posted May 25, 2015 02:20 PM              

I have to be careful with my words. I use the word science and study of a structure, method, and path interchangeably.

I'll tell you why I am talking about interpretation. It has more to do with great interest than skepticism.

Any Arabic or English speaker can pick up the Quran and read it in English translation or Arabic, but without knowledge of the complex grammatical sciences, and classical Arabic, even colloquial Arabic speakers barely understand what they are reading. And they unfortunately base there interpretation on limited understanding. Interpretation is really a spiritual exercise, testing freedom, fear, other things I can't think of at the moment.

Without a Sheikh or Guru that I trust has access to higher knowledge and understanding, I have to rely on my own ability to interpret what I am reading (which is my preference). Deep knowledge of the foundation gives my spirit freedom explore and receive inspiration. My goal is to learn, so that I can explore freely- so that I can test Ha's understanding against my own. I've got some nerve, huh? I know. I think my 4/6 profile explains this.

I am thinking what I need to learn is not HD, but its foundation. I'm just kind of sorting out my process, and wanted to know how much you guys know about the sciences/the foundation of HD.

edited a few times

posted May 25, 2015 02:35 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by teasel:
I have a friend who talks about this on Facebook. I can't remember if I mentioned that here before. I think I'm a manifesting generator.

---

posted May 25, 2015 02:44 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by venus2tinkerbell:
I'll tell you why I am talking about interpretation. It has more to do with great interest than skepticism.

Any Arabic or English speaker can pick up the Quran and read it in English translation or Arabic, but without knowledge of the complex grammatical sciences, and classical Arabic, even colloquial Arabic speakers barely understand what they are reading. And they unfortunately base there interpretation on limited understanding. Interpretation is really a spiritual exercise, testing freedom, fear, other things I can't think of at the moment.

Without a Sheikh or Guru that I trust has access to higher knowledge and understanding, I have to rely on my own ability to interpret what I am reading (which is my preference). Deep knowledge of the foundation gives my spirit freedom explore and receive inspiration. My goal is to learn, so that I can explore freely. I am thinking what I need to learn is not HD, but its foundation.

I'm just kind of sorting out my process, and wanted to know how much you guys know about the sciences/the foundation of HD.

---

posted May 25, 2015 03:07 PM              

I like the term revealed texts. Probably commonly used, but never by myself.

posted May 25, 2015 03:12 PM            

quote:

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I am thinking what I need to learn is not HD, but its foundation.

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edit

posted May 25, 2015 03:19 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by SaturnFan:
Either way, this irritating individual provided a system, which seems to be working for some reason. I'm also curious why it works... After spending 1 year on HD, I didn't come close to answering this question.

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Oh noooooo a whole year and no answers?

As I've said before but want to repeat in case anyone is reading, who hasn't read the whole thread:

posted May 25, 2015 07:24 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
I just don't understand how differently they can interpret it, while maintaining a real connection. My studies so far make me wonder if they just overwrote traditional astrology.

---

Just from reading the passages on this at the link, the astrology is linked to the hexagrams, so it looks like it is a departure from astrology as we know it.

The chakras do seem to correspond to the HD centers mostly, but I'm not sure about the Spleen and Solar Plexus. Spleen in HD seems to be a combination of Ajna and the Root and Solar Plexus seems to equate with the Heart according to East Indian authorities.

As for HD and Kabbalah, I found one source online that indicates how the two are connected. That is, the centers in HD equate with the Sefira. The Sefira are the macrocosmic equivalents of the centers in a human being, which alludes to the Hermetic dictum "As above, so below."

I don't know if or how the 32 Paths of Wisdom in Kabbalah equate with the 36 Channels in HD. Anyway, the numbers don't equate.

The 64 Gates = 64 Hexagrams, so these line up just considering the numbers and nothing more.

quote:

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And has anyone ever compared the DNA of people with various sun signs, and found we are genetically distinct according to our sign?

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I'd like to know that too.

quote:

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Wow THAT could blow the lid off science.

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I think the scientists would just deny it. Like Clive Baxter's experiments with plants in the 1960s who discovered that plants feel, are telepathic, and communicate with one another. The scientists said "plants don't have a nervous system. They can't feel." Evidently, they don't know that a nervous system is not the only way to perceive and communicate, they don't acknowledge the human aura and the chakras.

Thanks for the link on the I Ching and DNA. I'm sorry it takes so long to respond. People are asking thought provoking questions, including you, and it's hard to keep up, plus study.

posted May 25, 2015 07:34 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by venus2tinkerbell:
Yes. I read the Gospel and Old Testament with the eyes of a Sufi- 3 worlds apart from understanding it through the church.

I like the term revealed texts. Probably commonly used, but never by myself.

---

"Sruti" is the East Indian term in Sanscrit. The literal meaning is "that which is heard," and refers to revealed truth or knowledge of divine or "non-human primordial origins."

Edit: My guess is there's a word in Arabic for this.

posted May 26, 2015 12:44 AM            

Natal & Progressed Chart: January 4, 1987

The Uranus-Neptune world transit was significantly aspecting Ra Uru Hu's natal chart. tUranus is 2+ degrees from his ASC and tNeptune is in his 1H.

As for his Progressed chart, his nVertex and nAnti-Vertex are conjunct (0) his Progressed ASC-DESC axis.

"The vertex acts like an angle in the chart
and can be an indicator of something destined or fated.

When the vertex is activated people come into our lives that turn out to be beneficial or crucial to what we are doing at the time. Be on the look out for these people they can play a very important role in the achievement of your goal.

snip

The anti-vertex represents the point of freedom, in other words if you have completed the work required by the vertex, if you have faced your destiny, you are then released and can enjoy the point of freedom.
It takes a great deal of courage to reach a goal and facing the situation brought on by the vertex."

http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/000520.html

In his case, because of his encounter with "the Voice" he had to come to terms with a role he was not comfortable with, that of a mystic, but he says he had no choice. tNeptune was in his 1H.

"As a skeptic, and with a background in physics, Ra had no belief in anything mystical. But, as he says, the humility of the experience with the Voice brought him to his knees. It shook him to the roots of his being."

http://humandesign.net/articles.html#04

How fitting that tUranus was on his ASC and tSaturn was in Ra Uru Hu's 12H at the time of his meeting with the "Voice." He was living on an island in the Mediterranean, which must have been isolated. Internally, he underwent a descent into the Underworld, which is to say a stripping away of the ego as a preliminary to rebirth.

posted May 26, 2015 09:46 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:

Oh noooooo a whole year and no answers?

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posted May 26, 2015 09:56 AM            

Great analysis of the founder's chart, thank you so much for sharing!

posted May 26, 2015 05:04 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by SaturnFan:
But if their partner only activates a few centres, leaving 3, 4 or more undefined, then the relationship will be more 'open'.

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Yes, that's the situation I have with someone. We have a 6-3 so I'm concerned about how much time we're going to be spending together. Also, I think he's polyamorous. I know you say this can manifest in different ways, but he has 7 out of 9 centers open, besides our 6-3.

quote:

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This can manifest in many ways, depending on which centres are left open. I think purely from an HD perspective, the Gates play a big role in these small differences.

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Between us, we have G, Heart, and Sacral centers open. How do you think this might manifest in our relationship?

By the way, GREAT work on your analysis of his cardinal centers and channels, etc.!

posted May 27, 2015 12:46 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by bluestskies88:
Heya SaturnFan,

Is there a way to PM you on here?

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Hey bluestskies

posted May 27, 2015 01:08 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by peony:
How are you doing, SaturnFan?

It's been an intense two weeks, mentally, but exciting. I think I need a little rest.

---

Hey Peony - same here!
However instead of having rest, I surprisingly ended up at a workshop by the seaside this week, with a lot of people from different countries - it's exactly the type of thing I love, so it shapes up to be very energising

quote:

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Originally posted by peony:
Between us, we have G, Heart, and Sacral centers open. How do you think this might manifest in our relationship?

By the way, GREAT work on your analysis of his cardinal centers and channels, etc.!

---

Thank you! I'm glad you found it accurate!

For the first time, the 2nd book that I own (by Karen Curry) will prove to be more helpful than Ra Uru Hu's book but I don't have it with me at the workshop It has sections on the centres and how they interact with each other in synastry. When I'm back on Monday I'll check it and let you know! But based just on my personal observation, I think the G centre could be problematic as it is about sense of purpose and identity, but you are very self-aware, so you are not at risk of losing a sense of direction while in the relationship, or needing to look for it elsewhere.

Having an open Sacral in synastry will mean that you will be more laid back and relaxed while only in each other's company. I think in synastry it's best to either have 2 defined Sacrals or 2 open ones, because if only 1 person has a defined Sacral the other person is constantly amplifying the energy and without enough self-awareness, this can lead to exhaustion. Ra Uru Hu is even advising such couples to sleep separately in order for the open Sacral to discharge the energy. But with 2 open Sacrals, you both have a similar energetic tempo and one will not overwrite the other.

The Heart centre is about willpower, which I've always easily associated with work and personal goals, but am not sure how it plays out in synastry. I'll need to check the book!

posted May 27, 2015 08:10 AM            

Cool Beans!

Thanks so much! I'll grab it from LeeLoo

posted May 27, 2015 09:45 PM            

Okay, this may not have any interest to anybody, but it was fun putting this info together.

Here's a breakdown of the most prevalent channels and the people who have them in their HD charts.

Channel of Abstraction: 64/47

Bluetskies, VirgoAquaSag, deptic, SDragon, and peony.

This is about a third (5 out of 14) of all who posted their HD charts. This is said to be one of the most common channels, so I would have expected a higher percentage.

"The Channel of Abstraction - 64-47, links the Head Center through the 64, the Gate of Confusion, to the 47, the Gate of Realization in the Ajna Center.

snip

Basically this channel is trying to make sense out of the past. The abstract is based upon experience, so the 64-47 is always sifting through past experiences. It’s sifting through a kaleidoscope of images looking for the one that makes sense, the one to which it says “Aha! That’s it. I see the story.”

Great advice to give someone with this channel: Confusion marks the beginning of an experience for them and if they are patient enough with their process they will come out with a valuable story to share. (47 is the gate of Realization, 64 Confusion). It is important that they share what they think, since the collective is nothing without sharing.

The abstract mental person (the 64-47) wants to make sense of and share everything about the past - both yours and theirs. "We all share the past, this is what I think makes sense." The 64 - 47 is one of the 4 most common channels in humanity, so a big part of being human is always reviewing what makes sense and what does not.

Like all channels from the Head to the Ajna, this is a projector channel. It is most successful when it is recognized and invited to share its “sense” of the world. It’s always important for people with mental definitions to remember that the mind is NOT an authority for making decisions for oneself. It is not an internal authority."

Channel of Inspiration: 8/1

Bluetskies, SDragon, Florence, Aunt Anomalia, Free Lion

""The Channel of Inspiration, 8-1, links the throat Center through the 8, the Gate of Holding Together, to the 1, the Gate of The Creative in the G Center. This is the channel of the Creative Role Model. Here we see the expression of the self to demonstrate its unique creativity.

This channel is one of the projected "leadership" channels. (Like the 7-31,13-33 and 20-10). It offers leadership from a place of personal, creative authority, and as a projected channel, requires recognition and invitation to be able to operate correctly. This channel provides the only Individual Creative voice, so it is imperative that it hear itself and listen to itself speak. This Creative Role Model empowers (or disempowers) others and this is its great creativity. For it to be able to do this, it MUST wait for recognition.
Many inspiring entertainers have this 8-1 channel defined. The 8/1 entertainer has this marvelous ability to fill us with a sense of empowerment that we too can learn how to play an instrument, or sing or dance or act, or simply live. The entertainer is also an excellent example of waiting for recognition.

Gate 1, The Creative, is the most "yang" and powerfully mutative force in the I Ching, so when it is accessed through the 8, to become expressed, it has the potential to transform the lives of all who hear it. The challenge for anyone with this channel is to be clear from their Type and Authority whether it is their time or turn to speak out, to express."

Channel of Struggle: 28-38

Anga, SaturnFan, Faith, Yellow Gerbera

"The Channel of Struggle, 28-38, links the Root Center through the 38, the Gate of Opposition, to the 28, the Gate of Preponderance of the Great in the Splenic Center. In the Individual Circuitry, the 28 - 38 is designed to find meaning in life, no matter how much they have to struggle in that process.

In fact, there is nothing more satisfying for a 28-38 than to find something that is worth fighting for because that means their life has meaning. This is a personal struggle but it can empower others in their own struggle for their own meaning.
This is the only channel that is about seeking fulfillment through purpose - making this channel fundamental to the development of human beings. Whenever you see this channel in a chart you know that person is always seeking a purpose. Gate 28 is the intuitive watchfulness, fear-of-death, game player and risk taker. It is fueled by the pressure of Gate 38 is the to find its own, new way.

Now, when you look at the 6th line of Gate 28, Blaze of Glory, you can see the extreme of seeking purpose is to go all the way to one's own death, to push the boundaries to the very end. After all, the 28th gate is the ultimate game player. Think Russian Roulette in this case. In this 6th line of the 28th gate is also the potential of suicide if they fail to find meaning. There is nothing more depressing than a 28-38 who is unable to find meaning in their life. It takes them a long time to give up, though, since it is the channel of stubbornness after all."

Channel of Structuring: 43-23

Faith, Yellow Gerbera, peony

"The Channel of Structuring - 43-23, links the Throat Center through the 23, the Gate of Splitting Apart, to the 43, the Gate of Breakthrough in the Ajna Center. Here we see the channel of the expression of individual mind. Concepts are grasped as insights that have broken through in gate 43 and re-structured, then expressed in the 23rd gate.

Called the channel of genius to freak, their unusual perspective reflects an ability to hold to their own point of view, at times to the exclusion of hearing or being affected by what others have to say about their ideas. That doesn't mean that they actually know anything; it just means that is what they say. Sometimes they know, other times they don't.

The channel is subtitled "Genius to Freak" implying a great range of possible insights and expressions. Just because a person expresses something is no guarantee that they have expressed it intelligibly. Often the freak appellation is the result of poor communication rather than faulty insight. When the expression of those with this channel is grasped by others successfully they are considered geniuses, and if not understood, they seem like freaks.
Anyone who has this channel must learn two very important things: Speech skills and patience. Speech skills to reach the audience and, because this is a projector channel, patience to wait for recognition so they have an audience that is ready to hear what they have to say.

The ability of the "knower" is to empower others structurally. This channel is always structuring, and it's ultimate gift is to make things more efficient. What you have to realize about these people is that if they can explain to you how to be more efficient, they have been able to mutate you. The contribution those with this channel bring to us is to enhance our acceptance of those who are different and the role they play in the transformation of our old order into new forms and values."

http://humandesign.com/section-b

SDragon and Free Lion share the most defined channels: 8/1, 2/14, and 34/57.

Yellow Gerbera has six defined channels. Among the people who posted their HD charts, there was a range from 0-6.

We also have 7 out of 14 Projectors, or 50%, which is a much higher percentage than the general population.

SaturnFan: Have you come across an explanation of why some people have more and others have less defined channels?

Also, if you think I'm violating copyright, please let me know and I'll delete the material.

posted May 28, 2015 07:39 AM            

I need to catch up ~ for now I just wanted to post these charts.

Ra Uru Hu Human Design chart:

Transit chart for Ibiza encounter:

Not sure if this is how transits work in the HD system, but it looks like, by transit, all Ra Uru Hu's Centers were defined at that time.

-Transiting Red Gate 63 formed a channel with Ra's Gate 4 to define his Head Center.

-Transiting black Gate 14 formed a channel with Ra's Gate 2 to define his Sacral Center.

-Transiting red Gate 60 formed a channel with Ra's Gate 3 to define his Root Center.

posted May 28, 2015 01:35 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:
HD has nailed some things going on in my life, in a very uncanny way...if that weren't the case I wouldn't still be here. I just need to know if that was coincidence/wishful thinking or will be repeatable in a much larger test group. Gotta see for myself.

---

Hi Faith

I'd like to take you up on this. Would you be willing to share what you did?

posted May 28, 2015 02:24 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by peony:
Human Design Thread HD Synastry

Okay, this may not have any interest to anybody, but it was fun putting this info together.

Here's a breakdown of the most prevalent channels and the people who have them in their HD charts.

[b]Channel of Abstraction: 64/47

Bluetskies, VirgoAquaSag, deptic, SDragon, and peony.

This is about a third (5 out of 14) of all who posted their HD charts. This is said to be one of the most common channels, so I would have expected a higher percentage.

"The Channel of Abstraction - 64-47, links the Head Center through the 64, the Gate of Confusion, to the 47, the Gate of Realization in the Ajna Center.

snip

Basically this channel is trying to make sense out of the past. The abstract is based upon experience, so the 64-47 is always sifting through past experiences. It’s sifting through a kaleidoscope of images looking for the one that makes sense, the one to which it says “Aha! That’s it. I see the story.”

Great advice to give someone with this channel: Confusion marks the beginning of an experience for them and if they are patient enough with their process they will come out with a valuable story to share. (47 is the gate of Realization, 64 Confusion). It is important that they share what they think, since the collective is nothing without sharing.

The abstract mental person (the 64-47) wants to make sense of and share everything about the past - both yours and theirs. "We all share the past, this is what I think makes sense." The 64 - 47 is one of the 4 most common channels in humanity, so a big part of being human is always reviewing what makes sense and what does not.

Like all channels from the Head to the Ajna, this is a projector channel. It is most successful when it is recognized and invited to share its “sense” of the world. It’s always important for people with mental definitions to remember that the mind is NOT an authority for making decisions for oneself. It is not an internal authority."

Channel of Inspiration: 8/1

Bluetskies, SDragon, Florence, Aunt Anomalia, Free Lion

""The Channel of Inspiration, 8-1, links the throat Center through the 8, the Gate of Holding Together, to the 1, the Gate of The Creative in the G Center. This is the channel of the Creative Role Model. Here we see the expression of the self to demonstrate its unique creativity.

This channel is one of the projected "leadership" channels. (Like the 7-31,13-33 and 20-10). It offers leadership from a place of personal, creative authority, and as a projected channel, requires recognition and invitation to be able to operate correctly. This channel provides the only Individual Creative voice, so it is imperative that it hear itself and listen to itself speak. This Creative Role Model empowers (or disempowers) others and this is its great creativity. For it to be able to do this, it MUST wait for recognition.
Many inspiring entertainers have this 8-1 channel defined. The 8/1 entertainer has this marvelous ability to fill us with a sense of empowerment that we too can learn how to play an instrument, or sing or dance or act, or simply live. The entertainer is also an excellent example of waiting for recognition.

Gate 1, The Creative, is the most "yang" and powerfully mutative force in the I Ching, so when it is accessed through the 8, to become expressed, it has the potential to transform the lives of all who hear it. The challenge for anyone with this channel is to be clear from their Type and Authority whether it is their time or turn to speak out, to express."

Channel of Struggle: 28-38

Anga, SaturnFan, Faith, Yellow Gerbera

"The Channel of Struggle, 28-38, links the Root Center through the 38, the Gate of Opposition, to the 28, the Gate of Preponderance of the Great in the Splenic Center. In the Individual Circuitry, the 28 - 38 is designed to find meaning in life, no matter how much they have to struggle in that process.

In fact, there is nothing more satisfying for a 28-38 than to find something that is worth fighting for because that means their life has meaning. This is a personal struggle but it can empower others in their own struggle for their own meaning.
This is the only channel that is about seeking fulfillment through purpose - making this channel fundamental to the development of human beings. Whenever you see this channel in a chart you know that person is always seeking a purpose. Gate 28 is the intuitive watchfulness, fear-of-death, game player and risk taker. It is fueled by the pressure of Gate 38 is the to find its own, new way.

Now, when you look at the 6th line of Gate 28, Blaze of Glory, you can see the extreme of seeking purpose is to go all the way to one's own death, to push the boundaries to the very end. After all, the 28th gate is the ultimate game player. Think Russian Roulette in this case. In this 6th line of the 28th gate is also the potential of suicide if they fail to find meaning. There is nothing more depressing than a 28-38 who is unable to find meaning in their life. It takes them a long time to give up, though, since it is the channel of stubbornness after all."

Channel of Structuring: 43-23

Faith, Yellow Gerbera, peony

"The Channel of Structuring - 43-23, links the Throat Center through the 23, the Gate of Splitting Apart, to the 43, the Gate of Breakthrough in the Ajna Center. Here we see the channel of the expression of individual mind. Concepts are grasped as insights that have broken through in gate 43 and re-structured, then expressed in the 23rd gate.

Called the channel of genius to freak, their unusual perspective reflects an ability to hold to their own point of view, at times to the exclusion of hearing or being affected by what others have to say about their ideas. That doesn't mean that they actually know anything; it just means that is what they say. Sometimes they know, other times they don't.

The channel is subtitled "Genius to Freak" implying a great range of possible insights and expressions. Just because a person expresses something is no guarantee that they have expressed it intelligibly. Often the freak appellation is the result of poor communication rather than faulty insight. When the expression of those with this channel is grasped by others successfully they are considered geniuses, and if not understood, they seem like freaks.
Anyone who has this channel must learn two very important things: Speech skills and patience. Speech skills to reach the audience and, because this is a projector channel, patience to wait for recognition so they have an audience that is ready to hear what they have to say.

The ability of the "knower" is to empower others structurally. This channel is always structuring, and it's ultimate gift is to make things more efficient. What you have to realize about these people is that if they can explain to you how to be more efficient, they have been able to mutate you. The contribution those with this channel bring to us is to enhance our acceptance of those who are different and the role they play in the transformation of our old order into new forms and values."

http://humandesign.com/section-b

SDragon and Free Lion share the most defined channels: 8/1, 2/14, and 34/57.

Yellow Gerbera has six defined channels. Among the people who posted their HD charts, there was a range from 0-6.

We also have 7 out of 14 Projectors, or 50%, which is a much higher percentage than the general population.

SaturnFan: Have you come across an explanation of why some people have more and others have less defined channels?

Also, if you think I'm violating copyright, please let me know and I'll delete the material.

[/B]

---