posted January 17, 2017 12:28 PM            

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Originally posted by Elysia:

Yeah, screw politics. Let's get a massive tub of Ben n Jerry's and binge watch Gilmore girls. Or whatever you guys like.

And hot fudge of course.

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You are speaking my language. I'd like a little strawberry sauce, too.

posted January 17, 2017 12:36 PM              

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Originally posted by next to neptune:
Well nothing in his chart screams to me that he is totally insane, the thing is just that he sure is lol... He isn't a nice guy, besides maybe at home and he truly cares for his own family (and himself) but I don't see him as someone who will do much good in politics, and definitely not for our planet as a whole... his jupiter also seems really weak, for someone who is going to lead such a huge and influential country. He seems weak to me, someone who cannot do what is right and do what it takes, he just sits over there in his little corner with his twitter profile and loves to hear himself speak, but what good does this do? NOTHING

Someone told me he must've had a difficult childhood, perhaps he even got bullied? Not much indicate this in his chart, but I think a cancer venus in 11th house conjunction saturn probably got a huge issue dealing with other people in groups, but other times this is also the only place he get some inner shine and satisfaction....it can be a toxic combination at least

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Interesting point about Jupiter. Jupiter in this chart is a 5th house matter. Over there (2nd house Libra) shows wealth coming from parents (Sun and Moon opp by Wedge, 4th and 10th) and impacting/creating influential relationships. Neptune in the 2nd is fluctuating wealth and speculations. For his chart, along with Mars, Jupiter sustains what I believe to be the main focus of his chart: the 10th/4th axis with Sun/Moon opp on nodal axis with Uranus; Venus/Saturn also serves this opp. That is a great point about Saturn in the 11th as a source of ambition and concern for being acknowledged as an authority in groups, and with Venus, MC ruler, even more pronounced.
I'm inclined to agree with Aries though, personally I see the chart and the man as being overprotected by parents/family, overprotected childhood, rather than the other way around. However, all attempts at arrogance and deceit would have been sanctioned by peers (other children) early on. Thank you, I just added more ideas to what you inspired me.

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

posted January 17, 2017 01:32 PM              

EDIT: I found my quotes from the other thread

"Let's focus on his relationship with Neptune, Mercury in Cancer 11th sq Neptune in Libra 2nd, we can see here a Neptunian impact on the masses, mostly coming from people's fascination with "gold" (Neptune in the 2nd Libra) and cardinal, no less. Easiness in receiving, acquiring and losing wealth. Trading. Motivational speech.

Hillary: poor Neptune, no wonder the tide couldn't have been in her favor."

the discussion was about Neptune and tNeptune

"I'd like to add now as another aspect of Sun opp Moon - defining oneself by the relationships one has, and Moon on the SN in aspect with the Wedges shows great early support from family and peers, having a "backup". Apart from the backup, with Mars and Pluto in the 12th connected to the whole structure, Mr Trump has some "occult" friends and is part of a heavy backstage political game (aren't they all?) which will become apparent later on; it's interesting how this part is connected with IC, and from here the Sun and the Moon. It's a very "clean" chart for ascending on the 10th/11th axis."
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/236685-4.html

I'd call him an effigy at this point, rather than a leader (which is consistent with the Sun/Moon opp: a projection of the collective psyche which needs to be seen, the Full Moon, SN lunar Eclipse, 4th/10th axis: breaking with tradition)

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

posted January 17, 2017 03:09 PM            

I say he's a Leo rising because these seem to fit him very well (plus it puts his Mars on his AC):

Leo Rising attracts attention. They have a personal magnetism that makes them stand out. Whether it is their charisma or their appearance, they never fail to make an impression. Leo Ascendant is self-aware and conscious of their effect on others. They are acutely aware of their personal "set dressing"… that is who they are seen with, where they are seen and how they are perceived. They are always "onstage" even when they're relaxing at home.

Leo Rising is known for temper tantrums, jumping to conclusions and self-indulgences. They also have a lot of ambition, drive and idealism. They may appear bossy just because they want to be the driving force in their circle. Leo Ascendant makes a terrific manager or organizer.

Leo Ascendant is very demonstrative, and they like drama and grand gestures. They may get caught up in exaggeration without realizing it, but they will do anything to get admiration.

Leo Rising is usually of sunny disposition, although they usually speak their mind. They can be extremely stubborn, and it can be challenging for them to break bad habits or behaviors.

Leo Rising is full of energy and enthusiasm. Once they are excited about something, they're ready to jump right in. Despite this, they may be inclined to lie back and watch the activity. Some negative aspects to this Ascendant may result in a manipulative, power-hungry person whose ego must constantly be massaged. With a slightly different angle, Leo Ascendant could be loud and aggressive, or overwhelming. They can be self-absorbed to the point that it is difficult for them to take advice from others. They sometimes think asking for advice is a sign of weakness.

Confidence is not a problem with Leo Ascendant. They exude it in gallons. Don't embarrass them, especially in public. Their dignity is of utmost importance.

posted January 17, 2017 03:26 PM              

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Originally posted by Empty Spaces:

I just have this empath towards him and I'm more confused than anything and was just wondering if some aspects blur our power of discernment.

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Dear ES, Power itself blurs our power of discernment ours or that of others, either they're benevolent or malevolent. The astrological component is complex, but imo the clues are Saturn + outer planets. I will try to expand the topic, but I think this is what we are trying to understand here, among other things.

As a short non-astrological answer, I think we access our power of discernment in extraordinary situations (such as a dissonance between what we feel and what we know to be true or see) by taking actions/facts at face value. It is similar to loving someone yet deciding their actions is not what we want in our life, and that no matter how much we love them, it doesn't change what they actually do or don't do.

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

posted January 17, 2017 04:09 PM              

He has transiting Saturn in Sagittarius conjunct his natal Moon and also his South Node. Tr. Saturn conjunct the natal Moon is a notoriously tough transit. And when Saturn is in a transiting conjunction to your South Node, indulging in any negative habits will result in serious consequences. South Node in Sagittarius - being overly opinionated, not thinking before you speak, expressing dogmatic views, etc.

Also transiting Saturn will be opposing his Sun in Gemini in the 10th. Since Saturn is transiting the 4th, I think he is probably downright miserable behind closed doors. But, he is trying to hide it. Not really working, as we can gleam the motivations behind those angry 3 am rants on Twitter. And that is increasingly damaging his public image (Sun in the 10th).

Also Pluto in Capricorn is going to be opposing his Venus and his Saturn. The conjunction is in the 11th House and with Pluto transiting the 5th, if he is seeking or occupying power out of purely self-absorbed motives, the people (11th House) may strike back. The 5th House is also what you can control and command while the 11th is what you cannot control and what happens unexpectedly/unpredictably. Pluto being in the 5th means that if he becomes obsessed with gaining the upper hand, things will become increasingly chaotic for him. I feel like there may be peers or those within his social circle/network who come out of the woodwork to take him down, if certain power struggles ensue, making him feel powerless because of the will of others (11th House).

These transits will be happening simultaneously for him ALL YEAR with retrogrades occurring. That is really intense. I have said, since November, that it looks ominous af, in terms of his presidency and administration. Only time will tell but the pressures have already been building up for him, i.e. the intelligence agency dossier about Russia, countless lawmakers boycotting his inauguration (could be the start of a mutiny from his peers), and today, there is a new lawsuit against him for sexual harassment. It's been scandal after scandal after scandal. Also, the Washington Post just did a story on him saying that he has been increasingly isolated the past few months, not wanting to leave his house (symbolizing the Saturn in the 4th transit to me) and feeling extremely reluctant about the job. Are we seeing the beginning of a downfall? Who knows? But it wouldn't surprise me at all, using his transits as evidence.

That's all I need to say because I've said enough on the political part of this discussion already.

posted January 17, 2017 04:18 PM            

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Originally posted by Randall:
Trump is a leader. It's irrefutable. He's been a leader ever since his father sent him to military school. You can't run a business like Trump's and not be a leader. The true measure of a leader is viewed through who the followers are. Trump is the leader of the free world, and he commands the largest most powerful military force. Ask the generals under his command if he's a leader.

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posted January 17, 2017 04:20 PM            

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Losing the popular vote only means California wanted Hillary. In the electoral college, it was a landslide-- with Hillary suffering a veritable beating. Trump IS a leader, so what in his chart shows that?

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posted January 17, 2017 04:30 PM            

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I'd like to see Saturn and Pluto aspects for leadership. Mars and Ascendant Leo don't automatically make for leadership. And seeing how he act and talk, I find it hard to say he has leader qualities.

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Saturn's leadership style is to maintain the status quo. Trumps's entire campaign was anti-establishment.

Pluto's leadership style is 'micro-manager', this is also antithesis to his strong Gemini-Sagittarius character.

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Sagittarius Moon exaggerates emotional reactions. I know a woman with this moon who can incite people to do things because she nags too much but it's not inspiration in its pure sense.
What I'm saying is one or two placements don't make for inspiration or leader qualities.

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I have to disagree with you here. Sagittarius is the sign of inspiration and optimism.

posted January 17, 2017 04:33 PM            

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Nine, I don't want you to be or feel offended either, I hope you know my tolerance for offensive words is generally low. Dumb question from me : do you see any dark side to the Gem in question?

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posted January 17, 2017 04:36 PM              

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Originally posted by Randall:
Trump IS a leader, so what in his chart shows that?

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posted January 17, 2017 04:39 PM            

quote:

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Trump is a leader. It's irrefutable. He's been a leader ever since his father sent him to military school. You can't run a business like Trump's and not be a leader. The true measure of a leader is viewed through who the followers are. Trump is the leader of the free world, and he commands the largest most powerful military force. Ask the generals under his command if he's a leader.

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Agreed!

A leader won't hide behind her husband, then try to wield power from behind the scenes. A leader won't hide behind the popular black guy, then wield power from the State Department as though she was the one elected.

posted January 17, 2017 05:08 PM            

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Originally posted by Nine:
Agreed!

A leader won't hide behind her husband, then try to wield power from behind the scenes. A leader won't hide behind the popular black guy, then wield power from the State Department as though she was the one elected.

A leader will throw his hat in the ring and state his opinions without ambiguity.

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