posted June 05, 2014 07:11 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
Well if you are going to call out nice guys for being entitled you have to call out the women I mentioned too.The fact is alot of women expect the men they are having sex with to commit to them and even marry them, and get angry when they don't! That is no different from what nice guys do. And I sympathize with such women! I really do! I just wish society could see men in a sympathetic light when it comes to stuff like this for once.

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Now think about this AG, "women have sex and expect a relationship, nice guys get angry when put into the friendzone"

Could better be said 'women will have sex with men they are attracted to in the hope a relstionship will begin, nice guys get no sex, want it, and get angry when they fail and are friendzoned"

Basically, women choose who they have sex with, nice guys engage in all manner of behavior against self interest to be one of the guys women (presumably lots of different women) really WANT.

And that is the key to all of it from my pov, the nice guy is not upset that there is sex happening all the time, they are upset b/c Mr NG is being excluded from the party.

posted June 05, 2014 07:14 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
E, You just think you are big cuz you can hyperlink

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Bringing it to the Higher Octave.

(Just click on the picture.)

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Love,

posted June 05, 2014 07:41 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Padre35:
Now think about this AG, "women have sex and expect a relationship, nice guys get angry when put into the friendzone"

Could better be said 'women will have sex with men they are attracted to in the hope a relstionship will begin, nice guys get no sex, want it, and get angry when they fail and are friendzoned"

Basically, women choose who they have sex with, nice guys engage in all manner of behavior against self interest to be one of the guys women (presumably lots of different women) really WANT.

And that is the key to all of it from my pov, the nice guy is not upset that there is sex happening all the time, they are upset b/c Mr NG is being excluded from the party.

THAT is where the term entitlement springs from.

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Ughh. Well, since we're here again at this topic (again...), I suppose I'll peep in for a minute (although I generally tend to ignore this stuff).

I actually like what you had to say, for the most part.

But I think that there is a necessary distinction to be made between being a "nice guy", and being either a doormat, or looking like this fella (which is, from my understanding, generally not going to entice the ladies much).

Or, you could define a "nice guy" like so. A decent guy with enough self-esteem, combined with enough of the humble factor to not be an arrogant jerk, who is aware of his issues and able to accept the same level of issues in the women he dates?

That would be my personal definition of a "nice guy".

Also, I would steer clear of women who are continually moaning about wanting a "nice guy", for a variety of reasons. No offense to anyone here who does say that often, it's just what I've observed. :-/

I've never said those words in my life, to my knowledge. And yet I found one (or he found me, whatever). And yep, we both have our own issues and idiosyncrasies, but hey it works.

For the record, I dated a lot of arrogant jerks before I met my husband, but I did not assume that all men were the way that they were. I had guy friends who were not that way, and they were totally okay with just being friends (or perhaps had girlfriends of their own, etc.).

Anyway, good post Padre.

posted June 05, 2014 07:43 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Padre35:
Now think about this AG, "women have sex and expect a relationship, nice guys get angry when put into the friendzone"

Could better be said 'women will have sex with men they are attracted to in the hope a relstionship will begin, nice guys get no sex, want it, and get angry when they fail and are friendzoned"

Basically, women choose who they have sex with, nice guys engage in all manner of behavior against self interest to be one of the guys women (presumably lots of different women) really WANT.

And that is the key to all of it from my pov, the nice guy is not upset that there is sex happening all the time, they are upset b/c Mr NG is being excluded from the party.

THAT is where the term entitlement springs from.

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posted June 05, 2014 07:45 PM            

But it's not as though women always have the upper hand in these matters. Sometimes we do, sometimes we don't.

posted June 05, 2014 07:53 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Violets:
Although I will add that men also choose who they have sex with, for many of the same reasons that women do. Physical attraction, mental stimulation, interesting conversation, or just chemistry.

But it's not as though women always have the upper hand in these matters. Sometimes we do, sometimes we don't.

Depends on the individuals, I think.
"Individual" probably being the operative word.

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posted June 05, 2014 07:57 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by YoursTrulyAlways:
How about free-for-all anarchy with unrestricted speech? Keeps things lively and the forum hits really high.

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Why not? What could possibly go wrong?

Well, I'd rather see this than the constant gender wank in the thread.

posted June 05, 2014 07:57 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Violets:
Ughh. Well, since we're here again at this topic (again...), I suppose I'll peep in for a minute (although I generally tend to ignore this stuff).

I actually like what you had to say, for the most part.

But I think that there is a necessary distinction to be made between being a "nice guy", and being either a doormat, or looking like this fella (which is, from my understanding, generally not going to entice the ladies much).

Or, you could define a "nice guy" like so. A decent guy with enough self-esteem, combined with enough of the humble factor to not be an arrogant jerk, who is aware of his issues and able to accept the same level of issues in the women he dates?

That would be my personal definition of a "nice guy".

Also, I would steer clear of women who are continually moaning about wanting a "nice guy", for a variety of reasons. No offense to anyone here who does say that often, it's just what I've observed. :-/

I've never said those words in my life, to my knowledge. And yet I found one (or he found me, whatever). And yep, we both have our own issues and idiosyncrasies, but hey it works.

For the record, I dated a lot of arrogant jerks before I met my husband, but I did not assume that all men were the way that they were. I had guy friends who were not that way, and they were totally okay with just being friends (or perhaps had girlfriends of their own, etc.).

Anyway, good post Padre.

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I tend to attract cheaters. I've always said that I wanted a decent guy, that I'm attracted to, and compatible with.

I haven't assumed they're all bad, either. but this is for a different thread, and I'm really wiped out.

quote:

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Originally posted by Violets:
Although I will add that men also choose who they have sex with, for many of the same reasons that women do. Physical attraction, mental stimulation, interesting conversation, or just chemistry.

But it's not as though women always have the upper hand in these matters. Sometimes we do, sometimes we don't.

Depends on the individuals, I think.
"Individual" probably being the operative word.

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posted June 05, 2014 07:59 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:

IMO women always have the upper hand but they don't realize it and shoot themselves in the foot again and again because they don't realize it.

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Well...sometimes we have the upper hand, depending on the woman and man in question. Even when I was younger, I did encounter plenty of guys who just didn't consider me to be "their type". They didn't have to say so outright, I just got the memo.

My physical appearance, thoughts, ways of going about things, etc., are not every guy's cup of tea. At all. It's always been that way, and probably always will.

And then there are men who I have most definitely had the upper hand with, in that sense.

posted June 05, 2014 08:00 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Violets:
[b]Although I will add that men also choose who they have sex with, for many of the same reasons that women do. Physical attraction, mental stimulation, interesting conversation, or just chemistry.

But it's not as though women always have the upper hand in these matters. Sometimes we do, sometimes we don't.

Depends on the individuals, I think.
"Individual" probably being the operative word.

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posted June 05, 2014 08:04 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by BellaFenice:
Why not? What could possibly go wrong?

Well, I'd rather see this than the constant gender wank in the thread.

Anyone else have some nominations? A lot of great choices so far. At this rate will never pick a new mod.

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Heheheheheh. That made me laugh, thanks.

posted June 05, 2014 08:07 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by BellaFenice:
Why not? What could possibly go wrong?

Well, I'd rather see this than the constant gender wank in the thread.

Anyone else have some nominations? A lot of great choices so far. At this rate will never pick a new mod.

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I joined the affray simply to highlight the entrenched views on both sides of that topic and the long long long threads and replies and heated discussions that take place in them.

A good Mod is known for impartiality and that subject has been so thoroughly discussed that at some point most of SP's participants have taken a hard line stance that will later be tossed up to discredit any claim to impartiality.

Strictly my pov on that one BF

posted June 05, 2014 08:17 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Padre35:
I joined the affray simply to highlight the entrenched views on both sides of that topic and the long long long threads and replies and heated discussions that take place in them.

A good Mod is known for impartiality and that subject has been so thoroughly discussed that at some point most of SP's participants have taken a hard line stance that will later be tossed up to discredit any claim to impartiality.

Strictly my pov on that one BF

What would be interesting is a sort of "Uknown Mod' function that would allow the Mod to ref the debate without the above happening

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No worries, I was just jesting because I knew the topic would come back up again. Opinions are always good- as long as we don't copy and paste, right?

posted June 05, 2014 08:18 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Violets:
Well...sometimes we have the upper hand, depending on the woman and man in question. Even when I was younger, I did encounter plenty of guys who just didn't consider me to be "their type". They didn't have to say so outright, I just got the memo.

My physical appearance, thoughts, ways of going about things, etc., are not every guy's cup of tea. At all. It's always been that way, and probably always will.

And then there are men who I have most definitely had the upper hand with, in that sense.

It really depends, imo.

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posted June 05, 2014 08:25 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by teasel:
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum27/HTML/001897.html

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posted June 05, 2014 08:27 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Violets:
[b]Although I will add that men also choose who they have sex with, for many of the same reasons that women do. Physical attraction, mental stimulation, interesting conversation, or just chemistry.

But it's not as though women always have the upper hand in these matters. Sometimes we do, sometimes we don't.

Depends on the individuals, I think.
"Individual" probably being the operative word.

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It depends. On a lot of things. I think women have the upper hand in sex while men may have the upper hand when it comes to commitment.

Niceness does not mean attractiveness, intelligence, charisma, etc.. It's not enough. We look for more than that.

posted June 05, 2014 08:32 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by PixieJane:
NVM, I was just making point of orders and all and not likely to go anywhere good.

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posted June 05, 2014 08:36 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by ariestaurus:
It depends. On a lot of things. I think women have the upper hand in sex while men may have the upper hand when it comes to commitment.

Niceness does not mean attractiveness, intelligence, charisma, etc.. It's not enough. We look for more than that.

And there are plenty of average looking but 'nice' girls out there who are rejected in favor of prettier women. I think the majority of us accept this because we are taught that men are visual and will choose the better looking girl, regardless of how nice the other girl is. And I don't hold this against men at all. I also don't hold it against a woman when she chooses a better looking man over an average looking one. It's not unnatural to want to be with a beautiful person. Same applies to intelligence, charisma, chemistry, etc..

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posted June 05, 2014 08:56 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
I agree with you 100% .. But I think you are missing the point.. The reason men get so bent out of shape is the fact that women often lie and downplay how much things like looks matter... We (men) are honest about it.. I have never once heard a man say "oh looks dont matter! I'm attracted to outgoing and funny and/or confident women"... But women do this all the time.

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I have not noticed this. To be honest, I hardly ever see a hot guy with an average girl, but I see average guys with hot women all the time. All of my friends are 'hotter' than their guys. Personally I'm not totally into looks, and this is clear if you see the men I date. When me and my guy were on a date, some jerk came up to us and told me I could do a LOT better than him. My friends agree. But I don't care. My ex was hot but he was a liar. I'd much prefer my current guy, who is actually honest, over my ex.