posted May 18, 2015 12:49 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by olgatheo:
Uranus is exact opp. your Natal Mars - this is very cleansing - things clear up very quickly , esp. anything associated with the past ( Saturn- family/relationships/home life/self image)!
You will have no patience with this placement, maybe channel the energy into projects/working out/studying occult .
I have noticed a cutting quality even with my clients could mean a surgery to any 4 Cardinal parts or differences with Cardinal signs.
P.S Gabby Will send report to you to forward to Voix

---

posted May 18, 2015 01:33 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by olgatheo:
@voix- Uranus is exact opp. your Natal Mars - this is very cleansing - things clear up very quickly , esp. anything associated with the past ( Saturn- family/relationships/home life/self image)!
You will have no patience with this placement, maybe channel the energy into projects/working out/studying occult .
I have noticed a cutting quality even with my clients could mean a surgery to any 4 Cardinal parts or differences with Cardinal signs.
P.S Gabby Will send report to you to forward to Voix

---

Thank you Olgatheo.

Yes, my tolerance for certain things has been low.

Particularly the rampant sexual objectification in society, and society's worship of the media.

Many a rant is being had about that and I have virtually banished all traces of that crap from my life now.

And yes, I feel clean.

posted May 18, 2015 03:34 PM            

I just realised, t.URANUS is conj. (4' applying) to my freedom point.

posted May 18, 2015 03:41 PM            

You, 2' Aquarius:
AQUARIUS 2
A woman strolling in a garden. She is unaware that she is being watched by elves.
We adopt a split-screen mind when the outward frame of things seems so insistent that we must be reasonable and logical and make complete sense in a quantitative, functional way. But what happens is that the other side of our awareness, the outlawed side, gets very strong in the subconscious and stays alive. We can almost play off of it in emphasizing our skeptical or worldly approach to things. But there is a joke to it. For you are aware of what you are not aware of--you are tuned into the very things you deny. This kind of edge hones the mind and the soul. It teaches invaluable lessons, not the least of which is to make way for the unknown while hugging the known close to you, knowing all the whole how profoundly the unknown beckons.

Me, 22' Aries:
ARIES 22
Puppets coming alive at night.
The inner worlds can be just as animated, as fully fleshed out, as vivid and vibrant as any outer world could ever hope to match. There are vast kingdoms to explore on the inner. It is all a matter of motivation: if you seek for inward substantiation, you will get it to infinity and beyond. Here you get what you ask for. Everything snowballs. It tests you mightily, in that everything inside comes out. A wish like magic becomes embodied. Being so fertile and ingenious is one of the most demanding possible arenas to put yourself in. Most difficult of all is that if you fear or dread, resist or deny, these too have full power to play themselves out all the way. The inner life becomes the place where everything's happening, and where you must cultivate your highest and your best, or else be treated to the validation and proof of whatever you put in there coming out again amplified, magnified, completely full-on.

posted May 18, 2015 03:45 PM            

You:

PHASE 302 (AQUARIUS 2°): AN UNEXPECTED THUNDERSTORM.

KEYNOTE: The need to develop the inner security which will enable us to meet unexpected crises.

An interesting connection can be made between the symbols for Taurus 1° and 2° — "A clear mountain stream" and "An electrical storm" — and those for Aquarius 1° and 2°, two hundred and seventy degrees apart (a "waning" square, in terms of a cycle of relationship such as the lunation cycle). In the first case we deal with energies or activities that can be related to the natural development of the individual. But here we are primarily concerned with social, collective processes and the function of the individual within them. The symbol itself — "An unexpected thunderstorm" — could be given a very positive meaning in an arid environment, but the emphasis on "unexpected" tends to accent the sudden and dangerous character of the event. Such a thunderstorm in a region of dry hills can cause a devastating flood. At any rate, it refers to an event for which one is not prepared — a menace to men's works.

Seen as a second stage symbol — thus in contrast to the preceding one — this scene stresses the fact that nature may reduce to impermanence the seemingly most permanent endeavors and constructive activities of men. Under a downpour of rain, adobe brick can return to mud. All human institutions and their achievements can be washed away, even in their day of great glory. "Dust you were, dust you must become." This is NATURE'S CHALLENGE.

Me:

PHASE 22 (ARIES 22°): THE GATE TO THE GARDEN OF ALL FULFILLED DESIRES.

KEYNOTE: Abundance made possible by human togetherness and cooperation.

In contrast to the crude and cruel road to fame and power symbolized by the prizefighter, we now see a symbol of apparently wide-open and effortless fulfillment. Alone, a human being can barely survive in nature's great life drama; in organized groups men can in due time fulfill their desires. The abundant life is in theory open to all. At least this is the ideal, the great dream. This symbol can also be given an erotic meaning, referring to womanhood.

At the second stage of this series of symbols, the goal of happiness dominates the consciousness of cultural man, the more validly so the more modest his desires. Religious philosophies, like American New Thought, glorify this social feeling of abundance, glamorizing it into an avid COSMIC OPTIMISM and a cult of success.

posted May 18, 2015 09:18 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
Gabby,

I just realised, t.URANUS is conj. (4' applying) to my freedom point.

Did you have a transit to this point too?

---

Hmmm....I don't know but I will check! Sorry I'm so busy right now, I didn't forget about our thread! I'll be back

posted May 18, 2015 09:29 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by olgatheo:
You have a right to express how you feel ! Yes Gabby is awesome !
With coming out of a Saturn sq. Sun ( from Nov. 2012-
that was an intense Eclipse to 2014 Dec)surly issues
around father/childhood / family ) appeared .
Plus how many degrees is your Mars/Saturn/Pluto in Libra?( sexuality /family / home life /self image /psychology / career - might change your job - more to do with your new prospective) ! If your been affected By
Uranus /Pluto transit both
energies are hard enough to deal with but growth is there
and healing. Pluto will resurface anything buried . I have Pluto reports on their transits to natal Sun which I can send to Gabby's email and she can send it to you if you want it( no charge ) ! Might get a new insight.

---

posted May 19, 2015 03:39 PM            

Chiming in since I saw my name being mentioned.

One thing I noticed right away looking at your charts, and that has already been mentioned, is - a Vertex/Chiron conjunction and in both charts affecting the 7th house (and 8th house in Voix's case).
And interestingly, they also fall in those same houses in your synastry - since you both have a Libra ASC (I love Libra ASCs by the way).

As you probably very well know - deep wounding brought by circumstances that are hard to explain, "fate", related to how one relates to another and how others relate to one, the basic dynamics between people and how those dynamics can be deeply harmful and traumatic; and consequent healing of those wounds or at the very least an acceptance of them and ability to assist others who experience or have experienced similar things.

Gabby's Venus falling in Voix's 12H, close to her ASC and also conjuncting that Mars and Saturn, speaks to me of Gabby's compassion and loving disposition towards Voix and her experiences.

Voix's Venus and Mercury in Gabby's 4H - also a Water house, points to a level of acceptance here again, a meeting of the "hearts" and minds. Very nice.

Gabby's Saturn conjuncts Voix's MC and makes a supportive trine to her Uranus in the 2H, pointing to public support and making her feel like her system of values and ideas is understood and supported (especially with Gabby's Sun/Mercury conjuncting Voix's Uranus).

Saturn opposes Mercury, so there might be some misunderstandings here and there, or just obstacles in communicating properly or as much as you'd like (being busy and not having the time or energy to reply in the thread, for example...)

I know Voix said she uses the Whole house system, and I am sure it can be valid, however I would like to point out the fact that in Placidus as is shown in the posted synastry, both Virgo Moons are in Voix's 11H which is a very good sign for a meeting of the minds - similar ideas, much common ground here, especially when it comes to emotional experiences and the probability of both liking each other on a very simple, "basic," humane level (a "kindred spirit" sort of thing).

And of course the 12H influence speaks of the mutual understanding that transcends words, you "get" each other's experience and therefore can empathize with each other and be mutually supportive (and by the way, there can be a "us against the world" feeling with the 12H too, which seems to make sense. Not that there's outright enmity, but you know, you have your own "bubble", so to speak).

Oh and, almost forgot, you both have a Venus/Pluto hard aspect natally, and Pluto/ASC. I'm sure it has been pointed out already, but it caught my attention since Venus/Pluto is also associated with abuse (not only Mars/Pluto) and the ASC stands for the 1st house, which is ruled by... Mars. So it's like you both have a Venus/Pluto and Mars/Pluto link (Voix actually has Mars conjunct Pluto but not Gabby, so it's like the missing link).

Those are some of my thoughts.

Peace and light to you lovely souls ~

posted May 19, 2015 03:49 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:
Hmmm....I don't know but I will check! Sorry I'm so busy right now, I didn't forget about our thread! I'll be back

I forwarded the Pluto report from Olga for us to you, did you get it?

---

posted May 19, 2015 03:50 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by olgatheo:
@ Voix + Gabby
Your welcome Hope it helps you both

---

Thank you so much for sending this to us Olgatheo, it's really kind of you.

posted May 19, 2015 04:36 PM            

I absolutely love your vibe.
You are so wise and positive, despite all the things you've been through. I find that very inspiring and admirable. I have noticed you tend to help a lot of people on here by providing them with very insightful and humane yet spiritual advice, so respect for that. We need more people like you!

Naturally I also love Voix's vibe. Actually, I noticed Voix and the way she expresses herself in her old(er) posts, not only in that previous thread where I posted. Something about the way you write on here, Voix, is very attractive to me - a sense of poise, calmness, elegance, and wisdom. I'm not sure how to explain it. (Gosh, I hope I don't sound creepy, here.)

But yeah, I got a positive vibe from both of you in that previous thread, and while I'm no psychic and certainly subject to my own biases, I just felt a sense of "right" when you were explaining your experiences and points of view related to abuse and healing, and so on.

Thank you both for sharing and being patient and strong.

As for my chart (without the aspects though so the positions are easier to see):
http://i.imgur.com/y5LtQ3P.png

I think the most prominent thing here is my DSC and NN conjuncting Gabby's Sun/Mercury and Voix's Uranus.
It also looks like my Anti-Vertex conjuncts Voix's DSC and Gabby's Chiron/Vertex. Pretty cool stuff!

posted May 19, 2015 05:02 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
Thank you so much for sending this to us Olgatheo, it's really kind of you.

Can I ask though, is this transit PLuto?
You said in the email we should read Sun and ASC, but Pluto isn't aspecting my Sun yet, so I should just read ASC?

---

posted May 19, 2015 06:17 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
Gabby,

I just realised, t.URANUS is conj. (4' applying) to my freedom point.

Did you have a transit to this point too?

---

posted May 19, 2015 06:26 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
Hi guys.

Chiming in since I saw my name being mentioned.

One thing I noticed right away looking at your charts, and that has already been mentioned, is - a Vertex/Chiron conjunction and in both charts affecting the 7th house (and 8th house in Voix's case).
And interestingly, they also fall in those same houses in your synastry - since you both have a Libra ASC (I love Libra ASCs by the way).

As you probably very well know - deep wounding brought by circumstances that are hard to explain, "fate", related to how one relates to another and how others relate to one, the basic dynamics between people and how those dynamics can be deeply harmful and traumatic; and consequent healing of those wounds or at the very least an acceptance of them and ability to assist others who experience or have experienced similar things.

Gabby's Venus falling in Voix's 12H, close to her ASC and also conjuncting that Mars and Saturn, speaks to me of Gabby's compassion and loving disposition towards Voix and her experiences.

Voix's Venus and Mercury in Gabby's 4H - also a Water house, points to a level of acceptance here again, a meeting of the "hearts" and minds. Very nice.

Gabby's Saturn conjuncts Voix's MC and makes a supportive trine to her Uranus in the 2H, pointing to public support and making her feel like her system of values and ideas is understood and supported (especially with Gabby's Sun/Mercury conjuncting Voix's Uranus).

Saturn opposes Mercury, so there might be some misunderstandings here and there, or just obstacles in communicating properly or as much as you'd like (being busy and not having the time or energy to reply in the thread, for example...)

I know Voix said she uses the Whole house system, and I am sure it can be valid, however I would like to point out the fact that in Placidus as is shown in the posted synastry, both Virgo Moons are in Voix's 11H which is a very good sign for a meeting of the minds - similar ideas, much common ground here, especially when it comes to emotional experiences and the probability of both liking each other on a very simple, "basic," humane level (a "kindred spirit" sort of thing).

And of course the 12H influence speaks of the mutual understanding that transcends words, you "get" each other's experience and therefore can empathize with each other and be mutually supportive (and by the way, there can be a "us against the world" feeling with the 12H too, which seems to make sense. Not that there's outright enmity, but you know, you have your own "bubble", so to speak).

Oh and, almost forgot, you both have a Venus/Pluto hard aspect natally, and Pluto/ASC. I'm sure it has been pointed out already, but it caught my attention since Venus/Pluto is also associated with abuse (not only Mars/Pluto) and the ASC stands for the 1st house, which is ruled by... Mars. So it's like you both have a Venus/Pluto and Mars/Pluto link (Voix actually has Mars conjunct Pluto but not Gabby, so it's like the missing link).

Those are some of my thoughts.

Peace and light to you lovely souls ~

Ps. Gabby, if you'd still like to see my natal chart or our synastry and what not, let me know.

---

Wow Doux, this is excellent.

Thank you so much for sharing these insights.

That VERTEX/CHIRON is really standing out.

And I felt the same about Gabby's SUN/MERC to my URANUS.

You know, I'm really starting to love the 12th house.

I can see where you are coming from with the MOONs in 11th. It's just that in my natal it doesn't seem to fit too well.
It was iQ who pointed out to me that in Equal, it was actually in the 12th, and the interpretations I read made so much more sense.

posted May 19, 2015 07:10 PM            

These asteroids I think might give us an interesting picture regarding our step dad's.....of course not all of them will be hits but I think if we find we are seeing DW, meaning both of us have aspects with our dad's it could be invaluable research into the meaning of the asteroids and seeing potential for childhood abuse.

Nessus 7066
Dejanira 157
Child 4580
Kida 5140
Karma 3811
Anga (3158)- anger
Angrilli (18102)-angerly
Apatheia (8273)
Baade (1501)
Deprez (9795)
Devience (21419)
Grieve (4451)
Grimm (6912)
Hasse (7478) German for 'Hate'
Hazard (9305)
Hinderer (3404)
Lie (26955)
Maniac (228029)
Medusa (149)
Melancholia (5708)
Mentall (7116)
NOT (28570)
Nemisis (128)
Ohno (5180)
Pinocchio (12927)
Poisson (12874)
Prevert (18624)
Prey (6157)
Paine (5188)
Sedna (90377)
Sado (118230)
Swindle (8690)
Tore (97186)- to be tore or torn apart?
Villon (10140)
-----
(171) Ophelia
The name itself means, "in need of help or helper"
Very karmic for people who have been hurt and in need of help, dont get it and instead help themselves by turning their pain around and becoming empowered to help others, sound a bit like Chiron's story!
Her meanings...
Female despair and madness
Tragic undoing caused from oppression
Maddening endurance
Innocence gone mad
Duty to the point of losing yourself; driving one to insanity

Positives...
Demolishing the instruments used for her captivity
Exposing truth behind oppression, revolutionary gestures against those who cause oppression
Disowning your weakness and taking on a new empowered role
Ophelia goes mad in her madness she becomes Elektra....a heroine, revolting against the oppression of women;the mythological heroine of logic and revenge.

(130) Elektra
"I shall here first recount the crucial moments in the development of this archetype through the centuries, showing how the visual dimension has been vital for Ophelia’s representation, and how, in the collective imagery, this character has been deeply associated representing female despair and madness. The second part will then address the issue of how these sometimes contradictory and always iconographically powerful images made it possible for Ophelia and her madness to acquire a central function in the destruction and reconstruction of Shakespeare’s Hamlet. In his most cryptic yet powerful play, Hamletmaschine, as I will demonstrate, Heiner Müller promotes Ophelia’s madness as a revolutionary means to generate a connection between people and their unconscious. Finally, this association of Ophelia with the communicative power of images will become a metaphor for theatrical fiction and the power (or inability) to trigger chaos in order to generate a new cosmos world of conventions."

In Delacroix’s painting, Ophelia struggles to resist the cruel forces of nature by grabbing a branch, and, being bare-breasted, becomes “a symbol both of wounded, self absorbed sexuality and of the destruction of innocence by an indifferent world” http://shakespeare.edel.univ-poitiers.fr/index.php?id=161

Ophelia has limited options as a woman in a patriarchal society and this is what separates her from Hamlet, who has the freedom to change his own fate. Ophelia needs to be obedient and is not allowed to express herself and her true feelings. What happens in her life is determined by the whims of the men who control her. She is obedient to her father and brother and also to the king, and although she tries to do what is right, she is often pulled along by these men. Unlike Hamlet, who can act according to his own will and speak his mind as he wants, Ophelia must find an alternative to express herself. The only out that she sees is in madness and eventually death. As a mad woman, Ophelia would not be bound by the societal restrictions of women; she could voice herself; however, even in madness she is not free. Even though she is able to have a voice, she still has no freedom of choice and she is ultimately regarded as nonsensical and her words are taken to be simply mad-talk. Whereas Hamlet has the power and potential to change his fate, Ophelia does not and her death is tragic because the only escape she sees from her oppression is madness and death. Thus, her limited options in a patriarchal society and her realization of those limitations are what make Ophelia's death the true tragedy of Hamlet.

As a woman in a society dominated by men, Ophelia has few choices in life. While unmarried she would have to obey her father and once married she would have to obey her husband. It is clear from the text that Ophelia is a proper woman for her time. She obediently does as her father tells her without complaint. Even if she does not want to comply with the rules, when her father gave the order, she obeyed. Her real attitude is clear when she has a conversation about chastity, first with Laertes, her brother, then with Polonius, her father. After Laertes rather explicitly warns Ophelia to fear losing her virginity, she replies by telling him not to lecture her, “Whiles, a puffed and reckless libertine, / Himself the primrose path of dalliance treads, / And recks not his own rede” (1.3.48-50). She is able to rebuke her brother to some extent, but when her father gives her the same lecture and tells her not to accept Hamlet’s advances, she simply replies, “I shall obey, my lord” (1.3.135). This early scene in the play sets up Ophelia’s frame of mind. Although Ophelia wants to believe Hamlet is true to her and “Hath given countenance to his speech… / With almost all the holy vows of heaven” (1.3.112-13), her father’s word is law and what he says she must follow, for “if she refuses Polonius, she risks social ostracism and grave insult to the man who capriciously controls her future” (Campbell 58). Essentially, Ophelia was the property of her father.

(196) Philomela
Raped and brutalized by the one meant to protect her...
Loss of her ability to speak, her tongue was cut out to keep her from telling what had happened to her.

"According to Ovid, in the fifth year of Procne's marriage to Tereus, King of Thrace and son of Ares, she asked her husband to "Let me at Athens my dear sister to see or let her come to Thrace, and visit me."

Indulging his wife's request, Tereus agreed to travel to Athens and escort Philomela, his wife's sister, to Thrace.
King Pandion of Athens, the father of Philomela and Procne, was apprehensive about letting his only remaining daughter leave his home and protection and asks Tereus to protect her as if he were her father. Tereus agrees.

However, Tereus lusted for Philomela when he first saw her, and that lust grew during the course of the return voyage to Thrace.
Arriving in Thrace, he forced her to a cabin or lodge in the woods and raped her. After the assault, Tereus threatened her and advised her to keep silent.
Philomela was defiant and angered Tereus. In his rage, he was incited to cut out her tongue and abandon her in the cabin.
Rendered unable to speak because of her injuries, Philomela wove a tapestry (or a robe) that told her story and had it sent to Procne.
Procne was incensed and in revenge, she killed her son by Tereus, Itys (or Itylos), boiled him and served him as a meal to her husband. After Tereus ate Itys, the sisters presented him with the severed head of his son, and he became aware of their conspiracy and his cannibalistic meal.
He snatched up an axe and pursued them with the intent to kill the sisters. They fled but were almost overtaken by Tereus at Daulia in Phocis.
In desperation, they prayed to the gods to be turned into birds and escape Tereus' rage and vengeance. The gods transformed Procne into a swallow and Philomela into a nightingale.
Subsequently, the gods would transform Tereus into a hoopoe."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philomela

(2150) Nyctimene- Princess of Lesbos (in the Greek Aegean) who was raped by her own father. She fled to the woods and there hid herself in shame. Athena in sympathy transformed the girl into an owl, and appointed her as her animal familiar.
"Nyctimene, daughter of Epopeus, king of the Lesbians, is said to have been a most beautiful girl. Her father, Epopeus, smitten by passion, embraced her, and left her overcome by shame, she hid herself in the woods. Minerva [Athena] out of pity changed her into an owl, which, the owl out of shame, does not come into the light but appears only at night."

Epopeus was also a mythical Greek king of Sicyon, with an archaic bird-name that linked him to epops, the hoopoe, the "watcher". A fragment of Callimachus' Aitia appears to ask, "Why, at Sicyon, is it the hoopoe, and not the usual "splendid ravens", that is the bird of good omen?"

(665) Sabine- (10386) Romulus
Sabine Women in Ancient Rome
At first, it was mostly men who settled the city of Rome. It was a rough city and did not attract many women. Romulus realized this and tried to attract women from neighboring communities. He recognized that if Rome was to survive, it needed women to help populate the town. The Romans devised a plan to solve their problem. They invited a nearby tribe, the Sabians, to a festival. Once inside the city, the men were attacked and killed and the women abducted and raped (the word rape may refer to wife snatching, which was not uncommon in that time period). The surviving Sabian men returned to their city for reinforcements. They later returned to Rome with King Titus Tatius to get their women back. The Sabians were able to enter the city by getting a Roman to betray the city and unlock the gates. The city would have been sacked if not for the unexpected resistance the Sabians found once inside. The Sabians found the Romans being helped by their new Sabian wives. The wives called a halt to the violence. They explained to their tribe that they were happy with their new lives in Rome. The conflict was ended diplomatically by Romulus and Titus by agreeing that the two groups would become one with the seat of power staying in Rome. The Sabian patricians had power in the Rome government for years to follow.

Leda(38)-Zues(5731) Zues raped Leda

Lucretia (281) Raped by Prince Sextus Tarquinius

Dinah(17472) raped by Canaanite Prince(Biblical account)

Susanna(542) she was threatened to be raped by 2 elders. (Biblical account from the book of Daniel)

Tamar (326 Tamara?)raped by her half brother, Amnon.(2 Samuel, biblical account)

posted May 20, 2015 06:19 PM            

Hopefully you can see it.

posted May 20, 2015 06:38 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
I posted my chart in a post above, guys.

Hopefully you can see it.

Or you can just shoot me an email, it's up there in the Brown Owl School subforum.

---

I'm so sorry Doux, I missed that...I'm looking now

Omg...your chart is cool! Your Plutonian out the @ss!!
My Merc/Sun saggy@3.32/4.28 is on your DC and NN....how cool is that?
Your Pluto is on my NN....love your Moon on Regulus

Your Jupiter/Venus both trine my Mars exact
Your Moon sextiles my Mars
My Angel is on your Neptune/Uranus
Your Saturn is square my NN

Our Vertex's are almost opposed...mine is aries@21.26, yours libra@24.53