posted January 30, 2009 04:22 PM            

Scorpionic Web, don't you know you can't tell a Sag girl to be careful and then expect them to heed the warning! No wonder you keep finding yourself in those predicaments. That's virtually crack for us!

I've come across a few of your Sag posts, and I'll be sure to keep my eyes open for more. I read somewhere (was it Love Signs?) that Scorpio men are naturally drawn to Sagittarius women. So, you see, it's not your fault. I'm interested in the possession vs. freedom thing. I suppose it depends on the Scorp and Sag involved. I'm actually pretty possessive myself, so I don't necessarily fit the mold of the devil-may-care Sag girl. Maybe it's a sun in the twelfth house thing... I don't know. I haven't been able to crack that code yet.

One thing I've noticed in the small handful of Scorpio men I've known is that although they possess the stereotypical Scorpio physical drives, they almost seem ashamed/afraid/something about it, so they tend to express it in insincere ways. Almost a caricature of the true expression, but I would guess that this is because they know the drive is intense and worry about how it will be received.

The good news is that most Sagittarius females wouldn't be put off at all, as long as the execution was genuine.

None of this may pertain to you personally, but this is my two cents' worth of accumulated wisdom in the ways of the Plutonian kind.

Also, another thing I've noticed is that Scorpios don't care much for being analyzed, and this is a Saggi specialty! Some of us are simply curious. The rest of us need to know... and deeper the truth is hidden, the more it will call to us. I've been driving my husband crazy for almost five years with this one and he's just starting to talk.

Exhausting work! But some Sagittarians are more determined than others.

posted January 31, 2009 04:56 PM            

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I suppose it depends on the Scorp and Sag involved. I'm actually pretty possessive myself, so I don't necessarily fit the mold of the devil-may-care Sag girl. Maybe it's a sun in the twelfth house thing... I don't know. I haven't been able to crack that code yet.

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When considering the Sagittarius women I've known, compared to your self description, the thing that stands out to me is that you have a Capricorn Mercury. Mercury is in it's "detriment" in Sagittarius and I think this position causes so much nervous energy that freedom flights are a common solution for these folks. I imagine Capricorn helps immensely with stabilizing many of Mercury's typical issues.

I've actually thought to myself that this Mercury position may be the biggest missing link in making my relationships work with Sagittarius women.

quote:

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another thing I've noticed is that Scorpios don't care much for being analyzed, and this is a Saggi specialty!

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Haha, I was with my last Sag girlfriend for almost three years... her career is clinical psychology.

I was constantly being analyzed, but she's been so immersed in formal education that she tries to categorize everything, and ironically often misses the humanistic aspect. Her methods truly fit her "clinical" job definition. Her Sun is at 22 Sag, her Moon is at 24 Gemini: born during an almost perfectly full moon. So the Gemini attribute pulls on her strongly and while she certainly has no shortage of analytical ability, she is in desperate need of depth. So naturally, I feel my Scorpio nature only perplexed her, and she ultimately became frustrated when all her of book-logic fell short.

My attempts to analyze her in return only resulted in her firey outbursts. Her responses were so nebulous that they begged for further inquisition. The more I dug, the more defensive she would become until eventually she would break down, cry, yell, throw things, and retreat into some Tolkien-esque novel. I truly loved her, and I told her that I only wanted to know what made her tick, and her screaming reply was "Some people just don't tick!!"... a funny response to hear from a clinical psychologist, but it appears that she is entirely unable to look inside of herself.

An inability for introspection is a trend I've noticed among all three of the Gemini Moon women I've dated, but where the others simply hit a wall, she usually offered those nebulous, confounding, and deceptive responses, which truly reeks of the T-square from her Pisces Ascendant to her Sun conjunct Neptune (chart ruler), opposite Moon... A very afflicted chart for a very afflicted personality.

quote:

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One thing I've noticed in the small handful of Scorpio men I've known is that although they possess the stereotypical Scorpio physical drives, they almost seem ashamed/afraid/something about it, so they tend to express it in insincere ways. Almost a caricature of the true expression, but I would guess that this is because they know the drive is intense and worry about how it will be received.

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The Scorpio mask is legendary where casual relationships are involved, and you're exactly right, it's a fear of how we're received. But it's okay, feeling dismayed and misunderstood time after time from our attempts to open up, Scorpios get very accustomed to simply walking away.

I never put up a front where intimate relationships are concerned, because true connection is crucial, otherwise, what's the point, right? I'm not necessarily easy to figure out anyway, so I try to be accomodating when the women I love need to know my deeper sides. Besides, all Water signs want more than anything to be able to open up, it just takes a very special person to encourage us.

quote:

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The good news is that most Sagittarius females wouldn't be put off at all, as long as the execution was genuine.

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posted January 31, 2009 08:22 PM            

I find it interesting that you've been able to enjoy long-term relationships with Sagittarians. You really strike me as being grounded and mature. It doesn't surprise me that they've been drawn to you, but that you've found enough depth in the Archers to sustain you. I think it's common for Sagittarians to go deep within themselves, but not necessarily to share that with another person. Unless it's the right person. But it can take us a while to figure it out, and by then it's often too late! Really, I think we often respond to intensity with immaturity. This strikes me as the type of thing that would immediately put you off.

I read that you are also drawn to Taurus women. How does that usually play out for you in comparison?

posted January 31, 2009 11:50 PM            

As of now I haven't found the depth that I need from Sagittarians, but there are so many other qualities that attract me. As much as I want profound understanding and an exceedingly rare soul merging with the women I love, I've found the happiness some have brought me to be enough to indeed love them very much.

Aries and Leo don't do it for me, but I love the Sagittarius variety of Fire. They bring a certain heat which my emotional nature can grab on to. The Sag Sun/Asc with Taurus Jupiter cried to me frequently. A very emotional woman. I remember reading at the beginning of this thread that you aren't generally overly sentimental or emotionally reactive and I suspect this may be where the difference between Sag/Cap Mercuries comes into play. She is very prone to outbursts of tears over all sorts of issues from family, friends, and life... I found it so endearing. She becomes confusing and hysterical and slurs her words, and it becomes difficult for me to understand what she needs and how I can help. But like the other Saggies, I felt an inexplicable love for her, and maybe while holding her when she was crying and shaking, I was able to communicate this to her.

We have an exact Scorpio Venus/Venus conjunction.

We became physically intimate over time but never formally dated. She called me her "stability", says I'm the only person she is completely honest with, and wants me to move back to Richmond. She has quite a checkered past with men, and I'm honestly afraid she'll cheat on me. She's said things that I've always needed to hear from a woman, but I fear I'll only be cast out with the rest of her guys. It's so tempting, but I feel I should just be happy with what we have.

She moved back in to her father's place, with whom she is extremely close. She won't be leaving Richmond for a long time, and I don't want to return there. I'll probably never know what could've become of us as a couple.

The two of you with your Taurus Jupiters oppose my Scorpio Jupiter. So I assume you're both Dragons in the Chinese zodiac? I'm a Dog, and the two aren't supposed to mix well...

Which brings us to Taurus Suns. Compared to Sagittarius, I don't have nearly as much experience with Taurus women.

My sexual attraction to some Taurus women can be so raw and overwhelming as to bring out the absolute worst of my Scorpio nature.

There is a terrible communication gap between Taurus and I. It's awkward and I feel I often come off rather edgy to Taurus women much of the time. At times I can be very upfront, and I usually never get much of a reaction from Taurus, I largely feel invisible to them. So I push and I prod in my typical fasion because my 3rd house Moon needs communication, but for my efforts to connect I'm usually left ignored, and the rift remains. Still, being opposites, it is so hard to shake that feeling that these women very much offer me everything that I lack, and that they might see me to represent the same for them.

I knew while moving back to Philadelphia that my greatest obsession, a Taurus, moved into a neighborhood near my old residence and is single. I could revel in my familiar stomping grounds and rekindle the passionate affair of my teenage years. I could walk to her place now.

I haven't seen her or spoken to her since I returned, it's been almost two years since we've last talked. But something about returning, maybe while smelling the Philly air or walking the streets, struck me with the clarity of why she never really wanted me. I realized I'll never be good enough for her, and I've decided it's best to not call her.

posted February 01, 2009 08:43 AM            

But I am very expressive in my love for others... friends, family, even though my family isn't close and was generally unavailable as I was growing up. Mostly it's my brothers that I show affection to in my family. They're younger than me and they need to know that loving relationships can exist in families, so I try to let them know without saying the words. I just make sure to call and check in on them frequently.

Which takes me to another thing I've noticed... I'm something of an emotional rescuer. I know when someone needs validation and escape from repression and I've learned that I'm a good avenue for that. I go out of my way to make sure people don't get stomped on or teased for who they are. Even when I was young, and still now, when I see that someone has become the subject of ridicule, I tend to throw myself in their way, so to speak, as to take the attention from them and put myself up for criticism. It's an odd thing, but I can't stand to see an honest, vulnerable soul get hurt. Especially by the clueless minds and tongues of the general, unaware population. It's hard to explain, but that's what I do. True to my sign, I'm a die hard fan of the underdog!

I'm a little complex emotionally. It really takes someone who is tuned in to me to be able to satisfy that need. I've met very few who qualify. When I was 19 I dated a Capricorn with an Aquarius moon and Cancer rising... he was a lovely, lovely soul and very nurturing for me (something I've always suspected I needed, even longed for, but have never, as a child or adult, experienced.) Unfortunately, I was too young and busy chasing a Sagittarius who was so very close to my heart to realize how good things could have been with the Capricorn. The Sag and I spent four years together in our early 20's and the result was my uber-Taurus son. (He has his sun, Mercury, Venus, Jupiter, and Saturn in Taurus in the 11th, and enough tight conjunctions and squares in his chart to make a person dizzy!)

Anyway, in most of my relationships I've been the teacher and mother, and my relationship with my husband definitely follows that pattern. Sometimes I feel like I was put here to help others resolve their Karma, which must, as a rule, benefit me as well. I've rarely dabbled in light relationships.

And now I realize that I'm the one who has written a lengthy post. As far as that goes, I don't mind your posts at all. I enjoy a real conversation to flashy small talk anyday. I like to have some substance to dig into and analyze.

It's sad that you feel that you aren't good enough for the Taurus girl. Are you sure that's true? I admire your restraint in not contacting her, if that's what you feel is best. I suck at that sort of thing, and, consequently, have had one or two embarrassing breakups in the name of love! In those situations I can become rather quixotic, I'm afraid-- I lose all sense of reason where my heart is concerned. The guy in question has since forgiven me and now we're friends, but I was desperately in love with him!

I'm thinking, also, about your Sag girl-- the one who's only been true to you. I can understand your apprehension. Is she the younger girl I've read about? 19 or 20 maybe? I'd have to say your instincts are likely to be spot on. Speaking from my own experiences, although I loved madly and truly at that age, I couldn't always deliver on my promises. (It took my Virgo to teach me what commitment really means. No surprise there.) I'm sure she fully intends to deliver, but it might be best to let it play out for a few years if you think there may be a real possibility. It takes us a while to learn the difference between love, the verb, and love, the glorious, idealistic noun.

What a lovely chat this morning! It's early enough that the family is still asleep. The sun is coming in through the window in front of me. It's very peaceful. Enjoy your Sunday.

posted February 01, 2009 09:30 AM            

quote:

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As much as I want profound understanding and an exceedingly rare soul merging with the women I love, I've found the happiness some have brought me to be enough to indeed love them very much.

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We should discuss next time.

posted February 02, 2009 10:51 AM            

Interesting to hear about you dating a Capricorn. I've wondered what this Sun combination creates in intimate relationships. Sag and Cap and their respective planets, "the transition planets", are like I've said before, very much "two sides of the same coin". In many ways opposites, but still bound to concepts of "growth", thus somehow perhaps complimentary?

I suppose my Sag Sun/Asc woman may eventually learn from similar experiences to your own, aiding to take the heart off of the sleeve. And maybe somewhat settle her dangerous Aries Mars impulsivity.

Yes, she is 20, and I told her maybe things would make more sense once she's experienced life some more. She knows I hold her in very high regard, she's a very bright and understanding person and immediately recognized that I was in no way calling her immature, just that her currently restless and searching state of mind has a wider range of needs than what I can offer her... You're absolutely right about warnings being like crack for a Sagittarius, and aside from her wholesome feelings, I think for a long time she badly wanted to prove me wrong on this one, just to see if she could.

quote:

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I'm sure she fully intends to deliver, but it might be best to let it play out for a few years if you think there may be a real possibility. It takes us a while to learn the difference between love, the verb, and love, the glorious, idealistic noun.

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I think one day she and I may have potential for something great. We have serious bad-timing karma. In spite of our connection, there are so many ways in which we are on divergent paths at this moment. We feel great together, but whether it is a life-experience gap or something else, at every stage of our relationship we've been plagued with circumstances outside of our feelings for each other.

And with the Taurus, I know I'm not good enough. It's a matter of physical attraction and wealth.

I've noticed with a couple of Pisces Venus women that they have a security disposition that makes them gravitate to the very muscular men. She goes crazy for obscenely buff guys. She is the commonly big-boned Taurus woman. I'm 5'11", she's 5'9" and slightly thick, and she always goes for the 6'3" and muscular guys who can throw her over their shoulders.

And she wants big $$$. She's a school teacher, doesn't make nearly as much as she wants, and from what I can tell she has made up her mind to "marry up". I don't make the money she is looking for, I barely have anything in my life in order. I'm seen as a threat to her ambition.

I'm a Libra Moon, like you are. Our Moons are exactly conjunct. Your Moon makes a sextile to your Sun, and I imagine your ability to "intellectualize" your emotions is easier to activate and perhaps harmoniously reconcile the energy. My Moon only makes a semi-sextile to my Sun; more obscure and harder to control (intellectualize). I consider myself very rational in most areas of life, but all of my Scorpio makes it extremely difficult for me to intellectualize matters of the heart.

posted February 02, 2009 12:05 PM            

as a scorp its very interesting to hear another scorp (but of the male variety) talk about love. the final line of your last post, web, about the inability to intellectualise matters of the heart - this has been my problem, but in the opposite way. sometimes i just see things so clearly...i dunno, i tend to be searingly honest and sometimes quite cold in my responses in relationships. its not that i want to hurt, but i can feel what is in my heart...i can see the clear picture and i do rationalise/intellectualise my feelings. i find emotional immaturity the biggest turn off - and i can't bear clingyness. what scorps need is depth, honesty and humour! we don't laugh easily at ourselves and in love this is very much needed in the process of breaking down barriers.

posted February 06, 2009 09:51 PM            

I'm back after a truly horrible beginning of the week... probably two of my top ten worst days ever.

The dust has settled and life is returning to normal.

mezzoelf, I'm glad you found some info here that resonated with you.

Scorpionic Web, I hope you had a great week.

posted February 18, 2009 06:06 PM              

As far as I've been concerned if I feel strong sympathy toward someone I think I love them. I'm so self possessed lol, but it's the only thing that makes sense -analyzing out from your self that is- because you are all you know.

posted February 19, 2009 02:14 PM              

now i must say that I am generally not into worshipping other people but i have to admit that I have an inclination to fall at your feet, if only due to my relief that someone such as yourself is on the planet.

this thread is so good!

Ok, an interesting and possibly questionable fact about myself...

When I was seven, I lived for six months in a caravan in Northern Queensland, Australia.
The park that our family of eight lived in bordered an ancient tract of rainforest that looked like something out or pre-history. One day, when I was playing at the edge of this magnificent place, I discovered a small irridescent coloured beetle on the plant with amazing blue flowers. When I looked further, there was several other of the same shaped beetles on the plant but none of them had the same colour configurations. The bright metallic hues were in royal blues, vivid purples, emerald greens, bright liquid metallic yellows and reds, and the patterns varied; no two were alike. I felt I had made the discovery of the century and was tempted to bottle them all up and keep them. I decided to leave them where they were, and in my seven year old mind, I thought they would stay the same for ever just being on that shrub with its ridiculously bright flowers. I went back the next morning and they were all gone - I have never seen them ever again and I have never seen anything like them in any natural history collections. I treasure the memory and I assure you it wasn't a dream.

Anyhow, yes, you are just so fantastic!

posted February 19, 2009 05:03 PM            

Your story is very cool! I had a simlar situation with starfish once... I was very young and I saw one on the beach, so I went to ask my dad if I could touch it and when I went back it was gone. I know your disappointment to a degree, but, alas, a starfish is a very common find. The beetles sound gorgeous!

I noticed that you don't have your own thread back here, unless I missed it. I look forward to getting to know you better!

posted February 19, 2009 06:18 PM              

Yeah, no thread from me, its a personality dysfunction of mine, lol - I can't share a coffee with someone let alone host a thread. I'm into minimising, haha.

posted February 19, 2009 08:21 PM            

In the meantime, you're free to hang out on our threads!

posted February 20, 2009 10:36 AM            

Can you believe I've never seen the video before now? I didn't even realize it until you sent the link. The funny thing is is that I pull the song up on YouTube all the time, then I guess I just go on and do other things while it plays in the background.

It was beautiful though. I'm glad I got to see it today!

posted March 12, 2009 12:22 AM            

So wish me luck and inspiration (wait a minute-- I'm a double Sag! Aren't these things my birthright?) as I attempt to turn out something worth reading. Unfortunately, I have nothing to say, so the task won't be easy.

While I'm here, LEXX... if you're out there, I want to say that things have turned around a bit since we began talking. With my Virgo and me, I mean. We've settled into a nice little mellow happiness and I'm sure your words had something to do with that. Thank you! It's been a struggle to get to this place, but I kind of like this plateau.

Now... back to my Shiraz... here's hoping that I'll find something at the bottom of this glass!