posted August 15, 2006 09:25 PM            

Although I did have to laugh at this remark from BerrySweet

quote:

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Many MEXICANS were shot and killed by whites so they could cash in on their scalps.

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ROFL ... because Mexicans don't count as "Indian", right? They may not have been the kinds of "Indians" that some white settlers wanted to scalp for their own nefarious reasons ... but they're still "Indians".

posted August 16, 2006 04:21 AM              

Excerpt from "Custer Died for Your Sins: An Indian Manifesto"

"During my three years as Executive Director of the National Congress of American Indians it was a rare day when some white didn't visit my office and proudly proclaim that he or she was of Indian descent."

"Cherokee was the most popular tribe of their choice and many people placed the Cherokees anywhere from Maine to Washington State. Mohawk, Sioux, and Chippewa were next in popularity. Occasionally, I would be told about some mythical tribe from lower Pennsylvania, Virginia, or Massachusetts which had spawned the white standing before me."

"At times I became quite defensive about being a Sioux when these white people had a pedigree that was so much more respectable than mine. But eventually I came to understand their need to identify as partially Indian and did not resent them. I would confirm their wildest stories about their Indian ancestry and would add a few tales of my own hoping that they would be able to accept themselves someday and leave us alone."

"Whites claiming Indian blood generally tend to reinforce mythical beliefs about Indians. All but one person I met who claimed Indian blood claimed it on their grandmother's side. I once did a projection backward and discovered that evidently most tribes were entirely female for the first three hundred years of white occupation. No one, it seemed, wanted to claim a male Indian as a forebear."

"It doesn't take much insight into racial attitudes to understand the real meaning of the Indian grandmother complex that plagues certain whites. A male ancestor has too much of the aura of the savage warrior, the unknown primitive, the instinctive animal, to make him a respectable member of the family tree. But a young Indian princess? Ah, there was royalty for the taking. Somehow the white was linked with a noble house of gentility and culture if his grandmother was an Indian princess who ran away with an intrepid pioneer. And royalty has always been an unconscious but all-consuming goal of the European immigrant."

"The early colonists, accustomed to life under benevolent despots, projected their understanding of the European political structure onto the Indian tribe in trying to explain its political and social structure. European royal houses were closed to ex-convicts and indentured servants, so the colonists made all Indian maidens princesses, then proceeded to climb a social ladder of their own creation. Within the next generation, if the trend continues, a large portion of the American population will eventually be related to
Powhattan."

"While a real Indian grandmother is probably the nicest thing that could happen to a child, why is a remote Indian princess grandmother so necessary for many whites? Is it because they are afraid of being classed as foreigners? Do they need some blood tie with the frontier and its dangers in order to experience what it means to be an American? Or is it an attempt to avoid facing the guilt they bear for the treatment
of the Indian?"

posted August 16, 2006 04:34 AM              

http://www.ancestrybydna.com/welcome/ordernow/

So many people are mad when their results prove they are not really Indian, that they had to put it on their FAQ.

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I found these geneology sites, and apparently it is a very common myth:

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/EFSS/2000-03/0953092281

http://www.native-languages.org/princess.htm

http://www.genealogy.com/90_carmack.html

posted August 16, 2006 04:50 AM              

If I were you I would be dying right now.

posted August 16, 2006 09:28 AM              

According to this, wannabe Indians are called "twinkies" and annoy the hell out of real Indians.

If you're not a member of a Federally Recognised tribe, you're not an Indian.

http://www.comanchelodge.com/plastic-shamans.html

"There is nothing worse than having a conversation with a person that is bent on trying to convince you of their Indian Blood.

Considering that my whole family has Indian Blood, and that I lived on an Indian Reservation being known as having Indian Blood without saying a word about it to anyone, I can't fathom the misperception of others whom feel the need to convince people that they do have Indian Blood, you either do or you don't.

It is like any other creed or race if you will... you either have English blood, or you don't. You either have Irish, or you don't. You either have French or you don't. What the heck is the hang-up about Indian Blood?

In my humble experiences, I have come to one conclusion. That is thus.. Non-Indians whom go around playing Indian for some reason or another feel the need to be validated in some way by someone whom they know to be Indian.

This is done by trying out all these fun little buzzwords that make no sense at all to anyone raised as an Indian, and then make mention of ceremonies and laud their expertise in presiding over certain ceremonies and other such things. When in all reality, they have no idea what the heck they are talking about, and they show their ignorance to those whom have spent time with elders among our tribes.

I have heard of individuals claiming to be Comanche that try and pass themselves off as Medicine Men, and when questioned have stated that they were adopted by undergoing a grueling Comanche adoption ceremony that required some bloodletting sacrificial ceremony, of which the Comanche Tribe has never practiced.

Let me put it simply.. People that are adopting others as tribal members that are not in some way affiliated with a federally recognized tribe are most likely false. The reason I say this so plainly is that everyone knows that a federally recognized tribe is legit without a doubt, and if a person adopting others as Indians in the name of that tribe are not known to the legitimate tribal members, then they will NEVER be recognized by the people and are probably in all reality engaged in fraud.

This is doing a horrible thing to others, as these people's desire is to be accepted by others and when they eventually wind up going to a gathering not realizing that they have went through a false circumstance, they then tell everyone they meet that they are adopted by Chief Thunder Turtle of the Greater New York Apache tribe or some other fake tribe.

Over in Germany, this is in fact rampant. I have spoken to individuals whom have toured over there as a means of educating people about Indian Culture that was shocked to find people living in actual mock tribes and wearing Indian-type regalia on a daily basis.

It has become so prolific in fact that people are now writing to us over here in the states asking us if we know Chief so and so with such and such band of the Comanche over in the Netherlands and such! I am not sure what is going on with these people, they are either absolutely crazy, or they are so starved for any culture at all they pick Indians, I don't know why they choose Indians out of all the cultures of the world, but I would just prefer if they would just live their own culture for goodness sakes. What is wrong with that?

Then you have those folks whom we call wannabe Indians, or Twinkies for instance, that don Native Attire and Regalia, pass themselves off as a Cherokee Princess or Lakota Shaman whom claim to have been taught by some traditional leader that nobody ever heard of among these tribes. These frauds then in turn teach hoards of other Twinkies how to have sweat lodge ceremonies, smoke the sacred pipe, burn cedar and sweetgrass while listening to Yanni or Enya while pretending to be some super dynamo spiritual tribe.

On another note, there are then those Indian groupies whom are not enrolled whom just show up at a gathering expecting to dance in contests without being listed as being authorized by the elders to enter the circle.

Everyone knows that is a no-no. There are ways of doing things, and ways of not doing things, and nobody enters the circle until prayers are said and the area is blessed. That is just how it works, no matter what tribe you belong to.

I have spoken with many people regarding this issue and one thing has surfaced that appears quite often at Pow Wow and other American Indian sponsored gathering and events. And this is people whom attempt to force their way into traditional contests and events very boldly that have not been invited to do such.

Again and again I have heard of individuals dressed in fake regalia demanding to be allowed to dance that were not previously registered with the people responsible for the contests whom oversee events. These officials are responsible for keeping track of the numbers associated with a dancer and to ensure the integrity of the dancing competition.

These volunteers are constantly being harassed by these unregistered dancers showing up and demanding that they be treated like every other dancer and demand to be admitted to the contest. Most of these folks are not Indians registered with a federally recognized tribe, and in fact the shimmering plastic beads and painted chicken feathers are usually a pretty good indication of what is really going on.

Anyone whom has been to an event and witnessed this disturbing set of circumstances will tell you that upon being told that they are not permitted to dance in the contest, but are welcome to join in the public dances that everyone can participate. These bold individuals become volitile and believe it or not in many instances they attempt to get violent by starting fights. This is begun by calling the registered participants whom are authorized to be there to dance for the public, such things as Sellouts, Apple Indians and other disparaging names as a means to bring attention to their otherwise quiet refusal by authorities.

This then quickly escalates into a race issue where the unannounced visitor then bases his rejection on the fact that the event is being run by racist Indians whom hate mixed bloods that don't look like them and yadda yadda yadda.

posted August 16, 2006 09:33 AM              

Yet another Indian page, titled "Wannabees Destroy Indian Commission" about twinkies trying to claim indian blood, thus annoying the hell out of real indians.

http://64.62.196.98/board/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11749&whichpage=1

I had no idea the problem was so rampant.

posted August 16, 2006 01:21 PM            

I agree that people from various ethnic background can look so different depending on the blending of their chromosomes. Genetics is a beautiful thing and the fact that during the initial minutes of fertilizing along with the subsequent cell division, we get a gorgeous array of skin tones and colors. The way skin color is determined in celluar division is one of the great phenomenons. Chromosomes touch, exchange the briefest amount of material and the offspring from a very light skinned person and a very dark skinned person can produce an almost golden brown

Dulce - my tan is my actual skin tone. Most of my pics were taken in the winter time- but living out here in AZ I do have more sun exposure than when I lived in Maryland for 5 years. LOL....

We all have such interesting backgrounds here and come from such diverse places - no wonder LindaLand is an incredible place.

posted August 16, 2006 01:34 PM            

I see the rock got uncomfortable for you again, so you needed to crawl out for air, and to offend me again. LOL.... Unfortunately for you, you are but a flea in a big world. I never heard the "Indian Grandmother" story because MY grandmother is very much alive at the ripe old age of 92. I never had to "hear" a story because I LIVED the life with a fullblood with all the old ways passed down. That is all I will say to you in regards to my proving my blood line.

I will now comment on your behaviour -

You are an embarrassment to all females. You are an embarrassment to people on this board.
You are an embarrassment to astrology and all things metaphysical.
Worst of all, you are an embarrassment to yourself.

You are full of anger, bitterness and venom and have been towards me since you first came on this board. You have attacked me several times and come out from whatever crevice you normally reside, to throw out your personal digs.

This time you have crossed the line with race. You have used a person's ethnicity against them and have proved yourself to be a bigot.

The problems between you and I is that I stand up for my morality and back up my statements. YOU on the other hand lead pointless attacks on a person based on your preconceived notions. As a female you embarrass yourself by bragging on other threads how you use your sexuality to get gifts, money and meals from men BUT then you cry big tears when someone states that men can't be judged harshly when they use money, gifts and meals to procure sex.

For some reason you have this mental delusion that rules apply to everyone BUT you. I have called you on this and I have taken your barrage of personal attacks about the people I associate with and now you even seem to think you are in the KNOW about my American Indian friends (not Indian you racist- get the terminology correct).

You are exactly the kind of person that would use derogatory racial remarks against a person then try to disguise it with a "just kidding" or "well you shouldn't even be offended cuz you aint one of them people anyway".

Instead of hating you, I feel pity for someone like you. Having to go through life with your mindset is tragic. You are no more than a troll that targets someone and constantly pops out to attack them when you think others would approve.

But you're wrong. No one that has posted here, with the exception of BerrySweet, approves or endorses your behaviour.

Get some help because if you keep this mindset into your later years you will end up in an even more sorry state.

Also keep in mind that as people age and the hair turns gray, the skin loses it luster and wrinkles start to appear, sex and using ones body to gain attention becomes harder and harder.

Maybe invest some of your anger-energy into getting an education and bettering yourself. That way you can support yourself and not rely on sex to procure such items.

posted August 16, 2006 04:27 PM            

I completely understand the distain for any wholes OR wannabe`s preaching their superiority, but to go so far to attempt to discredit the legit bloodlines of the quiet everyday among you half, quarter , whatever breeds (of ANY nationality) is asnine!

I Know "who" I am, inside and out and this line of reasoning went out with the last train of fools.

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What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world is immortal"~

posted August 16, 2006 04:58 PM            

All of this started because of a response I made concerning all religions should be tolerant and we have all been on the other side at one time.

It doesn't help that the title of this thread also set up the situation for confrontation- but I can also understand the sentiment behind it.

~Pidaua

posted August 16, 2006 05:41 PM              

I tend to think that possibly Berry Sweet and Leyla Fey are the same person with perhaps a grudge against Pidaua but no need to insult everyone else here with Native American heritage and blood in the process of working out that grudge against Pidaua if they have to work out a grudge.

I never heard the so called "Grandmother Story" either but the person who wrote this, along with what both Berry Sweet and Leyla Fey are saying here on this thread, are certainly giving us an insight into "why people are so friggin dumb." It must be because they choose to be.

Pidaua, you and I have had our go arounds and arguments back and forth at GU but I am sorry that you are being subjected to this blatant racism and the statements made here on this thread. No one deserves that kind of treatment. In my opinion both Berry Sweet and Leyla Fey owe you an apology as well as everyone else here at LL with Native American heritage.

posted August 16, 2006 05:53 PM              

Most wouldn't know I'm Native Indian by looking at me. I'm blonde with fair skin.
I also have straight hair and dark brown eyes, etc. Interestingly enough it's most often other American Indians who recognize me as part Indian right away.

But, anyway...my attitude concerning anyone wanting me to furnish proof of my hertiage, as far as I would be concerned, is to say~

kiss my lily-white Cherokee, Apache, Irish, German, English, Dutch A*ss!

None of your business or concern!

posted August 16, 2006 05:58 PM            

The insulting statements are purely racism hid behind an anti - Pidaua agenda.

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~
What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world is immortal"~

posted August 16, 2006 06:07 PM            

quote:

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I tend to think that possibly Berry Sweet and Leyla Fey are the same person

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That same exact thought crossed my mind. Call me crazy, but the writing styles are similar (over zealous) and they're both Aquarian. I don't believe in coincidences.

posted August 16, 2006 06:14 PM              

quote:

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The insulting statements are purely rascism hid behind an anti - Pidaua agenda.

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It seems more anti-Pidaua than racism to me.

posted August 16, 2006 06:14 PM              

Thanks for the summary of the thread. I had read it.

I find it odd that so much conversation comes from offenses made by other users in a "networld". This is the reason why I posted my post. It was intended to be a "spiritual" type posting-a reminder that we can't presume anything about anyone, and any presumtions should get their own thread. Like, for example, the latest Scorpio thread that I posted on today. You know, the one that presumes that all Scorpios hold back their secrets and are possessive and all that other dribble.

posted August 16, 2006 06:15 PM            

Pid, what`s his face, Carlo? that had us walking this path of lunacy before. And he was banned for his blatant rascism, right?

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What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world is immortal"~

posted August 16, 2006 06:21 PM              

quote:

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I find it odd that so much conversation comes from offenses made by other users in a "networld".

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