posted May 19, 2015 11:56 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by peony:
Hey, Blue - I never bought into it! I've always been an outsider and with Venus in the 12H, I have different values. I think the answer for me is to know myself really well and being willing to stand alone. Study, for me it was metaphysics, was a big help. Being focused on the BIG PICTURE, like the metaphysical structures of the universe, and the nature of the soul.

---

It's wonderful to meet others who share the same perspectives in life. This very thought has been looming in my reality for awhile now, and I've realised something. Like you mentioned Peony about focusing on the bigger picture. We are here to awaken our consciousness, to develop the Self back to source. It's a very delicate balance between Spirit (Soul) and Matter (Material World).

So in conclusion, the point is to find balance between these two worlds/planes.

This song always gets me, wanted to share **
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9XKLqGqwLA

posted May 19, 2015 03:11 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by bluestskies88:
SaturnFan,

Saw this about Gate 55. Something really hit the nail here. I have it in bold. This was the issue with him! He was not able to make a decision whether or not to commit in the relationship! He was always On and off with his emotions. One moment it's a yes, the next is I am not sure. (Moon - confusion, insecurities etc) In turn left me impatient, and then critical (Mercury - conflict, impatience) due to frustrations and my own childhood issues of feeling unloved.

Am I interpreting this correctly?

---

Hey Bluestskies,

Yes, I believe you're interpreting correctly.
You two had a very dynamic emotional exchange. Your defined Gates in the Solar Plexus activated a few of his open Gates (and he amplified the energy). Then you picked up on this energy through your open Solar Plexus.

Gate 55 is your Mercury
Gate 6 is his Moon
Both are in the Solar Plexus, and you sensed not only his emotions, but the interplay between both of you. Very interesting synastry!

quote:

---

Originally posted by bluestskies88:
Regarding my 59/6 gate, it shows half white and half red towards the 6th. What does this mean? Does it mean it's white by 59 because I have a undefined Solar Plexus? Also, it's red towards the 6th because I also have unconscious blocks with intimacy?

---

In your chart:
Gate 59 is open
Gate 6 is defined (red = unconscious)
You do not have a completed 59-6 Channel, you'r Gate 6 will seek to connect to another's defined Gate 59.
Your ex had the whole channel, so he influenced your Gate 6 energy with his channel's energy. I'd recommend having a look at the PDF on synastry I posted on Page 7, there's a section about how a defined channel connects to a defined gate in synastry. It might explain a lot about the interaction between you two.

posted May 19, 2015 03:26 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by peony:
Hi SaturnFan,

This will probably not come as a surprise that there are a number of connections in our charts. First of all, your ASC10Aqua-DESC10Leo axis is the reverse of mine and my ASC13Leo-DESC13 Aqua are close in degrees as well. My ASC-Sun-Pluto is conjunct the sensitive point opposite your Aqua Venus, turning your fixed t-square into a fixed GRAND CROSS in synastry. T-squares have been compared to a three-legged stool, so combined our planets represent strength, stability, and perhaps sustained focus. I believe you’ve described the impact of my Sun-Pluto drawing attention to your own Pluto. As this is a mutual activation, maybe like three gates creating three active channels, your t-square is amplifying my Leo planets and ASC. But it also feels like I’m more aware of the energies of the signs in the fixed cross as a group. For example, I also feel like I’m benefiting from your Taurus energy with your teaching style of illustrating HD concepts with concrete examples. I also feel like I’m tapping into Aquarian energy as well, for example, the recent interest in groups having stelliums in their charts. I also have Mars in Scorpio, but it's not in aspect to the t-square. I think this kind of synastry could be problematic, creating ego conflicts. But you are older than your years and I’m older and have had really good teachers, so I don’t think the GC is a problem.

As I thought, we have a mutual activation with my Uranus opposing your Sun-Neptune-Mercury stellium and your Uranus trine my Sun-Pluto. You have a natal Jupiter-Uranus trine. I also have this aspect but in water signs. My Sun-Pluto makes your trine into a GRAND TRINE in fire signs! We also have a Jupiter-Pluto trine DW. Jupiter-Pluto is often seen in people involved in the human potential movement. This aspect also ties in with our mutual interests shown by our Nodes.

One of the most significant insights of the Magi system of astrology is in grasping the importance of geometry in synastry. We have both a Grand Cross in fixed signs and a Fire Grand Trine. We also have an exact Moon sextile Moon and an exact Mars trine my Venus. No wonder we have such an inspiring friendship!

---

posted May 19, 2015 03:42 PM            

You are absolutely not intruding! The analysis you're doing is brilliant, and very thought-provoking. The comparison between HD and SL is fascinating to me, because I only researched HD in isolation and while it claimed it combined a lot of systems, I didn't see it 'in action'. This really helps in gaining a better understanding of HD, and testing its validity.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:

You have such a nice birth chart, btw. I love the 11H stellium and Venus on the ASC. Like peony, my ASC is around 10 Leo, and venus2tinkerbell's is around there, too. It's like you are a Leo ASC magnet.

---

posted May 19, 2015 06:57 PM            

I'm looking more into HD things and I realized that there was a Solar Eclipse approximately 88 days before my birthday and coincidentally it is apparently when my unconscious definition is determined according to this website:

http://humandesign.net/basic-concepts.html

posted May 20, 2015 10:13 AM            

Thank you very much for your valued insights!

posted May 20, 2015 11:06 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by YellowGerbera:
Hi SaturnFan,

I'm looking more into HD things and I realized that there was a Solar Eclipse approximately 88 days before my birthday and coincidentally it is apparently when my unconscious definition is determined according to this website:

http://humandesign.net/basic-concepts.html

Is there any significance to this finding?

---

Hey YellowGerbera,

This is definitely significant! I've read about pre-natal New Moons and Full Moons having great significance astrologically. A Solar Eclipse coinciding with the date your soul entered your body (according to HD) is definitely not something to ignore.

posted May 20, 2015 11:09 AM            

You're so sweet!

posted May 20, 2015 11:49 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by bluestskies88:
It's wonderful to meet others who share the same perspectives in life. This very thought has been looming in my reality for awhile now, and I've realised something. Like you mentioned Peony about focusing on the bigger picture. We are here to awaken our consciousness, to develop the Self back to source. It's a very delicate balance between Spirit (Soul) and Matter (Material World).

So in conclusion, the point is to find balance between these two worlds/planes.

This song always gets me, wanted to share **
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9XKLqGqwLA

Oh, baby, every morning there are mountains to climb
Taking all my time
Oh, when I get up, this is what I see
Welcome to reality

---

Blue, I love the image. Thanks for posting it! I'll check out the song.

posted May 20, 2015 11:54 AM              

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:
#11,001 My god what am I doing with my life?

---

Good Things

Faith, you're a Generator, Right? I can't read the comments on this thread, and I can't read or watch anything to do with HD that I'm not currently focused on, and the comments are FULL of information, about EVERYTHING. This group is crazy (brilliant). But I'm looking at Generators. Are you a Generator? Your work looks like it (mind you, I can't read what you're writing because I am not focused on that yet).

posted May 20, 2015 12:17 PM              

What do you think of opening workshop-threads (maybe in Divine Diversities instead of 2.0), where we separate the participating Inner Authorities into groups. For example, we would have a thread called HD Sacral Inner Authority ...

In these workshop-threads we can create an environment where the Inner Authorities can practice working with their inner authorities. This would require a good deal of research and creativity, but Chris Powers says something compelling.

He says,The advanced work in anything is the basics done really well

Chris thought of creating groups like this during this webinar on Generators

posted May 20, 2015 02:57 PM            

Thanks SaturnFan and v2t, for the things you said.

Yes, v2t, I am a Generator, and yes I can see it when, for example, I just want to *generate* a book in three days that completes my entire specialized preliminary investigation on HD, index and cross-index included. LOL

I appreciate the webinar link.

I will try to participate in DD threads but half the time I'm at LL I'm wishing I wasn't. (Forum politics and Pluto. :/ )

posted May 20, 2015 10:47 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by SaturnFan:
I've been meaning to do a mapping of Cardinal placements in HD, since a question around this emerged in a conversation with Peony earlier in the thread. You have taken this to a whole new level however - it's fascinating to see how astrological energy is distributed in the HD centres!

This sounds like the first place to look in relation to Peony's question about cardinal placements. The Root Centre is about pressure to do things, it supplies adrenalin and urges you to move forward. I can definitely relate, as my Cap Sun is activating Gate 58 in the Root Centre.

---

SaturnFan, the person I mentioned with the 2/4 profile and a cardinal t-square has most of his defined gates in his Spleen and Root Centers. Does this correspond to a preponderance of cardinal placements in his astro chart? Or, is this something that remains to be determined? Also, here's his HD chart. Will you take a look and tell me whatever strikes you about it?

Another question: what determines what authority you have? Does it have to do with active channels or something else?

posted May 21, 2015 01:30 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by venus2tinkerbell:
There is SOOO much material right here on this thread. I'm gonna stop searching all around and read what you all have posted. I haven't actually done that yet!

---

posted May 21, 2015 03:58 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by venus2tinkerbell:
Greetings LL-HD Research Team,

What do you think of opening workshop-threads (maybe in Divine Diversities instead of 2.0), where we separate the participating Inner Authorities into groups. For example, we would have a thread called HD Sacral Inner Authority ...

In these workshop-threads we can create an environment where the Inner Authorities can practice working with their inner authorities. This would require a good deal of research and creativity, but Chris Powers says something compelling.

He says,The advanced work in anything is the basics done really well

Chris thought of creating groups like this during this webinar on Generators

---

posted May 21, 2015 04:31 AM            

Here's a list of all Cardinal placements in HD for reference - I'll respond to your specific questions in a separate post

Gates

Aries
25 - Innocence - The Gate of the Spirit of the Self | Centre: Identity
17 - Following - The Gate of Opinion | Centre: Ajna
21 - Biting Through - The Gate or the Hunter/ Huntress | Centre: Heart
51 - The Arousing - The Gate of Shock | Centre: Heart
42 - Increase - The Gate of Growth | Centre: Sacral
3 - Difficulty at the Beginning - The Gate of Ordering | Centre: Sacral

Cancer
15 - Modesty - The Gate of Extremes | Centre: Identity
52 - Keeping Still (Mountain) - The Gate of Stillness | Centre: Root
39 - Obstruction - The Gate of Provocation | Centre: Root
53 - Development - The Gate of Beginnings | Centre: Root
62 - Preponderance of the Small - The Gate of Details | Centre: Throat
56 - The Wanderer - The Gate of Stimulation | Centre: Throat

Libra
46 - Pushing Upward - The Gate of the Determination of the Self | Centre: Identity
18 - Work on What has been Spoilt - The Gate of Correction | Centre: Spleen
48 - The Well - The Gate of Depth | Centre: Spleen
57 - The Gentle - The Gate of Intuitive Insight | Centre: Spleen
32 - Durration - The Gate of Continuity | Centre: Spleen
50 - The Cauldron - The Gate of Values | Centre: Spleen

Capricorn
10 - Treading - The Gate of the Behaviour of the Self | Centre: Identity
58 - The Joyous - The Gate of Vitality | Centre: Root
38 - Opposition - The Gate of the Fighter | Centre: Root
54 - The Marrying Maiden - The Gate of Drive | Centre: Root
61 - Inner Truth - The Gate of Mystery | Centre: Head
60 - Limitation - The Gate of Acceptance | Centre: Root

Channels
(I've only included Channels where 2 cardinal Gates connect)

Channel 25 (Aries) - 51 (Aries) - The Channel of Initiation - A Design of needing to be First

Channel 17 (Aries) - 62 (Cancer) - The Channel of Acceptance - A Design of an Organisational Being

Channel 42 (Aries) - 53 (Cancer) - The Channel of Maturation - A Design of Balanced Development

Channels 57 (Libra) - 10 (Capricorn) - The Channel of Perfected Form - A Design of Survival

Channel 18 (Libra) - 58 (Capricorn) - The Channel of Judgement - A Design of Insatiability

Channel 3 (Aries) - 60 (Capricorn) - The Channel of Mutation - A design of Energy which Initiates and Fluctuates

posted May 21, 2015 05:18 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by peony:
SaturnFan, the person I mentioned with the 2/4 profile and a cardinal t-square has most of his defined gates in his Spleen and Root Centers. Does this correspond to a preponderance of cardinal placements in his astro chart? Or, is this something that remains to be determined? Also, here's his HD chart. Will you take a look and tell me whatever strikes you about it?

---

Hey Peony - so I checked all Cardinal Gates against the HD Mandala and mapped them in the post above. The 2/4 person definitely has a lot of defined cardinal placements - not only are the 2 main Cardinal Centres (Spleen and Root) defined in his chart, but he also has a lot of defined Cardinal Gates. There is strong correlation between his HD and Astrological charts.

Let's start with his Channels
18-58 The Channel of Judgement (Libra and Capricorn)
32-54 The Channel of Transformation (Libra and Capricorn)

Not only are his only 2 defined Centres Cardinal, but his only 2 defined Channels are Cardinal too.

However,

Channel 18-58 is Projected (meaning, it needs to be 'invited' in order to take action. It is very significant for him, because Gate 18 is activated by his Sun and Mercury, and by his "Design' Saturn (when the soul entered the body, according to HD), and his Gate 58 by his 'Design' Earth. Here are 2 excerpts from the book by the founder not he Channel:

quote:

---

Gate 58 fuels our love of and vitality for life, and pressures us to want to perpetuate this energy. The insatiability of Channel 58-18 is a by-product of feeling so wonderful. It is as though Gate 58 says 'more and better, more and better' as logic's impulse to keep us alive, while Gate 18, the Gate of Correction, tempers this impulse by alerting us to what isn't healthy, or is out of balance or in need of correcting. (...) The Channel of Judgement's underlying purpose is the purpose of Human Design; to reclaim or recover the joy and love that have been lost in living a homogenised, conditioned life.

(...)

To avoid wasting precious energy, and to use your essential gifts wisely, you are advised to pick your battles with care by first waiting to be asked to share your solution, and by devising solutions applicable society. In this way, you challenge only what others are most open and ready to address and potentially correct.

---

And the Channel of Transformation is also Projected - so its energy also needs to be 'invited'. Activated by his Neptune and Moon, so again very personal and significant for him.

Apart from these Channels he also has the following Cardinal Gates, which do not form a channel:
17 - Aries - activated by Earth (Personality - time of birth)
52 - Cancer - activated by Sun (Design)
39 - Cancer - activated by Uranus (Design)
53 - Cancer - activated by Uranus (Personality - time of birth)
56 - Cancer - activated by Mercury (Design)
57 - Libra - activated both by Saturn (Personality) and Neptune (Design)
50 - Libra - activated by Venus (Personality)

A lot of Cardinal Energy. His t-square is definitely showing through, and appears to be driving his life's purpose judging by his HD chart.

But there are the following factors:
- Both of his defined Channels are Projected
- He has no Manifesting Energy (no connection to a defined Throat)
- His Throat is open, so he needs to be 'invited' to speak, otherwise will not be heard, understood or accepted
- His Sacral is not only open, but has zero defined Gates - he is completely open for external energy, so needs to be spending time alone in order to discharge other's people Sacral energy
- With 7 open Centres, he is constantly receiving an enormous amount of other people's energy, so building on the previous point, he needs alone-time in order to discharge and re-establish a connection to himself.

So in short, he has very powerful cardinal energy, but it needs to be activated in the right way (through an invitation) - he should not be initiating. His Hermit profile helps him with this, because it protects him from going head-on into the world and getting burnt.

quote:

---

Originally posted by peony:
Another question: what determines what authority you have? Does it have to do with active channels or something else?

---

It depends on which Centres in your chart are defined. You can only have a defined Centre, if it is connected to another Centre with a channel. So if we consider the Mandala, if 2 planets activate 2 separate Gates which form a channel, this defines the Channel in your Chart, connected the 2 respective centres, and in this way the 2 Centres are also defined.

If you have a defined Solar Plexus, this overwrites any other defined centres. Anyone with a defined Solar Plexus has an Emotional Authority.

If you have a defined Sacral Centre, then this is your Authority (unless you have a defined Solar Plexus). A defined Sacral Centre always means the person is a Generator.

If none of the above 2 are defined, then the hierarchy goes like this:

defined Splenic Centre = Splenic Authority
defined Heart Centre = Ego Authority
defined Identity Centre = Self-Projected Authority
And Reflectors, with all centres open, have a 'Lunar Authority', requiring them to wait 1 Lunar Cycle (28 days) in order to gain clarity.

I have a Splenic Authority, because my Spleen is defined, and my Sacral and Solar Plexus centres are open.If my Spleen was undefined, I'd have an Ego Authority because my Heart and Identity Centres are defined and connected to each other.
My father has only his Identity and Throat centres defined, so he has a Self-Projected Authority. Aunt Anomalia who posted on this thread earlier had the same design, except she also had her Ajna defined as well.

posted May 21, 2015 09:40 AM            

Thanks again ~ I watched 25 minutes of the Generator webinar and he (Christopher Powell) did say some things that resonated with me.

But I am confused. He said that if a Generator doesn't feel really convinced about HD, he or she should probably abandon it.

That's where I stopped watching.

Perhaps I don't feel "sold" on it because the information is sequestered and treated like top-secret cult material, no offense intended to anyone...but the similarities between HD and Scientology freak me out.

I feel like, I just want to know all the basics about this system up front before I can decide whether or not to invest my time and money in it, but the way HD is presented raises more questions than it answers.

Questions like:

- What is the special relationship between the two gates that form a channel? What is the reason for their pairing?

- What exactly are they referring to when they say that this system incorporates genetics?

- How exactly does the I-Ching fit into this?

- Why does Ra Uru Hu say that we should investigate and experiment to our heart's content, yet there is apparently some kind of ban on releasing the answers to these rudimentary questions?

- Why do I get the eerie feeling like I'm the only one who's wondering about this stuff?

Here I am, showing you the expected "Frustration" response of a Generator.

And SaturnFan, if you're reading and can answer any of those questions for me, or tell me where to find them, I would really appreciate it, but I understand if you'd rather not. Perhaps I am just not looking in the right places.

posted May 21, 2015 10:01 AM            

I really like your critical thinking

I think I have an answer to some of your questions but am out now, so will get back to you later today or tomorrow. It will take a while to type them on a phone I just wanted to say that they are great questions and very important for understanding this concept - and, I absolutely advise against spending money on HD. The only thing worth paying for is the book co-written by the founder (which i've been quoting here)- it covers all the basics, and since people here have such a deep understanding of astrology and similar concepts, we don't need to pay for someone else's interpretation

posted May 21, 2015 04:26 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by SaturnFan:
Hey YellowGerbera,

This is definitely significant! I've read about pre-natal New Moons and Full Moons having great significance astrologically. A Solar Eclipse coinciding with the date your soul entered your body (according to HD) is definitely not something to ignore.

I'd pull an event chart of the Eclipse and run a synastry between that and your natal chart. That would be a fascinating thing to check!

---

Thanks for your reply SaturnFan!

posted May 21, 2015 07:51 PM            

Variable: PLL DRR
Type & Profile: Reflector 3 / 5 Definition: No Definition
Inner Authority: None
Incarnation Cross: Right Angle Cross of The Sphinx (2/1 | 13/7)

posted May 21, 2015 10:37 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by SaturnFan:
hi Peony,

Here's a list of all Cardinal placements in HD for reference

---

Hi SaturnFan,

I didn't mean to put you through all this trouble! but, thank you for taking the time. Hopefully, the info will be of use to other people also.

posted May 22, 2015 09:37 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:

- What is the special relationship between the two gates that form a channel? What is the reason for their pairing?

---

I haven't found an answer to this yet - unless I've missed something in my 2 books, as didn't read them linearly. If there's any logic behind that, I suspect it will be in the astrological sign of each Gate.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:
- What exactly are they referring to when they say that this system incorporates genetics?

---

According to HD, we are receiving neutrinos through each Gate which is activated by a planet. The Personality Sun Gate at the top of your chart will contain 70% of these neutrinos, and the rest is distributed between the other placements/ gates. These neutrinos manifest in our DNA, hence the name Human Design. I adore Genetics but have not studied it, so I'm not sure how much sense this makes. I do know that statement's definitely something that can't be proven though

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:
- How exactly does the I-Ching fit into this?

---

From the book by Ra Uru Hu:

quote:

---

The ancient I'Ching to Book of Changes, one of the first books ever written, reads like a dictionary of archetypical wisdom on the seasons of life. What makes the I'Ching so extraordinary in this synthesis, however, is not its philosophical or ethical text, but rather the amazing mathematical structure of its 64 hexagrams. Specifically, the 64 numbered sections you see in the outer ring of the Mandala represent the 64 hexagrams of the I'Ching. Each of these Hexagrams, pictures around the outside of the wheel, is made up of a particular combination of six broken (yin) or solid (yang) lines.

And further down:

In the 1950's biologists Watson and Crick cracked the genetic code, observing at the same time that DNA codons and the hexagrams of the I'Ching share identical binary structures. Our genetic code consists of four chemical bases arranged in groups of threes, which is similar in organisation to the lower and upper trigrams of the hexagrams of the I'Ching. Each of the chemical groupings relates to an amino acid and forms what is known as a codon. There are 64 codons in our genetic code, just as there are 64 hexagrams in the I'Ching. The 64 hexagrams around the outer wheel, translated into the BodyGraph as Gates, can be used in Human Design to thematically understand or interpret our genetic imprint, and provide very specific detail about the characteristics that make up each and every one of us.

---

The last paragraph provides some more insight on your question about genetics, though it could be pure conjecture.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:
- Why does Ra Uru Hu say that we should investigate and experiment to our heart's content, yet there is apparently some kind of ban on releasing the answers to these rudimentary questions?

---

The HD professional community is greedy, I think this is it. This is a relatively new concept - there's not much out there as with astrology for example, so at some point you either have to research/experiment on your own, spend money on a 'reading', or just drop the whole concept altogether. I researched it for 1 year and felt this is sufficient (though now I'm rediscovering its relevance and depth through this thread). While HD can be valid, and a real goldmine for exploring synastry, energy etc., I feel it should be approached with independent thinking, instead of relying on the current HD 'guides' out there

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:

I just have these "cult" alarms going off.

---

posted May 22, 2015 09:44 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lerena:
I was going to be lazy and not post this, but I actually think I'd be a good case study. Unfortunately, I'm not sure what can be determined just by looking at this, because it looks like information on Reflectors is limited. None of my "centers" seem to be activated, but the G center looks most developed.

Variable: PLL DRR
Type & Profile: Reflector 3 / 5 Definition: No Definition
Inner Authority: None
Incarnation Cross: Right Angle Cross of The Sphinx (2/1 | 13/7)

This system seems interesting so far. I must study it more and see what I can find on Reflectors.

---

Hi Lerena, thank you for joining us!

You G centre is very active indeed, this might be shielding you from losing your sense of self with all your centres open.

This link has a relatively detailed description of the Reflector type - do you find it accurate?