posted July 03, 2015 03:23 AM            

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Originally posted by SoaringLeaves:
Hi SaturnFan,

Thank you for introducing us to this concept! This is pretty amazing.

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Hello SoaringLeaves, thank you for joining us! I'm very happy that you found HD interesting!

Your design is very powerful, 4 defined channels is a lot of energy!

43-23 is a very fascinating channel, with great capacity to influence people on a deep level. A few posts above I shared some observations on it with peony - that might be of interest for you, since both for you and her this channel is red (unconscious). However, the energy you'll pick up from your environment will be different than what I described for peony, because of the difference in your open Centres. Your open Solar Plexus (emotions) and Ajna (ideas, inspiration) is where you'll receive energy from the people around you and will be able to channel it back to them in a powerful way through your 43-23 channel.

The Alpha channel is a great combination to this. You definitely seem cut up for a leadership role, not only because of the combination between these 2 channels but also because your Ajna centre is open to others ideas and inspirations, but your Head centre is defined (you have a fixed way of processing mental energy). So you can always receive inspiration from others, but this cannot influence your thoughts or how you take decisions.

38-28 is a great Channel - I also have this, and yes it's exactly as you describe it. A defined 38-28 channel means that we thrive on overcoming challenges and if things come to easily, we feel bored. This is also a powerful addition to your 'leadership' design When most people lose hope, get overwhelmed, or for any other reason want to give up, 38-28 will push you forward.

A few other comments:

Your open Solar Plexus is something to be mindful of - you receive other people's emotions and amplify them, and it can be very difficult to know whether the emotions you're feeling are your own or not. When you feel an emotional wave, keep in mind that it might be coming from someone around you - I also have an open Solar Plexus and one of the best "gifts" from researching HD was the ability to disassociate with all of the emotions that kept overflowing, and recognise them as not being mine.

You have a split definition - so your defined centres are separated in 2 groups. Head, Throat, Identity and Sacral are all connected to each other. Root and Spleen are also connected to each other, but not to the rest of the centres.
You will therefore attract people who will "bridge" this "gap" energetically, either by having a defined Channel connecting Root to Sacral (42-53, 3-60, 9-52 - or only Gate 52, which will connect to your defined Gate 9 and form a channel), or Spleen to Throat (48-16, 57-20) or Identity (57-10).

If you check the HD charts of your closest people who you've attracted in your life, most of them will have a defined Gate 52 connecting to your Gate 9 and forming a bridge between your split centres, or a defined Gate 16 connecting to your Gate 48.

What sold me on Human Design was when I discovered that my split definition can be bridged by Gate 26, connecting to my Gate 44. I checked the HD charts of my friends in my circle, and ALL of them had either a defined Gate 26, or a defined 44-26 channel.

posted July 03, 2015 03:25 AM            

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Originally posted by bluestskies88:
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posted July 03, 2015 03:27 AM            

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Originally posted by peony:
Fabulous explanation/exposition. Thanks, Saturn Fan.

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posted July 03, 2015 03:28 AM            

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Originally posted by Seimei:
just the 2 sides of the same coin< sounds a little Tao Te Ching there SaturnFan.

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posted July 03, 2015 07:43 AM            

please excuse the deletion of post, i've decided to make it private.

peony

will check out the transits

saturnfan

thank you will check email now

posted July 03, 2015 09:48 AM            

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Originally posted by SaturnFan:
43-23 is a very fascinating channel, with great capacity to influence people on a deep level. A few posts above I shared some observations on it with peony - that might be of interest for you, since both for you and her this channel is red (unconscious). However, the energy you'll pick up from your environment will be different than what I described for peony, because of the difference in your open Centres. Your open Solar Plexus (emotions) and Ajna (ideas, inspiration) is where you'll receive energy from the people around you and will be able to channel it back to them in a powerful way through your 43-23 channel.

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A think I read through most of this thread yesterday after my original post. I'm actually a writer, so everything you commented for Peony about 43 - 23 seems to fit right in. I have to admit that I still don't understand how a projector would present the same idea differently from a manifesting generator. I don't want to say that I create something brand new from old ideas and concepts, because it seems that this is what a projector would do too. Any thoughts on this?

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Originally posted by SaturnFan:
The Alpha channel is a great combination to this. You definitely seem cut up for a leadership role, not only because of the combination between these 2 channels but also because your Ajna centre is open to others ideas and inspirations, but your Head centre is defined (you have a fixed way of processing mental energy). So you can always receive inspiration from others, but this cannot influence your thoughts or how you take decisions.

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The funny part about my "leadership" in general is that I've never tried to lead anyone. If someone wants to build a pyramid (what an awful, awful parallel!) my instinct is to say, "Go ahead. I'm right here with a cold drink and a good book, taking pictures of you." The problem comes when that person acts against my best interest or, even worse, tries to manipulate me. There is no darker evil in my book than someone trying to control someone else against their will. In that case I become the one holding the signs during revolutions, so to speak.

quote:

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Originally posted by SaturnFan:
If you check the HD charts of your closest people who you've attracted in your life, most of them will have a defined Gate 52 connecting to your Gate 9 and forming a bridge between your split centres, or a defined Gate 16 connecting to your Gate 48.

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YES, YES! They do! Thank you for being so thorough with your answer. It helped a lot.

After my original post I noticed that my G Center was symmetrical, so I tried to find something on it. This explains the Cross of the Sphinx, if those who have it want to read more on it (scroll down): http://www.humandesign.com/g-or-self-center Sounds great!

posted July 03, 2015 12:33 PM            

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Originally posted by SoaringLeaves:
I'm actually a writer, so everything you commented for Peony about 43 - 23 seems to fit right in. I have to admit that I still don't understand how a projector would present the same idea differently from a manifesting generator. I don't want to say that I create something brand new from old ideas and concepts, because it seems that this is what a projector would do too. Any thoughts on this?

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I'm also a writer! (But not professionally, though it comes very handy in my job as well )

About your question, the difference here is not that you are a Manifesting Generator and that Peony is a Projector, the difference is which of your centres are open/white, because this is how you receive 'energy' from your environment. You are open to people's emotions and ideas (what a PERFECT combination for a writer, by the way). Peony is open to their identity and sense of direction, life force, and intuition. You can already see that there is a huge difference in the energy you'd be receiving.

This is actually a very interesting question and topic so I'll delve into it a bit more. Let's take a theoretical example - imagine a person, with all of their centres defined, who has for some reason diverted from their life path, without consciously knowing so, and are therefore feeling depressed. They might be consciously or unconsciously entertaining some ideas of how to handle their depression, like moving to another country, changing their job, getting a boyfriend/girlfriend etc.

If you sit down with this person, you'd immediately pick up on their depressed emotional state, even if they are acting cheerful. You'll sense the heaviness and hopelessness very strongly (you might even perceive these emotions as your own), even stronger than the other person because your open centres amplify the energy of the defined centres. You'd also pick up on the thoughts that run through their mind, even if they're not articulating them. They could say something simple like "I love Thai food" and your 43-23 channel, tapping into both their depression and ideas to handle it (taking a trip to Thailand or moving there, because something about Thailand attracts their soul), could get you to tell them "Oh I heard about this great offer for a holiday in Thailand, I can send you the information" or "If I were you, I'd take a few months off and go there to experience it first-hand!". Both ideas are quite a jump from the simple "I love Thai food" (this is why the channel is called Genius-to-Freak), but you are in fact very concretely articulating what is going under the surface, as a solution and a response to their depression.

If Peony sits down with this person, her defined Solar Plexus and Head + Ajna will not pick up on these undercurrents, but she will immediately pick up on the generic confusion with this person's life path, which is the fundamental cause for depression. She'd also pick up on the person's intuition (Splenic Centre), and life force (Sacral centre) which is being misdirected and therefore causing the depression. Her 43-23 channel would therefore come up with very different ideas, something which directly addresses the issue at its core. Remembering a movie, a book, a quote she's read recently, thinking of introducing this person to another friend of hers, telling them "it just seems to me that you'd be very good as [insert a job]", it can be any number of things. The person may end up moving to Thailand as a result, but they'd arrive at this decision differently, with bigger awareness of why they're going there.

(By the way I had this experience with Peony a few months ago when she recommended a book to me on another thread which literally changed my life )

Both approaches are brilliant, and can profoundly impact the other person, they just take a different route (literally, through the different open centres).

quote:

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Originally posted by SoaringLeaves:
The funny part about my "leadership" in general is that I've never tried to lead anyone. If someone wants to build a pyramid (what an awful, awful parallel!) my instinct is to say, "Go ahead. I'm right here with a cold drink and a good book, taking pictures of you." The problem comes when that person acts against my best interest or, even worse, tries to manipulate me. There is no darker evil in my book than someone trying to control someone else against their will. In that case I become the one holding the signs during revolutions, so to speak.

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Haha, you are yet another example of how this parallel with the pyramids is incredibly poor. I haven't met a single Generator or Manifesting Generator yet who blindly accepts authority.

By the way, people with your mentality make the best leaders - truly inspirational leaders who people want to follow, instead of tyrants who issue commands

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Originally posted by SoaringLeaves:

I don't really understand why those gates are highlighted (it seems to be common to all people born during those days), but in my natal chart gate 13 corresponds to my Sun, 1 to my ASC, 7 to my MakeMake (which is very important in my chart), and 2 to my DESC. I think it's only a coincidence though.

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The Gates are 'defined' by transitting planets around the Mandala. If a planet is in late Pisces for example it will 'define' Gates 36 or 25.

In Human Design we have 2 definitions: Design and Personality.

Personality (the black Gates in your chart) is where the planets were at the time of your birth.

Design (the red Gates in your chart) is where the planets were when your soul entered your body, which according to HD happens 3 months before birth.

In your chart Gates 15 and 46 are red, and if you check the red column on the left-hand side of your chart you'll see that Gate 15 is defined by Mars and Gate 46 by Venus - 3 months before you were born.

Gate 7 is black, but it doesn't appear in your astrological chart because this is where planet Earth was when you were born. No wonder MakeMake is significant for you!

Gates 1 and 2 (your ASC-DSC axis) are incredibly important in your HD chart!
This is where the Sun and Earth were in your 'design' phase, 3 months before birth, and this is where your North Node and South Node were when you were born.

posted July 03, 2015 04:32 PM            

Thank you for spending so much time enlightening us! You're a wonderful teacher. (And sorry for the late reply--it's a holiday here.)

That example about how Peony and I would deal with the same situation is perfect and I recognize myself in it a lot. I pick up people's emotions and thoughts very easily, which comes with many benefits, but also many drawbacks. I understand now how the "freak" part comes into play and sadly it's true. Most people are unnerved by the fact that I know things that I shouldn't. For instance I pick up if someone lies (not necessarily to me), which, as you can imagine, doesn't make one the most popular kid on the block. I try to help the ones around, but you'd be amazed how often people reject you because they don't understand where from it comes. For instance I know when people are having a hard time and I try to cheer them, but all they see is this shower of unexplained attention. Some appreciate it anyways, others...

The explanation about the crosses was great. Everything makes much more sense now.

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Originally posted by SaturnFan:
Gate 7 is black, but it doesn't appear in your astrological chart because this is where planet Earth was when you were born. No wonder MakeMake is significant for you!

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This makes MakeMake even more relevant for me! (MakeMake is the biggest dwarf after Pluto, orbiting relatively close to Pluto) I can post my chart, but allow me to give you some background first. The reason I thought MakeMake acts like a fully-fledged planet in my chart is because it's the only major object in my 9th house--the second most active of my houses. I'm the forever student, interested in everything from politics to all sciences under the sky. I read anything and everything. I'm fascinated by foreign cultures. When I was in my early 20's I decided overnight to move to a different continent. Even now that I'm closer to my 40's I always have a suitcase packed, in case the opportunity to travel arises. So there is no way my 9th house is empty. Saturn is close to the cusp, but sadly my Saturn is too well ensconced in my 8th house. (Obviously you love your Saturn , but mine brought me a lot of death. I really mean A LOT. Plus I don't see my ideas affected by Saturn.)

Anyways, this is my chart (I highlighted one pattern involving MakeMake). I start to understand more how the HD diagram connects with the chart (though if the highlighted gates represent the lunar nodes, then maybe my ASC falls in the next one. I can't tell from the earlier picture around what degree a highlighted zone ends and the other starts.

I have 20 squares (I didn't draw the ones to angles and nodes)--despite all the positive aspects I feel that I have to work three times harder than those around me. There is always a whirlpool of ideas and emotions in my head and heart. Sometimes I wish for a peaceful moment but it's never "quiet." I also have no inkling what planet is my ruler. I don't feel any planet stronger than the others, or better said my life feels like an astrological democracy.

posted July 04, 2015 10:40 AM            

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Originally posted by peony:
If you mean Parkyn Chetan's book, I don't have it, so nothing to compare Bunnell's book to. Actually, although not a book, I find SaturnFan's commentary very high quality, a lot better than what I've seen on YouTube for that matter, which is all pretty basic.

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The section that I wish could have been elaborated more on was the connection of the gates between people, kind of like synastry in Astrology.

posted July 04, 2015 12:51 PM            

How do you get that perfect star on your chart? That's like a perfect Tetragramaton.. Jesus have that same star on his birth chart.

posted July 04, 2015 01:00 PM            

I have also been studying astrology since 2008.

Both systems seem pretty right on.

I'm a Projector with Spendic authority.
(with a undefined Throat, Emotional, Sacral, and Root Centers).

Unfortunately this fits me way too well.

I was pretty much following my design until I was about 28/29. I was getting fed up on waiting and with lack of energy and said "*uck this"... broke up with my fiancé, I moved across the country, changed careers, was working 2 jobs... all that was a HUGE mistake without going into details. lol

posted July 04, 2015 03:57 PM            

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Originally posted by bluestskies88:
hey saturn fan and peony

please excuse the deletion of post, i've decided to make it private.

peony

will check out the transits

saturnfan

thank you will check email now

xx

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I just had a thought about your transits. Will see if I can send you an email.

posted July 04, 2015 04:09 PM            

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Originally posted by bluestskies88:
SoaringLeaves,

How do you get that perfect star on your chart? That's like a perfect Tetragramaton.. Jesus have that same star on his birth chart.

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Hi Bluestskies88,

I don't think the Star of David is as rare as people believe. There was one on July 29th, 2013. Thousands of people must be born with it. Plus, as nice as the good aspects are, they come in package with enough squares for an entire family. Most days I feel that I'm making 4 steps forward and 4 steps backwards.

quote:

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Originally posted by racole12:
I was pretty much following my design until I was about 28/29. I was getting fed up on waiting and with lack of energy and said "*uck this"... broke up with my fiancé, I moved across the country, changed careers, was working 2 jobs... all that was a HUGE mistake without going into details. lol

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Hi Racole12,

posted July 04, 2015 04:55 PM            

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Originally posted by GemBird82:
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@SoaringLeaves @bluestskies

~ Aww! Those are amazing charts ! ! !

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GemBird, wish that was my birth chart, but that's Jesus'!!

I love your smiley though hehe

posted July 04, 2015 04:56 PM            

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Originally posted by peony:
I just had a thought about your transits. Will see if I can send you an email.

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Peonnyyyy!!

posted July 04, 2015 05:13 PM            

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Originally posted by SoaringLeaves:
Hi SaturnFan,

Thank you for spending so much time enlightening us! You're a wonderful teacher.

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She certainly is.

Thank you, SoaringLeaves, for joining the conversation and initiating a fascinating discussion!

quote:

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I pick up people's emotions and thoughts very easily, which comes with many benefits, but also many drawbacks. I understand now how the "freak" part comes into play and sadly it's true. Most people are unnerved by the fact that I know things that I shouldn't. For instance I pick up if someone lies (not necessarily to me), which, as you can imagine, doesn't make one the most popular kid on the block. I try to help the ones around, but you'd be amazed how often people reject you because they don't understand where from it comes. For instance I know when people are having a hard time and I try to cheer them, but all they see is this shower of unexplained attention. Some appreciate it anyways, others...

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Yes, I can see the drawbacks. It seems to me this is one manifestation of the 11H Pluto. This placement can make you susceptible to projections, including power projections, from other people and this can be positive or negative. But if you learn not to take people's reactions personally, meaning, if you understand that you're carrying the energy of Pluto and giving expression to it and not identifying with it, the drawbacks will either cease being operational or you won't be affected by them.

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This makes MakeMake even more relevant for me! (MakeMake is the biggest dwarf after Pluto, orbiting relatively close to Pluto) I can post my chart, but allow me to give you some background first. The reason I thought MakeMake acts like a fully-fledged planet in my chart is because it's the only major object in my 9th house--the second most active of my houses. I'm the forever student, interested in everything from politics to all sciences under the sky. I read anything and everything. I'm fascinated by foreign cultures. When I was in my early 20's I decided overnight to move to a different continent. Even now that I'm closer to my 40's I always have a suitcase packed, in case the opportunity to travel arises.

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I don't know about MakeMake, in which case it would be silly for me to talk about it, so I won't. But, what I notice is that your 1H is largely comprised of Sagittarius and you have Neptune in Sagittarius in the 1H.

The geometry is impressive. The Star of David on a macrocosmic level represents the six dynamic archetypal principles, including a center from which these principles emanate, behind creation and through which the multi-dimensional universe comes into being.

On a microcosmic or individual level, although maybe grossly oversimplifying it, I believe it fits the Manifesting Generator, and the idea that we as human beings are co-creators with God. Not that just because one is a Manifesting Generator, one is consciously acting as such. It's a matter of the soul's evolution/purpose. The Star of David is rare. So, I submit that this suggests you have a distinctive and unique creative power. And, you have a defined Gate 1 (The Creative - The Gate of Self-Expression) to boot! With the Sun-Mars-Pluto Grand Trine (will) and Jupiter-Neptune trine (imagination/idealism) you can be an inspirational leader to those around you.

As for the squares what orbs are you using? Some of these are wide and some involve asteroids.

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Sometimes I wish for a peaceful moment but it's never "quiet."

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This seems to be where the North Node in the 12H is beckoning.

posted July 04, 2015 05:17 PM            

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Originally posted by bluestskies88:
Peonnyyyy!!

Have you got my current transit? I'll send over if it's Ok?

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Yes, please send.

posted July 04, 2015 05:49 PM            

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Originally posted by racole12:
I have been studying HD for about 4 months now:
I have read through about 4 books, taken a class and have had 3 couching sessions.

I have also been studying astrology since 2008.

Both systems seem pretty right on.

I'm a Projector with Spendic authority.
(with a undefined Throat, Emotional, Sacral, and Root Centers).

Unfortunately this fits me way too well.

I was pretty much following my design until I was about 28/29. I was getting fed up on waiting and with lack of energy and said "*uck this"... broke up with my fiancé, I moved across the country, changed careers, was working 2 jobs... all that was a HUGE mistake without going into details. lol

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Hi racole12, that was around the time of your first Saturn return. Also sounds like other big transits were going on at the same time.

Which book do you think is the best one? Also, I would be very interested to know what you thought of the class and your coaching sessions. Did you find them valuable?

posted July 04, 2015 05:59 PM            

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Originally posted by SDragon:
The section that I wish could have been elaborated more on was the connection of the gates between people, kind of like synastry in Astrology.

The electromagnetics and friendship connections were only briefly touched on but there's so many combinations it's certainly mind-boggling.

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My dear SDragon, I believe you've identified an area that needs to be filled in. A book, just on this subject, with in-depth, extensively analyzed and discussed examples from people's lives, is what I'd like to see.

posted July 04, 2015 06:05 PM            

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Originally posted by Soltze:
I thought I was seriously crazy before finding out I have the Channel of Moodiness and Emotional Authority.
It really improved my self esteem...no more crazy decisions when I'm feeling depressed or high up there...
I'm listening to some conferences Ra gave and I'm eager to learn as much as I can :-))

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Hi Soltze, thank you for your comments. I'm very glad to hear about your experience with HD. I'm sure Ra would be very pleased.

May I ask what conferences you are listening to? Are they on YouTube or somewhere else?

posted July 04, 2015 06:31 PM            

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Originally posted by peony:
It seems to me this is one manifestation of the 11H Pluto. This placement can make you susceptible to projections, including power projections, from other people and this can be positive or negative. But if you learn not to take people's reactions personally, meaning, if you understand that you're carrying the energy of Pluto and giving expression to it and not identifying with it, the drawbacks will either cease being operational or you won't be affected by them.

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I agree, but this is easier to say than to do. At a logical level I am perfectly aware that I have to regard these reactions detached, but any negative emotions feel like a punch in the gut.

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Originally posted by peony:
I submit that this suggests you have a distinctive and unique creative power. And, you have a defined Gate 1 (The Creative - The Gate of Self-Expression) to boot! With the Sun-Mars-Pluto Grand Trine (will) and Jupiter-Neptune trine (imagination/idealism) you can be an inspirational leader to those around you.

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Thank you!

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Originally posted by peony:
As for the squares what orbs are you using? Some of these are wide and some involve asteroids.

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I drew only the aspects to MakeMake, everything else came from Astro.com . The only asteroid I counted was Chiron and most people don't discount Chiron's inflence. The larger orbs (8°14) are formed by Saturn with Jupiter/Moon (conjunct with 0°01 orb). Believe me when I say, I wish so badly those aspects didn't count, but I feel them for both planets.

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Originally posted by peony:
This seems to be where the North Node in the 12H is beckoning.

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Actually what I meant to say was that everything in my life feels complicated. When a transit occurs (and I'm speaking here in general terms) I don't get only a nice trine. I get 2 trines, 2 squares, 1 opposition, a conjunction, and whatnot. I never experience life in *simple* terms. Even if one transiting planet is unaspected, there are two others that create a major ripple effect. Again speaking in general terms.

posted July 05, 2015 06:02 AM            

In addition to what Peony said about this corresponding with your Saturn return, I have 1 other thing to mention (as a fellow Projector with Splenic authority )

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Originally posted by racole12:
I was pretty much following my design until I was about 28/29. I was getting fed up on waiting and with lack of energy

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According to HD, a Projector fully living their design enjoys the "waiting" part because waiting means delving into hobbies and passions until an "invitation" happens. Also, lack of energy is experienced when a Projector has not been properly invited, or the 'invitation' has expired, i.e. the situation is outlived and we need to move on.

If you were feeling exhausted with this, then this "shaking up" was necessary even if you did not find it enjoyable. It'd be very arrogant of me to comment on your life decisions without knowing any details (or without being "invited" ), but I would not count this decision of yours as a "mistake". It just seems to me you were clearing the way for something much better and in harmony with your own nature, and these changes usually start out as 'bad' before they get better.