posted May 05, 2007 10:16 AM         

Ram Dass wraps his expanded mind around the last of the truly taboo subjects--death and dying

Sarah Phelan

ON A MONDAY afternoon, I pick up the phone feeling horribly nervous. In a minute, I have an interview with Ram Dass--the guy formerly known as Dr. Richard Alpert before he, Timothy Leary and other Harvard faculty experimented with LSD and magic mushrooms and were famously expelled from the university. But while Timothy Leary continued to tune in, turn on and drop out, Alpert became a beloved spiritual luminary who writes bestsellers.

I've spent the weekend reading two of them--Be Here Now, his 1971 classic that documents the Ramster's spiritual unfolding, and Still Here, which he completed after a disabling 1997 stroke. All of which has made me horribly aware that he talks from the heart about matters of spirit, a subject about which I know woefully little.

And yet when I actually speak to him, I find myself quickly at ease. Perhaps it has something to do with the slow and sometimes halting voice in which he has spoken since his stroke, but as I listen to the silence between his words, I relax and realize that what I really want to do is trash all the questions I've prepared and ask him about what's most troubling me--the direction our world is headed, post-Sept. 11--in the hope he'll offer me some useful advice. So, that's what I do.

"I'm scared, too" replies RD, an answer I find surprisingly comforting. "When I got my stroke, I finally conquered my fear by seeing it as fierce grace. Incredible grace. So, I think of Sept. 11 as fierce grace for humanity. It faced us with death and seeing all the symbols that we are powerful hit."

He pauses, and I listen to his labored breathing on the phone.

"I've been going around saying, 'I didn't know Shiva had a pilot's license,' which is pretty raw humor, I know," he says, finally. "But the questions we've been asking since that time are the kind of questions that try men's souls and that's what's so powerful about fierce grace. All this fear we're experiencing is people inhabiting their egos, because egos fear death."

This Time, It's Medical

Fierce Grace is also the name of Mickey Lemle's new Ram Dass documentary, which premieres in Santa Cruz on Nov. 7, as a benefit for the Wo/Men's Alliance for Medical Marijuana, a.k.a. WAMM.

Asked about the DEA's September raid of WAMM, Dass, who uses medical marijuana to help deal with the effects of his stroke, says, "I think the Santa Cruz bust was the poster child for the war against the war on drugs. Ethan Nadelman of the Drug Policy Alliance says Valerie Corral is the Mother Teresa of the medical marijuana movement. My purpose in coming to the Fierce Grace benefit screening is to let people know that Valerie and Michael Corral do incredible work."

But while Ram Dass has frequently and publicly stated that marijuana, LSD and magic mushrooms are carriers between what he calls "the two planes of consciousness," he admits that drugs alone can't free you from the ultimate control freak of life--your ego.

"Before the path of mushrooms, I was pretty much on the Western track, but then those experiences with mushrooms pointed to the home inside, which all my Western psychology didn't cover," Dass recalls. "And so we were studying, going down into our psyches, until we said, 'Who has got the map for this domain?' Aldous Huxley gave us the Tibetan Book of the Dead, and it was a map for consciousness, and everybody, all the gang, had gone to India--Allen Ginsberg, Timothy Leary, Ralph Metzner, Alan Watts--they all did, long before me. But in the end, we found that we couldn't get through our egos with drugs, that our egos controlled the drugs."

RD has moved on, though, to even edgier subjects. In How Can I Help? he wrote that one of the best ways to help someone is to be with them, look into their eyes, and listen. Since writing that, RD had a stroke and then finished Still Here, which deals with coping with aging, changing and dying--the West's three great taboos.

So what I ask him now is: Does he himself fear death?

"No. I don't think I do. To me, a death is a big acid trip, and I sort of like those. They are optimum change. The most important thing you can do in your dying period is to identify with your soul and not with your ego."

Fierce Grace director Mickey Lemle, who has known Ram Dass for 25 years, says he's wanted to make a film about him for years, but RD kept saying he wasn't ready. Lemle then recalls a conversation he had with RD a few months after the stroke on the porch of Dass' San Anselmo home.

"He pointed to himself with his left hand, the one that still works, and said, 'This is not who I thought I was going to be. Because my vision of myself as an old man didn't have a stroke in it.'"

According to Lemle, what RD said next altered his own view of reality.

"He said, 'When I focus on who I used to be or on who I thought I was going to be, it brings up suffering. But if I just rest in awareness, I'm fine.' For him the stroke was very traumatic and unsuspected, changed every aspect of his life--and helped him get closer to God. In the same way, Sept. 11 has been very traumatic for culture, but it can become fierce grace--hence the title of the movie." http://www.metroactive.com/papers/cruz/11.06.02/dass-0245.html

posted May 05, 2007 10:22 AM         

Wow...I love that picture with the flying carpet.
And the penguin...
I hear you ... about the unaugumented trip.
I have never been patient enough within myself to fly.
And it is something would love to cultivate.

So having experienced this altered bliss, the experience is easier to evoke?

posted May 05, 2007 10:59 AM         

Stephen ~

quote:

---

If people cared more about finding and understanding the truth than they do about guarding their present beliefs, they would welcome debate as a means to reform their beliefs, so that they will be fortified by a profound understanding of the truth; then no holes could be poked in them.

---

You are deeply disturbed about others "guarding their present beliefs" and not caring *enough* (in your opinion) about "finding and understanding the truth."
I also note that those others that you disparage probably do not have Mercury, Mars and Neptune in Sagittarius, nor a Pisces South Node

To my mind and understanding (albeit inadequate at times), your analysis of what people should care about conflicts with your comments:
let the baby have his bottle
and let me have my ego
life is a trip, let me have mine

posted May 05, 2007 11:05 AM         

quote:

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When my voice was meek, few people paid attention to my words. When I began to provoke people a bit, suddenly, all the champions came out of the woodwork to try their steel against me. And that is just the way I like it. If I am a turn-off to others, that is okay. I am not here to cut and chew their meat for them. Someone else will come along and baptize them with water. I've got a fire to spread. That's, at least, where I am coming from right now.

---

posted May 05, 2007 11:31 AM         

I havent even been reading your posts lately. What makes you think I'm going to read the novel you just wrote me? Who are you talking to anyway? I think you need to take a break. This is classic co-dependent behavior. Time to log off.

Fayte,

If I dont reply to you in the next 24hrs,
do me a favor and dont release the hounds.
This isnt my life.

Naiad,

Thank you.
I appreciate that a lot.

People have no idea how clearly I see myself,
and from so many angles.
It is so annoying to have people tell me
about some side of myself,
as if that is going to magically wake me up,
and I'm suddenly going to somehow shed that dimension.
Unlike most people,
I dont experience many surprises or rude awakenings;
not because I'm fast asleep, but,
because I've been up all night.
I know my shadow. We are on speaking terms.
The dialogue isnt lighthearted or flattering.
But it persists.
It is so easy for people without demons,
or with demons whom they serve and call angels,
to talk to me about fighting my own.
I cant get rid of them by fighting them,
any more than I can catch my tail by chasing it.
They have something to say,
and when they've said it,
they move on, and so do I.
But I go my own way.
Unfortuneately,
I am the dialogue,
and its participants.
But I know that much.

Sorry to go on like this,
but I just wanted to address these thoughts
to a sympathetic audience.

love to you,
s

---

Dew,

What's your Sun. Moon, Ascendant?
You sound a little Taurean.
I've never had a full-on bad trip either, -
I tend to stay fairly steady and in control,
even in the midst of some very profound turbulence.
But I've witnessed my friends go through them.

Thank you for the lovely things you said.
I need to get back to those heights.
Been striking at terrestrial prey for too long.

posted May 05, 2007 11:37 AM         

quote:

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When your "voice was meek" people (speaking for myself here, but possibly others) found you charming, enchanting, deep and very much worth reading/listening

---

posted May 05, 2007 11:47 AM         

quote:

---

Fayte,

If I dont reply to you in the next 24hrs,
do me a favor and dont release the hounds.
This isnt my life.

---

Is that a subtle way of saying you think I ordered Mirandee and Zala and others to give you a much needed "what for"?

I do not control them and neither are they "hounds"!
Which BTW....that is one insult to a female....even an idiot knows,
Ihat is a sly way of calling the "females" you disagree with...a pack of B!tches out to chase down and hurt you, the poor little bunny or whatever.

But then you say such things as this:

quote:

---

Been striking at terrestrial prey for too long

---

quote:

---

It is so easy for people without demons,
or with demons whom they serve and call angels

---

posted May 05, 2007 12:15 PM         

Its great talking to you too.
Im a 24 year old ladee....who has for the most part felt trapped within the social paradigm I exist in...and not nearly brave enough to create my own.
I get real scared of being responsible for other people's happiness....so I have a tendency to curtail my own.

I was always considered kinda weird between my friends as someone who has a 'clearing-out' as a result of shrooms.
But its nice to know I'm not alone.
Then again I am an 'old soul' amongst my peers.

The only time I feel peace and bliss is when I am present and focused on the 'I'. As with everyone, I guess.
I have had moments of 'enlightenment' and I have created a space within myself wherein I am just going with the flow and I know all is good.
So staying present is something I am working on cultivating. I very much enjoy talking about altered states.
And I have just finished reading a book by Bear Heart about the shaman ways of Native Americans.
All of which is of great great interest to me.
My fantasy is to travel to some distant land to meet someone who is still very much veresed in the old world ways.
Who is very much in touch with nature and with the songs in his heart.
I believe I shall meet someone like this.
My friends call me gullible because I am soo open.But I remind them that I am not so much open that my mind falls out but I absolutely believe that anything is possible.

Fayte,
Did you ever have the opportunity to meet such a teacher? And where did your interests take you?
Tell me all...

HSC,
This is the second time I've gotten some online love from you and it feels nice.
I was a real cynic about groups and group mentality...be it online or otherwise....but it was all a front.
A front for my fears of losing my individuality and the whole responsibility thing.
But hey, I am really embracing it now.
I want to be part of EVERYTHING now.
I got a 8H Cancer Sun, 2H Capricorn Moon and a Sagitarrius ascendant.
How you feeling these days?
You know the moon was in Scorpio 3 days ago? Maybe that explains the funky moods. Non?

Peas & Love

posted May 05, 2007 12:17 PM         

You Mirandee and Zala, humph, if I recall,
that's exactly what you do!

Stephen is standing alone

as I stand alone

I think you need to look at yourSelves, and what you have written, the whole World is, and
this is ridiculous!

posted May 05, 2007 12:28 PM         

quote:

---

Fayte, enough!
You Mirandee and Zala, humph, if I recall,
that's exactly what you do!
Stephen is standing alone

---

posted May 05, 2007 12:32 PM         

and everyOne reading in here, from around the world that is Intune, can SEE it too, it's right there in plain site....
all they have to do is read, Stephen has walked away several times, while you women continue to put him down, and show how much stronger you are than him, yet you do not see this...
But,
many do....

Compassion and Understanding,
LOve....for ALL

posted May 05, 2007 12:43 PM         

Later folks!

posted May 05, 2007 12:44 PM         

quote:

---

found I did not "need" the augmentors to "take" me to those realms.
Certain meditative techniques now do that for me. Or a certain piece of music.

---

That's awesome, I totally get what you mean!!! I once read up on the Symptoms of those LSD trips and I'm like: yo, I've been there without the drugs. Maybe its a water thing?

posted May 05, 2007 01:41 PM         

All those receptors in the brain have endogenous functions. Meaning that there is some substance naturally secreted by the brain that binds to these receptors.

Pot binds to cannibinoid receptors which are involved in a pain reducing resopnse along with other natural opiods like endorphins.

LSD works at the serotonin 2A receptor. But may act in a different way than your typical brain serotonin.

posted May 05, 2007 01:57 PM         

'Zala,

Thank you for voicing your objections without devolving into hysterical rage (as some are wont to do). It is a pleasure to debate with you. Understand that I will still word my responses in playful, but provocative, language.

quote:

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Assuming that we are speaking of “religious” beliefs here, I find it interesting that you believe that there IS a truth or truths (or belief/theory/opinion) about the Infinite/Unknowable that no holes could be poked in,

---

True religion does not conflict with science and logic. Some people want to draw a clear line of demarcation around their beliefs, saying, "Private Property! Science and Logic KEEP OUT!!" (((Now I've got that Tesla song, "Signs", in my head again.))) The problem is, those lines limit their ability to grasp, not merely the infinite, but the finite, which is, after all, the only means of approach to the infinite. "When you know what is seen, the unseen with appear. How can I speak to you of heavenly things, when you have not understood earthly things?".

Just because people put up those walls, doesnt mean I have to walk around them, when I have the ability to walk through them; because I move according to the spirit of Religion, and not the letter of religions. People read according to the letter, and then I tell people this, and they get all up in arms. I am doing exactly what Jesus did (not all that he did, obviously, but some of it), but they worship him and stone me. They would stone him if he were here, and I am proof of that. Jesus was no respecter of religions, and his voice was righteous [i]and[\i] indignant far more often than it was meek. Let's not kid ourselves. It is not different just because he was Jesus (who said, "follow me"), and it is not pressumtuous of me to emulate him. People break their necks nodding their approval when they read his words adressed to the Pharasees, but they are as indignant as the Pharasees when those words are adressed to them. Their beliefs are not temples but tombs. They are all whited sepulchres, filled with corruption and decay. I do not appear in sheep's clothing, so you reject me. But I am neither sheep nor wolf. I am a shepherd.

quote:

---

You are deeply disturbed about others "guarding their present beliefs" and not caring *enough* (in your opinion) about "finding and understanding the truth."

---

I'm not "deeply disturbed", 'Zala, lol. I'm just very frustrated (and I express that frustration flamboyantly) with what I see as the defense of mediocrity in an area of life which many pay lip-service to as extremely meaningful and important, perhaps more so than any other, but which they havent the inclination to discuss and explain to others, except by making use of popular one-liners and convenient cliches which don't really apply.

quote:

---

I also note that those others that you disparage probably do not have Mercury, Mars and Neptune in Sagittarius, nor a Pisces South Node

---

Not to mention my Sun, Venus, and Pluto in the 9th house, and Jupiter angular (in Leo) in aspect to the Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Uranus, the Midheaven, and Chiron.

But, to answer the question I think you are asking...

Maybe they will in the next life,
after meeting me.

posted May 05, 2007 01:58 PM         

quote:

---

To my mind and understanding (albeit inadequate at times), your analysis of what people should care about conflicts with your comments:
let the baby have his bottle
and let me have my ego
life is a trip, let me have mine.

---

Ego is not my milk.
It is the hot air that sometimes catches
in my lungs when I drink.
I do need to be burped,
from time to time,
but not struck with an closed hand.

You snatch my bottle away when it is that which nurses and strengthens me,
and my cries are a reproach to the whole world.
I snatch your bottle away when it is that which poisons and sedates you,
and your cries are something the world understands.

Before you object, just think,
what if I am right?
If you think I am only making claims,
then ask me about my claims.
If you only ask me about myself,
I must talk and tell you about myself.

quote:

---

When your "voice was meek" people (speaking for myself here, but possibly others) found you charming, enchanting, deep and very much worth reading/listening to.

---

The world loves a flatterer, 'Zala, you know that.

quote:

---

I am not a champion sharpening my steel against you.

---

Your Libran perception might not desire to see it that way. My Scorpio perception does not permit me to see this as a casual encounter. In any case, whether or not you see your words as swords, you have come out to face me, and to speak for your peace, and for the peace of those you choose to speak for.

quote:

---

I am merely another human spirit trying to find my OWN understanding on my OWN trip.

[quote]Please allow me the space and "free will" to do so

---

I have seen this in many Libra-influenced people. They are very good at twisting situations, to make it appear that the other person is being unfair, when the other person is merely practicing justice before mercy.

quote:

---

-- please correct me if I'm wrong,

---

I'm working on it.
"People need to be reminded more often than they need to be instructed."
- Samuel Johnson
Correction is easy,
when it is a matter of reminding,
and difficult when it calls for instruction.

quote:

---

But that seems to be what you were asking for a little bit ago.

---

I was being abusive then.
I've been very careful with my language since then.
What I asked to be corrected for
is not something I have continued to do.

quote:

---

And about that fire you want to spread?? NIMBY please.

---

I'm not fluent in internet speak, but I'm assuming NIMBY means you want an explaination. 'Zala, the prophets have never been luke-warm. They are called firey for a reason. They were not greated with laurels, but with stones. They incited revolutions, not cuddlepuddles. They questioned people's belief systems, and they did it in a way that made them impossible to ignore. They made people upset. They were derided, rejected, and stoned to death. The people danced for joy, and felt victorious for having killed them. Only a chosen few could hear them. And that is the way its always been. When the majority is against you, there is a pretty good chance that you have something truly special to say. When the majority is for you, there is absolutely no doubt that you are just another sheep in the herd.

If you think my objective is to make friends, all you will see in my words is error. I am not here to do that. I am here to provoke controversy, questions (like the ones you asked me, and I now get to answer), and passionate introspection. As long as you can be provoked and incited by me, it is proof that you are still alive. I have always admired that passion, and whosoever has ears to hear, has heard me say this many times. But passion must be well-directed, not blindly objecting to anything that threatens the walls we've built around our minds. Some answer every sound from the outside with a flurry of barks. Some answer just to see what dreams and truths may come. Some hear only what they want to hear, and some hear the truth. Some hear a fist, and some hear a knock. Who has ears to hear, let them hear.

And even those who rail loudly and violently against me now, will be pulled into the silence of the vaccuum that remains when I am gone. Verily, the loudest shall be pulled most deeply into the silence.

I am an imperfect channel.
But I am a powerful channel.
There is grace in every thought,
as there is wheat in every husk.

posted May 05, 2007 02:24 PM         

quote:

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And how interesting to be called “terrestrial prey”….. makes me chuckle
I doubt that you would find me very tasty, or satisfying to your hungers, Stephen

---

I was neither speaking nor referring to you, 'Zala.

But, how is that Leo Ascendant workin' out for ya?

My Cappy one is going a little crazy lately, too.

posted May 05, 2007 02:50 PM         

Thanks for spending your time and energy to clarify for me
As usual I am impressed by your eloquence..... and I appreciate your observations, even if I may not agree with them

"NIMBY" means Not In My Back Yard -- it was a joke