posted February 12, 2007 05:22 PM         

quote:

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don't think you know what you're talking about.

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Excuse me??? What are you talking about? I just explained to you what I was getting at and what the whole argument was about in the first place. It was said that Playboy is sexist as those militant Feminist magazines and someone disagreed. I've been trying to prove to this person why it was sexist and my reason was that it was degrading to women. And then somehow we got side tracked into how it was degrading to women and that's why I'm here wasting my breath on you. The fact is that everyone involved is to blame in the degrading factor of Playboy if that's what you wanted to hear from me.The women are to blame because they make the decision to go and pose. The men, because they went looking for them in the first place to display. (BTW The men in these industries scout for the women AND make the money off of them so therefore they still are exploiting them.)

*edit*The reason for my former post was because you had asked me why I thought Playboy was wrong and I explained to you: because I think its degrading. Then I was also careful to explain to you that I'm not declaring war on playboy and that the stupid magazines can stay in circulation till the end of time for all I care....each to his own. It doesn't mean I have to think Playboy is sooo right and virtuous if that's what you want from me.

So if there's anyone who doesn't know what the F they're talking about it is you who came off your high horse in the middle of this whole argument not really knowing what it was originally about.But since I am sooooo beneath you it is me who should be in awe of you're amazing knowledge, huh?
For someone who says that they don't think the world doesn't revolve around them, your posts sure demostrate the complete opposite.

posted February 12, 2007 06:05 PM         

This is not a reason.
This is what is called an "operational definition".
There are only two forms of sexism.
One degrades women, the other degrades men.
You have only told us which form you are refering to.
You are essentially saying,
"It is sexist because it is sexist."

quote:

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And then somehow we got side tracked into how it was degrading to women and that's why I'm here wasting my breath on you.

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On the contrary, I am trying to keep us on track. You have yet to give any reason for your claim that pornography is sexist (i.e. "degrading to men or women").

quote:

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(BTW The men in these industries scout for the women AND make the money off of them so therefore they still are exploiting them.)

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First of all, it is not really a male-femal issue. Women hold managerial positions in these industries (just as men do), and men pose for these photos (just as women do). The models (male and female) are getting paid. It is their choice. Evidently , it is worth it to them.

If they are exploited, it is by the richest 1% of people who control the distribution of wealth on this planet, thereby putting many people in the position of having to choose between working a soul-crushing job for minimum wage, and posing for photographs which they may or may not be entirely comfortable with.

The people who provide the cameras and equipment, and all the means of production and distribution, are getting paid for doing just that, and for all the other REAL work that goes into shooting and printing a magazine. Who are they exploiting?

You have only mangaged to articulate your opinion that this is wrong. You have provided no reasons to support this opinion. That is your choice. But, if you feel strongly about this, I would think you would be willing to produce a reason or two, to add at least some weight to your opinion. In order to do this, you must answer one two-part question: Who is this hurting and how? Bear in mind that, "Pornography is bad because it involves people in pornography," will not be considered an acceptable and sufficient response.

I'm going to ignore the personal insults.

posted February 12, 2007 07:32 PM         

to who???

the men buying them and looking at them
for their own personal desire and need???

what if it was your mother
or daughter???

posted February 12, 2007 07:51 PM         

Pornograpy is made to arouse sexual desire..to the public...

a crime, a sin

now bring in

child pornography
a horrific crime. ...

no form of pornography will ever be right!

it's that simple!

how have we fallen this far?

is there any hope?

Art and nudity is an entirely different thing
it is not about sexual arousel... .

posted February 12, 2007 07:54 PM         

this is a phrase i have often pondered over. It has so many implications that I'm not sure I have understood it completely, or even if I have, whether i agree with it or not.

Is nothing intrinsically good or bad ? Is it really in the mind?

Whose mind? The person who sees it, or the person who does it (if we r talking about an action) ?

I think these r some questions u r trying to address here, HSC. Very thought provoking.

ILWL

posted February 12, 2007 07:58 PM         

no one cares to fix it?

look around you
this is Hell

no respect, no reverence, no Love

sex sex sex

for example, when I went to high school, none of us even knew what anal sex was
today, my daughters come home to tell me
the phenomenal stories
about their friends
anal sex today in high school is considered part of normal sexual intercourse...
these girls just think they are supposed to do it, I've talked to them, I cry
these are daughters
this is so sad to me. ...

posted February 12, 2007 09:26 PM         

Lotus,

What's wrong with anal sex?
Nobody gets pregnant.
Nobody gets hurt.
Do you have any reason for thinking it is wrong,
other than the fact that it was once taboo?

People are human, Lotus.
People have needs, all kinds of needs.
I think sometimes you expect us to be gods.
But we are not gods, we are worlds.
Worlds containing different gods.
All of them have a voice,
whether you like it or not.
I hear you speaking for Saturn,
and I honor your voice.
But, even as I honor it, I must rebuke it
for the sake of the remaining solar system!

Sex is natural.
It is not pure or impure.
It just is.

The apparent shamefulness of a thing
is a reflection of the belief you hold about it.
What you see is only your own shadow.

You speak about Spirit...
Do you not understand this?

The earth is not evil, lotus.
The body is not a prison.
Free your mind.

Even violence is natural,
the will to possess, dominate, and control.
Outlets must be found.
Magazines and Messageboards.
(Better to take it out on a magazine.)

I am not championing these drives.
But I refuse to deny their need to be "handled".
When we deny the expression of these drives,
we only end up sublimating them,
and they errupt in the worst ways;
ways which are not just disturbing,
but which are positively horrific.

Let everyone be where they are, Lotus.
When you drag people kicking and screaming into the stratosphere,
who are still bound to the earth,
gravity just pulls them back down with greater force,
and the result is a resounding mess.

hsc

posted February 12, 2007 09:41 PM         

that was sooooo deep !! and so beautifully expressed that i can't put it into words how i feel after reading them

quote:

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But we are not gods, we are worlds.
Worlds containing different gods.
All of them have a voice

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quote:

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The apparent shamefulness of a thing
is a reflection of the belief you hold about it.
What you see is only your own shadow.

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quote:

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When you drag people kicking and screaming into the stratosphere,
who are still bound to the earth,
gravity just pulls them back down with greater force,
and the result is a resounding mess.

---

posted February 12, 2007 09:48 PM         

ignorance is bliss

posted February 12, 2007 10:10 PM         

anal sex = ecoli, bacteria, caca
bad bad bad, waste waste waste
exit door only, never for pleasure

it is the fall of man
no hole small enough
I am so sick and disgraced
by the insenstivity
to human life
ourchildren sons and daughters
raped and treated as animals

animals

are there any humans left?

666 is the beast, it's Man

and I am not playing along anymore
where evil wriggles its ugly head
I shall stomp on it

we are running out of time

this is no game

how can this all be accepted by you
how can you think this is all right???

posted February 12, 2007 10:14 PM         

i think we r not ignorant lotus. u have made your point umpteen times. we choose to disagree with you. we r aware of the ecoli, bacteria, 'bad, bad, bad'.

there is a difference between informing people, and pushing your opinions down their throat.

wht wud u do if you thought someone was mad? do u think saying anything to them wud make a difference? wud u shoot them since they r not worthy of this earth?

or do u let them be? and stop wasting your breath on them?

posted February 12, 2007 10:19 PM         

quote:

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where evil wriggles its ugly head
I shall stomp on it

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