posted August 26, 2006 10:43 PM              

You guys can twist things and put it all off on the liberals or lie your way out of it all you want but the truth remains for all to see if they just go read the threads at GU.

Jwhop stop with the dumb mantras. You keep repeating over and over again like a warp in a CD that we never offer proof and all we do is offer proof to back up what we say. Petron, myself, DD, Rainbow, and AG have offered pages and pages of proof. Then you tell us we are liars and the proof offered comes from lying liberal sources. You won't accept any proof we offer then turn around and say we don't offer any because it is not the proof you want to hear.

I am not playing the victim here, Jwhop. Because I do not feel that I am a victim. I have never allowed you or Pidaua or anyone else to make me a victim and I never will. What I am doing here is letting these people know that what LMoon and DD has said here on this thread is true. And it is.

Pidaua, it is your perception that my apology was weak. That is a judgment call on your part. It was sincere and I told Jwhop up straight that I would owe him an apology if that letter proved to be legit which it did and I apologized. I don't know what you expect me to do in regards to apologizing Pidaua. What would you consider a strong apology? Not that I really care. At least I apologized. I can't judge how weak or strong any of your apologies have been, Pidaua because I have never seen one.

Well at any rate I won the bet when I predicted what you guys would all do when I gave my opinion here. I think people can just read the posts and judge for themselves.

posted August 26, 2006 11:21 PM              

I don't like G.W. Bush. I don't hate him but I do hate the things he does and what he stands for.

I stand behind every statement I have ever made about Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld. I will not retract a word of it. As for Bush being a moron, yes I have said that. He gives me ammunition I am going to use it. Because if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck it probably is a duck. You can whine about that all you want and I will still call him a moron. You can verbally attack me all you want and it is not going to silence me. I have my principals and beliefs I stand true to them. I won't compromise them to get along and I won't ever think like you guys so it is useless to even make the attempts to browbeat me into doing that.

posted August 26, 2006 11:37 PM              

------------------
"WHATEVER the soul longs for, WILL be attained by the spirit"

"Love knows not its own depth until the hour of separation"

posted August 26, 2006 11:47 PM              

You are condoneing two people
s actions that have been rude..
and argumentative..can you see that?
Have you read this entire thread?

L Moon started all of this..it should have been started in GU..where she had a problem..to me..and it's only my opinion..you are amking no Sense...Sorry

posted August 27, 2006 12:13 AM            

I don't know what to say.

I don't see how you can say that the right is all bad and the left is not. Standing in the middle I see very clearly that both sides engage in the kind of activity that is being complained about here.

I don't understand how you can demand that others follow standards of conduct that you and many others in GU are unwilling to follow yourselves on the very flimsy excuse that "soandso is a public figure".

I don't recall anyone saying you can't have opinions or share them.

The problem is personal attacks and verbal abuse ... when you engage in that behavior regarding anyone at all ... that is not just expressing your opinion ... and demanding that others adhere to your standards while wiping the floor with theirs is hypocritical.

If no one on the left here can admit that ... if no one on the left can see the hypocrisy of that ...

then I guess I'm just not as cut out for this place as I thought I was.

So go on and vilify all the Conservatives here if you'd like. Toss us Independents under the bus, too. If what you want is to libel Pres. Bush and this adminstration and this war without having anyone at all disagree or call you on blatant lies, personal attacks and verbal abuse ... if you want everyone who disagrees with you to just shut up and bow to your all knowing "super-spiritual" wills and admit that they themselves are nothing more than stupid, blind, ignorant, baby killing sheeple and that anyone who dares to speak out is just evil and attacking you and is, of all things, a racist ... then I guess there's nothing that rational minds can do about it.

God/dess knows I've tried.

And I'm very sorry to have ever had to reach that opinion of GU and some of the people who post there myself.

Edited to add;
Mirandee
posted August 19, 2006 04:28 AM
This is how I see AG at GU (laughing smiley)

from: http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum7/HTML/004975-42.html

It's not just something the rest of us are imagining if anyone is still unbiased enough to be objective after this fiasco ... not that it'll make much difference I suppose, but it does matter.

posted August 27, 2006 01:12 AM            

quote:

---

That was one instance when VL was defending me. But you fail to mention all the other times that you attacked her verbally calling her a troll and like Pidaua, telling her that she was off her medication etc. It constantly amazes me that you people personally attack everyone who disagrees with you, calls them awful names, suggest that they are mentally disturbed and what not and yet you get upset beyond belief when people don't just take your BS and tell you off

---

With regards to me supposedly engaging in name calling, you are either lying or somehow mistaken. As usual you are confusing what Pid, Jwhop, Rainbow or someone else has said with me.

Apparently to you, this:

quote:

---

Don't feel sympathy for Mirandee Isis.

Feel sympathy for yourself for being a dirty wh*re who likes one night stands

---

constitutes "defending you"?

So, when Rainbow and Pid are having one of their mud-slinging sessions, if I were to call Rainbow a "wh*re", or even worse, I take it your position would be the same - that I was just defending Pid's honor, and therefore, while it's not really "right" or "ideal", it is "ok" cause she invited it by name calling before me? I'll just pick a volatile aspect of my chart, blame that, and say, "she started it!".

No, that wouldn't be ok. And nothing in my chart, nor any baseless allegation you make towards me, nor anything that was said would make that 'ok' or justifiable as far as I'm concerned. (Note that when VL called me that, even then I didn't engage in a name calling contest with her)

I bite my tongue (erm...fingers?) and have to restrain myself sometimes, like right now for instance, when I'd like to just rip someone a new @sshole. Because I don't want to be belittled and called names, so I try, and most of the time succeed, in not calling other people names.

VL/TP/AM etc's behavior in GU is there for the whole site to see. The very fact that she's been banned at least three times that I know of, speaks platitudes.

And the fact that you continue to defend VL's behavior is...mind-boggling.

You also try to portray it as if I call for a banning whenever names fly. I've been called names plenty; I've been on the receiving end of all the subtle and overt insinuations that we're just basically bad, mindwashed people, and yet the only time I requested someone be banned was when they came into a conversation out of nowhere and called me a wh*re.

I'll say it again:

I don't call people names, yet I get lumped in with those that do merely because I agree with their politics. Even better, when someone calls me a name, it is defended not in the name of ME having called people names and "deserving it", but because other people whose politics I agree with call people names. Again, gotta love how that works.

If you have an issue with how some people on the site talk to you, take it up with them.

posted August 27, 2006 03:12 AM              

Charlotte
Knowflake
Posts: 753
From: Tn. USA
Registered: Apr 2004

I have been a member of LL for 2 years now and have NEVER been involved in a debate until now!
I unfortunately came across you and DD, had I known the two of you were posting so vehemently against all who hold a different belief then your own, I would have avoided GU completely!!!!
I have no idea where you got that I have been here for only a month, and further more, the first post I ever made in LL was a post about a Dream that I had about Linda...
I only posted to DD after being attacked myself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You can spread lies all that you want- SHAME on those who believe them! and post without knowing the full truth of the matter.
You were wrong about when I joined, you were wrong about calling me a troll, you are wrong on So many levels that I would laugh if it all wasn't SO SAD!!!!

I have had enough of this slander, put a stop to it! the next time that you mention my name it better be the truth! if you have any sense of dignity.

If you were a teacher, I wouldn't let you get within a thousand miles of my two children, I teach them the value of honesty, something you know very little about!
and yes, this time I am angry!
GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

posted August 27, 2006 03:49 AM              

quote:

---

Mirandee..just so you know..our opinions are not truth..neither one of us..

You are condoneing two people
s actions that have been rude..
and argumentative..can you see that?

Have you read this entire thread?

---

Sorry that you don't feel that what you believe is truth, Lotus but I happen to feel that what I believe is my truth. That truth on certain things can change in light of further reasonable, logical evidence to the contrary, but for now it is my truth because I believe it to be true. Anything that you believe to be true is in fact your truth, Lotus. But the only Absolute Truth is God.

quote:

---

You are condoneing two people
s actions that have been rude..
and argumentative..can you see that?

---

You mean pretty much the way you condone the actions of Jwhop, Pidaua, Isis, and lioneye on every thread when they are rude and argumentative to people at GU and beyond that you chime in with them in the rudeness and argumentative statements Lotus?

posted August 27, 2006 08:45 AM              

remember when I told you to look in a mirror?
I didn't mean a real one..I meant take a look at yourSelf..

as for my actions..they are my responsiblity and karma..and I apologize when I have done something wrong..

YOu Mirandee have said horrible tings to me..
I forgave as you did..but you have never apologized to me..You are having two faces...

posted August 27, 2006 11:38 AM            

You are one of the few people on earth who I refuse to take anything you say at face value.

You just had another chance to post the lying statement(s) you allege Bush made...and once again, instead of doing so, you come off with more bullsh*t.

posted August 27, 2006 12:56 PM            

Today, the two newsmen who were kidnapped in Gaza were released by the terrorists and had a story to tell...and briefly told it.

They were forced at gunpoint to convert to Islam.

This is the public face of radical Islamics, convert or we will kill you.

This is the statement coming off radical Islamic clerics..in Europe and in the US.

This is the statement coming from the President of Iran, the utter madman who sent Bush a letter suggesting Bush should convert to Islam. It seems there's a provision in Islamic law or teaching which require a person or persons be given a chance to convert to Islam before any punitive action is taken against them.

This is the same little Iranian madman who is preaching and inciting genocide against the Jews in Israel...and presumably against Jews everywhere.

Now, for all those who are Muslim, this is the public face some in authority within your religion are putting on your religious faith. If you don't agree with the picture they're painting of Islam then you have some options and the ball is in your court.

One of your options is NOT to claim racism when someone points out the ill advised words and religious philosophy coming off some in positions of authority within your religion and governments. Attempts to shut people up always fail.

No one here has suggested all Muslims, most Muslims or even significant numbers of Muslims are terrorists or terrorist sympathizers. No one.

The fact the utterly corrupt wussies at the UN have not gotten around to defining terrorist and terrorism is totally immaterial. The rest of the world has and that definition describes the ACTIONS and NOT the race or religion of those who engage in the activity.

Eleanore, of course we can have reasonable discussion of issues, even when we disagree. First, you are a reasonable person with well thought out positions which you lay out clearly and I can see exactly where you're coming from. You have never loaded up your comments with libelous, slanderous accusations and we can have the polite, reasonable discussion of issues for which the GU forum was intended.

There are others on different sides of issues for which the same is true. We can disagree without the heat. Mainly because I perceive them...and they have proven to be, people of good will who are honestly, if passionately discussing issues about which they feel strongly.

Someone here said L Moron and that fits. The attempt to divide the membership at LL has failed and mainly because almost none of our members who post mainly on the other forurs jumped in to take sides as L Moron intended.

posted August 27, 2006 01:13 PM            

You can thank L Moon for starting it on FFA.

posted August 27, 2006 01:45 PM              

If I continue on defending myself here on this thread against the accusations this thread will collaspse under it's own weight as the KS thread did and it will get uglier and uglier as that thread did.

So I am not going to continue on past this post. What is taking place here on this thread is precisely what takes place at GU on a daily basis. These people have proven themselves true to form on this thread and I think that supports what LMoon said when she began this post and what DD said. Others here can draw their own conclusions.

Elanore what point were you trying to make by posting that picture that I put into the image thread other than that I have a sense of humor? That picture was a joke and I am sure that often the people on the right feel what that picture depicts as well. I thought it was funny and if someone on the right posted that picture as a joke I know that everyone on the right would be laughing their a$$ off. That picture also depicts what a lot of people around LL think about GU which is why they don't post there. Actually that picture was tame in comparison to what has been said to me, Rainbow, AG, DD and others who hold what these people determine to be a "liberal" view or who are not Bush supporters. The whole point of that image thread was how we see others at LL. That picture did, in a humorous way, depict how I see AG in the threads at GU at times. And like you, Elanore, AG presents himself and his views in a calm, non attacking manner and makes effort to see the other side of issues and yet he is still attacked personally and called names. Though in AG's case I do know where he stands as I think the others at GU do as well.

Charlotte the reason I brought up your name in one of my posts here is because I have not posted much at GU in about a month and your name is not familiar on the threads there. It struck me as odd that it was two of DD's posts that you responded to immediately because she was being attacked by others at GU at the time. Trust me it was not because I felt that you were even in the ballpark regarding truth that I mentioned you here. It was what you said about Muslims to DD on those threads that made me wonder about you.

I have noticed, and I think that DD would admit it, that she has gotten a little defensive lately in her replies to people, but who can blame her when she is ganged up on by all of you on a daily basis every time she posts something regarding the Muslim viewpoint or something about her religion?

Because Jwhop is constantly repeating his mantra that I do nothing but lie and spread liberal lies as he has done also on this thread, is the same reason on my part for being suspicious of that letter that Jwhop got and I explained on that thread why I was suspicious. I didn't get the same form letter that he did the first time I wrote to the station but got the same form letter as Jwhop the second time I wrote after he posted his letter and said what he did. They obviously changed their form letter between the time that I first wrote the station to the time that Jwhop wrote and that mix up was confusing but I did apologize to Jwhop and still you people will not let it drop.

My point is that when people accuse you of lying all the time or hammer you like you guys do to DD because she is trying to let you know how the Muslim people think and feel, we may tend to get a little paranoid or suspicious about the motives of people like that. In Jwhop's case he used that response that he got in a form letter from the station to accuse me of lying and misinforming people. He used it to support his repeated mantra that I was a liar who only posts liberal lies when all it really was in fact was a mix-up when the station changed their form letter. Pidaua will not only not let it drop but she has even determined that my apology doesn't count because she feels it was "weak." Good God! That speaks volumes about what has been said here by DD, LMoon and myself. I will be accused of making excuses for myself and DD for having said this but it is not an excuse for anything. It is just explaining why we may be defensive at times. The same applies to Rainbow, AG and others at GU. Cripes when people are constantly being attacked for every view they give in every post they make it is only normal to get a wee bit defensive, don't you think?

It's a no win situation any time with these people because they feel that they are right and they will go and on for an eternity until someone says they are right because fairness, true discussion and debate does not matter to these people. The only thing that matters is being right on their part and attempting to hammer anyone down who does not feel and think as they do or agree with what they say.

Of course Jwhop has never personally attacked you, Elanore because you sit on the fence on most issues and it is really hard to determine exactly what position you hold or what side of the fence you are on. Maybe that is just due to your attempts at being fair but sometimes people need to take a stand one way or the other or you don't really know where they stand on anything. There is certainly
nothing wrong with trying to be fair, but one thing for sure, it does keep you out of the frying pan and out of the heat at GU. Tink was suprised on one of the threads at GU because I thought from her response that she was a Bush supporter and really I thought that for the same reason. Tink does not get personally attacked by Jwhop at GU either. I may not agree with their political views and I may not like the tactics they employ but I do admire the passion that some of those at GU on the right have for what they believe to be true. Unfortunately that same admiration for the passion of their principals, political views and beliefs of those on the left seem to only be seen as a threat of some kind to those on the right at GU.

Enough said on my part because anything that I say will be taken out of context and twisted around to mean what some of those people here want it to mean, or think it means, or perceives it to mean or wants to depict it as to others and this will go and on for an eternity until they feel they have proven themselves to be right and us to be wrong.

posted August 27, 2006 02:04 PM              

And focus on more wholesome and uplifting issues, like helping each other with kind words, healing, light, funny stories etc

posted August 27, 2006 07:14 PM              

Mirandee - Admittedly, Jwhop and I have similiar perspectives on several subjects. We also have painfully contradictory philosophies on a host of others. Many, many times we have come to blows on the latter. Nevertheless, we have kept the peace and remained generally calm and always civilised. My political beliefs, and I'm guessing Eleanore's as well, are firm and clear. I find the idea that a staunch and passionate opinion must necessarily lead to obnoxious behavior to be repulsive in the extreme, not to mention the root cause of the very difficulties this thread has so sadly demonstrated for the whole of LindaLand. How very sad.

What I find most telling is this - You once thought me a Bush supporter. And yet upon first encountering Jwhop he thought me a flaming commie liberal. Ponder that.

posted August 27, 2006 09:04 PM            

I guess some things will never change for the better without ego-less honesty on all sides.

I appreciate your clear-sighted presence and I'm glad you're aware enough to have never mistaken my general lack of personal attacks and verbal abuse as not taking a stand for what I believe in ... and I know you've been around for a great many discussions where that has been the case. Sad that sometimes it seems people confuse taking a stand on an issue with trying their best (and worst) to convert everyone else to their "side" or their "truth".

I guess we can all just sit back and watch how this will evolve or choose to ignore it. Either way, I can only hope that those who frequent GU and have actual facts, logic, reason and verifiable proof at their side make a greater effort from now on to keep their posts limited to the aforementioned as much as possible so the that rest who constantly resort to personal attacks and verbal abuse about anyone stick out like the sorest of thumbs for all to see clearly.

******

Mirandee
I know you are not going to post here any longer but I do hope you read this.
I know it would be hard for you to understand how a picture like the one I posted that you originally posted could possibly be offensive to anyone ... considering that you consider yourself and others on the left to be the little kitty. I guess you never considered the insinuation that those who aren't on the left are dogs, and particularly those that are commonly trained to be aggressive when the need arises.
However, I think a more accurate depiction would include that little kitty being shown strapping doggie treats to itself and parading itself around in front of the dogs repeatedly while firing off vehement accusations, insults and sometimes strangely warped theories that completely defame and degrade what the doggies hold dear. Then, you could show a pic of a few of those doggies snapping at that kitty's ankles. Afterwards, the appropriate pic would show that kitty shaking off all the doggie treats, smearing itself with ketchup, running into the house and crying, in front of all the other occupants who rarely spend time in the yard, something along the lines of "bloody murder, I've been attacked for no reason at all" and proceeding to try to get the dogs removed from the premises. All in good humor, of course.

Anyway, I thought the above was pretty funny and I'm sure if someone on the left posted something similar as a joke ... well like your own pic, for example ... I suppose everyone on the left would be laughing their a$$es off, too.

posted August 27, 2006 09:11 PM              

quote:

---

Then dont feed it.....let it die.... let it be gone

---

Very intelligent words, Sue. Hmmmm, where have I heard them before? Oh yeah, I just said as much in my last post!