posted August 13, 2010 09:22 AM            

However,my greatest desire, in this life, after my relationship with God, is to find a soul mate and discover what intimacy is.
I think you have to find out by doing.
There are some things you can't read about lol

Ami

posted August 13, 2010 10:11 AM            

Funny, it went through my mind when writing my last post and now you ask.
No, it isn't that guy I'am with right now - that's a whole nother story if it comes to intimicay. More superficial in one word, like you can find all over the world (for example). There are other things that make it worth to stay with him.

posted August 13, 2010 10:15 AM            

Ami

posted August 13, 2010 11:03 AM            

I agree with a great deal of what Jane and Enchantress have already said- to an extent.

Like Jane, I know instantaneously whether or not someone is going to be important to me. And I need that connection, that electricity. I have experienced love that happens as a result of time and slowly realizing how alike you are.. but that's not what I'm looking for. I am destined for a Wuthering Heights love.

And unlike enchantress, I LOVE strong silent types. That mystery. That aura. It's almost intimidating, and demeaning. It makes me want to know that mind. I need someone I can talk to about everything and nothing. I need someone smarter than I am too. Someone who can teach me things on a cultural, life-experience, intellectual manner. And I want to be able to teach them as well, on an emotional level.

I think i'm so drawn to strong silent types because they seem selective. They don't just give themselves up to anyone. You have to work for it. You have to be worthy. And there's a true intimacy in that. And underneath that quiet exterior is a mountain of emotions waiting to be shared and unleashed. Mmmm... yummy...

I want us to share each other fully for the first time. I am everyone else's psychologist and problem solver in my own life, and shy away from opening up to people who won't really understand. I want him to push past my excuses and demand to know me.

posted August 13, 2010 11:06 AM            

x o x Ami

posted August 13, 2010 11:11 AM            

Ami

posted August 13, 2010 12:14 PM            

no planets are in the 8th
I am not going to get into asteroids...there can be lots

Centaur Chiron is in 10'32 Aries R in 8th - wounds,healing,inadequacies

Until this 21st century, I didn't know that I had the following objects in my 8th house:
Transneptunian dwarf planet Eris is in 12'15 Aries R - equality,diversity,discord,and controversy
Transneptunian dwarf planet candidate Sedna is in 2'06 Taurus R - environmental awareness,caretaking,victim,abuse,betrayal

I am passionate,impulsive when it comes to sex
There is also the unconventional,liberal,experimental sexual side that I have.
I have a history of feeling sexually inadequate including being accused of being gay, not fitting traditional male stereotypes. I do have high levels of estrogen naturally (my index fingers are longer than my ring fingers , showing that I was exposed to more estrogen when I was in my mother's womb).
I was born from an interracial relationship, and I have been in interracial relationships,dating,sex.

I believe in equality of the sexes.I believe that it's okay for women to be sexually liberated. I also believe in homosexual rights including that homosexuals should have full marriage rights as heterosexuals do. I am socially liberal.

With Pluto's fellow transneptunians, Eris and Sedna in my 8th, I have evolutionary intensified lessons,experiences when it comes to sexual matters

I definitely need a very profound,spiritual,intense bond with the person that I am intimate or I am just not interested.

Both Eris and Sedna orbit well beyond Pluto. Therefore, it would seem that Eris and Sedna in 8th would be a deeper,more psychological,more intense than Pluto in 8th.

My intimate partner needs to be spiritually oriented and share my views about helping others and neurodiversity advocacy. She definitely has to be a social liberal. I definitely don't want her to look down upon me in regards to my not fitting the male stereotype nor being neurotypical. She should also be that way with others like myself. She definitely should be tolerant of diversity and be aware of what happens on our planet. Those traits would turn me on sexually.

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted August 13, 2010 12:23 PM            

I'll be back later - I want to read the rest of this thread properly. I started to write something more, but I shouldn't be here right now.

posted August 13, 2010 06:50 PM            

quote:

---

Do you see anything in your chart that explains that? I think your 8th house ruler in your 10th could describe the public opening up to you, but what describes your end?

---

Hmm. Yes, 8th house ruler in the 10th would explain why the public opens up to me easily. Interesting. I've never caught that.

As to why it's hard for me to fully open up to someone else. I'm not entirely sure. I'd post my chart, but I don't think I remember how to do it... It's been awhile.

My closest guess is this: I'm a Scorpio Rising, so my chart ruler Pluto. I've got Pluto in Libra in the 11th conjunct Saturn in Scorpio in the 12th. Might have something to do with that. Makes me more cautious, and I do have parts of myself that I don't like to show to everyone. I have certain groups of friends for certain purposes. I have astrology friends, conservative friends (though I am not conservative), partying friends, and the list goes on... I usually only show a few parts of myself to each of these groups. I do have a couple of friends, and I've had a few guys I've dated in the past who I could fully open up to, but they are very rare people. I usually feel like I'm a strange amalgam of qualities, and that is part of WHY I get along with almost everyone.

posted August 13, 2010 10:56 PM            

I liked your Pluto love.

posted August 13, 2010 11:07 PM            

quote:

---

I have certain groups of friends for certain purposes. I have astrology friends, conservative friends (though I am not conservative), partying friends, and the list goes on... I usually only show a few parts of myself to each of these groups. I do have a couple of friends, and I've had a few guys I've dated in the past who I could fully open up to, but they are very rare people. I usually feel like I'm a strange amalgam of qualities, and that is part of WHY I get along with almost everyone.

---

Completely accurate! I have more friends than I can count- and they all have their categories. Some are "closer" to me than others- as in, some receive more of my attention than others. I will admit i have one or two pretty close friends, but even they don't know me well. I listen to whatever they have to say, and that's my purpose. To listen, and solve. And that's fine. I love helping. But they don't have an interest in doing the same for me. And on the rare occasion when they do ask how i am, i am very aloof and vague anyways. It's a cycle.

I think I have a problem linking intimacy to romantic love. I see them as one in the same. Therefore I don't allow myself to be intimate with anyone because the romantic connection is absent. I know I don't love them. Or don't want to love them. Or don't want to risk the chance of them loving me.

posted August 15, 2010 05:57 PM            

enchantress - I'm pretty sure I've seen your chart before at some point. We must be born at about the same time because we have almost the same placements!

Scorpio Rising, my Pluto is in Libra conjunct Saturn (both in the 12th house)
8th house ruler: Mercury is in the 10th conjunct Venus (Virgo).
Do you have Jupiter conjunct Uranus in the 1st too?

So many times I've wondered why some people just immediately, without knowing me, tell me all these details about their life, like right when I meet them. It's not everyone, but this has happened many times, and I just don't get it. I, myself, don't do this at all, not even with my 'closest' friends. It probably sounds bad but the thing that I really don't get the most is not so much that they are able to open up to me so easily, but rather that they seem to think I care (sounds a little harsh I know). But with me, I'm normally very vague with people and its mostly because I feel like 'well why do they care to know all the details...I'll just tell them I'm fine and thats it' - like, 'let me not burden them with whatever nonsense is going on in my life. I don't need to share.' I am however, the listener for a few of my friends and they are constantly sharing all this crazy crap thats going on in their lives with me. I don't mind being that, for them, if it helps them to have someone to vent to or whatever, but many times, it is definitely one-sided. Also, kids, especially, are very comfortable around me. I like kids but I feel like they like me even more than I like them. But I guess its that comfort thing.

I agree with what enchantress was saying about needing a real connection with someone. I don't get excited over someone easily. And, I can count on one hand the times that I saw a guy and immediately was like 'wow'. But in those cases, it wasnt like it was pure looks and thats it. I'm definitely not into the 'strong silent type either'...seems too much like a pushover. I need someone who's also going to have some 'bite' Someone who is 'ready to fight' (I know that rhymes, lol). By fight, I don't mean that I necessarily want to battle with someone, I just mean that they have to have a bit 'fighter' in them, some fire, some spark.

Anyway, and like meta4, I totally understand what you mean about having categories. I have friends and its like some of them I'll share some stuff with, and feel a little more comfortable with then others. I share things with some friends and then with others I wouldn't talk about those things. Its not secrets per se, its just the connection isn't as strong. And I too have a few friends that seemingly had feelings for me, or developed feelings, but likewise it was not returned. I never thought about the 'intimacy - romantic love' relationship that you described. But that makes sense, because I also feel like whoever I'm really romantically involved with, THAT person is the one that I'd really be intimate with, on all levels, NOT my friends.

posted August 15, 2010 06:22 PM            

quote:

---

I agree with what enchantress was saying about needing a real connection with someone. I don't get excited over someone easily. And, I can count on one hand the times that I saw a guy and immediately was like 'wow'. But in those cases, it wasnt like it was pure looks and thats it. I'm definitely not into the 'strong silent type either'...seems too much like a pushover. I need someone who's also going to have some 'bite' Someone who is 'ready to fight' (I know that rhymes, lol). By fight, I don't mean that I necessarily want to battle with someone, I just mean that they have to have a bit 'fighter' in them, some fire, some spark.

---

The one strong, silent type I know, isn't so silent once you get to know him, and he definitely has some bite. He likes a woman who can stand up for herself, too - he likes a woman with a little bite. I can also count on one hand, the number of men I've become excited over.

quote:

---

It's not everyone, but this has happened many times, and I just don't get it. I, myself, don't do this at all, not even with my 'closest' friends.

---

I don't either... but I mentioned that in another thread. I hardly opened up about anything, and learned that that isn't always such a good thing (neither is over-sharing, unless it's with the right person).

I don't mind if a man isn't the life of the party, as long as he talks to me. I got to know the one guy, because I was nice to him, here and there, and he then approached me. He's introverted, but he's smart and easy for me to talk to, about almost anything (when we're getting along).

posted August 15, 2010 06:35 PM            

Even though my seventh house (which is in LIBRA) is pretty full (moon, venus and merc, lilith, etc etc)

I have pluto in the 8th in scorp. So pluto rules my eighth.

posted August 16, 2010 11:57 PM            

quote:

---

Scorpio Rising, my Pluto is in Libra conjunct Saturn (both in the 12th house)
8th house ruler: Mercury is in the 10th conjunct Venus (Virgo).
Do you have Jupiter conjunct Uranus in the 1st too?

---

Yes, I do have Jupiter conjunct Uranus in the 1st. I do not, however, have Mercury conjunct Venus. Our placements are very similar though.

quote:

---

So many times I've wondered why some people just immediately, without knowing me, tell me all these details about their life, like right when I meet them... It probably sounds bad but the thing that I really don't get the most is not so much that they are able to open up to me so easily, but rather that they seem to think I care...

---

That is where the difference is between us. I actually DO care about other people's stories. In fact, I LOVE listening to other people's stories. I think people are so varied and interesting. Everyone comes from a different place. Truth really is stranger than fiction, I've learned.

I figured that's why people liked talking to me to begin with, because I actually like to listen... But, maybe not.

quote:

---

I think I have a problem linking intimacy to romantic love. I see them as one in the same. Therefore I don't allow myself to be intimate with anyone because the romantic connection is absent. I know I don't love them. Or don't want to love them. Or don't want to risk the chance of them loving me.

---

Interesting. I don't really have that same mindset. I believe that there are different levels of 'intimacy' since intimacy really just means being vulnerable with another person. If you actually look up the true definition of 'intimate' it has nothing about sex in it. Most of the formal definitions have to do with being very close and familiar with another person, and even suggest friendship.

And of course we are going to be the MOST intimate with our significant others. However, you can be 'intimate' with your friends too, in how much of your true self that you share with them.

Personally, I've always felt that the high ideal of romantic love is often paraded around as the only thing worth living for, but in truth, very very few people actually achieve it. Most people START relationships in deception (the person must be this way or that way to earn the affection of their loved one). That is about as far away from intimacy as you can get. But that is a rant for another time... lol.

quote:

---

The one strong, silent type I know, isn't so silent once you get to know him, and he definitely has some bite. He likes a woman who can stand up for herself, too - he likes a woman with a little bite.

---

Ok Teasel... To be fair, I shouldn't have generalized introvertedness, aloofness, and stupidity to ALL strong silent types. That's not fair.

posted August 17, 2010 06:54 AM            

So, to make it short:

Ruler of 8th house:
-------------------
Moon in Aquarius in 2nd house, peregrine

Midpoints involving 8th house ruler (within one degree, only conjunction, opposition and square):
-------------------------------------
Moon=Sun/Pluto -24
Moon=Mercury/Pluto -02

(Jupiter=Moon/Midheaven -11)
(Uranus=Moon/Saturn - 40)
(Mercury=Moon/Uranus -49)
(Neptune=Moon/Midheaven 1-05)

Planets in 8th house
-------------------------
Saturn in Cancer retograde, ruler of 2nd house

it is almost peregrine, too, unless you count the trine to Jupiter at 5°45

Moon - ruler of 8th house in 2nd house
quinkunx
Saturn - ruler of 2nd house in 8th house
(orb: 0°09)

midpoints involving Saturn
--------------------------

(Venus=Mercury/Saturn - 07)
(Sun=Mars / Saturn -08)
(Venus=Sun/Saturn - 19)
(Uranus=Moon/Saturn - 40)
(Neptune=Saturn/Uranus - 47)
(Sun=ASC/Saturn 1-03)
(Mercury=Mars/Saturn 1-01)
(MC=Mercury/Saturn 1-02)

The midpoint Uranus=Moon/Saturn is interesting as all three planets could be considered peregrine. No aspects under 5 degree orb. (unless the quinkunx between Moon and Saturn)

Other objects in 8th house (for example)
----------------------------------------
Eros 20°59 Cancer
Pan 21°02 Cancer r
Vertex 21°28 Cancer
(opposing Sun/Moon-mp on 21°31 Capricorn)

Destinn 23°18 Cancer r
Orcus 25°16 Cancer r

Logos 3°05 Leo r
Hypnos 6°08 Leo r

Makemake 19°30 r
Cupido 19°54 Leo r

Hmm, what does this say about me in terms of intimacy, sexuality and transformation?

posted August 17, 2010 08:44 AM            

quote:

---

I believe that there are different levels of 'intimacy' since intimacy really just means being vulnerable with another person. If you actually look up the true definition of 'intimate' it has nothing about sex in it. Most of the formal definitions have to do with being very close and familiar with another person, and even suggest friendship.

---

This is so huge for me, Thank you, Enchantress.
It puts a puzzle piece together .

x o x Ami

posted August 17, 2010 09:22 AM            

quote:

---

I believe that there are different levels of 'intimacy' since intimacy really just means being vulnerable with another person. If you actually look up the true definition of 'intimate' it has nothing about sex in it. Most of the formal definitions have to do with being very close and familiar with another person, and even suggest friendship.

---

posted August 17, 2010 10:41 AM            

In the 5th house sex happens for enjoyment, the theatrical playful element is dominant.

In the 8th house you completely merge with your partner. Never wondered why sex and death are both aspects of the 8th house?
In this form of sexual intimacy you die, or at least your Ego, your individual dies for some moments, as you become one with someone else.
It involves a merging of two souls, after all the 8th house is a water house.

The fixed houses are said to relate all to sex (though to see the 11th house taking part here may be difficult for many people to see), just the motivation is a different one, and HOW you experience it, probably.

posted August 17, 2010 10:48 AM            

------------------
Raymond Andrews,
President,Executive Director of Developmental Neurodiversity Association
Supporting the Neurodiversity Movement

posted August 17, 2010 10:59 AM            

quote:

---

In the 8th house you completely merge with your partner. Never wondered why sex and death are both aspects of the 8th house?
In this form of sexual intimacy you die, or at least your Ego, your individual dies for some moments, as you become one with someone else.
It involves a merging of two souls, after all the 8th house is a water house.

---

DD, Brilliant description of the 8th house view of sex but why do I expect anything less

Ami

posted August 17, 2010 02:51 PM            

quote:

---

It requires a level of sensitivity that's extremely rare to find and if it's there.... a whole new world

---

Yes, it is a magic carpet ride.

What was your synastry with that guy? Do you know his natal 8th?

Elton John's "The One" describes what this feels like for me:

quote:

---

In the instant that you love someone
In the second that the hammer hits
Reality runs up your spine
And the pieces finally fit

And all I ever needed was the one
Like freedom fields where wild horses run
When stars collide like you and I
No shadows block the sun

---

You know how in astrology planets are exalted in certain signs? I think that's a good metaphor for this experience. We're the planets, the other person is the sign we're swimming in, and when our natures meet we're exalted in one another.

quote:

---

to make it a bit more complex
We both have our Pluto conjunct S/M midpoint

---

I like complexity bc it's honest. I always feel like a charlatan when I isolate one part of the chart as a psychological explanation. I believe the entire self constructs all the other parts. For instance, my 8th house self operates as it does bc of my romantic Pisces 5th house. My 5th believes all people have riches in them that deserve to be loved. I want to love and be loved on that pure soul level. I don't need a REASON to look at someone with loving eyes.

Then my 5th house ruler is in my 2nd house, so I value that style of love. It's that pure soul connection I want to give (2nd house) and receive (8th house) because I consider that love (5th house).