posted July 03, 2014 06:44 AM              

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:
Thank you Ceri for understanding what I was saying! Sometimes I think ppl must think I'm crazy because most ppl fear feeling what we are talking about feeling , until they feel it.
Then they either want to hold into it so tight they suffocate it or they run from it because it's different and they don't understand their role or place in it. They fear the unknown and run.....but I think if twin flames can come to know themselves through, just as you said, the mirror image they reflect back n forth to each other...they can grow to understand themselves better and become stronger for themselves.
Your right these relationships are meant for us to become who we are meant to be.
Maybe at first we do it for them(or it potentially seems that way)but as they reflect this growth back to us, eventually it will be for ourselves because we will come to believe in ourselves through that carefree energy and that mirror reflection showing what we look like without all that unnecessary fear and burden.
But we have to open to it...instead of afraid.

I adore the carefree energy you talked about...it's like you could just lay next to each other and giggle for days straight, do you feel that?

---

I agree with all of that.
and yes I think people think we are crazy or delusional or simply wasting our time, just for me it is very clearly not a waste of time but instrumental in my growth, and besides giving me a feeling of joy and happiness (mostly) that is hard to explain, and probably impossible to understand for most people. It`s just for me relating to someone contains more than just being "in" a relationship.

And yes, yes, yes, kiddish, giggling. That stream of exhilaration is just there and so hard to describe.
It is almost impossible to NOT smile at him, especially in direct contact (well both of us seem to sometimes be aware of that and try to suppress it, so it becomes this weird blank expression. lol).

But it also made me smile (inwardly definitely, outwardly quite possibly) and it also struck me (though I thought I was maybe just reading too much into it, but then again given his last comment, maybe not. lol), well what I mean is, that he seems to be blissfully unaware of the normal distance zones. Cause since we are actually not much more than two strangers (well a little more maybe), there is something like a social zone, which he seems to be just totally unaware of, which actually led me to thinking last time we spoke: "Is he trying to crawl into me?"
It is probably just the way he is, being extrovert an all, but I noticed that even the first time we met.

And also how soft his voice gets when he speaks to me. I am not exactly sure why that is, but it made me smile inwardly.

i donīt know maybe it doesn`t even really has to do with me, but it makes me smile nevertheless.

posted July 03, 2014 06:57 AM              

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:
Lol...Ugh Saturn!! I always hate it when my Saturn touches ppl, I wonder if I'm being to Saturnian. I don't want to be a buzz kill!
I guess I'm glad my Saturn is in leo...it's not a super strict Saturn(it's weak and debilitated) so it's still got a little fun left in it! Haha

---

posted July 03, 2014 10:30 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
Is it also conjunct in the composite? ALMA-JUNO, I mean?

---

posted July 03, 2014 10:37 AM              

I don't think it's about delusion here.

It's about indulging in a fantasy. I have no problem with this as long as the person acknowledges it, acknowledges it's HER/HIS fantasy, not a shared fantasy. Indulging in this fantasy can be very exhilarating, life changing and ultimately triggering some positive changes in oneself, perhaps.

I have a problem however when the line is crossed and we start to believe that, just because we're infatuated with someone, it means they are infatuated too. I think this might even create energetic interference for the other person and this is not unconditional love to me. Unconditional love means loving someone and the truth at the same time, loving someone and knowing he doesn't love you, he's with another person, he has his own life, and he doesn't see you as a partner or is in love with you. Plus, if he/she lives in a couple, he already has this connection with someone and your energy is an interfering third party energy, so it's also about respecting boundaries and life choices of the one we unconditionally love.

posted July 03, 2014 10:55 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:
Lol...I've mentioned it before also but nobody said anything so I figured I was wrong!
Another one I wonder about is PortaCoeli, it's exact on my Hyperborea.
His PortaCoeli is exact sextile my Jupiter
My PortaCoeli is exact sextile his Jupiter
PortaCoeli is the "Gate to Heaven"
Jupiter is blessings from the universe...so it makes sense to me?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:
I've been wanting to get ppl to check these out with me but nobody was interested at the time!

---

I've been in the same boat. Most people tire of the subject before I do, so it's hard to find a "study buddy". I have natal Pluto in my 3rd house quintile Mercury, and currently transiting Pluto is exactly opposite natal Mercury 0°. So, I can't exhaust my supply of research energy. I'm learning so much from the in depth study of these things.

Thanks for mentioning Porta Coeli. I had never even heard of it. I'm so glad you mentioned it. It just sounds like such a beautiful asteroid. It's meaning is beautiful.

I checked the chart with T, and it's sitting right next to Hyperborea, which you mentioned earlier. They are both conjunct in this cluster of asteroids at the Midheaven of the Composite and Davison. The cluster is in both charts.
I'll post a pic, but I'm not sure how clear it will be. I had to zoom way in to see the details.

The cluster has:
Hyperborea @ 6.56 Sag
Porta Coeli @ 6.46 Sag
Valentine @ 5.44 Sag
Soma @ 5.11 Sag

That spot is also the Venus-Pluto Midpoint, which is @ 7 Sag. Pluto in 8th Trines Venus in 12th.

There are other asteroids that sit there, too, but if I put too many in the chart at once, their names become too small to read.

In the synastry, His Porta Coeli-my Hyperborea conj. 0° in his 8th.

I love the asteroids you bring up. I'm gonna check out the other threads you linked to and check out all the possible links you mentioned.

posted July 03, 2014 11:28 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
I agree with all of that.
and yes I think people think we are crazy or delusional or simply wasting our time, just for me it is very clearly not a waste of time but instrumental in my growth, and besides giving me a feeling of joy and happiness (mostly) that is hard to explain, and probably impossible to understand for most people. It`s just for me relating to someone contains more than just being "in" a relationship.

And yes, yes, yes, kiddish, giggling. That stream of exhilaration is just there and so hard to describe.
It is almost impossible to NOT smile at him, especially in direct contact (well both of us seem to sometimes be aware of that and try to suppress it, so it becomes this weird blank expression. lol).

But it also made me smile (inwardly definitely, outwardly quite possibly) and it also struck me (though I thought I was maybe just reading too much into it, but then again given his last comment, maybe not. lol), well what I mean is, that he seems to be blissfully unaware of the normal distance zones. Cause since we are actually not much more than two strangers (well a little more maybe), there is something like a social zone, which he seems to be just totally unaware of, which actually led me to thinking last time we spoke: "Is he trying to crawl into me?"
It is probably just the way he is, being extrovert an all, but I noticed that even the first time we met.

And also how soft his voice gets when he speaks to me. I am not exactly sure why that is, but it made me smile inwardly.

i donīt know maybe it doesn`t even really has to do with me, but it makes me smile nevertheless.

---

posted July 03, 2014 11:56 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Astro keen:
Don't you dare delete your post Gabby!

Just saw it - time difference. Lovely, lovely thoughts as usual. So meaningful!

Your Saturn on my Uranus/ Hyperborea sorting me out .

---

Ok, I won't! Sometimes when I put things out that are so personal and founded on my intuition I think later....what right do I have to say that....I have no proof! What if I'm wrong?
Then if no one comments I figure it's because it doesn't resonate with them and I delete the post...feeling kind of foolish I'd put it out there in the first place.

I guess I think of everyone on this site as being inspired and deep...I kind of think that we all are but some of us are anxious, fidgety and ready to get off this planet and others are slowly walking the path and taking the time to stop and smell the roses! Lol, We are not one of those!
We are full steam ahead, let's go, get out of this place....I'm ready to fly right NOW!!
So we get the depth of each other....maybe we are the heart for each other, of our little LL home? I love this place but I do think those that are already reconnecting to TF are the ones who have their head down running full force into destiny, while the others are less intense at this moment.
I bet you a million bucks, in the next life a few of them will be the ones going through all this and feeling they found a home in their friends who are experiencing the same thing as they are....it's a home within a home!

******For everyone*****
Who has a direct NN and very obviously a life that's all about settling Karmic debt?

I have a direct NN and Karma on my AC
AC libra@7.05
Karma libra@5.49
Pluto libra@11.02

Saturn leo@2.50 is sextile Karma
Karma touches Sun saggy@4.28/Mercury saggy@3.32/BM Lilith aries@3.00

posted July 03, 2014 01:11 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wild Horses:
Gabby, I forgot to mention I checked Soma also, because I've noticed it seems to play a big part, too. I think it's the reason I feel such an overwhelmingly strong feeling of euphoria and bliss in regard to him. It's literally intoxicating.

I read that Soma is supposed to be the intoxicating divine sense of euphoria released in the crown chakra. It's supposed to represent the union of yin-yang twin currents of kundalini energy. It's also linked to the Moon, so it is known for causing a strong emotional reaction and strong feelings of mystical union. You probably know more about it than I do. I'm just now beginning to research it.

It features VERY strongly in the synastry between he and I:

-His Pholus conj. my Soma 0°
-My Pholus opp. his Soma 0°.
(Pholus being involved would explain the suddenness of the eruption of feelings)

-His Soma conj. my Psyche, opp. my Eros
-My Soma opp. his Psyche, squares his Eros
All tightly 0°-2°.

In the Composite and Davison, Soma is part of the Valentine, Porta Coeli, Hyperborea, etc. cluster conj. Midheaven.

---

posted July 03, 2014 01:12 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:

******For everyone*****
Who has a direct NN and very obviously a life that's all about settling Karmic debt?

---

I have a direct NN, also. My NN is in my 7th conjunct my Descendant 2°.

DC Cap 24°24'
NN Cap 26°24'

They trine my Moon-Pluto and oppose Mars.

posted July 03, 2014 02:13 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wild Horses:
I have a direct NN, also. My NN is in my 7th conjunct my Descendant 2°.

DC Cap 24°24'
NN Cap 26°24'

They trine my Moon-Pluto and oppose Mars.

I've read a lot of descriptions on having NN on DC, and most of them are correct, except for stuff I've read about the physical description. I keep running across stuff saying those with NN conj. DC/SN conj. AC tend to be short and stubby in appearance.
That hasn't proven to be true with me. I am 5'9". For a female, that's not considered short.

---

Have you read the theory that rx NN indicates reincarnation or your soul will be coming back....that means direct indicates your being given the chance in this life to stop that process...if you accept the challenges and allow them to move you, change you and grow beyond the need for physical pain to overcome and still love , you've learned to live love without fear stopping your love from flowing.

What I've seen is the ppl with this aspect, that decided in this life, they were going to try to balance all karma left undone, their asteroid karma will make at least some positive aspects to personal planets, hopefully more positive than negative....but it will be in a very significant place showing it's very connected to who we are right now and our purpose.

As some progress beyond needing the physical and fear, they overcome it and stay in the spiritual but are still connected to Earth, except they have defeated the fear that destroys love, so the fear is not necessary for them to experience anymore!
But none of us leave Earth completely until all of us do, we are one...we will go together or we won't go!! IMO
These ones will serve as guides and helpers, inspirers and protectors until all have come to this same place! They will spread love silently behind the scenes and won't ever again forget their origin! They know we are one, they will never feel desperate again and will happily be there for all who are still hurting and suffering through another physical incarnation.

Ubuntu, means "I am, because we are"...
Ubuntu(202373)
Here's a link to the thread about Ubuntu.... http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum28/HTML/002151.html

To me this is humanities path! But what do I know?? It's just an opinion!! Lol

posted July 03, 2014 02:48 PM            

Asteroid Ubuntu is one of my favorite asteroids. It sits right on the Composite Sun between T and I, so I'm very familiar with it.

posted July 03, 2014 02:56 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Astro keen:
In this instance, Saturn is the equaliser. It plucks people mired in doubt, gives them a good shake and dusts them down; introducing a sense of balance and a very good thing too!

---

posted July 03, 2014 02:58 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by KarmicMoon:
Thank you Gabby and Ceri,
I agree with everything you said so beautifully. When I met him there was something inside me that just click and I thought, "if I am ever going to have a chance with this relationship I need to love myself." It was strange. I am very hard on myself and never satisfied. Intuitively I just knew it would never work if i was clingy, jealous, etc. (a side note, I think this is the function of Venus /Uranus in TF relationship. Being able to love without limiting the others freedom. Without needing to "own" them. We have a DW). And so started my journey of self-love. I was guided then to read Louise Hayes book You Can Heal Your Life. One of the exercisizes is looking at yourself in the mirror and saying "I love you". I couldn't even do that without breaking down in tears. It took me a week of doing it several times a day. Two years later, I am so much stronger. Now when I look in the mirror and say I love you, I mean it and I smile.

---

Awe, I'm so happy you have learned to love yourself!!

posted July 03, 2014 03:03 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wild Horses:
I just wanted to say to both of you... THANK YOU! THANK YOU! THANK YOU!

Both of your posts touched my so deeply I can't even describe it. It mean so very much to know that there are others who understand what this all feels like. Empathy is such a healing balm. Everything you both said is exactly how I feel, and I truly could not have said it better than you two did.

It gets very hard to find others who can relate to relationships such as these, because so many just think, "Well, what's the point if you aren't together as a couple." They believe you should just get over it and move on. They don't understand that it's not that simple, because it's not about being a daily couple together. It's about the effect that the energy of the person or the energy of the relationship is having on your entire being. This energy makes you feel more alive than you've ever felt and you feel like a tree that's been in a drought... then suddenly... the rain came. You feel yourself absorbing the energy of the love you are feeling like that tree absorbing the water. You feel yourself growing in ways you never dreamed. You become a better person, more full of life, laughter, joy, inspiration, compassion, sympathy, empathy. You see the way it touches other people, too, the way they respond to the love flowing out of you. You realize that even if you and your Twin do not end up as a couple, you will always feel indebted to them because something in their spirit helped trigger this change in you.

---

posted July 03, 2014 03:10 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wild Horses:
Gabby...
I haven't studied much on the Nodal directions, but you have got me interested. I'm going to look more closely into it. I do feel that having my NN direct and on my DC has caused most of my spiritual growth to come about through and because of one-to-one relationships. Whether romantic, platonic, familial... just the vehicle of relationship. So, I'm not surprised that I would feel a twin soul connection with someone which then launched me into spiritual hyperdrive.

Asteroid Ubuntu is one of my favorite asteroids. It sits right on the Composite Sun between he and I, so I'm very familiar with it. I love it.

Our Composite Sun - Cancer 19°20
Ubuntu - Cancer 19°32

"I am, because we are."

I remember the first time I ever read that, after seeing it on our Composite Sun in Cancer, it explained so much of how I felt. I cried because it touched me so deeply.
It just causes this inexplicable feeling of uplifting joy, like the person makes your heart and spirit just take flight and soar.

---

posted July 03, 2014 03:26 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:
That's so sweet, what a place for Ubuntu to be! It's beautiful! I think your honestly one of the first ppl who I've seen familiar with it, I made a thread(i posted it on here)on it awhile back....it seemed to be new to everyone. I'm so glad you know it and see it's beauty!

---

posted July 03, 2014 03:28 PM              

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wild Horses:
Haha That thread you made back then is the one that got me to research it. I even remember Ceridwen posting on that thread that she had Ubuntu on the Composite Sun with someone who also gave her such an uplifting feeling. Then, when I checked the Composite between he and I, there it was, too. Composite Sun conjunct Ubuntu just feels damn good. You just want to share everything you have and everything you are with the person.

---

Yes, as a matter of fact with Mr Sag.

posted July 03, 2014 03:41 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by KarmicMoon:
@Gabby

I have a direct Nodes. In Pisces, 6th house, 3 41 degrees. Spiritual service. South Node in the karmic 12th house. Squared by Karma 3 12 Gemini. Karma trines Uranus and widely opposes Neptune (5 orb). Squares Vertex by 4 degrees and semi-sextiles Juno, Kaali and Parvati.

---

Really? It so cool that we are finding this!!

I researched years ago about NN directions! I found many, if not most, of the monks I researched and spiritual guru's from Tibet and holy lands or places like that had direct NN!! Very high percentage in that group.

What's even funnier is I researched about 40 Catholic priests and Popes.....lol....maybe 9 or 10 out of the 40 had direct NN!! What a difference, I can't remember exactly, I might still have the book I wrote everything down in, but I was amazed how few Catholics had it!

posted July 03, 2014 03:57 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Yes, as a matter of fact with Mr Sag.

Sun: 26.26 Sag
Ubuntu: 26.50 Sag

---

It's awesome you both have that aspect!! Ours are quite that stand out!

Comp Ubuntu makes a grand trine with my Mars and his Jupiter.

posted July 03, 2014 06:08 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:
Yes, EXACTLY!!! It's hugely important, just not for the exact reason it appears to be important. If it moves you to grow....and feel your origins, you know it's a celestial, destined, perfect union even if it looks so wrong by all "human" standards of how relationships should play out!!

I'm so happy you are talking again, do you feel that kiddish joy from being near him or just feeling his energy?

---

Like getting a jump. He's like a battery to me. This is the first time I've been able to realise it's not out of anxiety or some other kind of nervous experience. He's always depended upon me for guidance and support; I never needed to feel as if I had to impress him. I could have always just been me -- like before. But you'd be amazed at how much more 'us' we can be when you're hiding behind anonymity. Suddenly, when we were OURSELVES, we were mutually paralysed by being less than how we'd portrayed ourselves.

The crushing blow was his telling me that he'd only been in love with me when he didn't know me; now that he's gotten to REALLY know me -- I was just crazy and he would rather x, y, and z than be in a relationship with me.

Yeah. January 2013. I'd never gone through that; not LIKE that. I felt so betrayed. The core of my identity had just been skewered, and my trust completely squandered. It hardly mattered ten minutes later, he admitted that he couldn't have a casual relationship with me because of how close we were -- and that's ALL he could do. Anything more than a fling or one-night-stand was verboten.

Valentine's Day, a month later, we'd spoken again. (I'd finally answered.) He could tell from my texts I was furious, so, he called. And I answered. That's when he confessed that our communication breakdown was driving him crazy.

But I wouldn't learn until two days ago that what I'd suspected MUST be true, actually IS.

Whenever he lashed out at me, he was feeling particularly self-loathing. This is why he could never bring himself to do it over the phone. He'd become used to creating characters online; he can detach himself enough from the experience, verbally eviscerating the recipient of his words.

And he started doing that to me latter 2012.

It was a combination; usually, his family would be subject to his ire. But I was the only other one with whom he was in such constant contact. He hated everything. He was constantly angry, and afraid that he was approaching another anxiety pattern. He wouldn't go back there, and guess who caused him inexplicable anxiety? Who he was trying to impress (and then pretend he wasn't) or dealing with the most intense emotions he'd ever had (and denying he ever had them)?

Yep. This girl. But rather than actually TELL me how it was, he'd use his own Sherlockian perception to annihilate me chapter-and-verse. He knew every little thing wrong with me -- and did what you should NEVER EVER do when you love someone. (Never in general, either.)

He spotlighted, highlighted, and dragged from the depths every one of my worst personal daemons -- that which I'd buried. Deep.

But you know what? I did it, too.

Of course, I was constructive about it. He didn't care. It was an acknowledgement. Of problems. He's from a NY Italian family. As a man, you don't 'have' problems. Not personal problems. Anxiety, depression -- stuff you can't handle. Noooooo. That's a direct hit to your masculinity.

And for a woman to be the one to constantly test and make you question your foundation? He had very intense emotions about it. He loved me, and he hated me for it. Sometimes at the exact same time.

I had to back off. It was too much. I never knew if he was going to leave a cheerful voicemail telling me that he was inspired and full of wonderful ideas, and show concern for how my day might be going -- and cheer me if it wasn't well. Or if I would get a set of text messages telling me how fine he was and how great things were and that he didn't need me telling him otherwise -- especially considering I'm x, y, and z.

What would YOU do?

So I saw a host of wasted potential. A horribly angry Gregory House figure who both respected and hated me for the very same things. Who couldn't just 'f*ck me and leave me' because of that respect and genuine companionship.

In short, we were really, REALLY screwed.

He said he started calling me crazy because 'he had to loosely apply the definition' -- and I kept repeating the same avoidance behaviours, saying it was 'going to be different NOW.'

But he'd never asked WHY.

And I never TOLD him why I wasn't comfortable with our relationship anymore.

And so it continued into absurdity for months. Then a year. Then almost two.

Finally, as he admitted his genuine problem, the catharsis acquired from tearing someone down so that he feels better about himself -- classic bullying, emotional abusive behaviours learnt from his late father -- I was able to tell him that's NOT okay -- and WHY I ran.

And he apologised. Legitimately. And so did I.

I also confessed that, before that started, I was feeling bad about my own life being such a train wreck -- and never having anything GOOD to share.

Know what he said?

'I didn't care. I don't need that. I just needed you there.'

So, I said -- okay, that's it, starting today (which was Tuesday night) I'm going to be. Period. And if we have a problem, we work it out. Then. No days passing. No weeks. No hinting or shoving it under the rug. We stay honest and open and THERE for each other.

Since last night, I now know what was wrong, too. I DID come back and confront everything just in time. Sure, he would have made it through -- but how easily could he have forgiven me? Believed me when I told him I was sorry?

He has an issue with acting logically when his past emotions overwhelm his memory. He knew I deserved forgiveness years ago -- but couldn't see past his own emotions.

He needed me. Then. He needs me now. And if I hadn't made the effort, I think he very well might have allowed his pride to convince him that I didn't care -- and all of what the negativity in his head deluded him into thinking was true -- WAS true.

He's not as strong as he thinks he is -- and he's seeing that.

I've learnt how dangerous pride can be. How we can lose that which is dear to us by wallowing in our own -- AND letting them do the same.

It's not worth it.

I thank God and everything that creates this third-dimensional experience, that I 'woke up' when I did -- before the next call I got from his number was his mother telling his friends he was gone.

We don't have the time to waste -- whether it's pride or something else.

Love, or ask yourself why you aren't. Why you can't. And try harder.