posted August 17, 2010 06:09 PM            

Honestly, I am skeptical about house placements including especially for the use of rectification purposes. I have been leaning more towards a geometrical,harmonic approach to Astrology.

Cosmobiologists rectify charts ,and they don't even use houses.

Vedic Astrologers rectify charts,and they use sidereal zodiac,whole sign house system, and don't use objects that orbit past Saturn.

I think that it would be interesting to have the charts rectified in different systems, and see if they come up with the same birthtime.

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted August 17, 2010 08:48 PM            

DO you know how to look using the other methods? If you do feel free to try or test any time that is given as a possible birth time...

I have talked to several people, and I have asked about the Asc trine Neptune... and Pluto and so far most people say that it would not alter the Aries Asc that much...

Im really stuck in the middle here... I would just like to know what it is either way...

I have been reading Sabian Symobols, Asc, 4th house cusp 7th house cusp, and MC....

To a point they both just kinda fit... I cant decide which one fits more.... Its very confusing..

A few things stand out in each, but you can find where it comes from if you still have my info...

I do have a sensitivity to drugs (prescriptions) I have never been able to complete a prescription, bc it makes me so sick to my stomache..
I dont do any drugs/or drink) Actually I can't drink I go straight to sleep.. I skip the "buzz" and get real sleepy... You will find me asleep in some car... hahahah.. (dont ask)

Im allergic to penicillin,cats,feathers, milk, ibuprofen. I forget what else... LOL
If the feathers sounds odd, well remember back in the 70's everyone slept with feather pillows...
Every day I would wake up with a half my face red and swollen.... It took forever to figure out it was the pillows....

Ohh and I do consider my self introverted, I dont consider my self shy.. I was extremely shy when I was young... I dont think Im shy.. I just prefer to be alone, or being around people I know well, but yet Im no hermit.. I do go out with friends..

I do have my wild side, but honestly (lolololol) Its a part of my secret self...
I always seem to get my self mixed up in some secret romance... (no, not with married men, just better to keep it private) I hate people knowing my business..

Very few people see this in me..
You know that phrase "It's always the quiet ones" lol... that soooo fits me..
Sometimes I do show a piece of this.... A few years ago, I have a big tattoo on my arm, yet people didnt know about it until I had it for a few years.. I would wear long sleeves..

I am EXTREMELY impatient, and I do walk fast.. I usually look down while walking.. Avoiding eye contact with people.. I get annoyed quick.. (Which is another reason I prefer to be home alone)

Humm cant remember what else right now..

posted August 17, 2010 09:25 PM            

I think that it really depends on the closeness of the orb

if Neptune is trining the Ascendant within 3 degree orb,I'd think that it would alter the Ascendant.
I am very sure that an opposition from Pluto would. If the orb is less than 3 degree. With your original birthtime, both Neptune and Pluto are closely aspecting your Ascendant

I have noticed that transneptunian dwarf planet Haumea conjunct my Ascendant with 2'10 orb alters my Virgo Ascendant quite a bit. Not just my appearance but how I approach life and relate to others.

Some say that the Pluto in 1st shows evidently in my appearance even though its no way near my Ascendant. But it could be actually Haumea. After all, Haumea is a transneptunian dwarf planet like Pluto. Therefore, it has an evolutionary intensity just like Pluto does.

My Mom has transneptunian dwarf planet candidate Orcus only 10 minutes conjunct the Cancer Ascendant, and she has a look of intensity about her that you don't see with Cancer Ascendant.

It's really hard to say what's causing what
using the birthtime that Geocosmic used, you have have Saturn oppose Neptune/MC midpoint with 2 minutes of arc, and that could indicate hypersensitivity,immune system issues

the thing is that there can be so many possibilities

there is the danger of Forer/Barnum Effect that can factor if somebody can relate to a a certain thing in a chart

I just don't believe in rectifying charts.
I just think that there is too much speculation and we can never know for sure.

The knowledge of the solar system is constantly evolving which tends to influence Astrology including what objects that they use in the chart and that effects rectification.

I wasn't kidding when I said that somebody rectified my chart with the use of hypothetical transneptunian planets that are used in Uranian Astrology.

I think that it would help if astrologers of different systems came together and came up with the same birthtime. Then we could see if rectification really works or not.

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted August 18, 2010 03:54 PM            

Eris quincunx Ascendant was a new aspect

also with the rectified birthtime, the royal fixed stars Aldebaran are on the Midheaven and Antares are on the Imum Coeli which don't happen with my original birthtime. Those are great connections for fame,success,glory, but my ego isn't big enough to embrace them. hahahahaha

midpoints involving the Midheaven were different too

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted August 26, 2010 09:28 PM            

I paid to have my chart rectified..
I went through I double checked my dates.. I pulled my employee file, for promotions and moves..I also checked my tranists. Like when my husband was taken away...

When my husband was taken permanently away
T Saturn was exactly conjunct my vertex in my 7th...

Saturn is in the 4th.. Grew up w/o a father.
My Leo Stellium is in the 6th..

So are you wondering what time he came up with???
Ok here's the weird thing...
I always say that Im an 8.. Im obessesd with the number 8..being born on 8/8
The info he gave me is
new time 8:44 pm
asc 8Pisces
Mc 17 Sag
I never mentioned the 8 to him.. This is what he told me...

*****Winged Leo do you want to check this time???
If so let me know, I will have to revise my dates... I was a little off..

posted August 26, 2010 10:06 PM            

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No..I am not a Virgo.

posted August 26, 2010 10:48 PM            

Care to take a look and see if it fits with the things I said?

If so if you still have my info.. change the time to 8:44 pm.. See if it makes sense?

Also what what be the difference for me, with makemake going from the 5th to the 6th?

posted August 26, 2010 10:52 PM            

I also wonder if you went to other astrologers, they would get the same birthtime. If they don't, it does raise valid questions about birth time and rectification.

I even think that scientific empirical data studies should be done on chart rectifications.
It would be interesting to see how a Cosmobiologist and Vedic Astrologer would rectify your chart.

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No..I am not a Virgo.

posted August 28, 2010 01:29 PM            

2. gave birth 5/12/92
3. married 7/22/00
4. gave birth 4/23/02
5. Started job 4/14/94 (still working for company)
9. May 30, 2008.. husband was taken taken away temporaliy..
10. Feb 3, 2009 Husband was permantely taken away.
Had to have a minor surgery on 11/6/09

1/22/00= promoted
3/1/99= moved
7/20/98 = promoted
1/30/98 moved (still live here)
1/16/96 = moved
8/24/94 = moved
2/16/04 = promoted (still in this position)

These date's I am positive about..

posted August 28, 2010 05:04 PM            

05/12/92: gave birth

No Solar Arcs & Transits

08/24/94: moved

Solar Arc Mars square MC

Solar Arc ASC sesquiquadrate Moon/Mercury (Mercury rules 4th)

Tr. Saturn conjunct ASC

04/14/94: started job

Solar Arc ASC square Jupiter

Tr. Saturn conjunct ASC

01/16/96: moved

No Solar Arcs & Transits

01/30/98: moved

Solar Arc ASC semisquare Jupiter

Tr. Pluto square ASC

07/20/98: promoted

No Solar Arcs & Transits

03/01/99: moved

No Solar Arcs & Transits

01/22/00: promoted

No Solar Arcs & Transits

07/22/00: married

No Solar Arcs & Transits

04/23/02: gave birth

No Solar Arcs

Tr. Pluto conjunct MC

02/16/04: promoted

Solar Arc Venus sesquiquadrate MC

Tr. Jupiter square MC

05/30/08: husband issue 1

No Solar Arcs & Transits

02/03/09: husband issue 2

Solar Arc Saturn sesquiquadrate ASC

No transits

11/6/09: minor surgery

No Solar Arcs & Transits

I don't know with what technic he tried to rectify your birth time, but I can surely say he's wrong, this is not your birth time. I hope you didn't pay him much. Are you sure that he's professional? What's his name?

I just got back from a vacation and I'm busy with unpacking my luggage, but when I have time I will open a new thread about finding your birth time so that we can start freshly.

You're welcome

posted August 28, 2010 05:23 PM            

That he adjusts the chart to personailty traits first. Asked alot of personailty questions..

I'm sorry - error - Saturn is Contra-Parallel MC, not parallel.

attached is the data sheet showing declinations of the points in your chart. Those are the positions North or South of the celestial equator.

Aspects:

Jupiter Parallel MC (like conjunction).
This is successive growth in career pursuits, the ability to get promotions, favor from superiors, etc.

Saturn is also in a wider Parallel to MC, showing a time-release of efforts and dedication to accomplishment.

In longitude:

Venus in wide trine and Neptune in wide square to Asc.
Especially the Neptune square shows your ability to often take on an invisible presence in groups or a sacrificial position in your personal friendships and relationship with groups. When you've been to a meeting or get-together and friends later say, "You were there?", this is the aspect that shows this quality. Pisces types can be unheard or invisible, slipping into and out of a room without being noticed. I have a Pisces rising (male) housemate who is this way. With Asc ruler Neptune squaring Pisces Asc, the fixed fire signature of Leo (very strong-willed) is muted. Venus aspect shows you're too nice to put out an irritating vibration upon not being noticed.

Saturn opposite MC.
This shows real effort and time to accomplish something worthwhile. You are urged to put longer-term values into work or career, rather than personal interaction. This aspect can also indicate issues relating to a dominant or stern parent or lack of fatherly guidance.

As to your Venus-Saturn question, they are in the 4th house. Saturn in the 4th is a rectification factor, being that you did not know your father. It seems to belong there instead of in the 3rd. Venus and Saturn in 4th show you value home, family, the personal and private part of life, but that you may have to overcome some obstacles or issues to gain them for yourself. Venus and Saturn in 4th anchors the values in your personal home life.

posted August 28, 2010 05:41 PM            

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No..I am not a Virgo.

posted August 28, 2010 05:44 PM            

Here is a synastry with myself.. lol
with the time you said and the time he said.. Not much of a difference chart wise.. Just Saturn from the 3rd to the 4th.
What do you think? What would be the differnce with Saturn? The time you did is on the inside, his time is on the outside.

posted August 30, 2010 02:41 PM            

I once again checked every possible Ascendants and concluded that 8:57 PM gets the most hits. I did my best to help you, now it's up to you to watch and see if it works for you.

If you want to be %100 sure, I suggest that you seek out a professional astrologer who will use SOLAR ARCS and Transits to rectify your birth time. Geocosmic Valentine and Lauren Delsack are two great astrologers, they are experts so they can help you more than I can.

ASC: 13 Pis 25
MC: 20 Sag 37
Birth time: 8:57 PM

June/July '86: trauma

Solar Arc Uranus sesquiquadrate ASC (Uranus rules 12th)

February '79: moved to California

Tr. Neptune conjunct MC (Neptune rules 1st)

May 2, '90: graduated high school

Solar Arc Mars oppose ASC

* Mars = ASC : fighting spirit

May 12, '92: gave birth

Solar Arc ASC square Venus (Venus is in the 4th)

April 14, '94: started job

Solar Arc MC sesquiquadrate Mars (Mars is in the 6th)

* MC = Mars : Recognition; responsibility grows; change of status

August 28, 94: moved

Tr. Saturn conjunct ASC (June '94)

January 16, '96: moved

Tr. Saturn square MC

Age 25: found dad

Solar Arc MC square Uranus

* MC = Uranus : Brings the power of selfhood forward; assertion is recognized; strong developmental tensions for job and social positions

January 30, '98: moved
July 20, '98: promoted

Solar Arc Mars square MC (Mars rules 2nd)

* Mars = MC : Ego awareness; action; fire; change of status

March 1, '99: moved
January 22, '00: promoted

Tr. Pluto square ASC

* Pluto = ASC : Extremely important time of life; dramatic changes of perspective are possible; identity transformation; geographic relocations; taking command of things; a life milestone

July 22, '00: married

Solar Arc Sun oppose ASC

April 23, '02: gave birth

Solar Arc Moon oppose ASC (Moon rules 5th)

Tr. Saturn square ASC

M. Node oppose MC

February 16, '04: promoted

Tr. Pluto conjunct MC

* Pluto = MC : job adjustment is major; professional developments are life significant

May 30, '08: husband issue 1
February 03, '09: husband issue 2

Tr. Saturn square MC

* Saturn was transiting 7th

Tr. Uranus square MC

* In Equal, Saturn is in the 4th!

posted August 30, 2010 02:45 PM            

WOW!

My ASC is 13'27 Virgo!

Maybe she and I should get married!

hahahahaha

just kidding!

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No..I am not a Virgo.

posted August 30, 2010 03:10 PM            

I think I will prob stick with yours.. You did such a great job... I will keep an eye on it, to see if something just seem's off..

I really appreciate all your help

Raymond...

posted August 30, 2010 09:47 PM            

Can you do me a favor please!!!

So if my Asc is at 13Pisces.. I have Eros conjunct Asc.. Eros at 10Pis.. (Eros in the 12th)

posted August 30, 2010 10:05 PM            

I would, but Solar Fire doesn't have interpretations for asteroid aspects

Raymond

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No..I am not a Virgo.

posted August 30, 2010 10:24 PM            

ok Can you give me the Definitions of Saturn in the 3rd conjunct IC... To Saturn in the 4th..