posted July 20, 2016 11:39 AM            

Aquaguy,
this can go the other way, such as when you approach a woman in a genuine way, she cannot read it properly, probably because of all the objectifiers that have mimicked being genuine simply to get her knickers off!

posted July 20, 2016 11:39 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:

When we live in an objectifying culture, it is sometimes difficult to tell the difference between genuine compliment and an objectification with an agenda attached.

When we change this culture, it will become clearer, and those whose values are more similar will find each other more easily.

Currently, it is a minefield.

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posted July 20, 2016 11:41 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
[b]

When we live in an objectifying culture, it is sometimes difficult to tell the difference between genuine compliment and an objectification with an agenda attached.

When we change this culture, it will become clearer, and those whose values are more similar will find each other more easily.

Currently, it is a minefield.

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posted July 20, 2016 12:06 PM            

Because, well, how did they get there? Did similar circumstances condition them to see that kind of behavior as okay? (And if they did, why are we okay with that as long as we don't see it as affecting us? Which, by the way, in a perfect world, it would still affect us.) Isn't continuing to treat them that way harming them even more? (And further decreasing the value of women in the eyes of men, while we're at it.)

posted July 20, 2016 12:29 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StubbornVirgo:
I personally don't view a stranger grabbing my butt as acceptable, since it still falls into that definition of objectifying women. I recognize that there's some women who welcome that kind of objectification, but at least for me, that's still an unacceptable way to treat women.

Because, well, how did they get there? Did similar circumstances condition them to see that kind of behavior as okay? (And if they did, why are we okay with that as long as we don't see it as affecting us? Which, by the way, in a perfect world, it would still affect us.) Isn't continuing to treat them that way harming them even more? (And further decreasing the value of women in the eyes of men, while we're at it.)

That's where I'm at, at least. I'm very pro-women. It's impossible for me to accept any form of objectification, even that which isn't directed at me, as acceptable.

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posted July 20, 2016 12:43 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
I am very vocal about the objectification of women, StubbornVirgo, in all area of my life. I hope you didn't take my post as accepting this behaviour.
I was viewing it analytically.

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I understand your intent now. Ignore my puritanical rant, if you will.

posted July 20, 2016 12:51 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by DopGang:
Depends on how you let them know. Politely or like you're living in a porno.

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posted July 20, 2016 12:51 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
Thank you Andstuff.

Yes. Our perception of femininity has been severely distorted by the current media agenda of sexual objectification.

And it has been venturing into dangerous ground where we are seuxalising children, as per Britney Spears "Hit me Baby" video, gracefully picked up by Miley Cyrus' recent sexualisation of a BABY no less, in her "music" video.

We live in a world obsessed by looks.
That judges attractiveness by first and foremost what is on the outside.

How many women will get offended if a guy says he values her traits of compassion, creativity, integrity, honesty?

Cat-calling and whistling are only flattering to those over-attached to their appearance as they only send a message about the physical appearance.
--- There are some women who are sick of being reduced to this shallow film of existence.

Aquaguy,
saying "hello" is clearly not intrusive.
But it may take a while for women to be able to see what genuine, holistic interest from a man looks like within the current culture.

This move should help makes it easier for us to do that.

Of course, women and NOT without blame here. One only has to go to the pub on a Saturday night to see women objectifying themselves along with the men, just for that little shred of validation.

--- THIS is also a major problem, as it perpetuates the objectification that they then complain about when they are "humped and dumped".

Those interested in genuine connection need to try and find each other in a sea of robotic, shallow interactions.
This is hard.
Hard for those men and women who wish TRUE connection with another.

This law, if handled with wisdom, could make it easier for people to truly connect with others, by limiting freedom to objectify.

I do understand your concern Aquaguy, that this may be abused by some unscrupulous women as a power move against men.

The same old power games between men and women will initially play out, I suspect.
But over time, I believe this should be a positive thing for our ability to relate to the PERSON, and not simply the sexual availability of that person or the flattery doled out with which to conquer them.

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posted July 20, 2016 01:30 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StubbornVirgo:
I understand your intent now. Ignore my puritanical rant, if you will.

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posted July 20, 2016 06:29 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
No probs, I am glad to meet a fellow "anti-objectificationer"!

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posted July 21, 2016 07:49 AM            

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posted July 21, 2016 09:48 AM              

But then again, in my youth, the two guys following me all through the city, constantly touching my, despite me having made clear I didn`t want that, were just flirting either, right?
How did I NOT get it? There I was thinking all the time I was being objectified and molested.

-------------------------

However it is just as dumb to assume that every man who looks at a woman or sais `Hello`is a potential rapist. That is just the other end of this scale.

posted July 21, 2016 04:19 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
Guys,
things are not as simple as you make them out to be. I don't think women will become more open and approachable if some guys stop whistling at them and being crude. I live in the Southern United States and guys are very polite and chivalrous to girls here, and young women are still paranoid as f*ck. I can walk down the street and exchange pleasantries with everyone but young women with no problems. If a guy says hello to a young woman here they will often look at him like he is Michael Myers. I blame this nonsense on feminism. It is toxic and brainwashes women to fear and hate men. Things like what I mentioned in the OP will only lead to more fear and paranoia.

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WORD

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posted July 21, 2016 04:52 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StubbornVirgo:
If you're going to blame anything, it's better to blame the hoards of men who mistreat women everyday. ........

.........
Sorry, but your theories hold no weight. All I can deduct from this discussion is that you're unhappy with the results of your own approach and are looking for someone to blame.

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posted July 21, 2016 05:01 PM              

I have never felt harassed by a man who was just talking to me, and maybe even patting my shoulder or arm for emphasizing something he said. That is just absurd!
It depends on the context though.

It always comes down to specific situations between specific individuals. So it is completely absurd to generalize and judge a whole gender, every member of that gender, for something they might not even be doing ever.

posted July 21, 2016 05:11 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StubbornVirgo:

Sorry, but your theories hold no weight. All I can deduct from this discussion is that you're unhappy with the results of your own approach and are looking for someone to blame.

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posted July 21, 2016 05:18 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:

And all I can deduce is you're the typical feminist who stoops to personal attacks when your worldview is challenged. My views arent "theories", they are common sense. Feminists do spread hatred and fear of men. Anyone who denies that is dishonest or ignorant (That's putting it nicely).

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posted July 21, 2016 05:29 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:

And all I can deduce is you're the typical feminist who stoops to personal attacks when your worldview is challenged. My views arent "theories", they are common sense. Feminists do spread hatred and fear of men. Anyone who denies that is dishonest or ignorant (That's putting it nicely).

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posted July 21, 2016 05:36 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by andstuff:

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That was my reaction when I read that, too.

posted July 21, 2016 05:47 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by andstuff:

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posted July 21, 2016 05:50 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StubbornVirgo:
Yes.

There's a huge difference between walking up to a woman and telling her you think she's beautiful and whistling or yelling at someone from across the parking lot.

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