, once in her 20s, I had a debate with her about psychology (she was a student back then, now is licensed) and I was surprised how confidently she supported her arguments. She became more confident in her looks and her ideas and it all had to do with becoming more active (working 2 jobs while in college), she rarely stays still! lol