posted March 02, 2010 05:36 PM            

In that chart, the asteroid that bears the man's name is CONJUNCT the asteroid that bear that other woman's name.

posted March 02, 2010 08:50 PM            

In my post to you I didn't define Amor or Eros because I was taking them for granted as a shared language between us. My aim wasn't to describe asteroids but to describe the way I interpret charts. Even if I looked only at planets, I would interpret charts the same way. I shared the way I interpret with you because I thought you may have/develop a similar view or at least find this interesting. I may be wrong on both counts.

I interpret charts the way I do because I think this way reflects the way we experience reality.

When I said that each part of our chart is the ending giving meaning to the earlier parts, I meant that happens simultaneously. It's not about looking with different eyes. It's about how our reality is built, and interpreting our charts in a way that matches that experience of being.

Since we can't look at everything all at the same time, we jump in somewhere and start our analysis there. Our analysis starts in one spot but our consciousness doesn't.

Whenever we analyze astrologically, it's after the fact. We already know what the experience was to us, what we are to us, and then we're looking for something that describes it/us. Multiple parts of our chart work together to reflect a particular experience/mindset, always. And the way the individual parts work in those particular experiences depends on the other parts.

I'll give an example because this is starting to sound more messy than it is.

(deleted example)

If instead of all those other transits accompanying Pluto on my ASC, I had
-t. Jupiter cnj Venus
-and t. Venus trine my Moon
then Pluto on my Asc would've felt different. It wouldn't have brought the same experience.

Now if you don't want to use asteroids, you could look at just one part of my transit network and see the event in that one part. Pluto cnj my Asc will describe how that event felt for me because its specific meaning comes from its context. Even if you don't look at the other parts, they're all there within the way Pluto felt for me at that time. That's what I meant by when you look at one part, you can know another even when they don't aspect one another.

posted March 03, 2010 05:25 AM            

Did you or family press charges against the abuser?
This effort is needed to end the victimization cycles of possibly many lifelines. Let no abuser be left unconfronted.

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http://tamsoft.co.in/articles.html

posted March 03, 2010 05:48 AM            

I am shocked about what happened to you.

posted March 03, 2010 05:56 AM            

I just wanted to let you know I read the first post - so you can edit it out if you like!

posted March 03, 2010 10:30 AM            

(deleted)

quote:

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The clarity of the asteroid transits is telling.

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I agree. And as I said before, if not for you, I wouldn't even have known to look at DEJ and NESSUS.
Raymond has also added new, relevant astro "words" to my vocab - asteroids, transneptunians, nodes.
DD got me into house rulers, which for me was a whole new word for the planets.

posted March 03, 2010 10:51 AM            

quote:

---

This effort is needed to end the victimization cycles of possibly many lifelines.

---

All my life, when a guy would show he was attracted to me, the first thought in my head was - Sure, he likes me now. In this moment, I'm who he wants me to be. But what about when I'm myself in ways he doesn't want me to be? What then? Will he still care for me or will he hurt me? Since I feared me disappointing him would cause him to hurt me, what I wanted to do was end his attraction to me. This thought pattern - attraction = threat to independence and safety - was with me for so long.

When I was 4, I had a recurring nightmare. (deleted)

This dream told me: stay merged, and you're safe. Separate and you're dead.

And before that: create someone's desire to be merged with you, and you create the risk of them hurting you when you deny that desire's fulfillment.

Even before that nightmare, I'd burst into tears when I sensed I disappointed someone. "Do you still love me?" I'd ask.

With the abuser, I'd done something bad. He played up his anger...in that separation, I felt destroyed...then he offered a way to make it all up to him.

From then on, I knew union could be just as destructive, since it could force me to sacrifice my own truth. I didn't think it in those words, just knew that there was this battle in me between being what someone else wanted and being what I needed to be because it was truly myself. (It's actually more complex than that, but I don't want to make this even longer! )

So then later on with guys I was attracted to, I would turn up the sexual heat and then turn it down as a test. I needed to see if they could feel our union and also accept our separation. I needed to know we had that balance because that to me was real love. Until I felt safe that we could exist in both ways together, I kept my distance.

To me, sex is the ultimate dissipation of the personal self. (Pisces Eros, Pisces on the 5th.) I couldn't do that with someone until I knew they would let me return to myself afterward, and that they would return to themselves. We both needed to be free to really love.

I see this issue in my Nodes and their asteroids:
EROS cnj Pisces SN (0)
AMOR cnj Virgo NN (0)
Eros trine Scorpio LUST (0) which is cnj my Asc. (2)

I see many other parts of my chart working together with those asteroids to construct what I feel about these issues.

posted March 03, 2010 12:30 PM            

you are a very wise woman.

Your dream reminded me of a recurring dream I was having, even though I was slightly older than you, when I dreamed it.
In that dream I was running away from my husband. It was not the first time, I had been running away again and again - and I think I was having a lover; someone I really loved, but was forbidden to be with him-, and this time I really feared my husband would kill me, if he caught up with me. He was a choleric and he would beat me to death for my disobedience; that was clear as an "amen in the church". And I think in the end he did catch up with me.

The strange thing is, that I never had experienced or witnessed any kind of violence, especially between spouses, before. My Dad always treated my mom in the most respectful ways, he still does.So it is a total mystery to me, where this dream came from, but it was very very nightmarish, more than most "fantastic" nightmares.

Somehow your dream reminded me of mine, that is why I mentioned it.

Oh and in some way I can relate to much what you said, too; for all my life I somehow felt responsible for the way other people felt. Even if I was seeing a film or theatre play in a group, especially if I suggested to see it, and some people didn`t enjoy it, I was actually feeling guilty. As if it was my fault that they did not enjoy it, and that I shouldn`t enjoy it, if others don`t.
Almost like I cannot allow myself to be happy as long as I know that others are unhappy.

I guess maybe, it has to do with Neptune on my NN squaring Jupiter.

EDIT:
I have Lust exact on my ASC, too; but cannot really relate to it.

But interstingly w hen I was younger, a kid, there were some boys (more than one, but only one at a time. lol), who literally locked me up in their rooms, telling me they would only let me out of there, if I agreed to marry them. I am talking about 4 year old boys!(and later on some elder ones).

Well, I was crying and screaming and biting and kicking so much, that they opened up the doors pretty quickly again.

Noone locks up a SAgittarius-girl!

posted March 03, 2010 07:21 PM            

Thanks for telling me! I'm happy to have helped. I still don't know how I did it exactly lol.
But I understand what you're saying. I guess you felt ostracized due to this particular situation and it reminded you of other situations in the past, where you felt the same way.

When I said: "well maybe all men do - and they just don't tell us".. Maybe that struck a chord with you - because it put a different spin on the experience.
So you realized - it's probably not the fact that you are the "odd one out" or that men behave in this way towards you in particular.. but rather that they feel comfortable enough to actually "open up" and be honest about it - after the fact.

So that ^ makes you an individual with your own personal vibe - which is very accommodating to male sexuality.

(You have a Venus-Mars trine - right? I have one myself – and I often find myself on the receiving end of stories and experiences that men don't normally share with women – due to social expectation or whatever else.. But *this* particular story I haven't heard - yet - lol)

On a side note - I really find it strange for someone to react as your sister did and as some other posters did with outrage or disgust. I find it extremely difficult to believe that if a man is attracted to a woman and they are dating (and have not had sex yet) - that he wouldn't fantasize about sex or masturbate..
We all do that.
I guess it's just the context that seems unusual.. in your situations.

I think it's interesting that I helped you become more Virgonean.. when my Pisces planets might be conjunct your SN.
My IC and Ceres are early in Virgo though.

----------*she says as her head rapidly inflates* ----------- LOL

:edit: I think ^ this ^ was my only - on topic - sentence (mentioning Ceres lol) Sorry Valus *insert wink smiley* - it won't let me add more smileys pffft -

bk to Janey (for some reason I have this odd compulsion to call you Janey - I've tried to avoid it in the past as I thought you'd absolutely hate it LOL) -

Anyhoo - I'll try not to say much about the story, since you don't want the information posted.. but I stand my by initial comment: No smiley face fits my facial expression lol

The juice he served you in the morning (how bizarre!). The way he behaved was just odd.. Maybe it was the wedding and his lack of a partner - perhaps he had some kind of emotional (should I say sexual?) crisis? I don't know.. I'm glad you gave him a piece of your mind, because he deserved it.

I feel sorry for him as well, if he really does like you that much.. but the way he handled the situation was seriously disgusting.. entertaining after the fact - but V. disgusting nonetheless. His approach does suit the Per-Pluto myth, scaringly so.

I thought it was funny you mentioned the bad joke.. There is nothing that I find more awkward.. I just love men who are extra quick witted and catch my own style of humour and roll with that..

Basically like a male version of you - Jane hehe

PS. It's great that they don't live in the same city or around the same area.. because you might see him more often - the height of awkwardness! lol

________________________________

:edit:

quote:

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This told me - stay merged, and you're safe. Separate and you're dead.

---

This suits my own NN-SN –-Taurus and Scorpio.. I completely understand.

Can you tell me the degrees of your NN-SN? I'm just curious..

quote:

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To me, sex is the ultimate dissipation of the personal self.

---

That's interesting also..
V. similar to a Scorpionic view of sex which has drowned me many times in my life.

When I think of Taurus I think of stability - I think of love.. I think of sex that fulfills you and makes you feel good physically.. sex that relaxes you. Easy sex.. Happy sex.. (Virgo would be somewhere in this camp!)

My Scorpio streak wants something else entirely.. a true merger of the physical and the spiritual.. an unbreakable bond. A sexual experience that shakes up your world and puts you out of your comfort zone and into the intensity of the life-death cycle.. (Pisces would be somewhere in this camp!)

posted March 04, 2010 03:22 PM            

Sept 11, 2001. 8:46 AM. New York.

1. Planetary Trigger: Mercury conjunct Exact in 14.21 Libra, trining Saturn [Establishment?] exact in 14.45 Gemini.

2. Asteroid Trigger. None of the spooky occult ones, straightforward one, confirming dear Linda Goodman's hypothesis of America living the karma of Atlantis.
Asteroid ATLANTIS exactly conjunct Asteroid AMERICA, 21 Libra. [Precisely On my North Node as well...]

3. ATLANTIS trines Uranus in 21.5 Aquarius exact.

4. Other Asteroids:
LUCIFER 2.5 degrees away from the Sun
LUCIFER exact YOD Uranus and SIVA
Satan Worshippers/Reptilian Conspiracy?

5. KAALI and ARABIA exactly conjunct SWINDLE 25.5 Virgo. Complicty of Al-Qaeda Terorists and Satanists?

6. SUMERIA conj Pluto exact, 12 Sag.
The wicked bloodline from Ancient Sumeria?

Sabian of Asc: "Circular Paths"
Karmic Cycles?

Sabian of SWINDLE 26.2 Virgo:
"A Group Of Aristocratic Ladies Meet Ceremonially At A Court's Function". An Illuminati Ritual?

Sabian of Arabia and Kaali:
"A Boy With A Censer Serves The Priest Near The Altar"

Ritually Mind Controlled religious slaves?
.....

posted March 04, 2010 04:12 PM            

Maybe. But my first thought was: we have been fed some really big lies, or at least a macabre distortion of the truth.

"Before anything the devil is the father of lies. The lies you tell. The truth you don`t tell."

posted March 04, 2010 04:26 PM            

What do you think of my asteroid node aspects that I listed in the thread...especially the ones where they aspecting both a geocentric and heliocentric node of the same object?

I am definitely a strong believer in the validity of the use of the asteroid nodes in Astrology. The orbs have to be no more than 1 degree unless there is a pattern. I would say about 1 1/2 degree

Raymond

------------------
"Nothing matters absolutely;
the truth is it only matters relatively"

posted March 05, 2010 12:37 PM            

quote:

---

I am definitely a strong believer in the validity of the use of the asteroid nodes in Astrology.

---

I've only looked at my Spain Nodes so far, but what I saw has me interested in looking at other asteroid nodes too. My SO's Spain SN is exactly opp my Spain NN!

We also have my Spain cnj his MARS sn, and his Spain opp my MARS nn.

posted March 05, 2010 12:58 PM            

quote:

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Noone locks up a SAgittarius-girl!

---

No one except herself.

What's your Persephone up to?

Your imprisonment sounds very Pluto square Venus.

...And also reminds me of how my SO proposed. Joke! As we both know it's the open door that works for a Sag.

quote:

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I have Lust exact on my ASC, too; but cannot really relate to it.

---

Well...Spain was cnj my 8th house ruler all along, but I had to go there before I felt it. What I mean is anything in our chart has to be a part of our consciousness before we experience its nature.

Is Lust also cnj your NN and Neptune? That would bring its own feel to it. Sag too, plus its dipositor. Jupiter in Pisces in the 3rd, right? My Lust's dispositor is Pluto in Libra, smack dab on my Juno/Venus mp.

One way I experience Lust on my ASC is that I feel myself becoming myself when I'm aroused, like I'm being born into the level of my being that feels the most like myself. This doesn't just come out during sex, but whenever I'm merged with a moment. The Scorpio influence is strong. It's trine my Pisces Eros, which links this arousal with the feeling of loving creation.

posted March 05, 2010 01:05 PM            

As far as wisdom goes, you clearly didn't read a word I wrote! Which is understandable, since there were many of them. But to bring you up to speed: I'm often a buffoon! My ignorance would be humiliating, if I gave a sh1t about that sort of thing. I'm wiser now than I was 6 months ago, but that's like saying I have better hair than Donald Trump. Or more hair than Jude Law, lol.

I will however take your comment and make it a segue to asteroid PALLAS Athena.

I have PALLAS in a 0* t-square: opp my Moon, square Uranus.

It's also cnj Psyche and trine Pluto, both 0*. Sextile Neptune, 1*.

posted March 05, 2010 02:05 PM            

Those same arguments can be applied to psychologists and psychiatrists.

Why don't they use Astrology to gain insight into the psyches of their patients like Carl Jung did.

Many of them view Astrology as B.S. After all, it is viewed as a pseudoscience.
That doesn't mean that Astrology doesn't work even though there isn't any strong evidence to support Astrology.

It's no different from how many Astrologers view Asteroid Astrology.

Raymond

------------------
"Nothing matters absolutely;
the truth is it only matters relatively"

posted March 05, 2010 02:08 PM            

I warned you not to get a big head because I did all the work. What you did was provide me with a final opportunity to put my progress together.

After your post, I was falling into that same subconscious thought pattern - boo hoo, being alone is so sad! - when the growth I'd been going through spoke up and yelled - this sorrow doesn't make sense anymore and here's why. It's weird that someone who lives on the other side of the world as me was sorta there with me during that moment.

Your IC and Ceres may be cnj my NN, which is at 2 Virgo. My Mars and Jupiter are at 7 and 9.

In my sister's defense, one day I nonchalantly asked her, "So, has a guy ever told you he jerked off to you?" I wanted to respect my bf's privacy, so I mentioned it like a hypothetical curiosity. Coming from out of nowhere, my question shocked her. When shocked I get intrigued and like to ask questions. My sister likes to yell at me. It's our thing.

When my bf's shared this with me, I didn't find it disgusting at all. And with some, I even found it erotic. I liked hearing about the moment that had turned them on and then giving it to them again, in a way that we had previously been denied.

But really, I cannot be the only person this happens to! I think you're right, that they find it easy to tell me about it because I'm accepting and understanding. Slightly perverse, as well.

posted March 05, 2010 02:15 PM            

"No one except herself."
You amaze me.

I once was having a daydream, and in that I was talking to someone, or he was talking to me, and one of the things he said to me, literally: "The only person who is locking you up, are yourself."

It was just then that I really realized the truth of it, and from that moment on I stopped looking for excuses to keep myself from doing something I enjoyed, even if it meant that I had to "leap into the unknown", even in little things.
I still don´t get how a "fantasy" of mine can tell me such things. lol

"What's your Persephone up to?"
Nothing good I guess.
Seriously, it is on 13 Virgo in 9th house.

The funny thing is, for some reason, I always get cold shudders when i see Ralph Fiennes on TV; something about him makes me being very thankful that I will never cross his path, and I cant even say what it is.
I nearly fell off my chair laughing, when I looked at his chart once; his Pluto is conjunct my Persephone.

posted March 05, 2010 02:16 PM            

."at I mean is anything in our chart has to be a part of our consciousness before we experience its nature. "
So true.

"Is Lust also cnj your NN and Neptune?"
By a bit more than 2 degrees, yes. I always say Neptune is watering my Lust a little bit, spiritualising it.

" That would bring its own feel to it. Sag too, plus its dipositor. Jupiter in Pisces in the 3rd, right?"
Jeez, you know my chart pretty well! You a stalker?

" My Lust's dispositor is Pluto in Libra, smack dab on my Juno/Venus mp."
Wow, Lust in Scorpio? Majorly intense I think.

"One way I experience Lust on my ASC is that I feel myself becoming myself when I'm aroused, like I'm being born into the level of my being that feels the most like myself. This doesn't just come out during sex, but whenever I'm merged with a moment."
Yes, I can relate to that. Merged with a moment.
Actually sometimes when I have finished a story, or a good chapter of a story, it has a clearly "orgasmic" feel to it. I always thought that strange. But maybe it makes sense as my Lust`s dispositor is in 3rd house.

"I'm reminded of when you discussed your writing. That sounds like you experiencing your particular Lust on your Asc. "
Ah you remember it!
Yes, I guess it is very Lust on my ASC. So I guess I DO feel it. I probably also feel it when I indulge in my lust for chocolate.

posted March 05, 2010 02:18 PM            

quote:

---

for some reason I have this odd compulsion to call you Janey - I've tried to avoid it in the past as I thought you'd absolutely hate it LOL

---

You know me so well.

quote:

---

His approach does suit the Per-Pluto myth, scaringly so.

---

Yeah, that and Venus-Neptune are really strong. He always loved it when people would mistake us for a couple.