posted November 17, 2017 10:31 PM            

The only way she can get moore to testify UNDER OATH is in front of congress. And that's what she's doing...saying that beverly's year book can be examined provided he testifies under oath before congress, just like beverly will.

Moore won't do it bc he knows he will purjure himself, and as a lawyer himself, he knows that wld really finish him. He's only alive politically bc of the evangelical christian cult dancing around him in a circle, shouting "HE KNOWS JESUS!" Other than that it's people like...um...you and randall lending him credibility when he doesn't have any.

So this attempt to discredit allred is just a defensive song and dance. She's defending her client very well.

posted November 18, 2017 12:34 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by jwhop:
Utter complete bullshiiite. Those are not standards of proof in America. Perhaps in backward third world countries and banana republics but not here.

---

Assuming that you think of america as "forward" and "first world" (repugnantly divisive term)...how exactly do you think we're leading?

In hate, divisiveness, racism, inequality, suppression and disrespect of women, and a moral and ethical bar that is currently so low that you wld need to peer into an abyss to try and find it...yes we are.

In leadership? No. The world is now turning to angela merkel

In education? No. Indian students do consistently better in science and math. We import the best software engineers in the world from india for their exceptional skill and knowledge, and then pay them a pittance just bc they're on foreign visas

Economically? No. In case you haven't heard, both india and china are flourishing while we're pretty much bankrupt...the next recession is just around the corner. # 45's asia trip was abt begging for money from the "backward asian" countries...which is why 45 began singing a different song when he got there, aftr saying china was raping america (in trade) while he was in the US

Spiritually? Hahaha! Yeeeah riiight!

In fortitude and courage? Absolutely NOT! Uneducated indian farmers stood together in solidarity to oust from their country, evil reptilian monsanto and his GMO seeds. Monsanto returned to the US in a hissy fit bc he cldn't contaminate india's crop and sicken millions...well bc that's what we do...throw hissy fits when we don't get our way. Meanwhile, we can do nothing abt stopping monsanto in the US, and the citizens of our "forward #1" nation in the world are eating food containing pesticides, many of which are known carcinogens. Cancer rates are going up and big pharma is making money off of sick and dying people in the #1 nation.

In our justice system? NO!!! You tried to present a rosy peachy picture abt how our justice system works, and it is absolute rubbish bc that's not how sex assault/rape cases are handled...not in the US i'm living in! The overwhelming majority of sex assault and rape cases are not reported bc victims don't want to be re-traumatized. The small fraction that do get reported are not taken seriously as is evidenced by the hundreds of thousands of untested rape kits lying in police locker rooms all over the country for years gathering dust. The majority of victims NEVER see justice of any kind their entire lives...and also have to handle the psychological aftr effects of the WORST possible violation one cld ever imagine...a violation that is worse than simple killing or murder bc of the shame and humiliation involved in rape. The small %age of cases that do end up being tried also don't see justice bc the perps either walk free or w/ just a rap on the knuckle. So quit trying to present a misleading picture abt our justice system to our foreign friends bc it isn't true

I'm not sure which leg you're standing on while feeling so superior, but
each time you arrogantly point your finger at someone and call them "backward" remember there are 3 fingers pointing right back at you!!

So please stop embarrassing yourself and all of us other americans by being hostile to someone from another country. Got that??

posted November 18, 2017 06:11 AM            

Resorting to diluted racism is a clear sign of a weak argument.

And, I believe, against the ethics and rules of Lindaland.

Surely the boundaries of Global Unity are not so lax to allow this archaic attempt at silencing through?

Jwop,
I don't blame you for feeling out of your depth here (it's clear for all to see) and were you slightly more civilised, I may even have some empathy for you and admiration for your passion and determination.

However, attempting to invalidate iQ's arguments on the basis he was not born in America, or, 'foreign' or 'not first-world' brings the issue of economic status and race into a discussion where it has no place, especially when this person is far more informed regarding human rights than you clearly ever will be.

And that is actually what this discussion is about. Sexual exploitation is a human rights issue. It extends far beyond politics, race and economics. And it is EVERYONE'S responsibility to ensure those rights are upheld by the system.
Living in a country where human rights have been repeatedly violated, I believe, makes iQ an excellent judge on the same.
You would do well to heed his warnings - you have daughters, do you not?

I think you know you would believe your own daughter if she accused a man of molesting her and would not wish her to to be wrung through the legal system the way you seem to wish other women to be.

I think you know you would not tell her that she must prove beyond reasonable doubt that this happened, as you know your daughter probably wouldn't lie to you about this and that it took a HEROIC level of courage for her to tell you (particularly if they hear your opinions on the cases in this thread).

I think you know you would not say to her "Well dear, the man you are accusing of sexually assaulting you is innocent until you prove him guilty, and until that day, I must assume you are lying to me".

IF you had, for one second, put yourself in the position of the father of a victim who is in the very vulnerable stage of disclosing a sexual assault, I do not think you would be resorting to all these nonsensical attempts to silence others who believe that the VICTIM should be believed innocent until proven guilty NOT the perpetrator.

Call me cynical, but I do not expect a civilised response from you.

I speak out because silence is support of division, victim-shaming and breaches of human rights.

As a victim of sexual trauma in childhood, I was very lucky to have justice served upon the man who stole 11 years of my childhood. I cannot begin to imagine the suffering and helplessness of those who are sexually violated without justice ever being served on the perpetrator.

posted November 18, 2017 07:02 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by jwhop:
Unlike leftist lunatics, I didn't declare them guilty upon accusation. Only after they admitted their guilt...those who did.

I'm willing to wait for proof..or their own admission. Unlike the leftist loony bin crowd.

---

posted November 18, 2017 07:07 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Catalina:
Moore is a liar so desperate that he's doctored a letter from clergymen toi make it look like they support him in this. Several have come out to expose his fraud. He may not be proven guilty - and statutes of limitation may save him from jail -but he has been proven crooked.

Funnily the picture that supposedly damns Franken looks like he's not even touching her.. and he has said he remembers the other incident differently.. but because he's been sensitive to the complainer, he's being convicted without proof just as jwhop protests Moore is.

---

posted November 18, 2017 09:22 AM            

All you mention here are ingrained in the rabid leftist list of virtues.

The very people..democrats, who virtue signal they're more virtuous and morally superior are the ones now caught in their own web of lies about their support for women's rights and wellbeing. Their façade has fallen away and given America a good look at who they really are.

Racism was and still is an institution of the democrat left as was the KKK. No one need look far to find the adoring, Hillary The Corrupt praising the Grand Poobah of the KKK, Senator Robert KKK Byrd...democrat. Further, it was the political mentor of Kommander Korruption, J. William Fulbright and the father of Algore, Albert Gore Sr. who fought rabidly against the Civil Rights Act and Voting Rights Act of the mid 1960s. democrats all.

So, save us the moral preening leftists engage in. Your masks have slipped off your dirty little faces. Your delusions of being intellectually, morally and spiritually superior beings have gone up in smoke. In reality, leftists don't begin to measure up to ordinary, everyday Americans in any of those categories.

posted November 18, 2017 09:35 AM            

if racism is so deplorable, in your opinion, perhaps you should consider offering iQ an apology for your veiled racist comment on his ability to evaluate and contribute to this discussion, due to his place of birth. More specifically, due to the socio-economic status of his country of birth, as you perceive it.

More generally, as long as you think that politics have anything to do with sexual assault, other than in the abuse of power to blame and shame victims, you really have nothing of value to contribute here.

posted November 18, 2017 09:38 AM            

However, attempting to invalidate iQ's arguments on the basis he was not born in America, or, 'foreign' or 'not first-world' brings the issue of economic status and race into a discussion where it has no place, especially when this person is far more informed regarding human rights than you clearly ever will be."

IQs arguments about how "guilt" is established in America are figments of his imagination. "Guilt by accusation" and "proving ones innocence" flies in the face of every precept of American justice. But, they are the very essence of third world and banana republic justice.

Btw, attempting to attribute a racial context to what I'm saying is an exercise in stupidity.

posted November 18, 2017 09:45 AM            

I can see why you generally avoid this forum. You're way out of your depth here.

posted November 18, 2017 09:52 AM            

that is not an explanation, nor is it an apology.

Your assumption that iQ is ignorant and uninformed because of his race, culture or origin of birth is racist, no matter whether it was direct, or indirect, as it was in this case. The terms and tone you took when responding were borderline pejorative.

posted November 18, 2017 10:07 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by jwhop:
Utter complete bullshiiite. Those are not standards of proof in America. Perhaps in backward third world countries and banana republics but not here.

---

Just quoting your illusion of superiority over our foreign friends, for reference Jwhop.

posted November 18, 2017 11:38 AM            

I have a daughter, and a dozen plus nieces in America. I would give 100% credence to their word if anyone was being stalked. Women do not travel with a Cameraman 24/7 to record their sexual harassment and assault. Evidence in Harassment Cases is almost always CIRCUMSTANTIAL.

Abused Women almost NEVER lie when thy give specific detailing of the abuse they endure.
When 9 women have given explicit details of how exactly they were harassed, real men have to support their view 100% else we are not men but mice. We are not going to imprison Moore because of these accounts (that is the job of the Courts), but we have to prevent him from gaining control of the power that can enable him to harangue the women or tamper with witnesses or evidence.

In India, 100s of women get raped every day. India is statistically the second worst country for underprivileged women in the planet, after South Africa. Which is why powerful Nations must set powerful examples of punishing predators who use their office to harass women.
In India, a complaint of harassment is sufficient to initiate an inquiry. An additional testimony is sufficient to suspend the Male from his job temporarily, pending investigation.

Like in every democracy, a person is "Innocent Until Proven Guilty" but only in a Court of Law. Accusation plus testimony is enough to prevent the person from standing for elections to a post from which he can control evidence or bully witnesses. I am sure this same "Ethical Standard" applies to USA which is why the Republican National Committee stopped funding Moore, and will surely evict him in case he wins.

I repeat, in Moore's case we have
1. Detailed Accusations.
2. Validation of Accusation prior to this coming in public domain.
3. 3rd Party Validation [Mall Manager for instance]
4. Same Republican Party people believe the women's testimony. A Jury will convict Moore for certain.

Alabamans would be doing a phenomenal injustice to their women if they elect him. In fact, only in a Banana Republic will such a Scum Bag Pervert Molester get elected, and only the most perverted kind of men will support such a candidate for a Senate Seat after so many clear cut allegations come out.

IMHO those who support Roy Moore are just misogynists. Secretly, they might even want to be him. Birds of a Feather...

posted November 18, 2017 01:58 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by jwhop:
"Lastly, there are foreign nationals here who like to stick their long, bony, busybody noses into America's affairs, political, economic and social. Before popping off about America, they would do well to expend their energy to correct the problems in their own countries. If help is needed in identifying those problems, I'm available to supply a list.

---

I don't care if iQ is able to solve his own country's problems...but i wld drop evything to listen to his warnings/tips/information/ about america. It's called being able to handle constructive criticism...in order to learn, evolve, grow, and expand in perception.

And i wld listen to him any day over you, bc all you do is keep hammering stale, outdated GOP ideas, which are so far removed from what is actually happening in the country, that you come across as clueless, as well as a red faced bigot. In all your posts on this thread i've learnt nothing from you.

So iQ's the one i'm gonna listen to. And he's welcome to talk about the US or india or any other country he wishes to discuss.

Besides, he's the only self aware gentleman on this forum, that i've encountered.

Now, where's your apology to him? You do still know how to apologize, right?

posted November 18, 2017 02:38 PM            

I suppose that's an extension of the leftist personality disorder which needs to feel superior to others. What a joke.

Worse, after the props are knocked out from under your current feel good superiority power play, you'll move on to another with no apologies. After all, you bill yourselves as morally superior, no matter how screwed up your initiatives turn out to be.

posted November 18, 2017 03:12 PM            

I ask again...

quote:

---

Originally posted by Linda Jones:
Hey einstein, a crime in which the perp uses as weapons...a twisted, perverted, lewd, and predatory mind...plus eyes, hands, and genitals...what evidence do you want???

---

If you cannot answer this, you're yourself conceding superiority

posted November 18, 2017 03:16 PM            

From a bellowing red face to a scowling gray face!

posted November 18, 2017 03:21 PM            

“If we become the party of Roy Moore and Donald Trump, we are toast,"

It’s exactly what I was saying here earlier. Someone mentioned me trying to be “Miss Cleo” (tv fake psychic). It wasn’t me predicting or trying to predict anything, but instead only stating the obvious, or reading the writing on the wall. Even the Republicans can see it. Welcome to reality, Flake.

Flake doesnt realize the damage is already done, it’s too late at this point. It won’t happen overnight, but they are going down, digging their own grave. There’s no turning back at this point.

Keep it all coming and....

posted November 18, 2017 03:24 PM            

Haven’t been able to read the thread thoroughly yet and probably won’t be able to tonight, but from the bits I have,

THANK YOU!

posted November 18, 2017 03:54 PM            

It sent a chill up my spine as about 10 years ago, I used to chat with a guy from here (LL), born in Alabama, now living in a neighboring state, who used to spend A WHOLE LOTTA time “hanging out” at his local mall. Seems that’s where he was always going (or the movie theater). I always thought it was a weird hobby for a guy in his mid- to late- 40’s.....

posted November 18, 2017 04:08 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by jwhop:
"The most hateful people in America are the leftist lunatics. Hate is ingrained and infused into their very being. They are a deplorable, disgusting, contemptible bunch of whiny, screeching, shrieking little pygmy intellects with arrested personality disorders that one would associate with pre-teens.

---

Complete, total, utter, out-and-out projection

Hey jwhop, are you perchance a closet hateful, deplorable, whiny, screeching, shrieking, pygmy intellect...a pre-teen arrested, personality disordered leftist?? And you just didn't TELL us???

And also a disgusting, contemptible lunatic?? What???

Why oh why haven't you shared your dirty little secret with us till now???

posted November 18, 2017 04:14 PM            

Hiya catalina, node, bluejay, voix, teasel!!

Voix...amazing!!

Special thanks to teasel for starting this important thread...a lot has come out. Stay strong inside...the tide is turning...no woman or child will be shamed and forced into silence anymore. We will openly speak about what has been done to us for centuries and shame them who have been doing it...and dare to still think it's ok to cross boundaries to touch a woman's body without her explicit permission in the form of a "yes you may"

posted November 18, 2017 07:01 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by iQ:
Feels rejuvenating to read the posts by the strong Ladies on this forum. They know what traumatized women go through. This is a great moment in history for Women's empowerment, across the World women are using social media to speak out.
It has been reported that the original accuser tried to commit suicide at age 16 because of Moore's sexual harassment.

I have a daughter, and a dozen plus nieces in America. I would give 100% credence to their word if anyone was being stalked. Women do not travel with a Cameraman 24/7 to record their sexual harassment and assault. Evidence in Harassment Cases is almost always CIRCUMSTANTIAL.

Abused Women almost NEVER lie when thy give specific detailing of the abuse they endure.
When 9 women have given explicit details of how exactly they were harassed, real men have to support their view 100% else we are not men but mice. We are not going to imprison Moore because of these accounts (that is the job of the Courts), but we have to prevent him from gaining control of the power that can enable him to harangue the women or tamper with witnesses or evidence.

In India, 100s of women get raped every day. India is statistically the second worst country for underprivileged women in the planet, after South Africa. Which is why powerful Nations must set powerful examples of punishing predators who use their office to harass women.
In India, a complaint of harassment is sufficient to initiate an inquiry. An additional testimony is sufficient to suspend the Male from his job temporarily, pending investigation.

Like in every democracy, a person is "Innocent Until Proven Guilty" but only in a Court of Law. Accusation plus testimony is enough to prevent the person from standing for elections to a post from which he can control evidence or bully witnesses. I am sure this same "Ethical Standard" applies to USA which is why the Republican National Committee stopped funding Moore, and will surely evict him in case he wins.

I repeat, in Moore's case we have
1. Detailed Accusations.
2. Validation of Accusation prior to this coming in public domain.
3. 3rd Party Validation [Mall Manager for instance]
4. Same Republican Party people believe the women's testimony. A Jury will convict Moore for certain.

Alabamans would be doing a phenomenal injustice to their women if they elect him. In fact, only in a Banana Republic will such a Scum Bag Pervert Molester get elected, and only the most perverted kind of men will support such a candidate for a Senate Seat after so many clear cut allegations come out.

IMHO those who support Roy Moore are just misogynists. Secretly, they might even want to be him. Birds of a Feather...

---