posted July 02, 2015 10:47 AM              

I meant astrological influences. I donīt know if you have read Westrans book on progressed synastry? He describes it pretty well, the process of eleminating the additional factors to be sure that the results are REALLY dependent on the Sun-Venus aspects (or whatever).

While I generally agree with you, it still, even if you know a couple very well, is not guaranteed that you can really judge their degree of love. After all how is love measured?

It is, at least to some degree, up to our evaluation or interpretation. and sometimes this might also be different for each person in the relationship.

Of course I know that this is a pretty theoretical argument, and most of the time we will come pretty close to the truth I guess.

posted July 02, 2015 10:48 AM              

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted July 02, 2015 10:49 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:

I really, really like Aqua moons.

+

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Speaks of your good taste.

posted July 02, 2015 10:51 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Leeloo,

I meant astrological influences. I donīt know if you have read Westrans book on progressed synastry? He describes it pretty well, the process of eleminating the additional factors to be sure that the results are REALLY dependent on the Sun-Venus aspects (or whatever).

While I generally agree with you, it still, even if you know a couple very well, is not guaranteed that you can really judge their degree of love. After all how is love measured?

It is, at least to some degree, up to our evaluation or interpretation. and sometimes this might also be different for each person in the relationship.

Of course I know that this is a pretty theoretical argument, and most of the time we will come pretty close to the truth I guess.

---

You are so right, it can't be measured, something happens as you said in your last phrase, which was brilliant: somehow we come to the truth and one of the reasons is, at least in my experience, that love shines. There is something unmistakable about it, even from pictures, sometimes. When knowing the people it is indeed much easier to figure it out.

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted July 02, 2015 10:51 AM              

yes that is what I was trying to point out in the other thread as well. Trines (and sextiles) might feel so natural and easy and soft and flowing and wonderful and you feel that kinship and in agreement, but sometimes you might agree on things that are not really good for you.
And yes, I see that too, how you can slip in such a familiarity and routine that you stay much longer than you should!

Faith,

posted July 02, 2015 10:51 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:
I have to disagree; the method I use is not questionable, it is standard and I have formally studied statistics.
It's not that hard: you establish a database of what you define as couples in long lasting loving relationships. They have specific criteria such as over 10y together + harmonious marital love life, love. This is your batch for studying long term love. You don't know their astrology yet, just the relational criteria you intend to study (in this case, what I said, long term love criteria). So it's the opposite of cherry picking based on astrological aspects.

Then you study their astrology. For this particular example, you find out the prevalence of Moon to Moon aspects: if it's 1:1 soft vs hard, this is the reality. If you made a good batch (criteria + significant sample), it applies to the whole Terra population. Which means long term loves on this planets have hard and soft equally. Period.

Then what you can do, if you want comparative results, is to study Moon aspects in harmonious vs not harmonious (short term, conflictual etc depending on your criteria) couples, if you want to take it further and find something out about a possible difference in Moon aspects in harmonious vs disharmonious couples.

That is another interesting study ( I didn't do): what is the prevalence soft vs hard Moon aspects in short term/conflictual/nasty relationships? I suspect it's the same, 1:1, but who knows? maybe trines prevail lol The point is we can't say without doing the actual research, no matter how much we subjectively like an idea or another.

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posted July 02, 2015 10:55 AM              

semi-kidding, semi-serious here.

Personally I think it`s not that easy to judge a relationship just from the MOon-placement alone, though it is a good start to begin an analysis (actually for me it would be both luminaries and the cardinal angles, the start).

posted July 02, 2015 10:56 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:
You know, looking at it from another perspective, one thing I have noticed about one of the possible downsides of trines - for I think all aspects have their good and bad side - and I think it may apply to Moons as well, perhaps even more when it comes to Moons, is that trines and sextiles may make you stay in an abusive and/or past its due time relationship. They grease the wheels and give the impressions things are smooth or will work out in the end. They can be quite slippery, if they are present in an abusive relationship, for instance, making it last for years.

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I can see that happening. Well then "abusive" CAN be subjective when it's purely psychological.

posted July 02, 2015 10:57 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
As much as I love statistics, I want to point out I am not a statistic as a person, and if I am the exception to *some* rule I rather want to know what MY pattern, my way to happiness is than that of 99 other people.
I am ego-centred like that.

semi-kidding, semi-serious here.

Personally I think it`s not that easy to judge a relationship just from the MOon-placement alone, though it is a good start to begin an analysis (actually for me it would be both luminaries and the cardinal angles, the start).

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posted July 02, 2015 10:59 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:
I have seen that sun-Venus can sometimes make up for lack of Saturn in synastry, both in couples I know and among celebs.

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And I can attest to this, with my Venus tightly trine my husband's sun. I swear it's like I am unable to hold a grudge for long. He is so appealing to me on a basic level.

His Venus is widely trine my sun, 9 degree orb.

Ceri will give me that, this once.

posted July 02, 2015 11:00 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Speaks of your good taste.

of course your Moon is also conjunct my Juno and trine my Saturn.

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posted July 02, 2015 11:05 AM            

Saturn conjunct Moon and square Venus
Mars square Pluto
Sun square Pluto
Sun and possibly Moon square Mars
Mercury conjunct Mars
Mars quincunx Mars
Chiron opposite Chiron
Chiron conjunct Uranus
Chiron conjunct Saturn and NN
Uranus opposite Saturn
Nessus opposite Pluto
Ceres square Chiron DW
I'm suspicious about Sun opposite Jupiter too

posted July 02, 2015 11:07 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
My moon is also watching over your Jupiter and Ceres. They are in good hands.

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Both you and Ceri are my best Moon-friends. And they also in aspect, with Ceri Moon opp Moon, and yours opposes my Sun. The Moons may be in BQ, but I'm not sure. You're on my exclusive list

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted July 02, 2015 11:14 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
And I can attest to this, with my Venus tightly trine my husband's sun. I swear it's like I am unable to hold a grudge for long. He is so appealing to me on a basic level.

His Venus is widely trine my sun, 9 degree orb.

Ceri will give me that, this once.

I mean the proof is in the pudding. LOL

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posted July 02, 2015 11:14 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
And I can attest to this, with my Venus tightly trine my husband's sun. I swear it's like I am unable to hold a grudge for long. He is so appealing to me on a basic level.

His Venus is widely trine my sun, 9 degree orb.

Ceri will give me that, this once.

I mean the proof is in the pudding. LOL

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ONLY if YOU grant me the 7°28 orb for a conjunction between HIS Moon and MY Venus, even though it is out of sign.

posted July 02, 2015 11:15 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:
Both you and Ceri are my best Moon-friends. And they also in aspect, with Ceri Moon opp Moon, and yours opposes my Sun. The Moons may be in BQ, but I'm not sure. You're on my exclusive list

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posted July 02, 2015 11:17 AM              

you were saying?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6m6bpxkjP4

posted July 02, 2015 11:17 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:

I am on a list!

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posted July 02, 2015 01:26 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:
Geez, agendas, red herrings...it's an astrological debate, for god's sake.

I do neither of the things you describe, just expressing a different opinion.

It was unclear from your post, so sorry, I understood you actually like those Pisces Moon.

Usually, we do attract people we need though, so you attracting Pisces Moons is in tune with your chart type.

It would be much more interesting to say which are the Moons you get along with, after taking a look at your circle of closed friends. My suspicion is that many of them have the placements I describe.

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posted July 02, 2015 01:30 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:
Yes, I did look at the list you posted. It is useless because it lacking birthtimes for a lot of them. And who the heck counts "adjacent moons" and semi-sextiles as significant aspects? Using wide orbs and "possible contacts" and insignificant aspects, you're really grasping for straws here! Sorry but, do you even astrology?

The last ex and I had squared moons in squared houses (5th and 8th), his was Sag and mine was Pisces, respectively. Before that it was moon square moon (by sign and not aspect this time) with his moon in the 11th and mine in the 8th. The last ex and I had otherwise all soft aspects to the moon; Venus sextile moon, moon trine ascendant, moon trine Mars, but there was no getting around that square and the problems REALLY only amplified immediately after we moved in together which Ami Anne did advise me not to do (I don't even like her as a human being so you can't really question my objectivity there in admitting she is right on the moon sign issue).

As I said, 75% of the problems could be attributed directly to moon sign differences; the remaining 25% were down to our Mars-Saturn conjunction and his Mars-Pluto conjunction natally. Both exes also had a Mars-Pluto hard aspect and these are not people you want to see mad.

We will have to respectfully disagree. I have also looked at about 30-40 celebrity couples (why do you think I'm always giving you new examples? And I only count the ones where the moon did NOT change signs on that day, such as the moon sign would be about 15° if you put in the generic time of noon) and the moon signs are almost always in compatible signs for long-standing couples. In fact when I can't understand why they're still together because I can't see a discernible Saturn aspect, there are always two things present to compensate; compatible moons, and a sun-Venus aspect (about half the time Pluto is present as well lending to obsession).

In fact, if you even just Google "moon signs lasting relationship" you will see that there is actual consensus from astrologers on the matter; you are the only one who seems to disagree.

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@Aquacheeka:

"And I only count the ones where the moon did NOT change signs on that day, such as the moon sign would be about 15° if you put in the generic time of noon) and the moon signs are almost always in compatible signs for long-standing couples."

posted July 02, 2015 01:44 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Ashes2Phoenix:
@Aquacheeka:

"And I only count the ones where the moon did NOT change signs on that day, such as the moon sign would be about 15° if you put in the generic time of noon) and the moon signs are almost always in compatible signs for long-standing couples."

Why did you not count the ones where the moon did not change signs on that day? What would you say about moon compatibility if both moons in question are within 3-4 degrees of the next sign?

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posted July 03, 2015 11:27 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:

I am on a list!

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Me, too, I think!

Unless Lee was only talking about my moon.

But why, when I am so dazzling in my entirety?

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
you were saying?

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You must have a very odd, secret life, to stumble on things like that.

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
ONLY if YOU grant me the 7°28 orb for a conjunction between HIS Moon and MY Venus, even though it is out of sign.

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Out of sign, though??

posted July 03, 2015 11:38 AM              

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted July 03, 2015 11:46 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Aquacheeka:
You are so lucky. You guys have everything; Venus to grant true love and adoration, Saturn to give it staying power, and Uranus to keep it interesting and fun. Any Neptune?

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My Neptune is conjunct his Saturn, 5 degrees, and his Neptune is square my Saturn, less than 1 degree. A little more on that below.

But this is what I wanted to elaborate on, with respect to Lee's survey. Remarkably, you listed the key planets in synastry with my husband (good memory!) And to give you a fuller picture: he and I both have several placements in the 5-7 degree range, all forming a web of tight and various aspects:

Between 5-7 degrees:

He has: sun, moon, Venus, Saturn, Uranus, Lilith (BML), Pholus, and Pallas. ASC at 4 Cancer if his birth time was recorded in Daylight Savings.

I have: Mercury, Venus, Uranus, Lilith (BML), Psyche, and ASC (if I'm rectifying my chart correctly.)

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We also have some concentration around 0 degrees, mainly my asteroids and Saturn hitting his Jupiter, Neptune, and Mercury, and another "hit" with his Mars-Pluto trine my Chiron.

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